A trip to look at art

[surada]

According to the left, "fine art" is a man painted to look like a woman showing off his "package." Exposing a kid to the sexual organs depicted on a statue opens the door to exposing him to sexual organs in a magazine.

You were brought up without culture to make such an asinine statement.

 

[SaxonJackson]

You were brought up without culture to make such an asinine statement.

You really believe that the difference between “culture” and non-culture is seeing a statue with a penis or not? All that means is that you're either narrow-minded or dumb.

 

[frigidweirdo]

You really believe that the difference between “culture” and non-culture is seeing a statue with a penis or not? All that means is that you're either narrow-minded or dumb.

Art is human creativity. Culture is what people do.

People have penises, I think quite a lot of them do, and people will make art and culture out of sex because, quite frankly, it's fucking (excuse the pun) important.

Different cultures, even in 2023, deal with sex and nudity in different ways. I lived in Germany, on a hot summer's day you could go to the river and there'd be naked me. I even lived in Austria, and I went walking and wanted to sit down, and remembered a lake in an empty forest I'd been to when there was snow, I got there and it was packed, and there were some naked men sunbathing/hiding in some reeds or rushes. I couldn't see them from the bench(the last bench free) I was sat on, but some dude was trying to perv on them anyway from about 10 meters in front of me.
Saunas, both Germany and Austria do saunas, I do not. I don't like them clothed, and I've never been in one unclothed. But the Germanic and Scandinavians love their saunas and will be naked. The Austrias get angry at the Italians for going into saunas in their swimsuits. They say it's dirty.
You have FKK beaches in Europe, for Germans, mostly, to go nude on beaches.
They don't care, they don't find it sexual, they don't make a big deal out of it, they just do it.

Culture, it's culture because they do it and it's different to the US where, it seems, showing your ankle will get you criticized by some right winger (who'll be found naked and bound the week later, having paid for some man to "punish" him).

When David was made, it was part of the culture of that period, and that period is a VERY influential period in time.
Take DC, full of Greek/Roman style buildings. The Eagle for the US, taken from the symbols of power from that time and before.

It's culture, it's considered HIGH CULTURE (rather than culture v. no culture). You don't have to agree, but it is.

 

[SaxonJackson]

Art is human creativity. Culture is what people do.

People have penises, I think quite a lot of them do, and people will make art and culture out of sex because, quite frankly, it's fucking (excuse the pun) important.

Different cultures, even in 2023, deal with sex and nudity in different ways. I lived in Germany, on a hot summer's day you could go to the river and there'd be naked me. I even lived in Austria, and I went walking and wanted to sit down, and remembered a lake in an empty forest I'd been to when there was snow, I got there and it was packed, and there were some naked men sunbathing/hiding in some reeds or rushes. I couldn't see them from the bench(the last bench free) I was sat on, but some dude was trying to perv on them anyway from about 10 meters in front of me.
Saunas, both Germany and Austria do saunas, I do not. I don't like them clothed, and I've never been in one unclothed. But the Germanic and Scandinavians love their saunas and will be naked. The Austrias get angry at the Italians for going into saunas in their swimsuits. They say it's dirty.
You have FKK beaches in Europe, for Germans, mostly, to go nude on beaches.
They don't care, they don't find it sexual, they don't make a big deal out of it, they just do it.

Culture, it's culture because they do it and it's different to the US where, it seems, showing your ankle will get you criticized by some right winger (who'll be found naked and bound the week later, having paid for some man to "punish" him).

When David was made, it was part of the culture of that period, and that period is a VERY influential period in time.
Take DC, full of Greek/Roman style buildings. The Eagle for the US, taken from the symbols of power from that time and before.

It's culture, it's considered HIGH CULTURE (rather than culture v. no culture). You don't have to agree, but it is.

True. Cultures are different based on a lot of factors. But for someone to say that “you lack culture” because you don't want your prepubescent kids to see statues of naked men is just plain ignorant.

Culture encompasses the entirety of a people's lifestyle, cultural norms, architecture, systems of commerce, systems of transportation, so on and so forth. There are many cultures based around Christianity where chastity, humility, standards of dress, etc. are considered moral, ethical, and righteous. These pockets of civilized humans are every bit as “cultural” in their own way as a tribe of uncivilized, naked Ubangi are in theirs.

 

[surada]

You really believe that the difference between “culture” and non-culture is seeing a statue with a penis or not? All that means is that you're either narrow-minded or dumb.

Most everyone I grew up with had traveled to Greece and Italy by the time they were 10 or 12..and seen the classical art and sculptures.

 

[surada]

True. Cultures are different based on a lot of factors. But for someone to say that “you lack culture” because you don't want your prepubescent kids to see statues of naked men is just plain ignorant.

Culture encompasses the entirety of a people's lifestyle, cultural norms, architecture, systems of commerce, systems of transportation, so on and so forth. There are many cultures based around Christianity where chastity, humility, standards of dress, etc. are considered moral, ethical, and righteous. These pockets of civilized humans are every bit as “cultural” in their own way as a tribe of uncivilized, naked Ubangi are in theirs.

France and Italy are Christian cultures.

 

[frigidweirdo]

True. Cultures are different based on a lot of factors. But for someone to say that “you lack culture” because you don't want your prepubescent kids to see statues of naked men is just plain ignorant.

Culture encompasses the entirety of a people's lifestyle, cultural norms, architecture, systems of commerce, systems of transportation, so on and so forth. There are many cultures based around Christianity where chastity, humility, standards of dress, etc. are considered moral, ethical, and righteous. These pockets of civilized humans are every bit as “cultural” in their own way as a tribe of uncivilized, naked Ubangi are in theirs.

Not ignorant. This isn't just a statue of a naked man. It's literally one of the most famous statues ever in the western world.

However I'd say most kids would probably just snigger at it.

But German kids go to saunas with naked people all through their upbringing, it doesn't harm them.

But being "cultured" is literally a thing. Literally someone who is educated and knowledgeable about cultural things. So the opposite would someone with "no culture" or however else you want to put it.
I'm not very cultured, more than others, less than people who profess to be "cultured". It's not a negative thing, necessarily.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

There are huge problems in Florida at the moment. There are now court cases challenging the bonehead strategies of the Gov.

One wonder what the dangers to youngsters of reading these books are.I dont think that there are dangers.

It seems like the precurser to a fascist state that certain demographics are deemed to be non people. We have seen where this leads before.

Fascism is a seductive cult because it tells you that someone else is to blame. When you combine this with a population that believes so heavily in conspiracy theories its a toxic brew.


Florida school district hit with lawsuit over ‘unconstitutional’ book bans

 

[SaxonJackson]

Not ignorant. This isn't just a statue of a naked man. It's literally one of the most famous statues ever in the western world.

However I'd say most kids would probably just snigger at it.

But German kids go to saunas with naked people all through their upbringing, it doesn't harm them.

But being "cultured" is literally a thing. Literally someone who is educated and knowledgeable about cultural things. So the opposite would someone with "no culture" or however else you want to put it.
I'm not very cultured, more than others, less than people who profess to be "cultured". It's not a negative thing, necessarily.

It could be the most "famous" items on planet earth but it still depicts a very base image: A naked man. I don't personally put much stock in material things. America has seen "famous" statues pulled to the ground in recent history. Why? Because people found them offensive. They didn't fit THEIR culture. So the left really can't have it both ways.

 

[surada]

It could be the most "famous" items on planet earth but it still depicts a very base image: A naked man. I don't personally put much stock in material things. America has seen "famous" statues pulled to the ground in recent history. Why? Because people found them offensive. They didn't fit THEIR culture. So the left really can't have it both ways.

These statues are beautiful and powerful not sexual in nature.

We pulled down historic statues of Confederate generals which IMO is very stupid.

 

[SaxonJackson]

These statues are beautiful and powerful not sexual in nature.

We pulled down historic statues of Confederate generals which IMO is very stupid.

My point exactly! YOU get to determine which statues are historic and wonderful but nobody else gets to have an opinion. Liberalism for all to see.

 

[surada]

My point exactly! YOU get to determine which statues are historic and wonderful but nobody else gets to have an opinion. Liberalism for all to see.

I'm not a liberal.. just educated.

I was a Republican for 35 years until Dubya invaded Iraq.

 

[SaxonJackson]

I'm not a liberal.. just educated.

I was a Republican for 35 years until Dubya invaded Iraq.

Nevertheless ... you're an elitist who believes his (her) opinion is the only one that counts. Quack like a duck; walk like a duck; swim like a duck. You're a duck.

 

[surada]

Nevertheless ... you're an elitist who believes his (her) opinion is the only one that counts. Quack like a duck; walk like a duck; swim like a duck. You're a duck.

Where are you from that you weren't exposed to the arts? Oil brats aren't considered elites.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

It could be the most "famous" items on planet earth but it still depicts a very base image: A naked man. I don't personally put much stock in material things. America has seen "famous" statues pulled to the ground in recent history. Why? Because people found them offensive. They didn't fit THEIR culture. So the left really can't have it both ways.

Its not a left/right issue. I think that many right leaning people would see themselves as educated and "cultured".
Michelangelos patrons would have seen his work as biblical in scope. It is sad that it has been swept up in a modern culture war.

The statues of the generals do not seem to have any artistic merit. People do not flock across Oceans just to see them. But you do raise an interesting point.

 

[frigidweirdo]

It could be the most "famous" items on planet earth but it still depicts a very base image: A naked man. I don't personally put much stock in material things. America has seen "famous" statues pulled to the ground in recent history. Why? Because people found them offensive. They didn't fit THEIR culture. So the left really can't have it both ways.

Because US statues were representative of something political. David isn't political. It's just art.

You say the left can't have it both ways, as if everything needs to be super simple, everyone needs to get down to the simple level of the most simple people. That isn't going to happen.

 

[SaxonJackson]

Because US statues were representative of something political. David isn't political. It's just art.

You say the left can't have it both ways, as if everything needs to be super simple, everyone needs to get down to the simple level of the most simple people. That isn't going to happen.

Maybe the politics of his day were raging over whether men should walk around naked or not, and Michelangelo was making a political statement. I say we pull the statue down and spray graffiti all over it. Isn't that how we leftists show our rage?

 

[frigidweirdo]

Maybe the politics of his day were raging over whether men should walk around naked or not, and Michelangelo was making a political statement. I say we pull the statue down and spray graffiti all over it. Isn't that how we leftists show our rage?

Again, you're being simplistic.

 

[surada]

Maybe the politics of his day were raging over whether men should walk around naked or not, and Michelangelo was making a political statement. I say we pull the statue down and spray graffiti all over it. Isn't that how we leftists show our rage?

They weren't going naked. Have you seen the Pieta?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Maybe the politics of his day were raging over whether men should walk around naked or not, and Michelangelo was making a political statement. I say we pull the statue down and spray graffiti all over it. Isn't that how we leftists show our rage?

If you want to be simplistic the statues of racist generalsc were on public display. David is housed in a gallery. You dont have to go and see it.

Nobody objects to a racism gallery with statues of racist heroes.