A new Fiction about Bush

[wihosa]

Considering I was ACTUALLY IN THE ARMY... yes.. I have seen undeserved medals

so STFU

So essentially medals are meaningless, right? I mean apparently the military commanders are such fools that anyone can just make up a story and get a medal. Hey, scratch your arm and here is a Purple Heart, fire your weapon and you get a Silver Star.

Talk about disrespecting the troops.

You guys will take down anybody just to avoid admitting the obvious, the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth were lying.

 

[JimH52]

This one's pretty good, too. And they focus on campaign rhetoric.

PolitiFact | A service of the St. Petersburg Times and CQ

And snopes.com is always good.

Good site is factcheck.org! Thanks for the link Jill and Care. It is true, they slam the left as well as the right. Refreshing indeed!
It seems they and snopes have no hidden agenda. Amazing!

Maybe Oberman and Limbaugh could learn from them and present unbiased opinions.....No, I guess they can't

 

[jillian]

Good site is factcheck.org! Thanks for the link Jill and Care. It is true, they slam the left as well as the right. Refreshing indeed!
It seems they and snopes have no hidden agenda. Amazing!

Maybe Oberman and Limbaugh could learn from them and present unbiased opinions.....No, I guess they can't

Ah...but neither Olberman or Limbaugh are paid to be unbiased. I disagree with Olberman on a lot of things, but I haven't found him to be a liar like Rush.

 

[DiamondDave]

So essentially medals are meaningless, right? I mean apparently the military commanders are such fools that anyone can just make up a story and get a medal. Hey, scratch your arm and here is a Purple Heart, fire your weapon and you get a Silver Star.

Talk about disrespecting the troops.

You guys will take down anybody just to avoid admitting the obvious, the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth were lying.

Nice try to take a statement to the utter edge of the spectrum.... not going to work with me though, son

I have medals... all of my service buddies have medals.... and we like to believe we earned them... but much of how you got a medal depened a lot more on things other than your actual actions.... the write-up... your connections... how well you told your story... and sometimes, yes sometimes RANK.... I saw butterbars get MSM's for no particular reason other than it being higher than the AAM's and ARCOM's that some of the enlisted folk were getting... because they felt that they were oh so valuable as an officer... meanwhile it is the enlisted guys that are putting forth most of the effort, most of the risk, and coming up with the needed solutions to fix the holes in the task that the officers overlooked...

You are not stating anything obvious.. you are simply trying to craft an argument to fit your ASSumptions.... and in particular in this case, on something you don't know SHIT about

so yes... STFU

 

[sealybobo]

YES, it is a wholly trustable unbiased source, and always has been....shoot, even dick cheney recommended going there on a thing or two, so lies would not continue...

Fackcheck.org is reliable and always hits lies from BOTH SIDES of the aisle....and researches, and reports, the truth.

honestly, they do!

Care

When they can't attack the information they attack the source. Its all true, whatever it is, unless they can confirm it isn't true.

and its not a lie if you believe it. lol

 

[JimH52]

Ah...but neither Olberman or Limbaugh are paid to be unbiased. I disagree with Olberman on a lot of things, but I haven't found him to be a liar like Rush.

Good Point

 

[DiamondDave]

When they can't attack the information they attack the source. Its all true, whatever it is, unless they can confirm it isn't true.

and its not a lie if you believe it. lol

When the extreme biased source (such as the majority of the ones you try to use, bobo) resorts to whatever flim-flam possible to create their supposed story (yes, including your STUPID conspiracy theory sources and Air-Head America)... it is indeed proper to discredit the validity just by the source itself

Just because a drub addict, alcoholic bum comes up with a new story about why he wants your money (he has used every cent in the past for booze and smack) does not mean you believe the bum

Your 'sources' are about as credible with political analysis and John Wayne Gacy is credible for information on child care

 

[JimH52]

I do think I remember that gw was awarded a Purple Heart on one occasion. He fell down drunk on the way back to the post one Saturday night and cut a finger. Of course the tumble may have been intentional, in which case, it may have been undeserved.

But no one can deny the boy could hang one on during his military days! What a Patriot!

 

[Care4all]

Nice try to take a statement to the utter edge of the spectrum.... not going to work with me though, son

I have medals... all of my service buddies have medals.... and we like to believe we earned them... but much of how you got a medal depened a lot more on things other than your actual actions.... the write-up... your connections... how well you told your story... and sometimes, yes sometimes RANK.... I saw butterbars get MSM's for no particular reason other than it being higher than the AAM's and ARCOM's that some of the enlisted folk were getting... because they felt that they were oh so valuable as an officer... meanwhile it is the enlisted guys that are putting forth most of the effort, most of the risk, and coming up with the needed solutions to fix the holes in the task that the officers overlooked...

You are not stating anything obvious.. you are simply trying to craft an argument to fit your ASSumptions.... and in particular in this case, on something you don't know SHIT about

so yes... STFU

ohhhhhhhhhhh, i seeeeeeeee, this is about your me, me, me syndrone that you suffer from....

YOU and your buddies EARNED their medals, but ALL the other guys....they didn't.

That's right, even my dad didn't earn his medals....while serving in Vietnam....the Air Force just GAVE THEM to him, cuz of his name or rank or who he knew...and the same with my Husband, he didn't earn his medals either, when serving in the Army....he finagled and duped his superiors in to giving him them.....

Ohhhh, but YOU and your buddies earned every damn one of your medals...

Cool, I got your drift! And so do the other military people that you soooooooooo conveniently dismiss and dishoner with that kind of thought process.

sheesh Dave!!!!!

Care

 

[DiamondDave]

ohhhhhhhhhhh, i seeeeeeeee, this is about your me, me, me syndrone that you suffer from....

YOU and your buddies EARNED their medals, but ALL the other guys....they didn't.

That's right, even my dad didn't earn his medals....while serving in Vietnam....the Air Force just GAVE THEM to him, cuz of his name or rank or who he knew...and the same with my Husband, he didn't earn his medals either, when serving in the Army....he finagled and duped his superiors in to giving him them.....

Ohhhh, but YOU and your buddies earned every damn one of your medals...

Cool, I got your drift! And so do the other military people that you soooooooooo conveniently dismiss and dishoner with that kind of thought process.

sheesh Dave!!!!!

Care

And of course. since you have no argument of logic OR any experience with the military, you have to take it into a different direction and at the wildest tangent possible.. nice try,. not gonna work with me

No... it is not about ME... but in my ACTUAL MILITARY EXPERIENCE and in the ACTUAL MILITARY EXPERIENCE of those I know, we have ACTUALLY seen undeserving medals... and I have already given some of the things behind it in my previous post... undeserved medals happen....

 

[Care4all]

And of course. since you have no argument of logic OR any experience with the military, you have to take it into a different direction and at the wildest tangent possible.. nice try,. not gonna work with me

No... it is not about ME... but in my ACTUAL MILITARY EXPERIENCE and in the ACTUAL MILITARY EXPERIENCE of those I know, we have ACTUALLY seen undeserving medals... and I have already given some of the things behind it in my previous post... undeserved medals happen....

yeah, right dave....this is how YOU KNOW that kerry's 4 plus separate medals were given to him illegitimately... READ the FACTS that contradict what the liars you support are saying..... it's all there for you... on the link I provided from FACTCHECK.org...

OH, BUT this isn't about facts is it Dave? This is ALL about YOU and YOUR infinate psychic ability and YOU always trying to put yourself up above the rest....because, YOU are special....better THAN ANYONE ELSE....YOU deserve what you get....

like i said, I got your ticket.... no need to try to explain yourself any further, not necessary.

Care

 

[sealybobo]

ohhhhhhhhhhh, i seeeeeeeee, this is about your me, me, me syndrone that you suffer from....

YOU and your buddies EARNED their medals, but ALL the other guys....they didn't.

That's right, even my dad didn't earn his medals....while serving in Vietnam....the Air Force just GAVE THEM to him, cuz of his name or rank or who he knew...and the same with my Husband, he didn't earn his medals either, when serving in the Army....he finagled and duped his superiors in to giving him them.....

Ohhhh, but YOU and your buddies earned every damn one of your medals...

Cool, I got your drift! And so do the other military people that you soooooooooo conveniently dismiss and dishoner with that kind of thought process.

sheesh Dave!!!!!

Care

In a long quagmire, they probably are more generous with medals. I bet it is a big boost to moral.

Plus I see Bush likes to give out kudo's to anyone/everyone, brownie, george tenet, many more...

so i'm sure his military does the same.

 

[Care4all]

In a long quagmire, they probably are more generous with medals. I bet it is a big boost to moral.

Plus I see Bush likes to give out kudo's to anyone/everyone, brownie, george tenet, many more...

so i'm sure his military does the same.

maybe it does, maybe it doesn't.... i find it highly unlikely on 4 separate occaisions the Military made a mistake or was trying to stroke Kerry... a peon among them, for his undeserved actions.... Why would Kerry have any kind of pull back then as a new college grad and at 27 years old....

I don't think medals, of any honor that the Military gives out are undeserved....

there are mistakes made, certainly....

but there are GUIDELINES for each and every medal that MUST be met before handing them out and I do not believe in any manner that the military are just handing them out willy nilly so that Medals end up having no meaning at all in their honoring of the men that earned them according to the guidelines.

 

[DiamondDave]

maybe it does, maybe it doesn't.... i find it highly unlikely on 4 separate occaisions the Military made a mistake or was trying to stroke Kerry... a peon among them, for his undeserved actions.... Why would Kerry have any kind of pull back then as a new college grad and at 27 years old....

I don't think medals, of any honor that the Military gives out are undeserved....

there are mistakes made, certainly....

but there are GUIDELINES for each and every medal that MUST be met before handing them out and I do not believe in any manner that the military are just handing them out willy nilly so that Medals end up having no meaning at all in their honoring of the men that earned them according to the guidelines.

Again... you know squat about the military, medals, earning medals, and the instances of undeserved medals...

'nuff said

 

[RetiredGySgt]

maybe it does, maybe it doesn't.... i find it highly unlikely on 4 separate occaisions the Military made a mistake or was trying to stroke Kerry... a peon among them, for his undeserved actions.... Why would Kerry have any kind of pull back then as a new college grad and at 27 years old....

I don't think medals, of any honor that the Military gives out are undeserved....

there are mistakes made, certainly....

but there are GUIDELINES for each and every medal that MUST be met before handing them out and I do not believe in any manner that the military are just handing them out willy nilly so that Medals end up having no meaning at all in their honoring of the men that earned them according to the guidelines.

And kerry, being the Boat commander wrote his awards. As for his purple hearts been over that before, all 3 were scratches that he pimped into awards. One was denied so he waited for a new commander and got it from him.

 

[Care4all]

And kerry, being the Boat commander wrote his awards. As for his purple hearts been over that before, all 3 were scratches that he pimped into awards. One was denied so he waited for a new commander and got it from him.

i see you DID NOT READ the link provide from factcheck.org and are still spouting the same ole same ole garbage.....don't want your head to explode when reading it so, i guess i can understand how it is just easier for you to continue on your unsubstantiated claims.....

care

 

[Care4all]

Again... you know squat about the military, medals, earning medals, and the instances of undeserved medals...

'nuff said

Again, you know it all....

even though you were NEVER IN THE NAVY....yep...what you say, is the say all, be all, about it all....and YOU are special....and carry more weight in your word than Factcheck regarding kerry...yep, i believe you....

 

[JimH52]

Care, you are wasting your breath on a lost cause. But the sheep will soon have no one to follow. The lies will continue but the sheperd will be in Texas telling war stories.

 

[editec]

The sad fact is that sometimes medal are given out for reasons other than merit.

Was that the case with Kerry?

I really do not know.

I think it best to assume that anyone weaing a medal deserves it.

Sadly many of the people who never got any damned recognition probably deserved some credit too. My guess is more people deserved a medal than ever got one.

But as Tech Esq described it, awarding medals are often a very political decision and often sheer dumb luck plays a part in who gets one, too.

And yes, I do think officers tend to get medal more often then they really merit them.

So what else is new?

The military is a feudal system, after all.

Officers get the benefit of being in the upper class that class gets the better of everything and considerations of all sorts regarding behavior besides. If you doubt me, just ask any retired higher ranking NCO. They've carried pasty faced incompetent officers since mankind fielded its first army, and they always will, too.

If we want to eliminate that problem, eliminating the class system in the military is the only way to do it.

That's not going to happen.

 

[Care4all]

The sad fact is that sometimes medal are given out for reasons other than merit.

Was that the case with Kerry?

I really do not know.

I think it best to assume that anyone weaing a medal deserves it.

Sadly many of the people who never got any damned recognition probably deserved some credit too. My guess is more people deserved a medal than ever got one.

But as Tech Esq described it, awarding medals are often a very political decision and often sheer dumb luck plays a part in who gets one, too.

And yes, I do think officers tend to get medal more often then they really merit them.

So what else is new?

The military is a feudal system, after all.

Officers get the benefit of being in the upper class that class gets the better of everything and considerations of all sorts regarding behavior besides. If you doubt me, just ask any retired higher ranking NCO. They've carried pasty faced incompetent officers since mankind fielded its first army, and they always will, too.

If we want to eliminate that problem, eliminating the class system in the military is the only way to do it.

That's not going to happen.

my father was a Chief Master Sargent.....as high as he could go, NCO...he did get honored with the bronze star while serving in VietNAM, and many, many, many other ribbons over the years he served....

this isn't to say that officers might have been given medals more freely than he was given them, just that i never heard him complain a peep about it....or even a ''mention'' of things being UNFAIR....

i am uncertain how he felt about new or young officers surrounding him, he pretty much was the boss and did his own thing....*they seemed to respect him...?

care