Abusive relationships - two points of view

[Luddly Neddite]

Photographer as Witness: A Portrait of Domestic Violence - LightBox
Slide show at the link.

N.H. GOPer: ?A lot of people like being in abusive relationships? - Salon.com

State Rep. Mark Warden said that "people are always free to leave" abusive relationships

 

[Luddly Neddite]

This slideshow is linked from the first slide show -

I Am Unbeatable: Donna Ferrato?s Commitment to Abused Women - LightBox

 

[Katzndogz]

No one knows why women choose to stay in abusive relationships. I've known MANY. One in particular was especially troubling. After months of leaving and going back, I never heard from the woman again. I assume she was murdered. I expected it.

VAWA does not help women in abusive relationships. It was ill designed and ill conceived. It just sounds good. It has a nice protective title when it does no such thing. I've seen VAWA intentionally used for personal gain, without regard as to the harm caused. Expecting and intending the harm caused. The expanded version of VAWA doesn't even require a domestic relationship. Or, even a relationship at all.

 

[AmyNation]

I agree with him.


A relationship takes two people, and sometimes its abusive because both people are dysfunctional. Some people do like being in abusive relationships.

 

[editec]

And many more people attempting to escape abusive relationship end up dead.

Murder
Women are more likely than men to be murdered by an intimate partner. Of those killed by an intimate partner, about three quarters are female and about a quarter are male. In 1999 in the United States, 1,218 women and 424 men were killed by an intimate partner,[30] and 1,181 females and 329 males were killed by their intimate partners in 2005.[31][32]

 

[Luddly Neddite]

What's wrong is that he is using that opinion to "reduce the penalty for assault".

Whether or not the abused person gets something out of the abuse, the abuse (physical assault) should be illegal on its own.

This touches on the reason I disagree with "hate crime" laws. IMO, its the act that should be illegal, not the motivation.

Therefore, he is wrong.

 

[AmyNation]

And many more people attempting to escape abusive relationship end up dead.

Murder
Women are more likely than men to be murdered by an intimate partner. Of those killed by an intimate partner, about three quarters are female and about a quarter are male. In 1999 in the United States, 1,218 women and 424 men were killed by an intimate partner,[30] and 1,181 females and 329 males were killed by their intimate partners in 2005.[31][32]

Just to clarify, those stats don't back up your statement. They only show people who were murdered by a partner, not people who were murdered attempting to leave an abusive relationship. They also refute your "many more" ,1200 is a very very, small number when you factor the number of people living in the United States.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

And many more people attempting to escape abusive relationship end up dead.

Murder
Women are more likely than men to be murdered by an intimate partner. Of those killed by an intimate partner, about three quarters are female and about a quarter are male. In 1999 in the United States, 1,218 women and 424 men were killed by an intimate partner,[30] and 1,181 females and 329 males were killed by their intimate partners in 2005.[31][32]

My "thanks" button is MIA again but please consider yourself thanked.

I've read that leaving is the most dangerous time and I've seen it firsthand. The abuse victim cannot depend on law enforcement for help. In a case I know of firsthand, the woman who was leaving went to the sheriff's dept and asked if they would just stand by while she got her belongings out of the house. They told her that since she had never signed a complaint against her husband for past abuse, they would not.

And, of course, as any abuse victim will tell you, signing a complaint against your abuser is a really good way to get the crap beat out of you.

Its easy to blame the abuse victim for staying but its not usually easy for him/her to leave.

 

[ArmyCowboy]

I agree with him.


A relationship takes two people, and sometimes its abusive because both people are dysfunctional. Some people do like being in abusive relationships.

I'm not sure 'like' is the right word, but I understand your meaning.

Generally, those who stay in abusive relationships either had parents who were in that type of relationship or have low self-esteem issues so that they think they deserve to be treated like they are.

 

[AmyNation]

Ok, I've read what they are attempting to do.

N.H. bill would reduce simple assault from misdemeanor to violation in some cases | Concord Monitor

I can see both sides of the argument. You can serve up to a year in jail for simple physical contact that results in no harm to another person. So, in the article the example they give is tapping (I assume in anger) a person on the shoulder, and now you're facing jail time.

However, I don't agree in reducing simple assault(which is physical contact that results in no harm to another person) to a violation only. Just like a year in jail is not a valid punishment for tapping someone on the shoulder, I can see many instances where a violation would not be a valid punishment for, say throwing someone around, shoving, grabbing, dragging etc... Lots of contact can be violent without causing harm.

 

[AmyNation]

I agree with him.


A relationship takes two people, and sometimes its abusive because both people are dysfunctional. Some people do like being in abusive relationships.

I'm not sure 'like' is the right word, but I understand your meaning.

Generally, those who stay in abusive relationships either had parents who were in that type of relationship or have low self-esteem issues so that they think they deserve to be treated like they are.

Some people like being a victim. I've known women personally who feed off of that type of relationship. Where they not only seek abusive men, but will do anything in their power to push a man into violence.

 

[Katzndogz]

I don't blame law enforcement for not getting involved. Many times the officer will confront the abuser only to have the abused wife turn on them. Domestic violence situations are the most dangerous calls for the police to go on simply because they never know when they will come under attack or by whom.

Even when an abused woman and it is mostly women, get out of an abusive relationship they normally go back. There are various reasons for this. Sometimes they simply like the excitement abuse brings into their lives. It's a rush. Evil Kneivel had broken every bone in his body, yet still took those risks. Some women are like that.

Some women believe the endless promises that it will never happen again. They'll say "He really loves me, he won't hurt me again."

Some women believe they are in control and have the power. "I can make him change. I can love him so much that he will change for me."

The most painful ones are the women who have gotten out of terribly abusive relationships. When confronted by the abuser, the abuser says the magic words "Come back or you will never see me again". It never fails to get the woman rushing back.

 

[Katzndogz]

I agree with him.


A relationship takes two people, and sometimes its abusive because both people are dysfunctional. Some people do like being in abusive relationships.

I'm not sure 'like' is the right word, but I understand your meaning.

Generally, those who stay in abusive relationships either had parents who were in that type of relationship or have low self-esteem issues so that they think they deserve to be treated like they are.

Some people like being a victim. I've known women personally who feed off of that type of relationship. Where they not only seek abusive men, but will do anything in their power to push a man into violence.

It goes further than that. When such a woman meets a man who isn't abusive they aren't interested. He's boring.

 

[Katzndogz]

Ok, I've read what they are attempting to do.

N.H. bill would reduce simple assault from misdemeanor to violation in some cases | Concord Monitor

I can see both sides of the argument. You can serve up to a year in jail for simple physical contact that results in no harm to another person. So, in the article the example they give is tapping (I assume in anger) a person on the shoulder, and now you're facing jail time.

However, I don't agree in reducing simple assault(which is physical contact that results in no harm to another person) to a violation only. Just like a year in jail is not a valid punishment for tapping someone on the shoulder, I can see many instances where a violation would not be a valid punishment for, say throwing someone around, shoving, grabbing, dragging etc... Lots of contact can be violent without causing harm.

The expanded law includes hurtful language as domestic violence too.

 

[martybegan]

And many more people attempting to escape abusive relationship end up dead.

Murder
Women are more likely than men to be murdered by an intimate partner. Of those killed by an intimate partner, about three quarters are female and about a quarter are male. In 1999 in the United States, 1,218 women and 424 men were killed by an intimate partner,[30] and 1,181 females and 329 males were killed by their intimate partners in 2005.[31][32]

My "thanks" button is MIA again but please consider yourself thanked.

I've read that leaving is the most dangerous time and I've seen it firsthand. The abuse victim cannot depend on law enforcement for help. In a case I know of firsthand, the woman who was leaving went to the sheriff's dept and asked if they would just stand by while she got her belongings out of the house. They told her that since she had never signed a complaint against her husband for past abuse, they would not.

And, of course, as any abuse victim will tell you, signing a complaint against your abuser is a really good way to get the crap beat out of you.

Its easy to blame the abuse victim for staying but its not usually easy for him/her to leave.

All the more reason for women to be armed. If the police can't help you, you have to help yourself.

 

[Polk]

This may be one of the worst threads I've ever seen. That you guys are so willing to defend abuse is horrifying.

 

[AmyNation]

No one is defending abuse. However I don't subscribe to the notion that every women who stays in an abusive relationship is an innocent victim, and that every man who hits is a monster.

Life is more complicated than that.

 

[ArmyCowboy]

I agree with him.


A relationship takes two people, and sometimes its abusive because both people are dysfunctional. Some people do like being in abusive relationships.

I'm not sure 'like' is the right word, but I understand your meaning.

Generally, those who stay in abusive relationships either had parents who were in that type of relationship or have low self-esteem issues so that they think they deserve to be treated like they are.

Some people like being a victim. I've known women personally who feed off of that type of relationship. Where they not only seek abusive men, but will do anything in their power to push a man into violence.

The women who try to push men to violence like playing the victim, but it's really about control. Ie, they are in control because they can make a man do that.

Again, I know what you're saying here, and I know I'm splitting hairs. Just think that 'like' is the wrong word.

 

[Polk]

Mental illness doesn't justify abuse, but that's the argument you're effectively making. If you are being assaulted, you are a victim. Full stop.

 

[martybegan]

This may be one of the worst threads I've ever seen. That you guys are so willing to defend abuse is horrifying.

It needs no outside "defense." Some women in abusive relationships are perfectly capable of defending it (in thier own minds).

I grew up with a "rescue" house run by nuns for abused women. Half the battle the nuns had was to prevent these women from calling the abusers and thus revealing thier location.