"We could hire two young teachers for what we are paying you"

Discussion in 'Education' started by chanel, Jul 5, 2012.

  1. chanel
    Offline

    chanel Silver Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2009
    Messages:
    12,130
    Thanks Received:
    2,746
    Trophy Points:
    98
    Location:
    People's Republic of NJ
    Ratings:
    +2,749
    Yesterday I read a letter written by an English teacher who was forced to retire after 41 years of teaching. It was powerful and sad, and had me thinking about the importance of tenure and seniority.

    Without going into all the details, this teacher had an incredible reputation. When my older son scored a perfect 5 on his AP English exam, he was the first person he called. After a year in his class, my younger son's SAT scores went up 100 points. He and his students won numerous awards which were often touted in the school newspaper and on their website.

    But his methods were not hip enough. He was asked to leave because he was too old to "adapt to the new methods of teaching". He was reminded that he was at the top of the pay scale and with the overwhelming number of employment applications they were getting, he could be replaced with two new teachers.

    He gave up his job "voluntarily" after a year or so of bullying by the administration, but it broke his heart to do so. (It is also worth mentioning that he never married and spent his life dedicated to the school).

    This was in a Catholic school.

    As I approach the last quarter of my career, I fear that without tenure protections and seniority, veteran teachers will be first on the chopping block. It's inevitable.

    Comments?
     
  2. JakeStarkey
    Offline

    JakeStarkey Diamond Member Supporting Member

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    Messages:
    136,790
    Thanks Received:
    12,302
    Trophy Points:
    2,165
    Ratings:
    +32,266
    A difficult question for GOP veterans. However, seniority and tenure need to be considered strongly in public and private school teaching professions. We forget that unions arose because of inability of owners and managers to properly assess, value, and compensate workers. The adversarial factor of labor and capital dictates an unbalance of power. The problem of course is finding the balance.

    The instructor could have continued, if I read the OP correctly, but "chose" to leave "voluntarily."
     
  3. rightwinger
    Online

    rightwinger Paid Messageboard Poster Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2009
    Messages:
    120,211
    Thanks Received:
    19,811
    Trophy Points:
    2,190
    Location:
    NJ & MD
    Ratings:
    +45,287
    It may be an argument for performance based pay instead of seniority. He is obviously a top teacher. He should be arguing his pay rate because he delivers results rather than he worked a lot of years

    Sad to see good teachers forced into retirement. But cash strapped districts have few options. One problem I have with tenure is that it holds teachers back. Great teachers should be able to sell their services between districts and get the best pay. Tenure ties you to one district
     
  4. JakeStarkey
    Offline

    JakeStarkey Diamond Member Supporting Member

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    Messages:
    136,790
    Thanks Received:
    12,302
    Trophy Points:
    2,165
    Ratings:
    +32,266
    Excellent insight. In my day as school board president we continually had to fight the "left" and the hard "right" off on these issues. Then, in the South, school boards have to get around state school boards that attack critical thinking values as an attack on family and church right to indoctrinate students and not have it challenged at school.

    I would tell them "then home school" and then "your students are going to learn critical thinking if they go on to higher education." The come back was always "dang gub'mint." My answer was "we don't want your religious interpretation of Christianity" as the sole source of values in public ed.
     
  5. WorldWatcher
    Offline

    WorldWatcher Gold Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2010
    Messages:
    6,971
    Thanks Received:
    1,275
    Trophy Points:
    200
    Location:
    VA
    Ratings:
    +1,905

    As a person in Human Resources...

    Considering an age of college graduation of 22 and 41 years in the profession that makes for age 63.

    If forced to retire without compulsory retirement ages in the law (which are legal for certain jobs, especially when safety is involved), then he could have implemented actions which put the administrators on notice of a potential violation of Federal law concerning age discrimination.


    >>>>
     
  6. rightwinger
    Online

    rightwinger Paid Messageboard Poster Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2009
    Messages:
    120,211
    Thanks Received:
    19,811
    Trophy Points:
    2,190
    Location:
    NJ & MD
    Ratings:
    +45,287
    What districts do here is they buy teachers out. Offer any teacher over 60 a one time incentive to retire now. $15,000 to $25,000 if you retire at the end of the year. The district makes the money back in a year by hiring a teacher fresh out of college
     
  7. JakeStarkey
    Offline

    JakeStarkey Diamond Member Supporting Member

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    Messages:
    136,790
    Thanks Received:
    12,302
    Trophy Points:
    2,165
    Ratings:
    +32,266
    Incentives are a tool that we used on occasion, when we wanted a teacher to retire but did not want the fight.
     
  8. squeeze berry
    Offline

    squeeze berry Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2010
    Messages:
    8,689
    Thanks Received:
    878
    Trophy Points:
    190
    Location:
    virginia
    Ratings:
    +1,459
    I can assure you that you get better at teaching each year.

    A new teacher may be cheaper, but not necwssarilt better. there are some exceptions to that, but they are rare.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  9. Truthmatters
    Offline

    Truthmatters BANNED

    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Messages:
    80,182
    Thanks Received:
    2,223
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings:
    +2,233
    just think if we actually funded education instead of short shifting at every turn.


    Our kids might actually think we wanted them to learn
     
  10. Douger
    Offline

    Douger BANNED

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2009
    Messages:
    12,323
    Thanks Received:
    915
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Not fucking there !
    Ratings:
    +915
    I think new teachers are far superior.
    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TY6tQiMlD8Y]Debra Lafave Interview - Part 1 of 4 - YouTube[/ame]
     

Share This Page