Where does Abraham Lincoln rank?

[JWBooth]

 

[Jon]

Don't blame him for the way history was written. History also says the Civil War was fought over slavery, and that Lincoln set the slaves free. The Civil War was about states' rights, and Lincoln didn't give two shits about the slaves. The Emancipation Proclamation freed zero slaves. It was a weapon of war, not a noble legislative move.

If it makes you feel good to cling to your revisionist history, you just go right on ahead there boy.

Revisionist history?

 

[Jon]

Lincoln put those Southern traitors in their place once and for all

For that we are eternally grateful

Traitors? For believing in states' rights? I don't understand. Don't get me wrong, the issue at hand was that states wanted the right to own other people, which is morally wrong. But the fact remains that states, by the constitution, have rights to make their own laws.

 

[paperview]

Lincoln put those Southern traitors in their place once and for all

For that we are eternally grateful

^ What he said.

 

[Liberty]

Several people were listing Lincoln toward the bottom of the list and I would like to hear their reasoning.

Dead last, worst President ever. Those needlessdeaths were on his watch. Should have just let the South leave like they are permitted to do. States can leave the Union at ANY TIME.

 

[Liberty]

Lincoln put those Southern traitors in their place once and for all

For that we are eternally grateful

lol my god are you stupid.

Also the real way it should be:
1. Washington
2. Jefferson
3. Jackson
4. Reagan
5. Teddy

..
....
......
42. Obama
43. FDR
44. Lincoln


Tyvm

 

[NYcarbineer]

Several people were listing Lincoln toward the bottom of the list and I would like to hear their reasoning.

Dead last, worst President ever. Those needlessdeaths were on his watch. Should have just let the South leave like they are permitted to do. States can leave the Union at ANY TIME.

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Don't blame him for the way history was written. History also says the Civil War was fought over slavery, and that Lincoln set the slaves free. The Civil War was about states' rights, and Lincoln didn't give two shits about the slaves. The Emancipation Proclamation freed zero slaves. It was a weapon of war, not a noble legislative move.

Ah, so the nobler of conditions today would be if America were two countries, one of which still enslaved black people.

I think that's all we need to know about Jon. Without objection, case closed.

 

[Liberty]

Several people were listing Lincoln toward the bottom of the list and I would like to hear their reasoning.

Dead last, worst President ever. Those needlessdeaths were on his watch. Should have just let the South leave like they are permitted to do. States can leave the Union at ANY TIME.

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

 

[paperview]

Dead last, worst President ever. Those needlessdeaths were on his watch. Should have just let the South leave like they are permitted to do. States can leave the Union at ANY TIME.

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

25% to 30% of Southern families owned slaves, and nearly all, slaveholder or not, had a vested interest in keeping slavery the engine of the south. It was what made the South run.

Keep revising, you neo-confederate bastard.

 

[Liberty]

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

25% to 30% of Southern families owned slaves, and nearly all, slaveholder or not, had a vested interest in keeping slavery the engine of the south. It was what made the South run.

Keep revising, you neo-confederate bastard.

ok thanks for adressing my real points, moreover lincoln and grant's opinion on slavery and how free black me fought for the south. But hey, this board is full of strawman lovers so keep it up, your ignorance is amusing.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Yeah, there's ignorant fools in every crowd.

Can't disagree with that!

Would attacking someone without even making an attempt to disprove what they said count as being an ignorant fool, I wonder?

You play the same tired old shuffle every time. Lincoln did none of what you claimed.

So Lincoln didn't completely ignore the Constitution by denying the freedom of press, the freedom of speech, or the right to habeas corpus in the northern states? He didn't destroy the voluntary union set up by the founders by waging a war to force the southern states back into said union? His generals didn't murder, rape, and rob innocent southern civilians and slaves as they made their way through the south while also completely destroying southern cities? He didn't then give the "thanks of the nation" to those generals for doing so? The Emancipation Proclamation wasn't simply a piece of propaganda that didn't apply to any slaves still within the Union or in the south where Union troops had taken over?

Uh huh.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Dead last, worst President ever. Those needlessdeaths were on his watch. Should have just let the South leave like they are permitted to do. States can leave the Union at ANY TIME.

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

This is how you learn about the Civil War. First when you're a kid, you learn that the Civil war was fought over slavery. Then a few years later, you get a little knowledge (that dangerous thing) and then suddenly you're the expert who knows that the Civil war wasn't about slavery at all! It was state's rights!! That's where you are. But then, with more than a little knowledge, assuming you acquire it, you realize that of COURSE the Civil war was about slavery. And you smack your forehead and say damn!!! how could I have been so stupid thinking I was so smart.

 

[Liberty]

Really? Could slaves leave their Southern owners anytime they wanted? Legally?

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

This is how you learn about the Civil War. First when you're a kid, you learn that the Civil war was fought over slavery. Then a few years later, you get a little knowledge (that dangerous thing) and then suddenly you're the expert who knows that the Civil war wasn't about slavery at all! It was state's rights!! That's where you are. But then, with more than a little knowledge, assuming you acquire it, you realize that of COURSE the Civil war was about slavery. And you smack your forehead and say damn!!! how could I have been so stupid thinking I was so smart.

ok dumbass, heres a few quotes:

Grant: If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission and offer my sword to the other side.

Lincoln: If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union

 

[mudwhistle]

Several people were listing Lincoln toward the bottom of the list and I would like to hear their reasoning.

i'd rank him first.

i'm figuring the people who rank him toward or at the bottom are still ticked off that the south lost the war.

what do you think?

I think they don't like strong American leaders that do everything in their power to defend the US and the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic.

 

[Liberty]

Several people were listing Lincoln toward the bottom of the list and I would like to hear their reasoning.

i'd rank him first.

i'm figuring the people who rank him toward or at the bottom are still ticked off that the south lost the war.

what do you think?

I think they don't like strong American leaders that do everything in their power to defend the US and the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic.

please elaborate.

 

[paperview]

Wow. So instead of real debate about states rights, you bring up slavery. An issue that Lincoln cared not for, and one that if Grant knew they were going to free slaves he would have deserted. A little fact: 90% of those who fought for the confederacy were not slave owners, and a small percent were even FREE black men. GASP! I know right. Read a book.

This is how you learn about the Civil War. First when you're a kid, you learn that the Civil war was fought over slavery. Then a few years later, you get a little knowledge (that dangerous thing) and then suddenly you're the expert who knows that the Civil war wasn't about slavery at all! It was state's rights!! That's where you are. But then, with more than a little knowledge, assuming you acquire it, you realize that of COURSE the Civil war was about slavery. And you smack your forehead and say damn!!! how could I have been so stupid thinking I was so smart.

ok dumbass, heres a few quotes:

Grant: If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission and offer my sword to the other side.

Lincoln: If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union

Lincoln was a savvy politician who knew what needed to be said to be elected. His actions spoke louder than words.

He was elected as an abolitionist President, and the South knew he was a foe of the slaveholders.

As for your Grant quote, it's false. Concocted.

Pulling a quote out to 'prove' something so complex shows how simple your mind works.

 

[Liberty]

This is how you learn about the Civil War. First when you're a kid, you learn that the Civil war was fought over slavery. Then a few years later, you get a little knowledge (that dangerous thing) and then suddenly you're the expert who knows that the Civil war wasn't about slavery at all! It was state's rights!! That's where you are. But then, with more than a little knowledge, assuming you acquire it, you realize that of COURSE the Civil war was about slavery. And you smack your forehead and say damn!!! how could I have been so stupid thinking I was so smart.

ok dumbass, heres a few quotes:

Grant: If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission and offer my sword to the other side.

Lincoln: If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union

Lincoln was a savvy politician who knew what needed to be said to be elected. His actions spoke louder than words.

He was elected as an abolitionist President, and the South knew he was a foe of the slaveholders.

As for your Grant quote, it's false. Concocted.

Pulling a quote out to 'prove' something so complex shows how simple your mind works.

haha. the civil war was about the 10th amendment. not slavery. it IS simple.

 

[Mr Natural]

Good grief, they're still fighting the Civil War.

You're the only people to have fought a war to prove you were better than slaves and lose.

 

[paperview]

ok dumbass, heres a few quotes:

Grant: If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission and offer my sword to the other side.

Lincoln: If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union

Lincoln was a savvy politician who knew what needed to be said to be elected. His actions spoke louder than words.

He was elected as an abolitionist President, and the South knew he was a foe of the slaveholders.

As for your Grant quote, it's false. Concocted.

Pulling a quote out to 'prove' something so complex shows how simple your mind works.

haha. the civil war was about the 10th amendment. not slavery. it IS simple.

Ever read the Secessionist documents?

I'm thinking you haven't.

Here, have a gander.

South Carolina Declarations of Causes of Seceding States American Civil War
Mississippi Declarations of Causes of Seceding States
Georgia Declarations of Causes of Seceding States Civil War
Texas Declarations of Causes of Seceding States

Take a few moments to skim though that. If you're too lazy, maybe you could do a Control ^F and enter "slavery" in the box.

Tell me how many times you see it.