Americans need to start a war against insurance companies

[Wolfstrike]

in the old days usury was considered illegal , charging interest for loaning money.
well ,what's insurance? paying money for some "service" you may or may not get?

the insurance companies take YOUR money, then hire lawyers so they can come up with ways to not pay your claims.

"Yes, Mr. Smith, you have hurricane insurance, but your house was destroyed by the flood from the hurricane, not the hurricane itself"

----------------------

i pay $500 per year for car insurance. (yes, i know that's very low)
if i add the money i paid when i had new-car payments, i've given the insurance company over $6500.
i've had my car for 10 years, and that's probably what the bluebook value is.

is the insurance company going to pay for my scratched bumber?
well, that's mighty nice of them, because with the amount of money i've paid them, i've purchased for them, a second car just like mine.
Wow! that's an awesome service to fix the bumper for me.
i buy them a car, and they fix a bumper.

--------------------------------------

dental insurance is the biggest scam.
you pay money every month for an imaginary discount

someone on these forums told me they had full dental coverage and they paid $800 for a root canal and crown.
when i needed a root canal and crown, i had no insurance, ...i went to a dentist in the bario and i paid about $550.

hispanics near my area don't have $800 to spend on dental work, and even if they did they wouldn't pay it.

let me ask you this.....
if you had a good job with full dental insurance, why would you think these insurance companies are going to give you a discount?
if you have a good job, you're going to spend top dollar, ...end of story.
what you spend in dental premiums is a gift and your "benefits" are imaginary.

--------------------------------------------


i took out a home loan for a house that cost about 55K.
the home insurance on my house is about $560 per year.
i've had the house for about 13 years.

when you take out a home loan , you pay about 3 times in interest.
(55k = approx 165k)
if i would have taken that same $560 per year and paid it toward principle of the home loan, i would have saved approx $1120 per year in interest, x13 = $14560.
i could have used that money to take a nice chunk out of the principle of my home loan, oh , they're going to give me a couple thousand to fix the roof? who...the hell... cares?

------------------------------------------------


the problem with out medical system , WAS the insurance companies.
forcing people to buy insurance was the absolute wrong direction.

under voluntary medical insurance, with many people choosing not to make payments, the insurance companies became some of the largest businesses in the country.
they became so big they can buy politicians.

health care companies started charging more money because
a) insurance companies were paying less money than requested
b) insurance companies had deep pockets so health care companies were charging them more money to offset costs.


the baby-boomer generation had money to burn, the new generation doesn't have this money, so medical insurance companies were FORCED to lower their prices.
well, Obama and the democrats solved that problem by forcing every working person to buy insurance.
people with no need for insurance will be paying for everyone else, while providing huge profits for the insurance companies.


-------------------------

the end result,
the newer generations have crappier jobs and can not afford to pay insurance, so it's inevitable that all insurance will become mandatory.
if Americans don't take control of this, than when your kids or grandkids go to start a business, due to their intolerable wages, their start-up insurance costs will be large numbers per month, just to get business licensing.
only the rich will be able to start businesses, the whole idea of that is anti-American.

 

[Katzndogz]

When you get some sort of coverage (it's not really coverage at all) that gives you a discount on services, you don't have insurance. Your company has an agreement with this dental group to provide is discount if you go there.

This is like having a AAA card and getting a discount at Lenscrafters. It's not insurance.

 

[Flopper]

Insurance companies make money by collecting premiums not paying claims so it only makes sense that they would do whatever they can to maximize premiums and minimize claims.

Are banks any better? Banks take your money, charge you fees to keep it, then loan your money to people who really don't need the money. In fact, if you really need money, a bank is usually the last place to go.

Mortgage companies make money by loaning money to people who won't be able to pay the mortgage. Then they make more money by selling the mortgage to someone who doesn't know what there're buying.

 

[gslack]

in the old days usury was considered illegal , charging interest for loaning money.
well ,what's insurance? paying money for some "service" you may or may not get?

the insurance companies take YOUR money, then hire lawyers so they can come up with ways to not pay your claims.

"Yes, Mr. Smith, you have hurricane insurance, but your house was destroyed by the flood from the hurricane, not the hurricane itself"

----------------------

i pay $500 per year for car insurance. (yes, i know that's very low)
if i add the money i paid when i had new-car payments, i've given the insurance company over $6500.
i've had my car for 10 years, and that's probably what the bluebook value is.

is the insurance company going to pay for my scratched bumber?
well, that's mighty nice of them, because with the amount of money i've paid them, i've purchased for them, a second car just like mine.
Wow! that's an awesome service to fix the bumper for me.
i buy them a car, and they fix a bumper.

--------------------------------------

dental insurance is the biggest scam.
you pay money every month for an imaginary discount

someone on these forums told me they had full dental coverage and they paid $800 for a root canal and crown.
when i needed a root canal and crown, i had no insurance, ...i went to a dentist in the bario and i paid about $550.

hispanics near my area don't have $800 to spend on dental work, and even if they did they wouldn't pay it.

let me ask you this.....
if you had a good job with full dental insurance, why would you think these insurance companies are going to give you a discount?
if you have a good job, you're going to spend top dollar, ...end of story.
what you spend in dental premiums is a gift and your "benefits" are imaginary.

--------------------------------------------


i took out a home loan for a house that cost about 55K.
the home insurance on my house is about $560 per year.
i've had the house for about 13 years.

when you take out a home loan , you pay about 3 times in interest.
(55k = approx 165k)
if i would have taken that same $560 per year and paid it toward principle of the home loan, i would have saved approx $1120 per year in interest, x13 = $14560.
i could have used that money to take a nice chunk out of the principle of my home loan, oh , they're going to give me a couple thousand to fix the roof? who...the hell... cares?

------------------------------------------------


the problem with out medical system , WAS the insurance companies.
forcing people to buy insurance was the absolute wrong direction.

under voluntary medical insurance, with many people choosing not to make payments, the insurance companies became some of the largest businesses in the country.
they became so big they can buy politicians.

health care companies started charging more money because
a) insurance companies were paying less money than requested
b) insurance companies had deep pockets so health care companies were charging them more money to offset costs.


the baby-boomer generation had money to burn, the new generation doesn't have this money, so medical insurance companies were FORCED to lower their prices.
well, Obama and the democrats solved that problem by forcing every working person to buy insurance.
people with no need for insurance will be paying for everyone else, while providing huge profits for the insurance companies.


-------------------------

the end result,
the newer generations have crappier jobs and can not afford to pay insurance, so it's inevitable that all insurance will become mandatory.
if Americans don't take control of this, than when your kids or grandkids go to start a business, due to their intolerable wages, their start-up insurance costs will be large numbers per month, just to get business licensing.
only the rich will be able to start businesses, the whole idea of that is anti-American.

Not sure where you were going wiht this.. You atarted out with insurance companies then went to home loans..

You pay insurance so you don't have to come out of pocket for a large sum in the event of an accident. The $500 a year you pay can be used up in one small fender bender. If you don't like the concept of paying for something you hope to never need, just purchase state minimum insurance and put back enough money to pay for any accidents you may have.

As far as a home loan, I don't disagree with you there. It's a scam. By charging you interest on the money you borrowed accrued in the manner it is, you will end uppaying back far more than you ever borrowed.

The problem is it's global. It's been that way so long it's like that every where you go. The good side is, unlike insurance, you don't have to take a loan for a house. You can save it yourself and buy the home..

 

[Luddly Neddite]

in the old days usury was considered illegal , charging interest for loaning money.
well ,what's insurance? paying money for some "service" you may or may not get?

the insurance companies take YOUR money, then hire lawyers so they can come up with ways to not pay your claims.

"Yes, Mr. Smith, you have hurricane insurance, but your house was destroyed by the flood from the hurricane, not the hurricane itself"

----------------------

i pay $500 per year for car insurance. (yes, i know that's very low)
if i add the money i paid when i had new-car payments, i've given the insurance company over $6500.
i've had my car for 10 years, and that's probably what the bluebook value is.

is the insurance company going to pay for my scratched bumber?
well, that's mighty nice of them, because with the amount of money i've paid them, i've purchased for them, a second car just like mine.
Wow! that's an awesome service to fix the bumper for me.
i buy them a car, and they fix a bumper.

--------------------------------------

dental insurance is the biggest scam.
you pay money every month for an imaginary discount

someone on these forums told me they had full dental coverage and they paid $800 for a root canal and crown.
when i needed a root canal and crown, i had no insurance, ...i went to a dentist in the bario and i paid about $550.

hispanics near my area don't have $800 to spend on dental work, and even if they did they wouldn't pay it.

let me ask you this.....
if you had a good job with full dental insurance, why would you think these insurance companies are going to give you a discount?
if you have a good job, you're going to spend top dollar, ...end of story.
what you spend in dental premiums is a gift and your "benefits" are imaginary.

--------------------------------------------


i took out a home loan for a house that cost about 55K.
the home insurance on my house is about $560 per year.
i've had the house for about 13 years.

when you take out a home loan , you pay about 3 times in interest.
(55k = approx 165k)
if i would have taken that same $560 per year and paid it toward principle of the home loan, i would have saved approx $1120 per year in interest, x13 = $14560.
i could have used that money to take a nice chunk out of the principle of my home loan, oh , they're going to give me a couple thousand to fix the roof? who...the hell... cares?

------------------------------------------------


the problem with out medical system , WAS the insurance companies.
forcing people to buy insurance was the absolute wrong direction.

under voluntary medical insurance, with many people choosing not to make payments, the insurance companies became some of the largest businesses in the country.
they became so big they can buy politicians.

health care companies started charging more money because
a) insurance companies were paying less money than requested
b) insurance companies had deep pockets so health care companies were charging them more money to offset costs.


the baby-boomer generation had money to burn, the new generation doesn't have this money, so medical insurance companies were FORCED to lower their prices.
well, Obama and the democrats solved that problem by forcing every working person to buy insurance.
people with no need for insurance will be paying for everyone else, while providing huge profits for the insurance companies.


-------------------------

the end result,
the newer generations have crappier jobs and can not afford to pay insurance, so it's inevitable that all insurance will become mandatory.
if Americans don't take control of this, than when your kids or grandkids go to start a business, due to their intolerable wages, their start-up insurance costs will be large numbers per month, just to get business licensing.
only the rich will be able to start businesses, the whole idea of that is anti-American.

President Obama already did. Its called ACA and the GObP/Rs enjoy the benefits of it but don't want us to.

Read the link in my sig area. Or, any of a gazillion others.

My insurance premium is now lower AND I've gotten two refunds from my insurance company. If the GObP/R is successful, we may have to pay back that money back.

Alternatively, you can wait in line with the illegals and get your health care free at the local emergency room. Illegals (and you) can get free prenatal care, free delivery and even free abortions there. As we ALL know, that is thanks to Ronnie Ray-Gun's

SOCIALIST​

EMTALA.

I don't want to have to pay for the health care of others. Nor is it good for our economy.

 

[Mad Scientist]

My Mom and Dad didn't have insurance but the total cost for me being born in a Hospital in 1963: $20.

Insurance doesn't lower the cost of anything and MANDATORY Insurance raises the cost and lowers the quality of anything it "covers". All it does is makes it convenient for you not to have to sue the person in court who hit you for damages.

Don't believe me? Next time you go to the Doctor or Dentist ask how much the Cash Rate would be then compare it to the Insured rate. How many people even KNOW they can do that?

 

[lynn63]

Where do you sign up?

 

[Flopper]

My Mom and Dad didn't have insurance but the total cost for me being born in a Hospital in 1963: $20.

Insurance doesn't lower the cost of anything and MANDATORY Insurance raises the cost and lowers the quality of anything it "covers". All it does is makes it convenient for you not to have to sue the person in court who hit you for damages.

Don't believe me? Next time you go to the Doctor or Dentist ask how much the Cash Rate would be then compare it to the Insured rate. How many people even KNOW they can do that?

My doctor does not accept cash or credit cards. All payments are handled through the billing department that submits all claims to my insurance company. Only after the insurance company determines payment I am I billed for services. I've tried the cash offer when I didn't have coverage and it doesn't work. You get billed at an amount that is about twice the insurance companies contracted rate. After a lot of poor mouthing, they would reduce the amount to what they would get from the insurance company.

 

[Flopper]

The purpose of insurance is to save your ass from a disaster such as illness, accidents, or a death in the family. With the encouragement of the insurance companies we have turned insurance into an expensive money management tool. Most people today do not have the discipline to build a rainy day fund to handle the inevitable little financial set backs in life so most people purchase the lowest deductible insurance they can afford. Not only that, but people purchase insurance for just about every major item they purchase and every service they might require from accident insurance to eyeglasses, to routine dental visits, to their cell phone.

 

[Wolfstrike]

so...insurance companies sell their "service" and i have no problem with that.
if people really believe they need insurance that's their call.

but now we have all this politics that make people think that if you are in a fender bender, the world will come to an end if someone doesn't have insurance.
the politicians make insurance mandatory, automobile, business licensing and now ObamaCare.

you give these companies their premiums and they have hoards of people standing around making 40k per year,
the owners are buying mansions all over the country, ...the best cars, and their kids are going to Harvard.

you file a claim and they spend their efforts trying to deny it, then they look up the info and decide they can pay out 1k because you gave them 10k

when a disaster strikes and it's time for the insurance companies to pay the piper, they declare a national disaster and public tax money pays for everything (eventually)


seriously, where was this business model invented?
Shangri La?

 

[Moonglow]

banks, and mortgage companies require you have home owners insurance.
Banks require life insurance on many loans.
I don't do business with lenders that stack on the fees or require insurance.
My auto insurance is 27 dollars a month.

 

[SteadyMercury]

but now we have all this politics that make people think that if you are in a fender bender, the world will come to an end if someone doesn't have insurance.

Actually it is more for the liability aspect, many don't carry collision for older cars and if it gets in a fender bender they'll either drive around with a bent fender or get rid of the car.

Liability insurance is important however, since a simple mistake can wreck you financially.

you file a claim and they spend their efforts trying to deny it, then they look up the info and decide they can pay out 1k because you gave them 10k

I've only filed a few insurance claims in my life but not once have I encountered any effort to fight it. I'm not saying it doesn't happen but your blanket statements about what happens when one files an insurance claim are absurd.

when a disaster strikes and it's time for the insurance companies to pay the piper, they declare a national disaster and public tax money pays for everything (eventually)

By federal law FEMA cannot provide money for losses that are covered by insurance.

 

[Flopper]

so...insurance companies sell their "service" and i have no problem with that.
if people really believe they need insurance that's their call.

but now we have all this politics that make people think that if you are in a fender bender, the world will come to an end if someone doesn't have insurance.
the politicians make insurance mandatory, automobile, business licensing and now ObamaCare.

you give these companies their premiums and they have hoards of people standing around making 40k per year,
the owners are buying mansions all over the country, ...the best cars, and their kids are going to Harvard.

you file a claim and they spend their efforts trying to deny it, then they look up the info and decide they can pay out 1k because you gave them 10k

when a disaster strikes and it's time for the insurance companies to pay the piper, they declare a national disaster and public tax money pays for everything (eventually)


seriously, where was this business model invented?
Shangri La?

I do not agree that auto insurance companies try to avoid paying the claims they are obligated to pay. The business model for insurance companies is pay claims based strictly on the terms of the policy. The premium is determined by the extent of coverage so they can not pay beyond the coverage.

The problem is people don't take the time to read and understand their insurance coverage and when a disaster occurs, they expect the insurance to pay for everything even thou it's not part of their coverage.

 

[Granny]

WOLFSTRIKE:
in the old days usury was considered illegal , charging interest for loaning money.
well ,what's insurance? paying money for some "service" you may or may not get?

the insurance companies take YOUR money, then hire lawyers so they can come up with ways to not pay your claims.

"Yes, Mr. Smith, you have hurricane insurance, but your house was destroyed by the flood from the hurricane, not the hurricane itself"

I have to disagree with your assessment of various insurance coverages. Insurance premiums are paid so that IN THE EVENT SOMETHING HAPPENS you will have money to cover the costs. If nothing happens, you're lucky and probably get some decreases in premiums ("discounts") for not having filed any claims. With the possible exception of car insurance you don't HAVE to carry any insurance at all.
----------------------

i pay $500 per year for car insurance. (yes, i know that's very low)
if i add the money i paid when i had new-car payments, i've given the insurance company over $6500.
i've had my car for 10 years, and that's probably what the bluebook value is.

is the insurance company going to pay for my scratched bumber?
well, that's mighty nice of them, because with the amount of money i've paid them, i've purchased for them, a second car just like mine.
Wow! that's an awesome service to fix the bumper for me.
i buy them a car, and they fix a bumper.

If you're smart, you will carry insurance on your car. If the car is 10 years old and has a few dents or dings it is really worth fixing them? You're working yourself up into a heart attack. The thing that matters is if the vehicle is still in good running condition and maintenance is regular. If your dented bumper is minor your deductible should take care of it. If it's a major mess the insurance should pay whatever is over your deductible.
--------------------------------------

dental insurance is the biggest scam.
you pay money every month for an imaginary discount

someone on these forums told me they had full dental coverage and they paid $800 for a root canal and crown.
when i needed a root canal and crown, i had no insurance, ...i went to a dentist in the bario and i paid about $550.

hispanics near my area don't have $800 to spend on dental work, and even if they did they wouldn't pay it.

let me ask you this.....
if you had a good job with full dental insurance, why would you think these insurance companies are going to give you a discount?
if you have a good job, you're going to spend top dollar, ...end of story.
what you spend in dental premiums is a gift and your "benefits" are imaginary.

You're probably right about dental insurance. Premiums are very low (some less than $10/month) but I don't see where they do much in the way of coverage. On the other hand, I also wouldn't go to the barrio to find a cheap dentist. There was a story on the news a short while ago that just broke my heart. This young man who could not afford expensive dentists went to one of the cheap dentists in his town to have one tooth pulled. They used gas instead of novocaine and when the kid woke up they had pulled every tooth in his mouth. He was in tears because "[he] looked like a freak."
--------------------------------------------


i took out a home loan for a house that cost about 55K.
the home insurance on my house is about $560 per year.
i've had the house for about 13 years.

when you take out a home loan , you pay about 3 times in interest.
(55k = approx 165k)
if i would have taken that same $560 per year and paid it toward principle of the home loan, i would have saved approx $1120 per year in interest, x13 = $14560.
i could have used that money to take a nice chunk out of the principle of my home loan, oh , they're going to give me a couple thousand to fix the roof? who...the hell... cares?

As long as you have a mortgage on your house the bank or mortgage company is going to make you carry insurance on it. If something happens to the house, then they suffer a financial loss that will be covered by the insurance. It's called mortgage insurance. If you want your contents covered then you need to get homeowner's insurance.
------------------------------------------------


the problem with out medical system , WAS the insurance companies.
forcing people to buy insurance was the absolute wrong direction.

under voluntary medical insurance, with many people choosing not to make payments, the insurance companies became some of the largest businesses in the country.
they became so big they can buy politicians.

health care companies started charging more money because
a) insurance companies were paying less money than requested
b) insurance companies had deep pockets so health care companies were charging them more money to offset costs.

The real problem with health care (and other insurances for that matter) is not so much the insurance companies as it is the LAWYERS suing the insurance companies for bull shit reasons. There are some people (and I hate to say it) but the majority are blacks who will get a lawyer and sue the hell out of someone for a damned paper cut. Then there are the mass tort lawyers who take on these huge suits against doctors, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies, etc. - they advertise on TV all the time. These suits can last for years and the only people who get rich off the suits are the lawyers. By the time taxes, lawyers fees and costs, etc. come off the top of the settlement or judgment there's not a hell of a lot of money left to distribute to the 50,000 (or more) people who were "injured" by the drugs, devices, medical care, etc. This is the stuff that drives insurance premiums through the ceiling. Malpractice insurance premiums as well as other insurance coverages are a nightmare for hospitals and doctors.

No, I don't work for insurance companies, but I spent 25 years of my life as a legal secretary to the damned lawyers.

Insurance companies make contractual agreements with hospitals and doctors as to what is the value of a particular treatment and that's what insurance companies pay. Insureds pay only their co-pay (if they have HMO coverage). In the vast majority of cases the insurance companies pay claims pretty promptly. It's the government agencies like Medicare and Medicaid who are the slackers when it comes to payments. What would be "written off" by doctors and hospitals does get passed on to people who are insured. I mean, these hospitals and doctors DO have overhead expenses that have to be paid such as salaries, utilities, costs of office space and equipment and it's got to come from somewhere.

the baby-boomer generation had money to burn, the new generation doesn't have this money, so medical insurance companies were FORCED to lower their prices.
well, Obama and the democrats solved that problem by forcing every working person to buy insurance.
people with no need for insurance will be paying for everyone else, while providing huge profits for the insurance companies.

The best thing we can do for Obamacare is to get rid of it as soon as possible.
-------------------------

the end result,
the newer generations have crappier jobs and can not afford to pay insurance, so it's inevitable that all insurance will become mandatory.
if Americans don't take control of this, than when your kids or grandkids go to start a business, due to their intolerable wages, their start-up insurance costs will be large numbers per month, just to get business licensing.
only the rich will be able to start businesses, the whole idea of that is anti-American.
Reply With Quote

 

[eflatminor]

Americans need to start a war against insurance companies

And replace them with what? What you don't know about how business works is a lot.

Do you think banks would make home loans without insurance in place?

Do you have the financial backing to pay the medical treatment and long term care should you permanently injury someone with your vehicle?

You going to force others to pay for your medical care if you should get sick and are unable to work?

Dude, insurance is the 'oil' in the engine that is the economy. Without it, that engine seizes and grow is severely impeded.

 

[eflatminor]

so...insurance companies sell their "service" and i have no problem with that.
if people really believe they need insurance that's their call.

but now we have all this politics that make people think that if you are in a fender bender, the world will come to an end if someone doesn't have insurance.

Auto insurance is not intended to cover a minor accident under the deductible. It's for serious accidents, theft and anything involving an injury.

the politicians make insurance mandatory, automobile,

Auto insurance is only mandatory at the state level and only if you drive on public roads. If we're going to have public roads (a different argument), then requiring insurance makes sense. Otherwise, the accident you cause that injuries another is foisted onto the taxpayers.

business licensing

Business licenses have nothing to do with insurance.

FWIW, I stand against the requirement to obtain a business license.

and now ObamaCare.

Agreed. It should be unconstitutional. They got it through by calling it a tax, not insurance. Thanks a lot Roberts.

you give these companies their premiums and they have hoards of people standing around making 40k per year,
the owners are buying mansions all over the country, ...the best cars, and their kids are going to Harvard.

Your ignorance is showing. The insurance market runs among the most slim margins of any industry, around 3%. Coke, Apple...they run margins in the 15-20% range.

There are not "hoards" of people working in insurance, but the minimum number required to be competitive. Their shareholders would never stand for excess overhead.

you file a claim and they spend their efforts trying to deny it, then they look up the info and decide they can pay out 1k because you gave them 10k

Bullshit. The coverage terms are crystal clear. If you didn't take the time to understand the contract you purchased, that's your fault, not theirs. An insurance company would NEVER "pay out 1k because you gave them 10k". They only pay out because the loss is covered under the terms of the contract.

when a disaster strikes and it's time for the insurance companies to pay the piper, they declare a national disaster and public tax money pays for everything (eventually)

Again, bullshit. Cite an instance when an insurance company didn't pay a covered claim by claiming a 'national disaster'. The floor is yours.

seriously, where was this business model invented?
Shangri La?

Centuries ago in England. It worked beautifully to spread risk and minimize the devastating effects of a major loss, for individuals and companies. Still works today.

I'm guessing you've never studied business nor held a serious job. Am I right?