America doesn't have a jobs issue, WE HAVE A WAGE ISSUE.

[Markle]

I find it interesting the complete disconnect here... The correlation of wages paid is not just "what's important for the business," it's between the paying rate for labor and labor availability. If there are 100 burger flipper's then that is a labor glut, it deflates the paying worth of that labor. If there are 10 managers, that is a labor shortage which inflates the paying worth of that labor. I am baffled that folks cannot see this, simple, common, everyday correlation.

If there are 1,000 widgets on the market the selling price would be less than if there were only 500. This is the exact same concept.

I agree in principal but you forget there are exceptions to that. Look at the cost of iphones and tell me they will go down if they have a surplus of them.

Here is the problem in this comparison:

You cannot compare a commodity with people. Yes, if there is a glut of widgets on the market, the price will fall.

And similarly, if there are more people available to do a job, the price falls for their labor too, but there's a difference. If the price on the widget falls, it doesn't affect the widget's ability to provide for its family. When workers earn less than they need to support their families, it becomes a societal problem.

I wasnt comparing a widget with people. Where did you get that idea from?

When workers earn less and need to support their families I have no issue paying higher taxes so they can have a wage subsidy/welfare but making the business pay the additional cost in the form of higher wages falsely inflates the value of the employees job. If you flip burgers for a living thats not really all that valuable as most people can do that. If you can build an IP network from the ground up you are more valuable as less people can do that.

Why should I be forced to pay someone for work from which I do not benefit? Why am I responsible for their bad decisions?

 

[OnePercenter]

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

Higher wages would promote growth.

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

But to promote growth you need higher wages/wages equal to costs to create growth due to more spending.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

Increased wages promotes more sales of products and services thus increased profits.

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Why are you pro business treating their employees like commodities?

 

[OnePercenter]

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

Probably to feed themselves, family, etc instead of being on welfare.

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

You do understand that those wages in the vast majority of the US is below living wage standards.

A minimum wage is not intended for "living wage" standards. It is the price of basically untrained and unskilled labor. Taking a minimum wage job is an entry into the workforce, not the ultimate goal.

A minimum wage is not intended for "living wage" standards. It is the price of basically untrained and unskilled labor. Taking a minimum wage job is an entry into the workforce, not the ultimate goal.

So untrained and unskilled labor shouldn't make a living wage?

 

[boedicca]

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

But to promote growth you need higher wages/wages equal to costs to create growth due to more spending.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

Increased wages promotes more sales of products and services thus increased profits.

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Why are you pro business treating their employees like commodities?

I said nothing of the sort. I am pro liberty, which includes the freedom of businesses to hire workers who wish to work for the offered wages.

Why do you hate Liberty?

 

[boedicca]

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

Probably to feed themselves, family, etc instead of being on welfare.

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

You do understand that those wages in the vast majority of the US is below living wage standards.

A minimum wage is not intended for "living wage" standards. It is the price of basically untrained and unskilled labor. Taking a minimum wage job is an entry into the workforce, not the ultimate goal.

A minimum wage is not intended for "living wage" standards. It is the price of basically untrained and unskilled labor. Taking a minimum wage job is an entry into the workforce, not the ultimate goal.

So untrained and unskilled labor shouldn't make a living wage?

Untrained and unskilled labor should be free to decide for themselves at what price they will agree to work.

 

[OnePercenter]

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

Higher wages would promote growth.

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States.

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

You're being suckered.

My favorite example of your 'suckering' comes from Levi-Strauss & Company who moved operations off-shore stating they couldn't make $26.00 501's in the US. So now 501's are made in slave wage countries and selling for $60.00, but the good news is that the company has enough monies to put their name on a stadium.

Every business in this country CAN afford to pay living wages, they don't want too.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

List a business bankruptcy filing that read excessive wages as being the reason for the filing.

 

[Markle]

Yes they do. High skilled worker make good money. Burger flippers do not.

Yes they do. High skilled worker make good money. Burger flippers do not.

Without 'burger flippers,' wouldn't the restaurant fail?

They will have burger flippers either way, forced wage increases or not. The wage increase will simply speed up automation.

They will have burger flippers either way, forced wage increases or not. The wage increase will simply speed up automation.

No it won't. Automation is stuck because of technology.

Technology is not stuck. Humans are stuck. The only reason everything isnt automated yet is because it has to be phased in. As the older generation (which needs human interaction) dies out look for more and more automation.

Technology is not stuck. Humans are stuck. The only reason everything isnt automated yet is because it has to be phased in. As the older generation (which needs human interaction) dies out look for more and more automation.

Technology is stuck because human's haven't figured out a way to advance it. Do you think for one minute if their was a burger flipping robot that someone, somewhere, wouldn't be using it?

WOW...I am shocked...SHOCKED I SAY that humans need interaction. What that has to do with robots...I have no clue. American car makers were crushed by imports because the American Auto Unions fought automation (robots) tooth and nail. That and many other things they demanded and were given.

Your comment that it is THE OLDER GENERATION (me) is holding up automation is showing you as a fool.

 

[Markle]

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States.

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

You're being suckered.

My favorite example of your 'suckering' comes from Levi-Strauss & Company who moved operations off-shore stating they couldn't make $26.00 501's in the US. So now 501's are made in slave wage countries and selling for $60.00, but the good news is that the company has enough monies to put their name on a stadium.

Every business in this country CAN afford to pay living wages, they don't want too.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

List a business bankruptcy filing that read excessive wages as being the reason for the filing.

General Motors, Chrysler would be two that come to mind without even looking.

 

[boedicca]

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States.

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

You're being suckered.

My favorite example of your 'suckering' comes from Levi-Strauss & Company who moved operations off-shore stating they couldn't make $26.00 501's in the US. So now 501's are made in slave wage countries and selling for $60.00, but the good news is that the company has enough monies to put their name on a stadium.

Every business in this country CAN afford to pay living wages, they don't want too.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

Your sentence is incomplete. They don't want to... lose money and go out of business.

List a business bankruptcy filing that read excessive wages as being the reason for the filing.

Easy peasy lemon squeezy: General Motors. The liabilities owed under union contracts were a major cause of insolvency.

On the March 30, 2009 deadline President Barack Obama declined to provide financial aid to General Motors, and requested that General Motors produce credible plans, saying that the company's proposals had avoided tough decisions, and that Chapter 11 bankruptcy appeared the most promising way to reduce its debts, by allowing the courts to compel bondholders and trade unions into settlements.[24] GM Chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner was also forced to resign.[25] GM bondholders rejected the government's first offer, but the unions agreed to the preferential terms.[26] A bondholder debt to equity counteroffer was ignored.[27]...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_Chapter_11_reorganization#cite_note-27

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_Chapter_11_reorganization

 

[Markle]

I agree it would be a wage subsidy. However, how do you rationalize paying people more than what they produce? Think about it for a minute. I own a company and I sell widgets that cost me $10 for raw material to build. I sell them at $20. Now I have to pay my employee that pushes the widgets down the assembly line $11. Why should i bother being in business?

You're asking the wrong question:

How much will the wage increase increase your production costs on a per unit basis? If the employee can process 60 widgets an hour, then the $3.00 per hour increase, adds 5 cents to the cost of your widget. You have the choice of adding the 5 cents to the price of your widgets, or absorbing it.

I get your point but human nature tells me there is no guarantee my employee will work faster and in fact he may actually get comfortable and slow down.

I get your point but human nature tells me there is no guarantee my employee will work faster and in fact he may actually get comfortable and slow down.

An employer can eliminate that problem by hiring correctly and placing employee retention programs.

Obviously, you have never worked for a large corporation where management is transferred. I worked for a large retailer. Before coming to Tallahassee I worked basically as a trouble shooter. If a manager was fired, I went in to get the store back on its feet. In the first month, I would fire 10-20 percent of the employees and give raises to the rest. The message never failed to get across to the employees.

 

[Mr Natural]

"Prosperity Through Lower Wages!"

 

[fbj]

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

Because there is nothing else available due to employers treating their employees like commodities.

Don't give me there is nothing else available BS. That's a loser mentality

 

[fbj]

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

Probably to feed themselves, family, etc instead of being on welfare.

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

Why not apply for $9.00 or $10.00 an hour? Why settle for minimum wage?

You do understand that those wages in the vast majority of the US is below living wage standards.

Well any normal adult should AIM for wages higher than minimum wage

 

[Dragonlady]

WOW...I am shocked...SHOCKED I SAY that humans need interaction. What that has to do with robots...I have no clue. American car makers were crushed by imports because the American Auto Unions fought automation (robots) tooth and nail. That and many other things they demanded and were given.

Your comment that it is THE OLDER GENERATION (me) is holding up automation is showing you as a fool.

American automobiles were crushed by imports because the US didn't force the Big 3 to comform to the higher mileage and emission standards being required in the rest of the world. American auto manufacturers fell behind in the technology that the rest of the world was developing, and their cars weren't selling as a result. The cars were simply not up to the rest of the world's standards. This had nothing to do with robotics.

 

[Markle]

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

Higher wages would promote growth.

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States.

Your lack of comprehension is duly noted!

As you intentionally posted: "Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States" is a lie, I did not post that phrase did I?

I posted: "FORCED higher wages would crash the growth."

Your desperation is duly noted!

 

[Markle]

why the **** would a grown person apply for a minimum wage job? WHY?

Probably to feed themselves, family, etc instead of being on welfare.

Nope, only one reason. THEY made bad decisions all their life and are now in the exact place where they made plans to be.

What percentage of workers, earning the minimum wage, are the sole earners in their household?

 

[WillowTree]

WOW...I am shocked...SHOCKED I SAY that humans need interaction. What that has to do with robots...I have no clue. American car makers were crushed by imports because the American Auto Unions fought automation (robots) tooth and nail. That and many other things they demanded and were given.

Your comment that it is THE OLDER GENERATION (me) is holding up automation is showing you as a fool.

American automobiles were crushed by imports because the US didn't force the Big 3 to comform to the higher mileage and emission standards being required in the rest of the world. American auto manufacturers fell behind in the technology that the rest of the world was developing, and their cars weren't selling as a result. The cars were simply not up to the rest of the world's standards. This had nothing to do with robotics.

The unions priced themselves out of a job. They have no one to blame but themselves.

 

[Markle]

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

America doesn't have a Wage issue, it has a Lack of Growth one.

Higher wages would promote growth.

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

FORCED higher wages would crash the growth. Keep in mind, Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama is the first president in history to NOT have a single year of his administration with a growth rate of over 3% and it was all of... 0.5 percent this past quarter. Dismal!

Higher wages have NEVER crashed growth in the United States.

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

Poppycock. Uneconomically viable costs of labor deter growth. We have that already in the forms of requiring Union Labor, Regulations, and Taxes. I bet you whinge that Multinationals have moved labor offshore. Now why would they do that if Higher Wages cause growth?

You're being suckered.

My favorite example of your 'suckering' comes from Levi-Strauss & Company who moved operations off-shore stating they couldn't make $26.00 501's in the US. So now 501's are made in slave wage countries and selling for $60.00, but the good news is that the company has enough monies to put their name on a stadium.

Every business in this country CAN afford to pay living wages, they don't want too.

What year was that when Levi said they could not make $26.00 jeans?

Every worker EARNS what they are paid. Why should a manufacturing company pay more?

 

[Markle]

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

B'loney. Growth begets higher wages as demand for labor increases. If spending more for something that it is worth (i.e., Porkulus Stimulus programs) begat growth, our economy would be growing at a very rapid pace by now. It's not. So you fail.

But to promote growth you need higher wages/wages equal to costs to create growth due to more spending.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

You have it backwards, bub.

To promote higher growth, investors must believe they can earn a reasonable return in order to invest capital. Arbitrarily raising wages above what productivity levels can support only suppresses expected returns and discourages investment. What you advocate destroys growth.

Increased wages promotes more sales of products and services thus increased profits.

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Then why not just have the government print money and give it away so that people can buy products and services?

Why are you pro business treating their employees like commodities?

If you do not like how you are treated at your job, quit and find another job. Easy to do if you have made RESPONSIBLE DECISIONS and are a value to your employer.

 

[Markle]

"Prosperity Through Lower Wages!"

Send your thank you letter to Lame Duck President Barack Hussein Obama.