Turning Logic on Its Head

[DGS49]

From a USA Today on-line article a little while ago:

Obama, aides and a half-dozen guests discussed how families have been separated because of existing immigration laws. Faith leaders discussed "the impact the failure to fix the immigration system has on families in their congregations and communities," the White House said.

The Senate passed an immigration bill last year that included a pathway to citizenship for people who are in the country illegally. Many House Republicans opposed such a provision, calling it amnesty for lawmakers (sic)*.

OK let's think about this. People jump the line and come to this country illegally. They have a "home" country - usually Mexico - but for whatever reason they choose to seek their fortune (or whatever) within the borders of the United States of America. Illegally.

They have kids, who by a perverse reading of the Constitution, become citizens of the U.S. by virtue of being born here, and ultimately it comes to pass that the parents face deportation (did I mention they are here illegally?), while the kids can stay here.

This is the situation that Our Beloved President describes as the families being, "...separated because of U.S. immigration laws..."

Are you shitting me? They are SEPARATED, Mr. President, because they have chosen to BREAK our immigration laws, AND because they CHOOSE not to go back WHERE THEY CAME FROM (if you will pardon the expression) AS A FAMILY! Nobody is forcing them to separate. No government edict is forcing some of them to go back to Mexico (or wherever) and some to remain. THAT IS THEIR OWN FUCKING CHOICE! They would be more than welcome in their HOME COUNTRY, as an intact family, even though some of them also have U.S. citizenship.

How can you cooperate and negotiate with people who intentionally distort reality for political gain? Just like with healthcare, the minimum wage, the "wage gap" and everything else.

__________________
* I assume he meant to say, "lawbreakers."

 

[waltky]

Like playin' Whack-a-mole...

Shift of illegal crossings into Texas accelerates
May 23, 2014 — A shift by immigrant smugglers to target the tough-to-defend U.S.-Mexico border in southernmost Texas has accelerated this year as the Border Patrol scrambles to shift its resources from states farther west, according to an internal agency report obtained by The Associated Press.

From Oct. 1 through May 17, agents in the southernmost tip of Texas made more than 148,000 arrests, on pace to match last year's total in less than eight months, according to the intelligence report. That compares with nearly 63,000 arrests in the Tucson, Arizona, sector, which it surpassed for the first time just last year. The Rio Grande Valley sector averaged nearly 1,100 arrests per day from May 11-17, according to the document.

What these numbers look like on the ground is a near-constant flow of people across the Rio Grande. The arrests do not represent the full level of traffic, only those who are caught, but the report's hourly breakdowns showed the arrests never stopped. Heat maps illustrating concentrations of arrests glowed bright red along miles of the Rio Grande south of McAllen. "I don't think we have anywhere near the resources that we would require to even make a dent in what we've got going on here," said Chris Cabrera, a Border Patrol agent in McAllen and local vice president of the agents' union. "I think it's common knowledge that we don't have the resources, that's why they're coming in droves like they are. They're exploiting a weakness that they've found and quite frankly they're doing a good job of it."

When a delegation of state agriculture commissioners from around the country visited the McAllen Border Patrol station Wednesday, they were told about 1,400 arrests were made the night before. They saw more than 1,000 immigrants, many mothers with infants or solo teenagers, being held in spaces intended to accommodate only a fraction of that. In a statement Friday, Department of Homeland Security spokeswoman Marsha Catron addressed the government's efforts to deal with unaccompanied children, who have contributed to the crowded conditions at Border Patrol stations and overwhelmed available shelter space. Last week, the government announced it would once again temporarily house as many as 1,000 of the children at a San Antonio Air Force base. DHS has designated someone to coordinate efforts, sent additional senior staff to the region and expanded awareness campaigns in the immigrants' home countries.

Last month, at the McAllen station to welcome a new group of temporarily assigned agents, the sector's Deputy Chief Raul Ortiz said he and the new chief were talking a lot about staff levels. "We do plan to bring on additional agents," Ortiz said. "Our plan is to certainly increase the staffing commensurate with the threat level down here." The Border Patrol has been trying to beef up its resources in the area for more than a year. Most new academy graduates come straight to Texas, and 115 agents from sectors elsewhere in Texas as well as Arizona and California have been temporarily detailed here. At the end of the last fiscal year, the Tucson sector had 1,049 more agents than the Rio Grande Valley.

The difference is not only in agents. Drones hum above the South Texas border with high-powered cameras, and a growing fleet of blimp-like aerostats are tethered at busy crossing spots to watch with infrared cameras. But one slide in a presentation by Border Patrol Chief Michael Fisher in March listed each sector's "deployment density," which it defined as having "sufficient assets to detect and respond to illicit cross-border activity." At that point, before the arrival of the temporary detail, the Rio Grande Valley ranked third from the bottom on the Southwest border at 58 percent, compared with 100 percent in San Diego.

MORE

 

[protectionist]

From a USA Today on-line article a little while ago:

Obama, aides and a half-dozen guests discussed how families have been separated because of existing immigration laws. Faith leaders discussed "the impact the failure to fix the immigration system has on families in their congregations and communities," the White House said.

The Senate passed an immigration bill last year that included a pathway to citizenship for people who are in the country illegally. Many House Republicans opposed such a provision, calling it amnesty for lawmakers (sic)*.

OK let's think about this. People jump the line and come to this country illegally. They have a "home" country - usually Mexico - but for whatever reason they choose to seek their fortune (or whatever) within the borders of the United States of America. Illegally.

They have kids, who by a perverse reading of the Constitution, become citizens of the U.S. by virtue of being born here, and ultimately it comes to pass that the parents face deportation (did I mention they are here illegally?), while the kids can stay here.

This is the situation that Our Beloved President describes as the families being, "...separated because of U.S. immigration laws..."

Are you shitting me? They are SEPARATED, Mr. President, because they have chosen to BREAK our immigration laws, AND because they CHOOSE not to go back WHERE THEY CAME FROM (if you will pardon the expression) AS A FAMILY! Nobody is forcing them to separate. No government edict is forcing some of them to go back to Mexico (or wherever) and some to remain. THAT IS THEIR OWN FUCKING CHOICE! They would be more than welcome in their HOME COUNTRY, as an intact family, even though some of them also have U.S. citizenship.

How can you cooperate and negotiate with people who intentionally distort reality for political gain?

__________________
* I assume he meant to say, "lawbreakers."

The real kicker of it is that we shouldn't even have this idiotic chain migration system based on family ties. We should have a point immigration system, like Canada, where applicants for immigration can only come here IF they have a cumulative total of a certain number of points. These should come from basically 2 things.
1. If they are bring a rare skill that we have a high demand for (this would not be very common)
2. If they are bringing capital, with which to open businesses and create jobs (For AMERICANS)

Another aspect of all this, is the birthright citizenship clause of the 14th amendment. It was never intended by its author (Jacob Howard), to give citizenship to foreigners, just because the parents came here before they were born (to acquire a lifetime of benefits at US taxpayer expense, from the birth of that child on the US side of the border).
Howard is a far more significant name in American history than most people realized. Some historians consider him to be as important as Lincoln in the abolition of slavery. He is credited with working closely with Lincoln in drafting and passing the Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution, which abolished slavery.
He also introduced the 14th Amendment, and served on the Joint Committee on Reconstruction which drafted it. At this time, he said >> "[The 14th amendment] will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the government of the United States, but will include every other class of person."

Clearly, Howard was not meaning to have foreigners helping themselves to US citizenship, and fortunes of US benefits, thereby.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_M._Howard

 

[MaryL]

Yeah yeah, blame the LAW and not the criminal. People are like that. Funny thing about that, when people get caught red handed they always find away to protest something...Like when people get caught red handed by cameras speeding, running red lights or shoplifting...it's about big brother, the NSA or violation of privacy or some other bullocks. Yeah.
Another thing. About Immigration laws "breaking up families"...What? Um, so does being a parent get you off the hook for breaking any law? So, if a rapist is married and has kids, we can't put him in jail because...think of the children! That is so cynical. Illegals are cynically playing the system. If you believe their line of crap I have a bridge in Brooklyn I can also sell to ya.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Jeb Bush: Immigration is ?not a felony? but ?an act of love? ? CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Jeb Bush: Immigration is 'not a felony' but 'an act of love'


(CNN) - Jeb Bush said the debate over immigration reform needs to move past derisive rhetoric describing illegal immigrants.

The former Florida governor said in an interview Sunday in College Station, Texas, that people who come to the United States illegally are often looking for opportunities to provide for their families that are not available in their home countries.

"Yes, they broke the law, but it's not a felony. It's an act of love, it's an act of commitment to your family," Bush told Fox News host Shannon Bream at town hall event at the George Bush Presidential Library Center.



"I honestly think that is a different kind of crime, that there should be a price paid, but it shouldn't rile people up that people are actually coming to this country to provide for their families," he said.

"I think we need to kind of get beyond the harsh political rhetoric to a better place."

Bush acknowledged that his comments would be recorded. "So be it," he said before discussing immigration reform, an area where he splits from many in the Republican Party in lobbying for a comprehensive overhaul.

 

[MaryL]

Jeb Bush: Immigration is ?not a felony? but ?an act of love? ? CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Jeb Bush: Immigration is 'not a felony' but 'an act of love'


(CNN) - Jeb Bush said the debate over immigration reform needs to move past derisive rhetoric describing illegal immigrants.

The former Florida governor said in an interview Sunday in College Station, Texas, that people who come to the United States illegally are often looking for opportunities to provide for their families that are not available in their home countries.

"Yes, they broke the law, but it's not a felony. It's an act of love, it's an act of commitment to your family," Bush told Fox News host Shannon Bream at town hall event at the George Bush Presidential Library Center.



"I honestly think that is a different kind of crime, that there should be a price paid, but it shouldn't rile people up that people are actually coming to this country to provide for their families," he said.

"I think we need to kind of get beyond the harsh political rhetoric to a better place."

Bush acknowledged that his comments would be recorded. "So be it," he said before discussing immigration reform, an area where he splits from many in the Republican Party in lobbying for a comprehensive overhaul.

I despise Bush. His "logic"put in us in a meaningless war in Iraq for no reason. Plutocrats like Bush are not something I would use as a be all end all. These rich white elitists exploit poor Mexicans, and they ignore their own history. I think they know white America is doomed. So does Obama, he is like Bush, he doesn't know were to redirect this train wreck of a culture.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Jeb Bush: Immigration is ?not a felony? but ?an act of love? ? CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

Jeb Bush: Immigration is 'not a felony' but 'an act of love'


(CNN) - Jeb Bush said the debate over immigration reform needs to move past derisive rhetoric describing illegal immigrants.

The former Florida governor said in an interview Sunday in College Station, Texas, that people who come to the United States illegally are often looking for opportunities to provide for their families that are not available in their home countries.

"Yes, they broke the law, but it's not a felony. It's an act of love, it's an act of commitment to your family," Bush told Fox News host Shannon Bream at town hall event at the George Bush Presidential Library Center.



"I honestly think that is a different kind of crime, that there should be a price paid, but it shouldn't rile people up that people are actually coming to this country to provide for their families," he said.

"I think we need to kind of get beyond the harsh political rhetoric to a better place."

Bush acknowledged that his comments would be recorded. "So be it," he said before discussing immigration reform, an area where he splits from many in the Republican Party in lobbying for a comprehensive overhaul.

I despise Bush. His "logic"put in us in a meaningless war in Iraq for no reason. Plutocrats like Bush are not something I would use as a be all end all. These rich white elitists exploit poor Mexicans, and they ignore their own history. I think they know white America is doomed. So does Obama, he is like Bush, he doesn't know were to redirect this train wreck of a culture.

That was Jeb Bush speaking, not George Bush. And yes, George did allow the plutocrats to exploit illegal immigrants while turning a blind eye. The Obama administration has been more diligent as far as deportations goes.

But since this is Jeb Bush and he is married to a Latina and his children are Hispanic it is understandable why he would have a more humane view of the issue.

And it makes no difference who is in the Whitehouse. The demographic shift in this nation is not happening purely because of illegal immigration. White America will retain it's hold on the purse strings long after the electorate has relegated whites to a minority status.

Speaking personally I don't have any problem with the demographic shift. I am a firm believer that the core values will remain and this nation will continue to stumble from crisis to crisis in the future just as it has always done when whites were the majority.

 

[Windship]

Jeb Bush: Immigration is ?not a felony? but ?an act of love? ? CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

I despise Bush. His "logic"put in us in a meaningless war in Iraq for no reason. Plutocrats like Bush are not something I would use as a be all end all. These rich white elitists exploit poor Mexicans, and they ignore their own history. I think they know white America is doomed. So does Obama, he is like Bush, he doesn't know were to redirect this train wreck of a culture.

That was Jeb Bush speaking, not George Bush. And yes, George did allow the plutocrats to exploit illegal immigrants while turning a blind eye. The Obama administration has been more diligent as far as deportations goes.

But since this is Jeb Bush and he is married to a Latina and his children are Hispanic it is understandable why he would have a more humane view of the issue.

And it makes no difference who is in the Whitehouse. The demographic shift in this nation is not happening purely because of illegal immigration. White America will retain it's hold on the purse strings long after the electorate has relegated whites to a minority status.

Speaking personally I don't have any problem with the demographic shift. I am a firm believer that the core values will remain and this nation will continue to stumble from crisis to crisis in the future just as it has always done when whites were the majority.

Let me guess...your not white, right?