Untying the Israel palestine knot

[Boston1]

Untying the Palestinian Israeli Knot - Blogs - Jerusalem Post

This is an interesting article that presents some of the problems faced unless both Israel and its refugees can effectively solve their differences and present a united front to what might just be an even worse enemy than each other.

My take is the only chance the situation on the ground has to improve is to allow a period of peace to prevail. At which point restrictions can be lightened and the healing process can begin. I realize thats the standard Israeli position but I don't see how restrictions can be lifted in the middle of daily violent acts. It just isn't justifiable to bear ones neck to the knife and prey.

 

[Penelope]

What refugees?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Good to see someone thinking about the issues.

BDS is trying to break that cycle. What are the Israelis doing?

 

[Indeependent]

Good to see someone thinking about the issues.

BDS is trying to break that cycle. What are the Israelis doing?

Supplying Jobs, Electricity and Water to people trying to kill them.
Next question...

 

[Boston1]

Thats the whole point Penelope, what refugees. The issue really boils down to refugee status. Since the UN failed to segregate at any point in the conflict legitimate refugees from legal or illegal combatants then what we have today is a complex mix of all three. One that must be disentangled before any real other issues can be addressed.

But before any issues can be addressed we must break the cycle of violence.

I'd be comfortable with lifting restrictions when the Geneva convention suggested period of one year transpire without ANY ACTS OF VIOLENCE.

My own personal peace plan would ask the Israeli's to also halt any police actions against known terrorists or terrorist organizations. As this issue has inflamed tensions throughout former peace efforts.

I'd further ask the palestinian authorities to enforce arrest requests from the Israeli side regardless and even lacking judicial action.

Both sides will need a cooling off period. I'd suggest this period be allowed without further agreements being made.

If all else fails, one year of peace would ensue.

Once a year of peace is acheived then I believe Israel should lighten restrictions ( no travel restrictions but continued searches of goods moving into or through Israeli areas ) on say half of the areas in the disputed territories now under restrictions and allow free trade nationally and internationally within those areas for a period of two years. As long as the peace prevails over those two years.

I'd keep it simple and aim for a three year hand shake deal. My personal take is the economic wild fire that would ensue in the formerly restricted areas would be all the convincing necessary to produce results at the negotiating table from then on out.

The palestinians aren't lazy, they just haven't had a chance yet to really prosper minus the ongoing war. Given the chance and I think good things will happen.

I know I've gone off on some untra nationalist stuff but in the end I'm a proponent of peace and prosperity.

Both peoples will do better in peace than in war.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Thats the whole point Penelope, what refugees. The issue really boils down to refugee status. Since the UN failed to segregate at any point in the conflict legitimate refugees from legal or illegal combatants then what we have today is a complex mix of all three. One that must be disentangled before any real other issues can be addressed.

But before any issues can be addressed we must break the cycle of violence.

I'd be comfortable with lifting restrictions when the Geneva convention suggested period of one year transpire without ANY ACTS OF VIOLENCE.

My own personal peace plan would ask the Israeli's to also halt any police actions against known terrorists or terrorist organizations. As this issue has inflamed tensions throughout former peace efforts.

I'd further ask the palestinian authorities to enforce arrest requests from the Israeli side regardless and even lacking judicial action.

Both sides will need a cooling off period. I'd suggest this period be allowed without further agreements being made.

If all else fails, one year of peace would ensue.

Once a year of peace is acheived then I believe Israel should lighten restrictions ( no travel restrictions but continued searches of goods moving into or through Israeli areas ) on say half of the areas in the disputed territories now under restrictions and allow free trade nationally and internationally within those areas for a period of two years. As long as the peace prevails over those two years.

I'd keep it simple and aim for a three year hand shake deal. My personal take is the economic wild fire that would ensue in the formerly restricted areas would be all the convincing necessary to produce results at the negotiating table from then on out.

The palestinians aren't lazy, they just haven't had a chance yet to really prosper minus the ongoing war. Given the chance and I think good things will happen.

I know I've gone off on some untra nationalist stuff but in the end I'm a proponent of peace and prosperity.

Both peoples will do better in peace than in war.

I'd be comfortable with lifting restrictions when the Geneva convention suggested period of one year transpire without ANY ACTS OF VIOLENCE.​

That would be a great help.

The problem is that Israel's version of no violence is for the Palestinians give up theirs while Israel keeps theirs.

 

[Boston1]

Each side would say that of the other. Saying it one more time does no good whatsoever.

The Israeli government needs to halt its police actions against palestinians FOR NOW, and focus on its own citizens cooperation with the year truce

The palestinian government needs to do something similar

Period.

Quite pointing fingers and just give peace a chance. Everyone just police their own for one year. If either side issues an arrest request the other side must honor it except for specified individuals like say Abbas or Bibi or whoever ends up on that list.

It could actually be a fairly simple process.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Each side would say that of the other. Saying it one more time does no good whatsoever.

The Israeli government needs to halt its police actions against palestinians FOR NOW, and focus on its own citizens cooperation with the year truce

The palestinian government needs to do something similar

Period.

Quite pointing fingers and just give peace a chance. Everyone just police their own for one year. If either side issues an arrest request the other side must honor it except for specified individuals like say Abbas or Bibi or whoever ends up on that list.

It could actually be a fairly simple process.

That is a good idea.

The way it is now, any Palestinian (including the speaker of parliament or cabinet ministers) can be arrested or killed by Israelis while the PA cannot touch any Israeli.

 

[Boston1]

Cool

This particular thread is about untangling the knot and actually moving forward from here.

I think just a few basic compromises would go a long way.

I'd suspect that no agreement beyond just two or three house rules should be required to try and establish a cease fire.

I don't think a single year has gone bye without one side of the other engaging in multiple acts the other sees as incitement

 

[P F Tinmore]

Cool

This particular thread is about untangling the knot and actually moving forward from here.

I think just a few basic compromises would go a long way.

I'd suspect that no agreement beyond just two or three house rules should be required to try and establish a cease fire.

I don't think a single year has gone bye without one side of the other engaging in multiple acts the other sees as incitement

It is Israel's definition of violence that needs to change. Take the ceasefires in Gaza for example. You have heard Nut&yahoo say that he wants quiet for quiet. What he means by that is that there will be no rockets, etc out of Gaza. However, Israel can still shoot farmers and fishermen. It can still clamp Gaza's economy down to nothing. He doesn't consider that violence.

 

[Shusha]

If Hamas honors the ceasefire there will be no need to shoot anyone. It is perfectly fair to expect Gazans not to approach the fence or go outside the naval boundaries set by Israel. At first. Those corridors can be gradually reduced or increased as it becomes apparent that Hamas is honoring the ceasefire. Easy peasy.

 

[P F Tinmore]

If Hamas honors the ceasefire there will be no need to shoot anyone. It is perfectly fair to expect Gazans not to approach the fence or go outside the naval boundaries set by Israel. At first. Those corridors can be gradually reduced or increased as it becomes apparent that Hamas is honoring the ceasefire. Easy peasy.

It is perfectly fair to expect Gazans not to approach the fence...​

No it isn't. That is private property on Palestinian land and the livelihood of the farmers.

If those freeloaders want a buffer zone they should put it on their own side of the fence.

 

[dani67]

i can understand why israel dont genocide them?

 

[Boston1]

This thread needs to stay on track or I dont see the point

 

[Penelope]

i can understand why israel dont genocide them?

Do you mean that? or are you being sarcastic?

 

[Penelope]

I wish they would tie the knot. I have been watching this for a few decades (like many have on here) and at one time I was for Israel, until I investigated more.
I have a major issue with the Israelites, thinking they have a God given right to the land and in my opinion they are the ones who have always begun stuff to instigate violence and unrest. I guess they are hoping the rest of the Palestinians will leave due to the abuse.
Yes there are zealot Palestinians and also zealot jews who cause trouble, but to recognize Israel as a Jewish state, I can understand why the Palestinians say no, and unless they get their land back and treated as equals , I understand their position. Now we know , that Israel plans one day to have a "temple" in Jerusalem , like Herods, and they have no right to change that area, which is a historical site. Daily and nightly the Israelite's regime bulldoze down homes and is stealing more an more land, and also polluting the West Bank.

I have more disgust for the Israel régime, than I do the Iranian or SA due to the fact the regime in Israel is all about power, land , and we own the world, the only reason I care at all about Israel and Palestine now is due to their abuse of the Palestinians, otherwise I can careless about the Israel state or the so called secular and religious zealots who want to begin sacrifices again who occupy the land. In my opinion they are a disgust to humanity in this day and age, this is no longer 500 BC in the ME, but they are acting out the OT.

 

[dani67]

i can understand why israel dont genocide them?

Do you mean that? or are you being sarcastic?

sarcastic

 

[Lipush]

Good to see someone thinking about the issues.

BDS is trying to break that cycle. What are the Israelis doing?

Fighting the Axis of Evil such as BDS

 

[Penelope]

Good to see someone thinking about the issues.

BDS is trying to break that cycle. What are the Israelis doing?

Fighting the Axis of Evil such as BDS

Lebanon, Syria and Iran??

 

[P F Tinmore]

Good to see someone thinking about the issues.

BDS is trying to break that cycle. What are the Israelis doing?

Fighting the Axis of Evil such as BDS

Israel is up a tree with BDS. They can't bomb BDS so they have no defense. That is the only thing those clowns know what to do do.