AAAARGH...another stupid jury decision

[Moi]

I hope that these people are not going to get much in the way of punitive damages. I just don't understand how a jury can decide the the cigarette manufacturers (who, by the way, are not selling an illegal substance) are responsible and award any damages to someone who smoked for 45 years! 64% of the time after the warnings were issued which, in other liability issues would have at least given him the majority of the blame.

It is beyond my imagination why society continually allows people to abdicate responsibility for their actions.

It didn't work so well for alcohol or marijuana or other illegal drugs (I just don't believe that society has suffered less for having outlawed these substances, given how many people die as a result of the illegal drug trades) or any other voluntary behavior. If you don't want to suffer the consequences, don't participate in the behavior!



http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...10&u=/ap/20031219/ap_on_re_us/smoking_lawsuit

 

[jimnyc]

They should just give all of us smokers 100k now and I'll agree not to sue in the future.

 

[lilcountriegal]

Thats just ridiculous. I'm a wanna-be non-smoker. I've been smoking for 15 years now. I know its dangerous, I know if I dont stop, it'll eventually kill me. It is an addiction, however, not a 200K addiction. Every smoker knows it's harmful to their health, if they dont want to get sick, quit.

Whats next? An alcoholic suing Aneheiser Busch for decreased liver function? Puhleez.

 

[MtnBiker]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal



Whats next? An alcoholic suing Aneheiser Busch for decreased liver function? Puhleez.

Yeah, I think you are right.

 

[Moi]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
Thats just ridiculous. I'm a wanna-be non-smoker. I've been smoking for 15 years now. I know its dangerous, I know if I dont stop, it'll eventually kill me. It is an addiction, however, not a 200K addiction. Every smoker knows it's harmful to their health, if they dont want to get sick, quit.

Whats next? An alcoholic suing Aneheiser Busch for decreased liver function? Puhleez.

First, I bet alcoholics and their families already sue and win.

Second, I wish you good luck and strength in quitting. MY post was not to say that I thought it would be easy or to callously throw it back at smokers (as you can see my husband smokes). Many things in life ain't easy, that's for sure.

but instead of enriching the family of a smoker to ridiculous proportions, why couldn't that money be set aside for people who wish to stop smoking get the help they need??? Wouldn't that be more economically sound - and, if the majority did successfully quit - economically detrimental to the cigarette manufacturers????

 

[lilcountriegal]

By no means did I think your post suggested that you thought quitting smoking was easy.. that was just my way of venting that people know its dangerous. Its almost the same as driving down the road, seeing a big sign that says "Bridge Out Ahead".. continuing down that road.. wrecking.. and then suing the Dept of Transportation for your car accident. Its ridiculous.

but instead of enriching the family of a smoker to ridiculous proportions, why couldn't that money be set aside for people who wish to stop smoking get the help they need??? Wouldn't that be more economically sound - and, if the majority did successfully quit - economically detrimental to the cigarette manufacturers????

I COMPLETELY agree with this. I'll be the first to admit I'm addicted to nicotine. I'll also readily admit that I wont be able to quit cold turkey. I'm a single mom raising a three year old child on one income (before I go farther... I dont smoke in front of my daughter... its MY habit, not hers.... I disagree STRONGLY with smoking around minor children...). I checked the price of the patch, they want anywhere from $60-$75 dollars for a patch that will last two weeks. If I had an extra $60-$75 in one clip, I'd have no problem with quitting.

(there is a large difference between hunting up $3 for a pack of cigarettes at a time than hunting up $75 at once. If I could hold off smoking long enough to save the $75 for the patch, then I wouldnt need the patch in the first place. Vicious circle there)

The Philip Morris ads crack me up. I smoke Marlboro lights and now on every pack they have a little pamphlet stuck warning of the dangers of smoking. "There is no safe cigarette". Seriously... instead of wasting their time, money, and trees on these pamphlets, how about offering smokers who want to quit a free two week trial of the patch to get them started.

 

[Moi]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
I'll also readily admit that I wont be able to quit cold turkey. how about offering smokers who want to quit a free two week trial of the patch to get them started.

Amen, sister. I wonder if your state or insurance offeres any assistance; some do because they realize that it reduces the health costs overall.

Also, try this link to find out any other possible sources:

http://www.smokefreevirginia.org/Cessation-Resources.html

 

[Psychoblues]

Having been raised in the '50's and having been addicted to both alcohol and nicotine since my days in the womb I have a problem with your analogy.

During virtually all of my childhood the presense of alcohol and tobacco was pushed from the TV screen, the silver screen and on most poster boards and in newspapers. Although I didn't take a "puff" off a cigarette until I was about 10 years old, I would've done it years earlier had it not been for my mother's admonitions. I didn't drink alcohol either until I was about 12. But both were regularly used in my household throughout my childhood and adolescence. Even encouraged from about every advertising venue available. My mother's good sense about all of that succeeded in only delaying the dilemma that was to beset me to this day. I'm 53 and not so especially unusual for those my age and raised under similar circumstances.

I certainly don't advocate legal remedy for legal activity unless, of course, the legality of the activity was tainted on it's premise. I think the alcohol and tobacco industries have many sins to atone for, don't you?

 

[lilcountriegal]

I think the alcohol and tobacco industries have many sins to atone for, don't you?

I would have to say that tobacco industries do, to a point. I feel comfortable speaking on the tobacco industry as I am an addict, the alcohol industry is another matter alltogether for me.

This is one of the posts that I can at least see your point Psycho. I blame that on the age difference. As you say, growing up in your time, there were questions regarding health issues and cigarettes. You're 53, I'm 31. When I began smoking at about 15, I knew the health issues. That makes it my problem, not the industries. Whereas when you began smoking, they were still saying it wasn't bad for your health. I consciously made the decision to inhale that first cigarette knowing the issues. You, on the other hand, didnt have all of the facts prior to becommign addicted.

 

[Psychoblues]

Even at your age, lilcountriegal, you have a problem that you can't identify. I won't be so egotistical as to say that I identify it either. Even now, our movies promote smoking as "cool" even "sexy". Alcohol? With runaway primetime specials that do nothing other than promote drinking I have no idea as to your confusion.

Like eating clay in the first grade to obtain the minerals that my body needed at that time, smoking and drinking were as much a part of my needs and remain to this day. Some call it demons, some addiction, others weakness. I don't know what to call it.

 

[lilcountriegal]

With runaway primetime specials that do nothing other than promote drinking I have no idea as to your confusion.

Really there is no confusion on my part. I am not addicted to alcohol so I wont speak in regards to alcohol addiction. I enjoy the occasional beer. Hell, I enjoy the occasional night out on the town where I stumble home, but I'm not an addict. Tobacco addiction, however, I'm an expert on.

I will state that, for the most part, beginning addiction is a personal choice. One has to decide to take that first hit of a cigarette, that first drink of alcohol, before they ever become an addict. I strongly believe that one of the largest things plaguing the insurance companies today causing prices to skyrocket, etc., is astronomical settlements like which Moi posted. Somewhere we need to get a grip on this and start taking responsibility for our own destructive choices, myself included.

 

[NightTrain]

This is one of the posts that I can at least see your point Psycho. I blame that on the age difference. As you say, growing up in your time, there were questions regarding health issues and cigarettes. You're 53, I'm 31. When I began smoking at about 15, I knew the health issues. That makes it my problem, not the industries

I agree completely.

I'm 32, I'll turn 33 on New Years. I also knew it was bad for me, but started anyway. I still enjoy smoking, strangely.

Which will make it a real bitch when I do quit. That'll happen fairly soon, since I'm already pushing the envelope - my Dad died 2 days before 9/11 at the age of 52 because of lung cancer that spread to his brain. The Mayo clinic gave up on him.

The truly disturbing thing is, my Dad was sitting in that hospital room, getting those evil fucking chemicals pumped into his body for an hour. Chemotherapy. I sat there and watched every treatment that he received, and let me tell you, it's truly evil poison that they pump into you for Chemo.

After the first dose, Dad got up and said he had to go to the bathroom. He slowly walked out of the room. About 3 minutes later, a buzzer went off and there were nurses running down the hallway in the direction of the restroom. I got up and ran out too, scared. Turns out, Dad had tripped a smoke detector in the Mayo Clinic because he smoked a Winston in there after receiving his first dose of Chemotherapy.

He died, still smoking Winstons on his very last day. No matter what I said or did, he wouldn't quit. I even made a deal with him to quit, saying we'd both quit together. No dice, less than 24 hours later he was puffing away.

Still, he lived the way he wanted. He knew the cigarettes were bad for him and that cancer runs in our family. He knew it and accepted it - hell, when you light up in the Mayo friggin Clinic, you're really making a statement!

Dad knew from the get go that smoking was bad, back when he started smoking in the '60s. It was no secret then, everyone knew that it was bad for you . It was a choice. Yeah, the tobacco companies said it wasn't a killer, but everyone knew it was. Even in the early '60s.

The tobacco companies aren't at fault - we are, as smokers. Every smoker makes the choice to smoke, and that's our burden - sooner or later.

 

[Psychoblues]

You have a choice. Quit. That would be my choice.

 

[lilcountriegal]

You have a choice. Quit.

Its not that easy, and you know that.

Sorry to hear about your dad NT. I worked in a Cancer Clinic and I've seen the evils chemotherapy induce. Thankfully, cancer does not run in my family. However, heart disease does.

I was born in '72. My only memory of my grandfather was the day he died. He died with a non-filter cigarette in his hand when he took a massive heart attack in '76. Laying on the couch, with a cigarette in his left hand, he dropped the cigarette in the ashtray, grabbed his chest, rolled off the couch and died before he hit the floor beside me. Where he was a jolly 'ol fella with a Santa belly and he loved his beer (he owned a bar), cigarettes were the main culprit in his heart disease. It sucks when you believe you know how you'll die. Whereas cigarettes may cause you to get lung cancer like your dad, cigarettes will undoubtedly cause me heart disease. Oddly enough, I work for Cardiac Surgeons.

I enjoy smoking tremendously, even though it has caused me asthma. In a normal day, I can take a hit off my inhaler, turn around and light a cigarette not 10 minutes later. THAT is a problem. I've pretty much made the decision that with my income tax this year, I'll invest in the patch. I have a 3-year-old daughter, I sure would like to be around long enough to see her graduate high school and attend her wedding.

 

[MtnBiker]

I do not smoke, never have. My father smoked all his life and is now in poor health because of it, so I have seen what damage it can do. Even though I do not smoke I would defend the right for people to be able to choose to smoke, however I do hope you success in quiting when you choose to do so. And I'm sure your kids will appreciated it as well.

 

[lilcountriegal]

Thanks Mtn. Just remember that around February when I get my income tax return back and within a week I become incessantly bitchy, please forgive me, you'll know why.

 

[jimnyc]

PMS?

 

[MtnBiker]

Hey Lil, bitch all you want. If dealing with a little bitchness will help you quit smoking I say, bitch on! I believe you will still have a sense of humor throughout.

 

[jimnyc]

I read that too fast at first, I thought you called her "Lilbitch"

 

[MtnBiker]

Maybe we can call her that in Feburaury.