A Touchy Question On Gendercide Or In This Case Homocide

[Katzndogz]

Seems like liberals are unintentionally being honest. Abortion is a way to get rid of the poor. We could just house the poor near toxic waste. Have a nice government health care program in place to deny them treatment. Start a rumor that vaccinations will make them sick.

 

[clevergirl]

I think I pointed out the fallacies of your argument in full living color, and really, going on when you can't even process simple logic like only 1% of abortions occur before gender can be determined, really doesn't make it worth my time.

50% of abortions are had by poor people for economic reasons, but you aren't about to go out and try to fix economic inequality in this country. You are going to go on about the third world immigrant who might be having a sex selection abortion.

And yet your side ignores that 97% of all abortions are for convenience.

I think it depends on how you define "convenience", doesn't it?

An abortion costs about $300.00. A live birth without complications costs about $10,000. Which is really hard to wing if you don't have insurance.

If you know that having a baby is going to cost you your job, because you work for the kind of jerkwad who fires pregnant women, I'd call that necessity.

If you know you can't afford a baby because said jerkwad is barely paying you enough to keep a roof over your head, I'd call that necessity.

Mitt Romney gets rid of good paying union jobs and replaces them with crappy McJobs at Staples, and you praise the snot out of him and think he's a genius, but then you don't realize, yeah, there's a reason why those Staple Employees have abortions.

The majority of women who get abortions qualify for state medical insurance. But I digress, if cost were the rationale for killing children in the womb- why you have just made the case for legal homicide of children outside the womb...I mean care taking; braces; college...aye-ca-rumba!

So, again, all you do is excuse killing babies for convenience sake- that's barbaric and selfish.

You can create as many scenarios as you wish.-they all merely prove my point. 97% of women have abortions for their own personal convenience- gender based abortions would/is just another one.

Abortion kills unborn babies.Every-time it is done, apart from a mother's life being at serious risk- it's a despicable act.

 

[koshergrl]

Joe thinks it's justified if your boss doesn't want you to be pregnant.

Cute, huh?

 

[JoeB131]

That's good Nazi reasoning of the type they applied when making abortions de rigeur in Poland.

BTW..if you work for a boss who fires pregnant women, that's discrimination, and said boss needs to be reported. It's also abortion COERCION and is one of the things that PP covers up. You're saying that as long as there are people who want to force other people to get abortions, then we need to have abortions available for them.

This is my primary issue with abortion. It isn't about women's rights. It's about victimizing them. It's also why men are the staunchest supporters of abortion on demand. The ones who go to bat for it are all about coercing women into abortion.

Okay, real world, which apparently you don't live in. When you have "At Will" employment, a law that protects pregnant women is sort of meaningless. Last job I worked, two women got pregnant, and they were both let go for "performance issues", even though their performance had really been the same for months.

Another lady I know was asked straight up by a prospective employer if she planned to have children in the next year. Totally illegal, but people do it.

You can't support a moral system that demands women can't have abortions, and then support an economic system like the one we have that demands they have them if that is what is in their employers best interests.

Unless of course, you don't spend a lot of time actually thinking about it.

Once again, how the Religious Right is played by the Plutocratic Right.

 

[JoeB131]

The majority of women who get abortions qualify for state medical insurance.!

Uh, no they don't.

Facts About Abortion: U.S. Abortion Statistics

•17 states (AK, AZ, CA, CT, HI, IL, MA, MD, MN, MT, NJ, NM, NY, OR, VT, WA and WV) do use public funds to pay for abortions for some poor women. About 14% of all abortions in the United States are paid for with public funds (virtually all from the state).

Now, while it is true that 50% of abortions are had by women whose households make less than 30K a year, (an economic fact that "conservatives" don't care about, because, hey, Mitt needs a new Polo Pony) getting on state medical insurance isn't all that easy.

But I digress, if cost were the rationale for killing children in the womb- why you have just made the case for legal homicide of children outside the womb...I mean care taking; braces; college...aye-ca-rumba!

Probably something every parent of a teenager has considered, but don't be silly. Most people can tell the difference between a child and a kidney-bean sized fetus.

So, again, all you do is excuse killing babies for convenience sake- that's barbaric and selfish.!

I agree, it is. But until you support socialized medicine, pay equality, workers rights, card check, strong unionization or maybe just once taking the side of working people against big corporations and the wealthy, you're still a hypocrite on this issue...

You can create as many scenarios as you wish.-they all merely prove my point. 97% of women have abortions for their own personal convenience- gender based abortions would/is just another one.

Abortion kills unborn babies.Every-time it is done, apart from a mother's life being at serious risk- it's a despicable act.

Actually, abortion is safer than childbirth... and it's only despicable if you really think a kidney bean sized fetus is the same as a "baby", which most people really don't.

And I don't consider "being able to put food on the table" to be an issue of "convienence", nor would most people.

 

[koshergrl]

That's good Nazi reasoning of the type they applied when making abortions de rigeur in Poland.

BTW..if you work for a boss who fires pregnant women, that's discrimination, and said boss needs to be reported. It's also abortion COERCION and is one of the things that PP covers up. You're saying that as long as there are people who want to force other people to get abortions, then we need to have abortions available for them.

This is my primary issue with abortion. It isn't about women's rights. It's about victimizing them. It's also why men are the staunchest supporters of abortion on demand. The ones who go to bat for it are all about coercing women into abortion.

Okay, real world, which apparently you don't live in. When you have "At Will" employment, a law that protects pregnant women is sort of meaningless. Last job I worked, two women got pregnant, and they were both let go for "performance issues", even though their performance had really been the same for months.

Another lady I know was asked straight up by a prospective employer if she planned to have children in the next year. Totally illegal, but people do it.

You can't support a moral system that demands women can't have abortions, and then support an economic system like the one we have that demands they have them if that is what is in their employers best interests.

Unless of course, you don't spend a lot of time actually thinking about it.

Once again, how the Religious Right is played by the Plutocratic Right.

"I know, I'll make a reference to the *religious right* and people will ignore the fact that I'm okay with coerced abortions!"

 

[koshergrl]

The majority of women who get abortions qualify for state medical insurance.!

Uh, no they don't.

Facts About Abortion: U.S. Abortion Statistics

•17 states (AK, AZ, CA, CT, HI, IL, MA, MD, MN, MT, NJ, NM, NY, OR, VT, WA and WV) do use public funds to pay for abortions for some poor women. About 14% of all abortions in the United States are paid for with public funds (virtually all from the state).

Now, while it is true that 50% of abortions are had by women whose households make less than 30K a year, (an economic fact that "conservatives" don't care about, because, hey, Mitt needs a new Polo Pony) getting on state medical insurance isn't all that easy.

But I digress, if cost were the rationale for killing children in the womb- why you have just made the case for legal homicide of children outside the womb...I mean care taking; braces; college...aye-ca-rumba!

Probably something every parent of a teenager has considered, but don't be silly. Most people can tell the difference between a child and a kidney-bean sized fetus.

So, again, all you do is excuse killing babies for convenience sake- that's barbaric and selfish.!

I agree, it is. But until you support socialized medicine, pay equality, workers rights, card check, strong unionization or maybe just once taking the side of working people against big corporations and the wealthy, you're still a hypocrite on this issue...

You can create as many scenarios as you wish.-they all merely prove my point. 97% of women have abortions for their own personal convenience- gender based abortions would/is just another one.

Abortion kills unborn babies.Every-time it is done, apart from a mother's life being at serious risk- it's a despicable act.

Actually, abortion is safer than childbirth... and it's only despicable if you really think a kidney bean sized fetus is the same as a "baby", which most people really don't.

And I don't consider "being able to put food on the table" to be an issue of "convienence", nor would most people.

Lie.

Abortion isn't safer than childbirth.

And people don't have to get abortions to put food on the table. That's another lie, and is one that the Nazis held very near and dear, btw.

 

[JoeB131]

That's good Nazi reasoning of the type they applied when making abortions de rigeur in Poland.

BTW..if you work for a boss who fires pregnant women, that's discrimination, and said boss needs to be reported. It's also abortion COERCION and is one of the things that PP covers up. You're saying that as long as there are people who want to force other people to get abortions, then we need to have abortions available for them.

This is my primary issue with abortion. It isn't about women's rights. It's about victimizing them. It's also why men are the staunchest supporters of abortion on demand. The ones who go to bat for it are all about coercing women into abortion.

Okay, real world, which apparently you don't live in. When you have "At Will" employment, a law that protects pregnant women is sort of meaningless. Last job I worked, two women got pregnant, and they were both let go for "performance issues", even though their performance had really been the same for months.

Another lady I know was asked straight up by a prospective employer if she planned to have children in the next year. Totally illegal, but people do it.

You can't support a moral system that demands women can't have abortions, and then support an economic system like the one we have that demands they have them if that is what is in their employers best interests.

Unless of course, you don't spend a lot of time actually thinking about it.

Once again, how the Religious Right is played by the Plutocratic Right.

"I know, I'll make a reference to the *religious right* and people will ignore the fact that I'm okay with coerced abortions!"

Since no abortion is "coerced", really. People make choices.

Have a baby or have a job. I didn't "coerce" anything. The economic system you support did.

When you support universal health coverage, paid family leave, day care, head start, etc. , then you can come back to me and talk about how you've actually taken steps to reduce the number of abortions.

Beyond that, it's all a lot of talk.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Lie.

Abortion isn't safer than childbirth.

And people don't have to get abortions to put food on the table. That's another lie, and is one that the Nazis held very near and dear, btw.

Um, when you are given a choice between keeping your job and having a baby, yeah, that's the choice.

It's one you are fine with the plutocrats imposing on you, because clearly, you enjoy being duped by them.

And to further correct your science challenged thinking.

Abortion safer than giving birth: study | Reuters

Getting a legal abortion is much safer than giving birth, suggests a new U.S. study published Monday.

Researchers found that women were about 14 times more likely to die during or after giving birth to a live baby than to die from complications of an abortion.

Experts say the findings, though not unexpected, contradict some state laws that suggest abortions are high-risk procedures.

Dr. Elizabeth Raymond from Gynuity Health Projects in New York City and Dr. David Grimes of the University of North Carolina School of Medicine, Chapel Hill, found that between 1998 and 2005, one woman died during childbirth for every 11,000 or so babies born.

That compared to one woman of every 167,000 who died from a legal abortion.

 

[Unkotare]

When you support universal health coverage, paid family leave, day care, head start, etc. , then you can come back to me and talk about how you've actually taken steps to reduce the number of abortions.

Beyond that, it's all a lot of talk.

Yeah, only those who embrace your far-left ideology are really interested in reducing the number of abortions. Do you really imagine anyone but other extremists like yourself are going to buy into such clumsy and transparent doublespeak bullshit?

 

[koshergrl]

Joe's not interested in reducing the number of abortions. If he was, he wouldn't so fervently cling to the myth that there were more abortions before abortion was legal, than after.

These people want more babies dead, not fewer. That's why they keep promoting abortion.

 

[clevergirl]

[

Lie.

Abortion isn't safer than childbirth.

And people don't have to get abortions to put food on the table. That's another lie, and is one that the Nazis held very near and dear, btw.

Um, when you are given a choice between keeping your job and having a baby, yeah, that's the choice.

It's one you are fine with the plutocrats imposing on you, because clearly, you enjoy being duped by them.

And to further correct your science challenged thinking.

Abortion safer than giving birth: study | Reuters

Getting a legal abortion is much safer than giving birth, suggests a new U.S. study published Monday.

Researchers found that women were about 14 times more likely to die during or after giving birth to a live baby than to die from complications of an abortion.

Experts say the findings, though not unexpected, contradict some state laws that suggest abortions are high-risk procedures.

Dr. Elizabeth Raymond from Gynuity Health Projects in New York City and Dr. David Grimes of the University of North Carolina School of Medicine, Chapel Hill, found that between 1998 and 2005, one woman died during childbirth for every 11,000 or so babies born.

That compared to one woman of every 167,000 who died from a legal abortion.

That's pretty bad logic there Joe- I understand how you make it. Unborn babies are not human beings- so they are as disposable as that annoying fly stuck bumping the window.

This is the very same kind of bad logic that has allowed human directed atrocities to take place all throughout human history (insert these people are not completely human)...the next time you or anyone you says..."how could the Nazis have done such things" or "How did we ever allow slavery" or "How could the killing fields have ever happened" Remember your "they just wanted to put food on the table kind of logic".

 

[JoeB131]

When you support universal health coverage, paid family leave, day care, head start, etc. , then you can come back to me and talk about how you've actually taken steps to reduce the number of abortions.

Beyond that, it's all a lot of talk.

Yeah, only those who embrace your far-left ideology are really interested in reducing the number of abortions. Do you really imagine anyone but other extremists like yourself are going to buy into such clumsy and transparent doublespeak bullshit?

No, I would expect an intelligent person (not you) to actually look at what other countries have done and see what works.

Example 1- The Philippines. They've banned abortion, but there are 500,000 illegal abortions every year in a country of 90 million. Almost as many per capita as we have.

Legal Updates and free legal information Family Code Philippines: Laws, facts and statistics on abortions in the Philippines

Example 2- France or any other European Socialist country. Abortion is legal, and the government pays for them. But the also require employers to provide paid medical leave, have complete economic support and there are even government workers who come by and help new mothers out. As a result, they have about half as many abortions as we do per capita.

Reasons and Opinions: France Vs. United States: An Argument From Economics

This is no doubt where you'll babble back about how America is the most awesomest country in the world and we can't learn anything from Foreigners...

 

[JoeB131]

Joe's not interested in reducing the number of abortions. If he was, he wouldn't so fervently cling to the myth that there were more abortions before abortion was legal, than after.

These people want more babies dead, not fewer. That's why they keep promoting abortion.

I don't consider fetuses to be babies. Neither does the law. Neither does medical science. Neither does the Bible. Sorry.

Even when abortion was illegal, not one person was charged with murder for killing a fetus.

Fact is, after abortion was legalized, there was not a drop in the birth rate. Which means that before Roe, just as many women were finding ways to get rid of their "little problem" as after.

 

[JoeB131]

That's pretty bad logic there Joe- I understand how you make it. Unborn babies are not human beings- so they are as disposable as that annoying fly stuck bumping the window.

This is the very same kind of bad logic that has allowed human directed atrocities to take place all throughout human history (insert these people are not completely human)...the next time you or anyone you says..."how could the Nazis have done such things" or "How did we ever allow slavery" or "How could the killing fields have ever happened" Remember your "they just wanted to put food on the table kind of logic".

Oh, no. I don't think that at all.

The Nazis killed the Jews because 2000 years of Christian Stupidity villified the Jews for not accepting their dude on a stick as God. Which is why I always find it amusing when Christians are suddenly so concerned with "life" now. There was no economic motive at all. You all act like Hitler came along with some crazy talk and people went along with it. Ummm. Nope. Anti-Semitism is really built into the German DNA. All the way back to Martin Luther writing a book called "The Jews and their lies."

As I stated above, abortion laws aren't about protecting babies. It's about keeping women in their place.

 

[Unkotare]

When you support universal health coverage, paid family leave, day care, head start, etc. , then you can come back to me and talk about how you've actually taken steps to reduce the number of abortions.

Beyond that, it's all a lot of talk.

Yeah, only those who embrace your far-left ideology are really interested in reducing the number of abortions. Do you really imagine anyone but other extremists like yourself are going to buy into such clumsy and transparent doublespeak bullshit?

No, I would expect an intelligent person to actually look at what other countries have done and see what works. ...

When that second brain cell arrives in the mail try to consider why your comment there is illogical, idiot.

 

[Unkotare]

I don't consider fetuses to be babies. .

You don't want to, because you are too much of a coward to face the moral implications of your position.

 

[JoeB131]

Yeah, only those who embrace your far-left ideology are really interested in reducing the number of abortions. Do you really imagine anyone but other extremists like yourself are going to buy into such clumsy and transparent doublespeak bullshit?

No, I would expect an intelligent person to actually look at what other countries have done and see what works. ...

When that second brain cell arrives in the mail try to consider why your comment there is illogical, idiot.

And once again, even though I provided valuable facts and figures, you still couldn't process them.

Only one I see being brainless and emotional is you.

I don't care how many abortions there are. My only concern is that the Plutocrats have gotten very good at using the issue to get brainless morons like you to get worked up and voting against our economic interests.

Which is why Abortion is still legal after 30 years of the GOP being against it. It's only there to fool you... they don't plan to do anything about it.

 

[JoeB131]

I don't consider fetuses to be babies. .

You don't want to, because you are too much of a coward to face the moral implications of your position.

No, i just recognize that something that is the size of a kidney bean and can't live outside the womb is not the same as a baby.

2/3rds of fertilized eggs don't attach to the uterine wall. We don't hold funerals over tampons.

 

[Unkotare]

I don't care how many abortions there are.

Yeah, you have established the fact that your deep insecurity has led you to a nihilistic immorality. You won't make your fear go away like that, champ. You really, really won't.