Zone1 What do we "owe" the Homeless?

[Michelle420]

Then the title of the OP is a misnomer. "We" is open ended. Many people in the world do not believe in organized religion so the fall back becomes government mandated charity through taxes. I am all for charity. Charity comes voluntarily from the heart. It is not OWED. No one OWES the homeless anything.

If you believe the bible then you owe loving your neighbor as yourself.

 

[Anathema]

Sure it can many people change the road they were on to live and behave better. This happens a lot

The Future can be changed. The Past cannot. Or can the damage done previously, ever truly be healed or forgotten; therefore they should not be forgiven.

The gentleman you mentioned and I have agreed to go our separate ways. We were close for many years but he jept forgetting to repay debts, so we agreed to part ways.

 

[Concerned American]

Understood but it is posted in religion so answering from a metaphysical perspective makes sense.

Ethics is part of this particular forum as well.

 

[Foxfyre]

I know that but he did not lecture the insane man he cast the evil out of him. Not every healing had the same sin or ailment and he handled them differently. How can one stop sinning if they are insane and do not know they are sinning? First getting help and sometimes help is just prayer and other times it is a prayer answered in the form of a person or a better situation unfolding. I also pointed out a person has to want and accept the help. With the desire to change that leads to repentance. Not all homeless people are a lost cause. Not all homeless people have committed a crime either.

My Post #25

Zone1 - What do we "owe" the Homeless?

How about the far more numerous homeless who live out of the cars and RV's or crash on somebody's couch, all of whom have jobs and do work? This is sad. The result of shipping labour out to 3rd World nations while citizens in the West have to live with 1st World housing costs.

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[lg325]

1.Good health= physical,mental,spritual. 2. Education= general knowledge ,job skills training,life skills. 3. Access to capital.

These three things will get people off the streets. Can government work with private charities to get this done? Yes, but must be done with a strict oversight on how the tax money is spent. And I will add stop with a one size fits all approach to those who are poor and less advantaged each is an individual with individual problems and needs and should be treated that way.

There is a faction who beleive goverment should not work with private relegious charities I have always disagreed with that position. Also to get all this done it needs qualified people who are dedicated in the past I have seen people running these type of programs with a do as little as possible attitude and really don't care about getting things done.It's just a government paycheck for them.

Lastly we need those in power to make this sort of thing a top priority. It is an investment to make our nation stronger and more stable.

 

[Michelle420]

The Future can be changed. The Past cannot. Or can the damage done previously, ever truly be healed or forgotten; therefore they should not be forgiven.

The gentleman you mentioned and I have agreed to go our separate ways. We were close for many years but he jept forgetting to repay debts, so we agreed to part ways.

Who is that?

 

[Mr Natural]

A decent place to sleep.

A place to get cleaned up.

A place to take a shit.

 

[Michelle420]

My Post #25

Zone1 - What do we "owe" the Homeless?

How about the far more numerous homeless who live out of the cars and RV's or crash on somebody's couch, all of whom have jobs and do work? This is sad. The result of shipping labour out to 3rd World nations while citizens in the West have to live with 1st World housing costs.

www.usmessageboard.com

We are saying the same thing. I already thanked that post.

 

[Concerned American]

If you believe the bible then you owe loving your neighbor as yourself.

Wrong. The bible does not say anyone OWES anything except in the case where Jesus addresses charity and taxes. "Give unto Caesar what is Caesar's and give unto the Lord what is the Lord's" The bible also says "Judge not and ye shall not be judged." along with other scripture dealing with hypocrisy. Loving your neighbor as yourself? LOL, there are so many ways that could be interpreted and you wouldn't like any of them either.

 

[Michelle420]

Ethics is part of this particular forum as well.

Ok still not general politics.

 

[Foxfyre]

I know that but he did not lecture the insane man he cast the evil out of him. Not every healing had the same sin or ailment and he handled them differently. How can one stop sinning if they are insane and do not know they are sinning? First getting help and sometimes help is just prayer and other times it is a prayer answered in the form of a person or a better situation unfolding. I also pointed out a person has to want and accept the help. With the desire to change that leads to repentance. Not all homeless people are a lost cause. Not all homeless people have committed a crime either.

We are probably arguing the same side of the fence here. This thread is about what do we 'owe' the homeless as opposed what do we owe the 'sinner' or 'criminal'.

From my Post #25
We owe all people humane treatment. We open, staff and fund food banks and homeless shelters to ensure that all have access to food and shelter. All states should maintain mental institutions and those mentally incapable of helping themselves should go there involuntarily if necessary. A caring community does provide for the least among us but not without some rules and guidelines.

Being homeless in itself is not a sin and is not a crime. Theoretically it could happen to anybody. But responsible people who find themselves homeless generally do what they can to help their own situation and in most cases find ways to remedy it. Such people should be encouraged and admired.

To those who refuse private and government services, refuse to help themselves, who are in the country illegally, we owe absolutely nothing. Nor should they be allowed to interfere with the rights of responsible citizens to have safe, peaceful, aesthetic enjoyment of their neighborhoods/communities. The undocumented should be returned to Mexico or wherever they entered the country illegally. The rest should go to the homeless shelters, confined rehab, or they have to leave public premises and find somewhere else to live.

Our local Science and Natural History Museum runs a little cafe most frequented by museum goers. Except for supervisory personnel, it is staffed exclusively by homeless people willing to accept a job. As these people develop skills and references most are able to move into better paying more full time jobs and eventually get off the street. That is real charity at its finest.

 

[nomadic5]

We don't "owe" them anything.

But we can choose to demonstrate empathy and compassion, and we can choose to try to help them.

Real Christians used to do that, as I recall. Not sure about that any more.

how is it we don't owe them anything?

Do we owe anyone anything? Christians say Yes.

We owe them giving them what they need if we have it, esp if we have an over-abundance of something.

People think that if someone is not working (chronically) that person is lazy, doesn't want to work, never considering the fact that maybe, just maybe no one will hire that person... could be just a simple matter of not being as attractive as another applicant for the same job.. could be employers don't want to hire people wo don't have a physical address on their app...

 

[Michelle420]

Wrong. The bible does not say anyone OWES anything except in the case where Jesus addresses charity and taxes. "Give unto Caesar what is Caesar's and give unto the Lord what is the Lord's" The bible also says "Judge not and ye shall not be judged." along with other scripture dealing with hypocrisy. Loving your neighbor as yourself? LOL, there are so many ways that could be interpreted and you wouldn't like any of them either.

We do owe God for everything. God gave us commandments.

 

[Michelle420]

We are probably arguing the same side of the fence here. This thread is about what do we 'owe' the homeless as opposed what do we owe the 'sinner' or 'criminal'.

From my Post #25
We owe all people humane treatment. We open, staff and fund food banks and homeless shelters to ensure that all have access to food and shelter. All states should maintain mental institutions and those mentally incapable of helping themselves should go there involuntarily if necessary. A caring community does provide for the least among us but not without some rules and guidelines.

Being homeless in itself is not a sin and is not a crime. Theoretically it could happen to anybody. But responsible people who find themselves homeless generally do what they can to help their own situation and in most cases find ways to remedy it. Such people should be encouraged and admired.

To those who refuse private and government services, refuse to help themselves, who are in the country illegally, we owe absolutely nothing. Nor should they be allowed to interfere with the rights of responsible citizens to have safe, peaceful, aesthetic enjoyment of their neighborhoods/communities. The undocumented should be returned to Mexico or wherever they entered the country illegally. The rest should go to the homeless shelters, confined rehab, or they have to leave public premises and find somewhere else to live.

Our local Science and Natural History Museum runs a little cafe most frequented by museum goers. Except for supervisory personnel, it is staffed exclusively by homeless people willing to accept a job. As these people develop skills and references most are able to move into better paying more full time jobs and eventually get off the street. That is real charity at its finest.

Yeah I think we are saying the same thing.

 

[Anathema]

Who is that?

You prior post referenced Hesus in the last sentence. He and I dust generally disagree. He thinks He’s God, and I disagree.

 

[nomadic5]

Our local Science and Natural History Museum runs a little cafe most frequented by museum goers. Except for supervisory personnel, it is staffed exclusively by homeless people willing to accept a job. As these people develop skills and references most are able to move into better paying more full time jobs and eventually get off the street. That is real charity at its finest.

wow.. never heard of that. . it's a good idea.

You are in NM... would it be an invasion of privacy to ask which part?

Someone told me years ago that NM is the best state she and her husband had been to as far as how homeless people are treated. Do u think that's true? I have driven through there but never lived there.

 

[Concerned American]

wow.. never heard of that. . it's a good idea.

You are in NM... would it be an invasion of privacy to ask which part?

Someone told me years ago that NM is the best state she and her husband had been to as far as how homeless people are treated. Do u think that's true? I have driven through there but never lived there.

I grew up in Las Cruces and Deming in the 60s and after going to many schools nationwide, I firmly believe that NM has the best schools in the nation. As for other aspects of their gov't or changes since the 60s, I can't say, but I enjoyed the ten years or so that I lived there.

 

[Michelle420]

You prior post referenced Hesus in the last sentence. He and I dust generally disagree. He thinks He’s God, and I disagree.

oh ok, so you are not religious. That makes sense. You don't care.

 

[Michelle420]

I grew up in Las Cruces and Deming in the 60s and after going to many schools nationwide, I firmly believe that NM has the best schools in the nation. As for other aspects of their gov't or changes since the 60s, I can't say, but I enjoyed the ten years or so that I lived there.

I lived in Albuquerque for a few years as a kid.

 

[Anathema]

oh ok, so you are not religious. That makes sense. You don't care.

I grew up very religious. My father’s death was the last straw thst pushed me away from all organized religion. I continue to be a very Spiritual person following the path I found for myself after my dad passed away.