America's 2-class tax system

[Mad Scientist]

National Debt: 14,200,000,000,000.00
G.E Profits: 5,100,000,000.00

If Government were to confiscate ALL of G.E.'s profit the National Debt would be:

14,194,900,000,000.00

And if the government were to confiscate all of an average American's profit, the debt would be 14,199,956,000.00, so let's just abolish all taxes.

The Government doesn't have a revenue problem, it has a spending problem.
We did just fine without an Income Tax until 1913.

 

[Harry Dresden]

You rightwing, deluded morons have made it painfully hard to defend tax cuts and what simply amounts to corporate welfare, for big business, I seriously believe that the only reason you jackasses continue to defend and promote lies is just to save face from telling the American people they've been bamboozled and hoodwinked.

and the left has been doing something about this the last 50 years or so....right Bass?..and if you believe they are now......there is only one person here being bamboozled and hoodwinked......you the so-called Conservative.....

So the last bastion of the proven to be bullshit "Trickle Down Theory of Economics" is the Republican Party... Who could have predicted that one?

The fun part is watching people leave the republican party as they look at the graphs of "Tax cuts for the wealthy -vs- Jobs created in the USA" over the last decade.

The sad part is knowing their political choices once they wise up.

if anyone think rich Democrats care about the rest of us......keep dreaming....the rich stick together and i dont care what party they are from.....and if Bass was suddenly worth 50 million....he would be right there with them.....

 

[Bass v 2.0]

More proof that the rich don't need any more damn tax cuts and tax breaks

Super rich see federal taxes drop dramatically - Yahoo! News

These guys aren't being "oppressed" by insanely "high" corporate tax rates, they're living it up, and yes, almost half of Americans will pay no income taxes, but guess what, its not the poor people, they hardly make anything to tax in the first place, but it puzzles me that GE can make billions and pay nothing while still getting a fat tax refund.

You rightwing monkeys are hypocrites and retards to demand that public and federal employees are blood suckers that need to pay more while at the same time you monkeys are demanding less taxes and more tax breaks and cuts for the super rich. If you all were of the super rich thats one thing, but you monkeys are paying more of a burden for the super rich.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

and the left has been doing something about this the last 50 years or so....right Bass?..and if you believe they are now......there is only one person here being bamboozled and hoodwinked......you the so-called Conservative.....

So the last bastion of the proven to be bullshit "Trickle Down Theory of Economics" is the Republican Party... Who could have predicted that one?

The fun part is watching people leave the republican party as they look at the graphs of "Tax cuts for the wealthy -vs- Jobs created in the USA" over the last decade.

The sad part is knowing their political choices once they wise up.

if anyone think rich Democrats care about the rest of us......keep dreaming....the rich stick together and i dont care what party they are from.....and if Bass was suddenly worth 50 million....he would be right there with them.....

Who the hell is supporting rich Democrats you retard? Your logic of saying "Democrats do it too" doesn't change the reality of what the rightwing monkey Republitards are advocating and lying about, you really think two wrongs makes a right?

 

[Seawytch]

What works? When, in recent history, have we had the most economic prosperity in our country, what were the factors? WHAT WORKS? What were the factors during the Clinton years when 22 million jobs were created? What about the "boom" of the 50s?

Somehow I don't see how brining down US wages to 3rd world levels so we can compete is the answer. Somehow I don't see how cutting the taxes of a gazillionaire while cutting the wages of a teacher is the answer.

 

[Mad Scientist]

...but it puzzles me that GE can make billions and pay nothing while still getting a fat tax refund.

You be all like, hoaxed and shit :
GE says tax refund press release is a hoax - Apr. 13, 2011

General Electric dismissed as a hoax a Wednesday press release that claimed the company has a multi-billion dollar tax refund that it will be giving back to the U.S. Treasury."It's a hoax," said GE spokeswoman Barbara Butler. "That's not our press release."

 

[mudwhistle]

The US has the highest corporate tax rate in the world:
AEI - Report Card on Effective Corporate Tax Rates

Plus, companies have State taxes and when applicable, city taxes. In China and Japan for example, corporations pay their Government tax and that's it!

As an individual I pay Federal, State and City taxes and that aint good either, but I guess that comes under the Liberal idea of "everyone must pay their fair share" and "shared sacrifice". Thanks Leftwing Deluded Morons!

Reality:

One of the more egregious falsehoods being peddled by the corporate tax cutters is that companies doing business in the United States are taxed at an exorbitant rate. Not so. Though the United States has one of the highest statutory rates on the books at 35 percent, the only fair way to measure what companies actually pay is their effective rate - what they ultimately pay after deductions, credits, and assorted write-offs. By that yardstick, companies in the United States consistently pay taxes at rates lower than corporations in Japan and many nations in Europe.

The federal government isn't the only entity that taxes businesses. State and local taxes are very high for businesses dependent on which area your business is located. It explains why California is losing businesses in droves. Try opening a business anywhere and the state nails the hell out of you. The city tells you how to run your business. They tell you what kind of signs you can post on your own property. They tell you which licenses you have to maintain and the state can walk in anytime they want and audit you without any warning.

 

[California Girl]

I so love it when people link to the thoughts of someone else like that's fact and shit. It makes me laugh.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

I so love it when people link to the thoughts of someone else like that's fact and shit. It makes me laugh.

I so love when certain posters sit around and and complain about other people's sources without presenting their own, it makes it plain to see that they have no damn argument other than attacking the person, real easy way to weasel out of discussing the topic. Nice bait but I refuse to bite.

 

[editec]

When GE pays local taxes on purchases they get to write them off as an expense.

When their workers pay local taxes on purchases they do not get to write them off.

When GE pays local real estate taxes, it gets to write them off their bottom line and therefore their taxes.

When GE's workers pay the same taxes, few of them get to write them off because they don't make enough money to enjoy that write off.

When the CEO of GE takes his limo to work GE gets to write off the expense as a cost of doing business.

When his workers drive the cars they bought and paid for (and get taxed like crazy to own and operate, too) they don't get to write that off, either, again because so few of them make enough to itemize their taxes.

I could go on and on citing one example after the other where corporations (mostly by dint of the enormous size of their returns) enjoy TAX breaks few of their workers enjoy.

Declaring that the rich pay the majorioty of the taxes it takes to keep our society afloat is a big fat LIE by half truth.

The technique of foisting a big fat lie by half truth is one that the supply siders have honed to perfection.

Who really pays most of the taxes that keeps our federal state and local governments going?

The middle class... BY FAR, the middle class.

The font of ALL wealth in this nation, folks.

The MIDDLE CLASS.

The one that we are systematically destroying on behalf of the INVESTMENT CLASS.

 

[mudwhistle]

When GE pays local taxes on purchases they get to write them off as an expense.

When their workers pay local taxes on purchases they do not get to write them off.

When GE pays local real estate taxes, it gets to write them off their bottom line and therefore their taxes.

When GE's workers pay the same taxes, few of them get to write them off because they don't make enough money to enjoy that write off.

When the CEO of GE takes his limo to work GE gets to write off the expense as a cost of doing business.

When his workers drive the cars they bought and paid for (and get taxed like crazy to own and operate, too) they don't get to write that off, either, again because so few of them make enough to itemize their taxes.

I could goo and on citing one example after the other where corporations( mostly by dint of the enormous size of their returns) enjoy TAX breaks few of their workers enjoy.

DEclaing that the rich pay the majorioty of the taxes its taking to keep our society afloat is a big fat LUE by half truth.

A technique of foisting a lie that the supply siders have honed to perfection.

Who really pays most of the taxes that keeps our federal state and local governments going?

The middle class BY FAR, the middle class.

The font of ALL wealth in this nation, folks.

The MIDDLE CLASS.

They get to write it off indirectly through a Standard Deduction. If you don't spend enough to itemize, what's the difference?

Oh, and you need to support your claims with links instead of just saying it's so, especially when they go against the facts so glaringly.

 

[MaggieMae]

The US has the highest corporate tax rate in the world:
AEI - Report Card on Effective Corporate Tax Rates

Plus, companies have State taxes and when applicable, city taxes. In China and Japan for example, corporations pay their Government tax and that's it!

As an individual I pay Federal, State and City taxes and that aint good either, but I guess that comes under the Liberal idea of "everyone must pay their fair share" and "shared sacrifice". Thanks Leftwing Deluded Morons!

Where in the Constitution does it say that people should NOT pay their fair share? Throughout, it implies equality and, as does the Declaration of Independence. Do you treat one child differently than another? Would you put more on one's dinner plate than the others? "Shared sacrifice" is hardly a terrible thing, unless of course it's seen as terrible by terrible people.

 

[MaggieMae]

Liberals think that we can just tax a few millionaires and the "evil rich" and we'll be out of debt. They call it "shared sacrifice" and "paying your fair share". Ok, lets look at something.

What is the National Debt?:
U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

14.2 Trillion Dollars

What is the US GDP? (Market value of all goods and services from a nation in a given year)
List of countries by GDP (nominal) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

14.1 Trillion Dollars

The US Government could confiscate all goods and services, everything we have, and STILL NOT pay off the national debt. They would come up 100 Billion dollars short.

So as you can see the idea that government can tax the rich to pay off the debt is patently wrong.

Becky Quick, co-anchor of CNBC's "Squawk Box" says that 15% of taxpayers admit to cheating on their taxes (who knows how many don't "admit" it), and that if the IRS could collect on all those cheats, it would add about $500 billion annually to the Treasury. No, we're not going to "pay off" the national debt anytime soon, but it's high time that people and corporations began paying their, dare I say, FAIR SHARE and stop whining that it's everybody else who is at fault for the high debt!

 

[Bass v 2.0]

When GE pays local taxes on purchases they get to write them off as an expense.

When their workers pay local taxes on purchases they do not get to write them off.

When GE pays local real estate taxes, it gets to write them off their bottom line and therefore their taxes.

When GE's workers pay the same taxes, few of them get to write them off because they don't make enough money to enjoy that write off.

When the CEO of GE takes his limo to work GE gets to write off the expense as a cost of doing business.

When his workers drive the cars they bought and paid for (and get taxed like crazy to own and operate, too) they don't get to write that off, either, again because so few of them make enough to itemize their taxes.

I could goo and on citing one example after the other where corporations( mostly by dint of the enormous size of their returns) enjoy TAX breaks few of their workers enjoy.

DEclaing that the rich pay the majorioty of the taxes its taking to keep our society afloat is a big fat LUE by half truth.

A technique of foisting a lie that the supply siders have honed to perfection.

Who really pays most of the taxes that keeps our federal state and local governments going?

The middle class BY FAR, the middle class.

The font of ALL wealth in this nation, folks.

The MIDDLE CLASS.

They get to write it off indirectly through a Standard Deduction. If you don't spend enough to itemize, what's the difference?

Oh, and you need to support your claims with links instead of just saying it's so, especially when they go against the facts so glaringly.

I'd like to see proof that the federal government is oppressing corporate America with corporate tax rates so damn high that these businesses are forced to outsource jobs to China and Mexico. The rightwing morons have been stating this lie repeatedly in all of their speeches yet the evidence shows that businesses have been flourishing, even making huge profits while paying virtually no federal taxes and even getting returns.

 

[Navy1960]

But Carnival’s biggest government benefit of all may be the price it pays for many of those services. Over the last five years, the company has paid total corporate taxes — federal, state, local and foreign — equal to only 1.1 percent of its cumulative $11.3 billion in profits. Thanks to an obscure loophole in the tax code, Carnival can legally avoid most taxes.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/02/business/economy/02leonhardt.html

The U.S. government is unlikely to recover its entire $50 billion investment in General Motors Co., in part because the Obama administration unloaded a big block of shares in the company's initial public offering at $33 a share rather than wait for a higher price, a federal panel said Wednesday
U.S. Unlikely to Recoup Entire GM Bailout, Panel Says - WSJ.com

The U.S. government seized control of American International Group Inc. -- one of the world's biggest insurers -- in an $85 billion deal that signaled the intensity of its concerns about the danger a collapse could pose to the financial system
U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up - WSJ.com

U.S. companies. Some of the results may surprise you. The average income tax rate within the group was 25.4%. America's three biggest oil companies, ExxonMobil ( XOM - news - people ), Chevron ( CVX - news - people ) and ConocoPhillips ( COP - news - people ), all endure income tax burdens of more than 40%--higher than the statutory U.S. rate of 35%. Exxon, with a 45% rate, tallied $21.6 billion in worldwide income taxes for 2010. Wal-Mart Stores ( WMT - news - people ) paid $7.1 billion (at a rate of 32.4%) in income taxes.


So where does General Electric ( GE - news - people ) stand? Contrary to what many in the public seem to think, the conglomerate did pay taxes in 2010. It reported $2.7 billion in cash tax payments during the year, and on its income statement lists a provision for income taxes of $1.05 billion. Considering GE's pretax income of $14.2 billion, that makes for a tax rate of just 7.4%. The only one of the 20 corporate giants with a lower rate was AT&T ( T - news - people ), at -6.4%--but that was only because MaBell won a tax settlement with the IRS that reduced its tax liability by $8.3 billion.

What The Top U.S. Companies Pay In Taxes - Forbes.com

It's not just a spending problem, its a revenue and spending and policy problem, and to think otherwise is to ignore the fact that our Government has been for the last decade or more highly partisan in one form or the other and has looked out after the interests of just about everything but what really matters and thats the American people no matter what your political stripe is. You say its just a spending problem, you ignore the fact that many companies literally reap billions in benefits that you and I cannot begin to fathom. We are not Lockheed Martin who has for over 15 years now been awarded a multi billion dollar contract for a aircraft and has yet to deliver a single aircraft to the Navy on that contract and yet is paid every single year on that contract billions and then is given many tax breaks that you and I do not get. We can all agree that G.E. not paying any taxes at all is shameful to say the least. I have no truck with the tax rate at 35% if ALL the deductions for those companies save for example, " made in the USA" were eliminated. However, we all know this is not true. If these issues are to be fixed we must recognize the fact that this issue is not a singular issue based based on one's political beliefs but rather it's a fixable one if only we have the courage to do so.

 

[MaggieMae]

Corporate tax receipts plunge 31% in 1st Quarter of 2011:
News Headlines

As corporate earnings season fires up, a piece of data from the U.S. Treasury could be a warning shot for stock market investors. Federal corporate income tax receipts plunged 31% in the first quarter of 2011 from a year earlier, a potential indicator of weaker-than-expected Q1 corporate profits.

In case you didn't know, the US Treasury is the place where businesses, who pay taxes quarterly, send their checks to. It's down 31%. That means businesses are making less money. That means business is slowing down. More than likely the double dip recession as the government stimulus wears off.

What's the Liberal idea for fixing this? Take more money from them of course! Which is the exact opposite of what they should do!

Apparently "shared sacrifice" doesn't apply to government.

BULLSHIT! Here's where their "money" went:

U.S. companies buy back stock in droves as they hold record levels of cash

 

[Bass v 2.0]

Come on you rightwing monkeytards, why keep asking for more tax cuts for the uber rich and corporate America when they making tons of cash and paying very little taxes? They have the money to create more jobs so your excuse that tax cuts and breaks for the uber rich and corporate America is needed to create jobs is BS, that money is being pocketed so whats excuse will you monkeytards come up with? You all seem surprisingly quiet in this thread, what are you all up to, spamming the Foxnews website looking for lies?

 

[MaggieMae]

What are the businesses actually paying monkey, forget about the rates on the books, what are they actually paying? I'll give you one example of what they're paying:
General Electric Paid No Federal Taxes in 2010 - ABC News
They're paying so damn much aren't they? Stupid monkey, now defend that.

What you don't know could fill volumes AssMaster (V.2):
What The Top U.S. Companies Pay In Taxes - Forbes.com

But it's the tax benefit of overseas operations that is the biggest reason why multinationals end up with lower tax rates than the rest of us. It only makes sense that multinationals "put costs in high-tax countries and profits in low-tax countries," says Scott Hodge, president of the Tax Foundation. Those low-tax countries are almost anywhere but the U.S. "When you add in state taxes, the U.S. has the highest tax burden among industrialized countries," says Hodge. In contrast, China's rate is just 25%; Ireland's is 12.5%.

So the US needs to revise it's tax laws and enforce its trade laws.
Obama less interested in U.S. jobs than his campaign war chest | The Post and Courier, Charleston SC - News, Sports, Entertainment

President Obama recently said on the campaign trail: “I don’t wake up in the morning that I don’t think of jobs. I don’t go to sleep at night without thinking of jobs.” Pretty words — but President Obama is the reason we don’t have jobs. Only the president can enforce the trade laws, and President Obama avoids enforcement like the plague. Enforcement would limit offshore profits, which would limit campaign contributions, which would ruin Obama’s drive to raise $1 billion in campaign contributions.
China is not the enemy. China is developing a strong economy with controlled trade like the United States did in the early days. We didn’t pass the income tax until 1913. For the first hundred years we financed and built these United States with trade tariffs, causing Edmund Morris to report in “Theodore Rex”: “This first year of the new century found her [U.S.] worth twenty-five billion dollars more than her nearest rival, Great Britain, with a gross national product more than twice that of Germany and Russia.” President Theodore Roosevelt exclaimed: “Thank God, I’m not a free trader.”
China uses every twist and turn in the trade laws to develop its economy. The U.S. doesn’t call China on it because this would limit corporate profits, which would limit campaign contributions. Both the president and Trump are as confused as Hogan’s goat. Like Pogo, we’ve met the enemy, and it is us.

So you post a biased opinion post to justify your biased opinion? I think it's time we started slapping you guys down for that, since Heaven Forbid one of us should link anything from the Huffington Post, or even for that matter, The Washington Post.

When all the tax loopholes are used by corporations that don't offshore, their effective tax rate is about 15%. So the comparison you use is moot.

Lower corporate taxes won't create more jobs - Fortune Finance

Compared with other advanced economies, companies doing business in the U.S. already pay low taxes. It's true that at 35% the corporate tax rate is technically higher than most major economies. But because of loopholes and other deductions, most companies pay significantly less – so the effective rate (or the percentage of corporate profits that is paid in federal corporate taxes) is about 13% to 15%, which is relatively low even by international standards.

 

[MaggieMae]

You rightwing, deluded morons have made it painfully hard to defend tax cuts and what simply amounts to corporate welfare, for big business, I seriously believe that the only reason you jackasses continue to defend and promote lies is just to save face from telling the American people they've been bamboozled and hoodwinked.

and the left has been doing something about this the last 50 years or so....right Bass?..and if you believe they are now......there is only one person here being bamboozled and hoodwinked......you the so-called Conservative.....

Democrats have been trying to do something about corporate welfare for decades. Unfortunately, that's where the big guns (lobbyists) spend the most money to protect.

 

[MaggieMae]

The US has the highest corporate tax rate in the world:
AEI - Report Card on Effective Corporate Tax Rates

Plus, companies have State taxes and when applicable, city taxes. In China and Japan for example, corporations pay their Government tax and that's it!

As an individual I pay Federal, State and City taxes and that aint good either, but I guess that comes under the Liberal idea of "everyone must pay their fair share" and "shared sacrifice". Thanks Leftwing Deluded Morons!

Reality:

One of the more egregious falsehoods being peddled by the corporate tax cutters is that companies doing business in the United States are taxed at an exorbitant rate. Not so. Though the United States has one of the highest statutory rates on the books at 35 percent, the only fair way to measure what companies actually pay is their effective rate - what they ultimately pay after deductions, credits, and assorted write-offs. By that yardstick, companies in the United States consistently pay taxes at rates lower than corporations in Japan and many nations in Europe.

The federal government isn't the only entity that taxes businesses. State and local taxes are very high for businesses dependent on which area your business is located. It explains why California is losing businesses in droves. Try opening a business anywhere and the state nails the hell out of you. The city tells you how to run your business. They tell you what kind of signs you can post on your own property. They tell you which licenses you have to maintain and the state can walk in anytime they want and audit you without any warning.

Well the cons are constantly demanding "states rights," so there ya go. They suck at it too.