Almost 80 million with employer health care plans could have coverage canceled

[WelfareQueen]

You know g5000 is so completely full of shit it is laughable. He calls the OP's thread "bogus," yet he presents no evidence. I call him on it and he says nothing....and he has nothing.

Then he says if your employer based plan gets cancelled you will automatically get something better. I say, "but wait, the President said if I like my plan, I can keep my plan." Is the President a liar?

Again silence.

Any idiot can deny shit or make shit up. This is a message board where you present your opinion or ideas. If you cannot defend them in any way they are basically worthless. Just saying.....

I referred you to the posts I made with the evidence which solidly debunks Fox News' claim. Even provided a link.

Nice try.

You have not responded to a single post I have made nor have you provided any evidence to back up any of your claims. Post any link you have I will read them. I don't make shit up. I like facts. Bring 'em on.

 

[Vox]

I for the life of me can not understand what is going through the head of someone who doesn't take into account whether or not someone can actually afford to "improve" or "upgrade" from their current plan. Whether that be an individual or a group, or an employer.

it's like the twilight zone with this.

that is the denial mode - they understand that obamacare crap has failed but can not consciously admiti it "because obama".

 

[g5000]

I've said every time this bullshit meme comes up, GO TALK TO YOUR HR DEPARTMENT.

Don't just take my word for it.

Most of you will find your company lost its grandfather status a while ago, just as the Obama adminstration predicted would happen by the END OF 2013.

And yet your company has not cancelled your insurance, and has no intention of doing so, unlike the lie Fox News is feeding you. 80 million people are not walking around having lost their insurance from their employer.

 

[g5000]

Fox, CNN, The New York Times, Forbes, The National Review, etc are not lying. If you don't like Fox read the link to the National Review story I posted above.

You saying something is not true is worth exactly nothing. Comment on the specifics of the story. Then there can be a real discussion. Otherwise, it is utter bullshit.

They are all based on a bullshit story in Forbes a couple weeks ago. That's how much incest there is in the hack media. They all parrot each other. If you are stupid enough to think seeing the same lie repeated enough times makes it true, I can't help you.

 

[WelfareQueen]

For the mentally challenged, I will repeat myself. Again.

The FACTS are that, in 2010, the Obama Administration predicted that 40 to 66 percent of businesses which sponsor health insurance for their employees would lose their grandfather status between 2011 and 2013. Those companies which provided health insurance to their employees before the enactment of the ACA were grandfathered from having to meet the minimum requirements of the ACA. But if they substantially changed their polices after enactment, they lost their grandfather status.


Got that? Would lose their grandfather status, NOT cancel their policies. And the period was from 2011 to the end of 2013. That is what the Obama Adminstration was talking about in the federal register. Go and look for yourselves. They never predictied 80 million people would lose their insurance. Faux News is lying to you. Flat out lying.

But then anyone who listens to Faux News deserves to be lied to.

Well, here we are, the end of 2013. A lot of companies have lost their grandfather status. Have 80 million people been disenrolled from employer sponsored health insurance?


Nope.


Have you bothered to go to your HR department and ask about this?

Probably not. Because you think Faux News is telling you the fair and balanced truth.

Many of you who have employer sponsored insurance may very well be working for a company that has already lost its grandfather status, and yet your company has no intention of cancelling your insurance.

The "experts" who wrote this hack piece of shit don't understand even the simplest workings of this program.

Most companies which sponsor insurance for their employees already provide insurance which EXCEEDS the requirements of the ACA. If they made a change to their policies since the enactment of the ACA, they lost their grandfather status. That DOES NOT automatically imply they will suddenly decide to stop insuring you, and it DOES NOT automatically mean they fall below ACA standards.

Go to your HR department. Don't take the word of Faux News, for chrissakes.

Here is the link to the Federal Register: http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2010-06-17/pdf/2010-14488.pdf

Read it, and see for yourselves.

Under this assumption, the Departments’ mid-range estimate is that
66 percent of small employer plans and 45 percent of large employer plans will
relinquish their grandfather status by the end of 2013. The low-end estimates
are for 49 percent and 34 percent of small and large employer plans,
respectively, to have relinquished grandfather status, and the high-end
estimates are 80 percent and 64 percent, respectively.

The words "cancel" nor "cancelled" appear anywhere in the Register.

Here is what Fox News just claimed:

In fact, according to the Federal Register, its mid-range estimate was that by the end of 2014, 76 percent of small group plans would be cancelled, along with 55 percent of large employer plans.

You now can see Fox News lied. Flat out lied.

Stop regurgitating the piss of hack media outlets, or else you deserve to be lied to as much as a reader of the National Enquirer, and are just as gullible.

Grandfathered...cancelled....what is the difference? All of this was stopped because Obama illegally delayed the employer mandate for a year and is not forcing companies to comply with HHS regs....for now.

Address those questions please.

 

[g5000]

Internal Obama Administration numbers have been found saying 55% of people with employer sponsored insurance will lose their plans as soon as the employer mandate kicks in.

Prove this claim.

Show me the evidence.

I have linked to the Federal Register for you, so it should be a piece of cake to quote from it to prove your claim.

 

[Vox]

g, what does 'lose grandfather status' mean?

it means the cancellation of the policies you like.

But don't expect the obamabots to admit it.

Now he claims "as the administration predicted it" - but the administration LIED all the way up yo October 1 "if you like your plan -you will keep it ".

And I can bet during those years all obamabots, including g were singing the same tune

 

[WelfareQueen]

Fox, CNN, The New York Times, Forbes, The National Review, etc are not lying. If you don't like Fox read the link to the National Review story I posted above.

You saying something is not true is worth exactly nothing. Comment on the specifics of the story. Then there can be a real discussion. Otherwise, it is utter bullshit.

They are all based on a bullshit story in Forbes a couple weeks ago.

You calling it bullshit means absolutely nothing. All of the news organizations reporting this story are reputable. A number of well respected think tanks have all reached the same conclusions. Should we trust you, or the about two dozen news outlets and think tanks that have studied and reported on the issue?

 

[william the wie]

If those plans aren't up to aca regulation specs, how do you reconcile that they will be allowed to keep their plans? I cover 49 employees and the plan that I have offered, through a small business pact with several other owners, doesn't satisfy those standards.

Some things you might find useful:

Open for enrollment now, small employers with generally up to 50 employees will have access to the new health care insurance marketplaces through the Small Business Health Options Program (SHOP). Currently, small businesses may pay on average 18% more than big businesses for health insurance because of administrative costs. SHOP offers small employers increased purchasing power to obtain a better choice of high-quality coverage at a lower cost. Costs are lowered because small employers can pool their risk. To enroll, eligible employers must have an office within the service area of the SHOP and offer SHOP coverage to all full-time employees. In 2016, employers with up to 100 employees will be able to participate in SHOP.

SBA.gov

I've checked that out and am looking into an intermediary way of offering health insurance to my employees by circumventing the aca. I've hired legal counsel and so far its looks like it may be possible. Im about to cross the threshold of 50.

Your lawyer may have problems. The word I am getting is that the lack of case law and other court decisions is so bad that hard numbers on different options don't really exist yet. Because compliant non-exchange policies and different ways of running compliant medical care has not yet made it through the courts moving what operations you can to a non-compliant state and using a labor contractor at all sites is probably the safety play until the situation clears up.

 

[g5000]

So Fox News is lying? Right. How about Forbes, CNN, the New York Times or The National Review among many others. Why do liberals always lie? It is easy to google the story and get the real facts, but libtards would rather lie like their Messiah. Here is another source saying exactly the same thing.


In 2010, Administration Predicted 'Majority' of Employer-Based Health Plans Would Disappear | National Review Online

Show me the New York Times and CNN reporting this.

 

[boedicca]

For the mentally challenged, I will repeat myself. Again.

The FACTS are that, in 2010, the Obama Administration predicted that 40 to 66 percent of businesses which sponsor health insurance for their employees would lose their grandfather status between 2011 and 2013. Those companies which provided health insurance to their employees before the enactment of the ACA were grandfathered from having to meet the minimum requirements of the ACA. But if they substantially changed their polices after enactment, they lost their grandfather status.


Got that? Would lose their grandfather status, NOT cancel their policies. And the period was from 2011 to the end of 2013. That is what the Obama Adminstration was talking about in the federal register. Go and look for yourselves. They never predictied 80 million people would lose their insurance. Faux News is lying to you. Flat out lying.

But then anyone who listens to Faux News deserves to be lied to.

Well, here we are, the end of 2013. A lot of companies have lost their grandfather status. Have 80 million people been disenrolled from employer sponsored health insurance?


Nope.


Have you bothered to go to your HR department and ask about this?

Probably not. Because you think Faux News is telling you the fair and balanced truth.

Many of you who have employer sponsored insurance may very well be working for a company that has already lost its grandfather status, and yet your company has no intention of cancelling your insurance.

The "experts" who wrote this hack piece of shit don't understand even the simplest workings of this program.

Most companies which sponsor insurance for their employees already provide insurance which EXCEEDS the requirements of the ACA. If they made a change to their policies since the enactment of the ACA, they lost their grandfather status. That DOES NOT automatically imply they will suddenly decide to stop insuring you, and it DOES NOT automatically mean they fall below ACA standards.

Go to your HR department. Don't take the word of Faux News, for chrissakes.

Here is the link to the Federal Register: http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2010-06-17/pdf/2010-14488.pdf

Read it, and see for yourselves.

Under this assumption, the Departments’ mid-range estimate is that
66 percent of small employer plans and 45 percent of large employer plans will
relinquish their grandfather status by the end of 2013. The low-end estimates
are for 49 percent and 34 percent of small and large employer plans,
respectively, to have relinquished grandfather status, and the high-end
estimates are 80 percent and 64 percent, respectively.

The words "cancel" nor "cancelled" appear anywhere in the Register.

Here is what Fox News just claimed:

In fact, according to the Federal Register, its mid-range estimate was that by the end of 2014, 76 percent of small group plans would be cancelled, along with 55 percent of large employer plans.

You now can see Fox News lied. Flat out lied.

Stop regurgitating the piss of hack media outlets, or else you deserve to be lied to as much as a reader of the National Enquirer, and are just as gullible.

You are a blithering idiot engaged in transparent sophistry.

Losing grandfather status means plans are not acceptable to the government. That is why millions are being cancelled. Companies are not going to be able to absorb the impact of not having "approved" plans. Given how the Obama administration has no respect for the law, replacing it with the whim of the bureaucrat, most companies will not put themselves at risk for retaliation by continuing with non-grandfathered plans.

 

[g5000]

Fox, CNN, The New York Times, Forbes, The National Review, etc are not lying. If you don't like Fox read the link to the National Review story I posted above.

You saying something is not true is worth exactly nothing. Comment on the specifics of the story. Then there can be a real discussion. Otherwise, it is utter bullshit.

They are all based on a bullshit story in Forbes a couple weeks ago.

You calling it bullshit means absolutely nothing. All of the news organizations reporting this story are reputable. A number of well respected think tanks have all reached the same conclusions. Should we trust you, or the about two dozen news outlets and think tanks that have studied and reported on the issue?

"Think tanks". BWA-HA-HA-HA. They are partisan organizations.

I have already disproven Fox News claims. Several times. I cannot help it if you are too retarded to comprehend the evidence right in front of your eyes.

NOW SHOW ME THE EVIDENCE THE OBAMA ADMINSTRATION SAID THERE COULD BE UP TO 80 MILLION CANCELLATIONS.

Do you need the link to the Federal Register again on which all this bullshit is based?

 

[TakeAStepBack]

g, what does 'lose grandfather status' mean?

Exactly. G is desperately clinging to a game of semantics.

"It doesn't say any where that plans would be cancelled! It says the grandfather status will be lost. Huge difference, brah!"

 

[WelfareQueen]

Internal Obama Administration numbers have been found saying 55% of people with employer sponsored insurance will lose their plans as soon as the employer mandate kicks in.

Prove this claim.

Show me the evidence.

I have linked to the Federal Register for you, so it should be a piece of cake to quote from it to prove your claim.

The Federal Register is the source of all the data, as well as Dept of Justice Briefs saying the majority of employer based plans will be cancelled. I have proved that infromation countless times. That figure is in multiple media reports. The evidence has been provided over and over again. Read it for yourself.

 

[g5000]

Losing grandfather status means plans are not acceptable to the government.

Wrong.

You have no clue.

Losing grandfather status means they changed their policy to the point it is no longer the one which was grandfathered. It does not automatically mean they do not meet the ACA minimum standards.

 

[Zoom-boing]

g, what does 'lose grandfather status' mean?

it means the cancellation of the policies you like.

But don't expect the obamabots to admit it.

Now he claims "as the administration predicted it" - but the administration LIED all the way up yo October 1 "if you like your plan -you will keep it ".

And I can bet during those years all obamabots, including g were singing the same tune

Was hoping g would have answered this.

 

[boedicca]

So Fox News is lying? Right. How about Forbes, CNN, the New York Times or The National Review among many others. Why do liberals always lie? It is easy to google the story and get the real facts, but libtards would rather lie like their Messiah. Here is another source saying exactly the same thing.


In 2010, Administration Predicted 'Majority' of Employer-Based Health Plans Would Disappear | National Review Online

Show me the New York Times and CNN reporting this.

We don't need to see that. The FEDERAL REGISTER includes that information.

Back in 2010, the Obama Administration estimated that millions of plans would lose the grandfathered status, making all of Obama's keep your plan statements utter lies.

% of Employer Plans losing grandfathered status in 2013:

Low estimate: 39%
Mid estimate: 51%
High estimate: 69%

The Magnitude of the Lie | The Blog on Obama: White House Dossier


If Obama had told the truth, it is highly likely he would not be President today. He lied to get reelected - and even worse, led a scheme to defraud American citizens.

 

[g5000]

Once again, go to your HR department and ask them what "grandfather status" means and how it affects your company with respect to the ACA.

Most companies meet or exceed the ACA's minimum standards, so losing grandfather status means nothing. They do not have to raise their standards to meet the ACA since they already exceed it, and always have, before there even was an ACA.

 

[WelfareQueen]

g5000...I'm done. People can read the OP's story. There can read the National review story. Here is a link from a google search of hundreds of stories from reputable news outlets all saying the same thing. Enormous millions will lose their employer based coverage. (I provided this because either you cannot read or do not know how to use a search engine).


https://www.google.com/search?hl=en...0.0.0.0.78.78.1.1.0...0.0...1ac.2.SwPxAgSzHPA

 

[Zoom-boing]

Losing grandfather status means plans are not acceptable to the government.

Wrong.

You have no clue.

Losing grandfather status means they changed their policy to the point it is no longer the one which was grandfathered. It does not automatically mean they do not meet the ACA minimum standards.

Right. So what happens to the plans that are no longer grandfathered if they do not meet (un)aca 'standards'?