Airbus Criticizes USAF!!

[Navy1960]

SEVILLE, SPAIN — European Aeronautic Defense and Space said Tuesday that the U.S. Air Force’s latest specifications for a $50 billion contract to build aerial-refueling tankers would not yield any significant technological improvement on the capabilities of America’s already outdated tanker fleet.

The European plane maker and its U.S. partner, Northrop Grumman, have said they would withdraw from the competition if the rules were not revised, a position that Sean O’Keefe, the new head of EADS’s North American operations, reiterated Tuesday.

“The current draft request for proposals is not a tanker modernization program, it is just a replacement program” for the existing fleet of Eisenhower-era U.S. tankers, Mr. O’Keefe told journalists.

Airbus Criticizes Latest U.S. Air Force Specs for Refueling Tanker - NYTimes.com


I don't know where many stand on this issue, but as Airbus has recently lost in the WTO for providing illegal subsidies for it's aircraft development a withdrawl from the RFP would be the best thing that could ever happen to FINALLY get much needed tankers to the USAF.

 

[Xenophon]

What will happen is Boeing's substandard tankers will get the contracts, and the Grumman workers of gerogia will get fucked.

 

[Navy1960]

Gomg to have to disagree with you on this one Xeno for a few reasons, one is that Boeing has over 50 years of experience in Aerial Refueling and the technology that goes along with that. The other thing is that EADS will do final assembly on the KC-45 in Mobile on already completed airframes that are built in Toulouse France. The aircraft are 2 very different aircraft, with the the only difference being the size of the aircraft. That by itself brings a lot of issues in terms of infrastructure etc. If the USAF wanted a Tanker of that size then Boeing can offer the KC-777 which is a far superior aircraft to the EADS aircraft. Here is something else you many not know.

ST. LOUIS, Sept. 21, 2007 -- The Boeing Company [NYSE: BA] today announced that Georgia will benefit from an estimated 600 direct and indirect jobs if it is selected to build the U.S. Air Force's new tanker aircraft fleet. The economic activity generated in Georgia will exceed an estimated $25 million annually.

"A KC-767 Tanker win will undoubtedly benefit Georgia's aerospace industry and business community,'' said George M. Israel, president and CEO of the Georgia Chamber of Commerce. "Georgia's workforce is energized about the KC-767 program and the positive impact it will bring to our state.''

Boeing formally submitted its proposal to the Air Force on April 10. The offering, the KC-767 Advanced Tanker, is designed for aerial refueling of other aircraft, but also is able to move cargo, passengers, patients and medical crewmembers. These capabilities, combined with best-in-competition fuel efficiency, global flexibility and space usage, provide a strong value proposition to the Air Force.
Boeing: Boeing KC-767 Tanker Win Would Benefit Georgia Economy

 

[Xenophon]

You do know that Boeing was hit with massive penalties for lying about this, right?

Its also a red state/blue state fight, Boeing means blue state jobs, Grumman is red state jobs.

The last time this came up the Air Force made it clear it wanted the Grumman planes, that they felt the Boening stuff was inferior.

 

[Contessa_Sharra]

What will happen is Boeing's substandard tankers will get the contracts, and the Grumman workers of gerogia will get fucked.

Business is business, oh well, and maybe going with a design that seems to have been working and replacing very old planes (metal fatigue and other issues of age in aircraft) is the way to go. If the design is effective....

Somehow I see all new designs as untried promises that may have massive cost overruns. Isn't that how these guys make the real money?

 

[Xenophon]

And defense industry will be a money pit for the gov, there is no disputing that.

 

[Navy1960]

Actually do you know that its more like a purple state issue, in that with a reward of a Tanker to EADS and make no mistake this is an A-330 airframe , your looking at the loss of jobs not only in red states but in places like Texas, Arizona, Oklahoma, Kansas, and yes Washington. Further I will remind you that a few years prior to the selection of the Airbus aircraft and make not mistake it's NOT a Grumman aircraft the USAF selected the KC-767. The problem with this RFP in general for both sides of this issue is that it keeps changing with each protest/cancellation/ and then new RFP. I do tend to think though that if the USAF is ever to get a replacement for the KC-135 it may require a split-buy because you and I both know what will happen should this contract be awarded to Boeing. It will be protested , then a long drawn out process will begin again. The only loser here really is the warfighter. I submit at this point perhaps that is the only viable solution. It is not a matter of which aircraft is better than the other, because they both offer different mission capabilites. If Boeing were to offer the KC-777 then the KC-45 becomes the smaller aircraft, if the primary mission is a MRTT mission. I submit that if the USAF can fly the KC-10 and the KC-135, then perhaps in order to replace a 50 year old airframe that si not getting any younger, the best solution is to fly both of them.

 

[Navy1960]

If we are looking at the 2 aircraft ...

This capable aircraft is based on the highly successful A330 airliner, and is a derivative of the tanker/transport aircraft already selected for service in the air forces of Australia, United Kingdom, United Arab Emirates and Saudi Arabia. The KC-45 provides a total air mobility solution – with exceptional capacity for in-flight refueling, plus full flexibility in cargo delivery, passenger transport, aeromedical evacuation, and other missions



Boeing delivered the last of four KC-767 aerial refueling tankers to the Japan Ministry of Defense on Jan. 8, the company announced Tuesday.

"Providing Japan with the fourth and final KC-767 tanker on-schedule and on-cost, as we did the previous two KC-767s, means a great deal to our company and our relationship with this important customer," Dennis Muilenburg, president and CEO of Boeing Defense, Space & Security, said in a news release.

Boeing delivers fourth and final Japanese tanker


Boeing is building four KC-767 tanker aircraft for Italy. Boeing continues to perform a comprehensive flight test program for Italy's KC-767 and limits discussions about the results from these continuing tests to our Italian customer to keep them fully informed on our progress. We are making good progress on maturing the tanker and look forward to fielding the first Italy tankers to the Italian Air Force. Fuel the fight. Anytime. Anywhere.
Boeing: GlobalTanker - Italy

See what I mean? both these aircraft if they are good enough for other nations then they are good enough for the USAF which deserves the very best and I fear that based on all the controversy around this will only mean both aircraft.