What cell phone/driving laws should be enacted?

[dmp]

If holding hands-free conversations were a problem, then people with passengers in the car would have been crashing all over the place for the last 90 years.

That's not an honest argument...the whole 'IF Then'...

Talking on a phone is 'different' than talking to somebody.

 

[Mr. P]

That's not an honest argument...the whole 'IF Then'...

Talking on a phone is 'different' than talking to somebody.

Exactly, which I think is what Jeff was eluding to, and that is why “hands free” wins hands down. Most people can't or don't multi-task well while driving, which is what the real problem is. Unfortunately we must legislate to the lowest level.

 

[Abbey Normal]

*******

 

[fuzzykitten99]

I want to know something that my grandpa brought up to me once.

What was the accident rate of those back in the 70's and 80's with CB radios in their cars? And what is the difference in using a CB radio and a cell phone other than how you operate it? If you use a hands-free set for a cell phone, wouldn't that be theoretically safer than using a CB where you have to keep one hand on the apparatus to continue a conversation? If you don't use a hands free set, how is that any different than using a CB while operating a vehicle?

Basically, his point was CBs never got the flak that cell phones get, even though the concept is the same: you take some of your attention off the road to communicate with someone not in the vehicle with you. And you also take one hand off the wheel to do so.

I even tried to google accident rates related to use of CB radios, but I couldn't locate anything at all. Maybe someone else can.

 

[dmp]

Exactly, which I think is what Jeff was eluding to, and that is why “hands free” wins hands down. Most people can't or don't multi-task well while driving, which is what the real problem is. Unfortunately we must legislate to the lowest level.

How does 'hands free' change the fact the person on the phone is engaged in a conversation miles away?

The problem is NOT two-hands-on-the-wheel. It's being occupied with something away from what you are doing. Like...trying to read in front of a TV showing the Lingerie Bowl.

 

[dmp]

I want to know something that my grandpa brought up to me once.

What was the accident rate of those back in the 70's and 80's with CB radios in their cars? And what is the difference in using a CB radio and a cell phone other than how you operate it? If you use a hands-free set for a cell phone, wouldn't that be theoretically safer than using a CB where you have to keep one hand on the apparatus to continue a conversation? If you don't use a hands free set, how is that any different than using a CB while operating a vehicle?

Basically, his point was CBs never got the flak that cell phones get, even though the concept is the same: you take some of your attention off the road to communicate with someone not in the vehicle with you. And you also take one hand off the wheel to do so.

I even tried to google accident rates related to use of CB radios, but I couldn't locate anything at all. Maybe someone else can.

Twood be hard to compare because of the saturation levels of cell-phone users.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

I want to know something that my grandpa brought up to me once.

What was the accident rate of those back in the 70's and 80's with CB radios in their cars? And what is the difference in using a CB radio and a cell phone other than how you operate it? If you use a hands-free set for a cell phone, wouldn't that be theoretically safer than using a CB where you have to keep one hand on the apparatus to continue a conversation? If you don't use a hands free set, how is that any different than using a CB while operating a vehicle?

Basically, his point was CBs never got the flak that cell phones get, even though the concept is the same: you take some of your attention off the road to communicate with someone not in the vehicle with you. And you also take one hand off the wheel to do so.

I even tried to google accident rates related to use of CB radios, but I couldn't locate anything at all. Maybe someone else can.

That's probably because of the saturation of cell phones onto the roads, as opposed to cb users, who were usually truckers or road trippers... ie people who drive a lot. I bet if you gave everyone who has a cell phone a cb radio, accident rates would go up.

But you're right, there are people who are perfectly capable of driving and talking without causing a ruckus. I think almost anyone can do it on an empty freeway, which is why I'm for no restrictions, yet fines on those who are on phones during accidents or the like. Unfortunately, this is a system that is difficult to enforce, because you can't really tell who's on the phone when an accident happens...

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Twood be hard to compare because of the saturation levels of cell-phone users.

saturation was my word, you loser.

 

[dmp]

saturation was my word, you loser.

01-06-2006, 08:08 AM

Pwn3d.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

01-06-2006, 08:08 AM

Pwn3d.

You and your west coast shenaniganry. It's 11:25, get with the real world!

 

[Mr. P]

How does 'hands free' change the fact the person on the phone is engaged in a conversation miles away?

The problem is NOT two-hands-on-the-wheel. It's being occupied with something away from what you are doing. Like...trying to read in front of a TV showing the Lingerie Bowl.

I think we agree, dunno.

“Hands free” has nothing to do with distance, nor two hands on the wheel. That is not what causes the problem IMO.

Multi tasking while operating a vehicle is something I’m very familiar with, in my case operating high performance aircraft. I’m here to tell you that hands free radio communication was much less of a diversion to the tasks at hand vs holding a mic.

We also had in-flight phones. I can’t give you any scientific reason for what happens when you place a phone to your ear, but I will tell you it seems to flip a switch that diverts most of your attention to the caller, it happened every time. I have no doubt this is what occurs on cell phones at your ear while driving as well.

What is it the Highway safety people say about cell phone use; it’s equivalent to driving while drunk. I have no doubt they’re correct. I think “hands free” would reduce this problem.

 

[5stringJeff]

I think we agree, dunno.

“Hands free” has nothing to do with distance, nor two hands on the wheel. That is not what causes the problem IMO.

Multi tasking while operating a vehicle is something I’m very familiar with, in my case operating high performance aircraft. I’m here to tell you that hands free radio communication was much less of a diversion to the tasks at hand vs holding a mic.

We also had in-flight phones. I can’t give you any scientific reason for what happens when you place a phone to your ear, but I will tell you it seems to flip a switch that diverts most of your attention to the caller, it happened every time. I have no doubt this is what occurs on cell phones at your ear while driving as well.

What is it the Highway safety people say about cell phone use; it’s equivalent to driving while drunk. I have no doubt they’re correct. I think “hands free” would reduce this problem.

I agree 100% with Mr. P. Multi-tasking is the problem, and while hands-free devices don't solve 100% of the problem, it makes it much easier to hold a conversation, since it's akin to talking with someone in the car. Hands-free devices will reduce the problem, though they will not eliminate them.

 

[Hobbit]

Hands free does fix a lot of the problem, especially with voice activation (like on my phone). In fact, I find that it keeps me awake and alert when I can carry on a conversation while driving. Holding a phone, on the other hand, has the added distraction of trying to operate the wheel, turn signals, windshield wipers, and, in my case, a manual transmission all with just one hand.

As for your 'speed kills' comment, I should really remind you that speed not only makes collisions more dangerous (do you really think you're not more likely to die hitting a phone pole at 90 as opposed to 60?), but driving too fast, especially under adverse conditions, makes you far more likely to spin out of control if you have to make a sudden stop. During nighttime hours, it's also a really bad idea to drive so fast that your stopping distance is greater than the range of your headlights, for obvious reasons.

Lots of stuff everyone does distracts from driving. I, personally, go the speed of the prevailing traffic and no faster, avoid any distractions (even eschewing talking when in heavy traffic or adverse conditions). If I used any mind-altering substances, I would be sure to be sober before hopping behind the wheel. Anybody who tries to multitask while driving, speeds (and not just to keep up with traffic), drives intoxicated, or several of these other things that can make driving more dangerous, but says that it's not really dangerous "because he can handle it" has been lied to, usually by himself.

 

[dmp]

Hands free does fix a lot of the problem, especially with voice activation (like on my phone). In fact, I find that it keeps me awake and alert when I can carry on a conversation while driving. Holding a phone, on the other hand, has the added distraction of trying to operate the wheel, turn signals, windshield wipers, and, in my case, a manual transmission all with just one hand.

As for your 'speed kills' comment, I should really remind you that speed not only makes collisions more dangerous (do you really think you're not more likely to die hitting a phone pole at 90 as opposed to 60?), but driving too fast, especially under adverse conditions, makes you far more likely to spin out of control if you have to make a sudden stop. During nighttime hours, it's also a really bad idea to drive so fast that your stopping distance is greater than the range of your headlights, for obvious reasons.

Lots of stuff everyone does distracts from driving. I, personally, go the speed of the prevailing traffic and no faster, avoid any distractions (even eschewing talking when in heavy traffic or adverse conditions). If I used any mind-altering substances, I would be sure to be sober before hopping behind the wheel. Anybody who tries to multitask while driving, speeds (and not just to keep up with traffic), drives intoxicated, or several of these other things that can make driving more dangerous, but says that it's not really dangerous "because he can handle it" has been lied to, usually by himself.

See? it's not 'speed' that kills...it's 'poor driving decisions'.

For the record, my headlights shine for at LEAST 300 feet. My car stops from 70 in about 150 feet.

I'm surprised you've bought into NannyState regulations, brother...

 

[dmp]

I agree 100% with Mr. P. Multi-tasking is the problem, and while hands-free devices don't solve 100% of the problem, it makes it much easier to hold a conversation, since it's akin to talking with someone in the car. Hands-free devices will reduce the problem, though they will not eliminate them.

That's all great except it's NOT like talking to somebody in the car.

 

[Abbey Normal]

I am much more distracted by talking to a passenger while I'm driving, than I am by talking on the phone. Perhaps that is because when the person is right there, you have to be conscious of both parties' facial expressions.

 

[5stringJeff]

That's all great except it's NOT like talking to somebody in the car.

'Nuh-uh' is not an effective rebuttal, my friend.

 

[Shattered]

I think Abbey's right.. Talking to someone in the car with you is MUCH more distracting than talking to them on the phone.. While you're on the phone, your instinct is not to automatically look at the phone when the person speaks to you.. However, when someone sitting right next to you speaks, your first instinct is to look over. If they're a "babbler", it's even worse.

 

[dmp]

'Nuh-uh' is not an effective rebuttal, my friend.

There's nothing I can to convince you - but you can borrow my cell phone this weekend and try for yourself, if you like.

 

[misterblu]

I think Abbey's right.. Talking to someone in the car with you is MUCH more distracting than talking to them on the phone.. While you're on the phone, your instinct is not to automatically look at the phone when the person speaks to you.. However, when someone sitting right next to you speaks, your first instinct is to look over. If they're a "babbler", it's even worse.

I completely disagree. Whether I'm having a conversation with someone over the phone, or in the car, I'm looking at the road ahead. People that tend to look at the person they're talking to while driving scare me.

The main difference between the two 'types' of conversation is that the person in the car with you experiences the conditions around you. If there is some difficult driving task to perform (merging, bad road condions, etc) the person in the car is apt to stop or limit the conversation. The person on the other end of a cell phone call has no idea where you are and what you're doing and it causes a distraction.

How many people get in accidents because they decided to change the radio station at the wrong time? It's not a problem to change a radio station, but you wouldn't generally do it while driving around a decreasing radius turn either. It's a distraction.

It's not so much that you can't drive and talk on the cell phone at the same time, it's just that there are times when you shouldn't.

Since many people lack the good judgement to stay off the phone in these situations, it might be best to ban it altogether. If the phone conversation is that important, pull off onto the shoulder for a few minutes.

Oh, and I'm just a lurker... don't know why I decided to reply this time. :wave: