Why Do Liberals Deny America's Christian Founding and Heritage?

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Ah then you should love Obamacare as God compelled them to do it

typical liberal without IQ for substance

dear, blow it out your ass. Do you understand?

typical liberal without IQ for substance

 

[occupied]

The "Jefferson bible" is all the proof anyone should need of the founders intent concerning religion. Add to that their almost universal loathing for the Calvinists and it is clear this "Christian Nation" stuff is a Lie. No where in the constitution does it say that our nation's collective conscience should come exclusively from some pulpit. Our founders wanted men to live by their own conscience and be guided by clear-headed reason. That is absolutely impossible when everything must pass approval by a non-elected religious authority. Sometimes I think social conservatives would love a system like Iran has, They have a secular government but the real power is hoarded by a bunch of holier than thou dickheads who want to stamp-out fun.

 

[regent]

At the Constitution convention it was moved that a chaplain open each session of the convention with a prayer. There was not enough aye votes, so it failed.

 

[OKTexas]

Anyone who reads the writings from the founding era will encounter countless declarations that God helped found America, that God helped the Patriots defeat the British army, and that God founded America to be a beacon of Christianity to the world. Such sentiments are plastered throughout writings from the founding period.

Yet, many if not most liberals claim that America was founded as a secular nation. They quote a small handful of documents that seem to contradict America's godly heritage. They quote, for example, the Treaty of Treaty, but ignore the circumstances in which that treaty was written, not to mention the fact that they ignore the numerous founding-era statements that plainly contradict that treaty. They also ignore the countless statements from the generations following the founding era.

When FDR referred to preserving "our religion" in his nationally broadcast prayer for the success of the D-Day invasion, what religion do liberals suppose he had in mind?

A few liberals acknowledge America's Christian heritage and simply argue that that heritage is outdated and should be rejected. But, most liberals argue that America was founded as a secular country, when in fact primary sources from the founding era and from subsequent generations clearly prove otherwise.

Some sources:

American Not a Christian Nation? Wrong, Mr. President

AMERICA S GODLY HERITAGE

Statements on Religious Belief and the Importance of Religion and Morality for America by George Washington John Adams and Thomas Jefferson

Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States 143 U.S. 457 1892 Justia U.S. Supreme Court Center











FDR s D-Day Prayer - YouTube

Probably because of stuff like this.....

" The Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion."
~1797 Treaty of Tripoli signed by Founding Father John Adams

Why didn't you post all of that sentence instead of putting a period in the middle of it?

Here it is in it's entirety:

Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen [Muslims]; and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan [Muslim] nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

Treaty of Tripoli - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Lying assed libs, you all need to be reeducated.

 

[mikegriffith1]

Anyone who reads the writings from the founding era will encounter countless declarations that God helped found America, that God helped the Patriots defeat the British army, and that God founded America to be a beacon of Christianity to the world. Such sentiments are plastered throughout writings from the founding period.

Yet, many if not most liberals claim that America was founded as a secular nation. They quote a small handful of documents that seem to contradict America's godly heritage. They quote, for example, the Treaty of Treaty, but ignore the circumstances in which that treaty was written, not to mention the fact that they ignore the numerous founding-era statements that plainly contradict that treaty. They also ignore the countless statements from the generations following the founding era.

When FDR referred to preserving "our religion" in his nationally broadcast prayer for the success of the D-Day invasion, what religion do liberals suppose he had in mind?

A few liberals acknowledge America's Christian heritage and simply argue that that heritage is outdated and should be rejected. But, most liberals argue that America was founded as a secular country, when in fact primary sources from the founding era and from subsequent generations clearly prove otherwise.

Some sources:

American Not a Christian Nation? Wrong, Mr. President

AMERICA S GODLY HERITAGE

Statements on Religious Belief and the Importance of Religion and Morality for America by George Washington John Adams and Thomas Jefferson

Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States 143 U.S. 457 1892 Justia U.S. Supreme Court Center











FDR s D-Day Prayer - YouTube

Probably because of stuff like this.....

" The Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion."
~1797 Treaty of Tripoli signed by Founding Father John Adams

Next time, you might want to read an OP before you respond to it. Do you know anything about the circumstances surrounding the Treaty of Tripoli (Muslim pirates had been abducting Americans and we were trying to put a stop to this)? By the way, the same John Adams who signed that treaty also said this:

“The general Principles, on which the Fathers Achieved Independence, were the only Principles in which that beautiful Assembly of young Gentlemen could Unite . . . . And what were these general Principles? I answer, the general Principles of Christianity. . . . Now I will avow, that I then believed, and now believe, that those general Principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the Existence and Attributes of God, and that those Principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human Nature and our terrestrial, mundane System.” (Letter to Thomas Jefferson, June 28, 1813)
​

At the Constitution convention it was moved that a chaplain open each session of the convention with a prayer. There was not enough aye votes, so it failed.

Uh, only because they couldn't agree on how to arrange for clergy to conduct the prayers (they were very short on funds) and also because a few (like Hamilton, who was very religious) feared that given how much time had already passed some in the public might think that arranging for opening prayers was a sign of desperation. Furthermore, after Franklin's motion failed, another delegate (Randolph) proposed that they ask for and attend a sermon on the 4th of July, which was a few days away. This was arranged and most of the delegates attended the sermon. (Let me guess: Your liberal source didn't mention any of these additional facts, right? Why do you suppose that is? Why do liberals constantly mention that the convention voted against opening each session with prayer but fail to mention that this was because they couldn't agree on the arrangements for clergy and that the framers gathered for religious sessions outside the convention?)

Here's a another really thorough scholarly essay on America's Christian founding:

Did America Have a Christian Founding

By the way, one of the first things George Washington did as president was to issue the following proclamation calling for national day of prayer and thanksgiving:

Whereas it is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor-- and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness.​

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be-- That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks--for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation--for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence which we experienced in the course and conclusion of the late war--for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty, which we have since enjoyed--for the peaceable and rational manner, in which we have been enabled to establish constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national One now lately instituted--for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed; and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge; and in general for all the great and various favors which he hath been pleased to confer upon us.​

And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions-- to enable us all, whether in public or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually--to render our national government a blessing to all the people, by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed--to protect and guide all Sovereigns and Nations (especially such as have shewn kindness unto us) and to bless them with good government, peace, and concord--To promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the encrease of science among them and us--and generally to grant unto all Mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as he alone knows to be best.​

Given under my hand at the City of New York the third day of October in the year of our Lord 1789.​

Go: Washington​

 

[nuhuh]

Here is an appropriate quote from George Washington:

“Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. I had hoped that liberal and enlightened thought would have reconciled the Christians so that their [not our?] religious fights would not endanger the peace of Society.” (Letter to Sir Edward Newenham, June 22, 1792)

 

[NYcarbineer]

Anyone who reads the writings from the founding era will encounter countless declarations that God helped found America, that God helped the Patriots defeat the British army, and that God founded America to be a beacon of Christianity to the world. Such sentiments are plastered throughout writings from the founding period.

Yet, many if not most liberals claim that America was founded as a secular nation. They quote a small handful of documents that seem to contradict America's godly heritage. They quote, for example, the Treaty of Treaty, but ignore the circumstances in which that treaty was written, not to mention the fact that they ignore the numerous founding-era statements that plainly contradict that treaty. They also ignore the countless statements from the generations following the founding era.

When FDR referred to preserving "our religion" in his nationally broadcast prayer for the success of the D-Day invasion, what religion do liberals suppose he had in mind?

A few liberals acknowledge America's Christian heritage and simply argue that that heritage is outdated and should be rejected. But, most liberals argue that America was founded as a secular country, when in fact primary sources from the founding era and from subsequent generations clearly prove otherwise.

Some sources:

American Not a Christian Nation? Wrong, Mr. President

AMERICA S GODLY HERITAGE

Statements on Religious Belief and the Importance of Religion and Morality for America by George Washington John Adams and Thomas Jefferson

Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States 143 U.S. 457 1892 Justia U.S. Supreme Court Center











FDR s D-Day Prayer - YouTube

What is uniquely Christian about our form of government? What is uniquely Christian about the Constitution?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

I am not sure I understand why believing in God and Christianity are intertwined.

But the OP was asking a question.....as usual, the convesation does not really address the evidence put forth....it only seeks to show it is a bad idea.

 

[bodecea]

The U.S. was founded by people who specifically wrote laws into the constitution to prevent the zealously religious from writing their religious beliefs into law. They were well read on history and knew how bad things get when you start down that road.

You didn't read or view a single one of the sources, did you? The founders based our laws on the Bible's moral teachings. Heard of Blackstone?

No they did not...our laws are based on Enlightenment principles INCLUDING the principles of the Freemasons...many of our founders being members. They also relied a great deal on the ideas/ideals of the Roman Republic. They were christians for the most part, but kudos to them for avoiding the trap the Puritans fell into of making the government dependent on religious principles.

 

[bodecea]

People with good sense know what happens when religious zealots gain secular power. Hint: it's nothing good. Tend to the maintenance of your own soul and leave people alone to go to whatever afterlife there may be on their own terms. Trying make people conform to a narrow morality by force of law is futile.

too bad our country is based on religion. Before Christianity you had Rome, no families, no love, and entertainment was watching people being eaten alive.

Christianity brought love and civilization to the planet! Conservative is based on understanding the wisdom of the past while liberalism is based on pure ignorance.

Wait....what?

 

[bodecea]

" where religion has a place in government but is not the dominant dogma.

too stupid!! without religion we are Rome. America is the result of religion and the manifestation of religion.

Um...Rome is who made Christianity the official religion of the Empire...without Rome, Christianity, most likely, would have continued to be a small regional religion perceived as a branch of Judaism.

 

[bodecea]

What they wanted was for all Christian religions to be recognized, rather than as England did, ostracizing and persecuting those Christians outside the Church of England. If you ever, ever took the time to go back and read the writings in the archives of all the first documents, writings of the signers, etc., you would realize this. Instead, people are fed bits and pieces in textbooks or by those that wish to change our history as it was.
One of my favorites-

By the PRESIDENT of the United States Of America
A PROCLAMATION

WHEREAS it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favour; and Whereas both Houses of Congress have, by their joint committee, requested me “to recommend to the people of the United States a DAY OF PUBLICK THANKSGIVING and PRAYER, to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God, especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness:”

NOW THEREFORE, I do recommend and assign THURSDAY, the TWENTY-SIXTH DAY of NOVEMBER next, to be devoted by the people of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being who is the beneficent author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be; that we may then all unite in rendering unto Him our sincere and humble thanks for His kind care and protection of the people of this country previous to their becoming a nation; for the signal and manifold mercies and the favorable interpositions of His providence in the course and conclusion of the late war; for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty which we have since enjoyed;– for the peaceable and rational manner in which we have been enable to establish Constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national one now lately instituted;– for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed, and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge;– and, in general, for all the great and various favours which He has been pleased to confer upon us.

And also, that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations and beseech Him to pardon our national and other transgressions;– to enable us all, whether in publick or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually; to render our National Government a blessing to all the people by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed; to protect and guide all sovereigns and nations (especially such as have shewn kindness unto us); and to bless them with good governments, peace, and concord; to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the increase of science among them and us; and, generally to grant unto all mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as he alone knows to be best.

GIVEN under my hand, at the city of New-York, the third day of October, in the year of our Lord, one thousand seven hundred and eighty-nine.

(signed) G. Washington

Source: The Massachusetts Centinel, Wednesday, October 14, 1789

Anyone who reads the writings from the founding era will encounter countless declarations that God helped found America, that God helped the Patriots defeat the British army, and that God founded America to be a beacon of Christianity to the world. Such sentiments are plastered throughout writings from the founding period.

Yet, many if not most liberals claim that America was founded as a secular nation. They quote a small handful of documents that seem to contradict America's godly heritage. They quote, for example, the Treaty of Treaty, but ignore the circumstances in which that treaty was written, not to mention the fact that they ignore the numerous founding-era statements that plainly contradict that treaty. They also ignore the countless statements from the generations following the founding era.

When FDR referred to preserving "our religion" in his nationally broadcast prayer for the success of the D-Day invasion, what religion do liberals suppose he had in mind?

A few liberals acknowledge America's Christian heritage and simply argue that that heritage is outdated and should be rejected. But, most liberals argue that America was founded as a secular country, when in fact primary sources from the founding era and from subsequent generations clearly prove otherwise.

Some sources:

American Not a Christian Nation? Wrong, Mr. President

AMERICA S GODLY HERITAGE

Statements on Religious Belief and the Importance of Religion and Morality for America by George Washington John Adams and Thomas Jefferson

Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States 143 U.S. 457 1892 Justia U.S. Supreme Court Center











FDR s D-Day Prayer - YouTube

The U.S. was founded by people who specifically wrote laws into the constitution to prevent the zealously religious from writing their religious beliefs into law. They were well read on history and knew how bad things get when you start down that road. This country has many wonderful religious people who mix their religious beliefs with common sense and compassion. But there are some segments of the population, such as evangelical "christians," who would transform our country into Iran 2.0 if they had the power.

and everyday when the House and Senate opens they open with a prayer that compels them to do Gods work that day.

So? That isn't manditory, nor is it always a christian prayer.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

This is consistent with what I had been taught.

The founders knew that the first pilgrims came to the country to escape religious persecution. Therefore they were not interested in establishing a NATIONAL Religion. However, they also knew and accepted that many of the colonies had a central faith that was built right into their governments. That was allowed to continue even after the constitution was ratified. These states eventually wrote religion out of their constitutions too. To the best of my knowledge, the practice of state run religions was never challenged in the Supreme Court.

Clarence Thomas even hinted that such a practice would be allowable today under the Constitution (which means he rejects the selective incorporation of the 1st amendment).

Jefferson detested the Congregationalists as they openly blasted him from the pulpit which is where his famous Danbury letter came from which uses the phrase "wall of separation......" (which many mistakenly believe is in the Constitution).

The country was not founded to be a theocracy at the federal level...but as was accepted at the time.....it was O.K. for the states to do whatever they pleased. All of the states eventually got there...some right away....

But there is no getting away from the heritage as described by President Taft (from memory) that the "prilgrims came here not to practice the freedom of religion, but to practice the freedom of their religions."

Religion in Early America

First, we need to remember that when the First Amendment was drafted, most of the newly independent states of the United States already had established churches. These churches were the "official" religion in their colonies and were paid for by taxes collected by the government. Dissenters, or members of churches that disagreed with the established church, were tolerated in every colony, but they had to accept certain restrictions as a result of their religious choice. Many had to pay taxes to support the established church despite their disagreements with it, and many were barred from holding public office.

 

[bodecea]

Many in Europe and the new world were moving from a God centered world to a world that was nature centered. Nature had laws and those natural laws seem to be based on more truth than Biblical laws. By examining the earth they doubted the earth was only created in 4004BC, but the biggie was the astronomers determination that the sun didn't revolve about the Earth but the opposite. Of course Newton's law of gravity was just one evidence of nature's laws.
These new findings, and there were many, cast doubt on the Bible, and natural laws began to replace Biblical laws. Jefferson's Declaration of Independence used those natural laws as evidence of nature's laws regarding man, governments and so forth. It was called the Age of Enlightenment.

When in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bonds which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.[1]

nature's god...that could be any of the multiple versions of christian gods...judaism's god, hindu's god, muslim's god, etc. Even pagan gods...mother nature herself. Any of those. Clearly not exclusive to the christian god in his many versions.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

What does it mean to deny their heritage ?

To deny that the founders had an element of "religion" in their thought patterns is silly.

To turn your back on the fact that they were not at all interested in forcing religion on people is even sillier.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Our nation was founded by people who wanted as little government as possible. The Modern progressive simply cannot relate to that mindset. Without government, Progressives wouldn't know what to eat or drink, how to live, even how to procreate; they owe it all to the almighty Government

 

[Eaglewings]

Read about the Pat Robertson movement which started these lies in 1992. There are just as many christians on the liberal side as there are in the Gop, you are just sucked into the lies . They have so many who feel if you don't vote right, your not a christian still so many fall for that. Get out and think for yourself with your own relationship with Christ and follow what He says not what people on earth say who want to scam you.

 

[regent]

This being a democracy, and since both Christians and non-Christians are needed, and both vote, both were, and are, accommodated.

 

[occupied]

A lot people have abandoned organized religion in recent years as the social conservatives have become increasingly cultish, nasty and politically militant. By acting so angry and actively working to alienate moderate views they have sealed the fate of their increasingly unpopular attempts at wielding secular power. Still it's going to be quite some time before their influence ebbs in theocratic dumbfuckistan also known as The South.

 

[Davros]

Yes, we have a Christian heritage ... as does the entire Western World.

However, the Constitution of the United States as amended prohibits theocratic rule by any government entity in this nation. Period.

We have heritage, but as a nation we evolve beyond that heritage to become something different from what we once were.

We once were a nation that had slavery and prevented many citizens from voting.

Things change. The Constitution has been set up to keep us strong and free as we do change as a nation.