Trump files, jury sees classified files or Trump wins

[Catsnmeters]

I don’t think there need be a trial in the first place. Even if the prosecution is 100% right, Good God Y’all! Ain’t they no murderers and rapists they could focus on?

Both can be done at the same time.

You didn't know?

If there is to be a trial, then the defense has an obligation to present all potentially exculpatory information to the jury.

Why is that evidence?

None of the indictments are for possessing classified documents.

If the prosecution doesn’t want to show the jury any classified documents it should not mention any classified documents.

The jury can see the covert pages and the classification status it shows but I don't why they would need to see that.

The indictments are for espionage violation, lying to investigaters, conspiracy to obstruct and obstruction of justice.

That said, their is a procedure for this type of case. As stated above the classified documents are neither helpful or relevant, again because classification status has nothing to with the indictments.

The Quick Guide to CIPA (Classified Information Procedures Act)

The fundamentals of the Classified Information Procedures Act (CIPA) – and how it will play a critical role in Donald Trump's prosecution.

www.justsecurity.org

Normally in criminal cases, information that is relevant to the preparation of a defense is discoverable. But under a series of cases, the most well-known of which is United States v. Yunis (DC Circuit), courts have held that if the information is classified, it must be both relevant and helpful to the defense to be discoverable, due to its highly-sensitive nature. The courts adopted the “relevant and helpful” standard that had been recognized by the Supreme Court for discovery of information involving informants, which also warranted heighted protections due to its sensitive nature.

 

[Billiejeens]

No you didn't else you would have for the above.

The indictment is a work of fiction.
That's a problem for you.
Just like the J6 infomercials were.

 

[WEATHER53]

The Democrats never expected to win.
It simply election interference.

It’s a smear campaign with no real desire for trials and outcome. Just hamper his election efforts.

 

[Zincwarrior]

The indictment is a work of fiction.
That's a problem for you.
Just like the J6 infomercials were.

 

[Billiejeens]

View attachment 919524

Correct, staged fiction.

 

[Catsnmeters]

yes he is, Trump can even receive classified intelligence reports

This is a strawman.

It doesn't apply to lying to investigaters, conspiracy to obstruct, obstruction of justice or the espionage act.

 

[Orangecat]

Why do you MAGAts hate reading?

Why do you bingos project so often?

 

[bendog]

prove it

oh you've been down this dark road before .... you Trollope (-:

 

[Curried Goats]

Why do you bingos project so often?

What projection?

 

[Rawley]

No you didn't else you would have for the above.

Nah. You have faith in Comrade Smith solely because he shares your hatred of Trump and represents your party's political interest. The fact that you are not disgusted with this Administration's resort to lawfare at inconceivable lengths says it all.

 

[Marener]

Nah. You have faith in Comrade Smith solely because he shares your hatred of Trump and represents your party's political interest. The fact that you are not disgusted with this Administration's resort to lawfare at inconceivable lengths says it all.

Or maybe we just expect Trump to follow the law like the rest of us. It’s Trump’s belief he’s untouchable that is disgusting.

 

[SavannahMann]

​

Wow, if this isn't a deal breaker, I don't know what is. Judge says jury entitled to see classified evidence....or screw it.

Mar-a-Lago Judge’s Stark Ruling: Jury Sees Secret Files or Trump Wins​

Department of Justice Special Counsel Jack Smith must now choose whether to allow jurors at the upcoming criminal trial to peruse through the many classified records found at the former president’s South Florida mansion or give jurors instructions that would effectively order them to acquit him.

Alternatively, Smith could appeal to the Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals, where more experienced judges have already overturned Cannon and reined her in. But doing that will only further delay a trial that’s at least three months behind schedule, entirely by the judge’s own design. (She froze the investigation and tried to slow-roll document review until the appellate court forced her to stop.)

Mar-a-Lago Judge’s Stark Ruling: Jury Sees Secret Files or Trump Wins

Jay Paul/ReutersThe MAGA-friendly federal judge who keeps siding with Donald Trump in his Mar-a-Lago classified records case has forced prosecutors to make a stark choice: allow jurors to see a huge trove of national secrets or let him go.U.S. District Judge Aileen M. Cannon’s ultimatum Monday...

www.yahoo.com

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.648652/gov.uscourts.flsd.648652.407.0.pdf

Ok. Then the Jury can be made up of people with TS clearances, which means people aware of how the documents are supposed to be stored and the responsibility that comes with the clearances.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Nah. You have faith in Comrade Smith solely because he shares your hatred of Trump and represents your party's political interest. The fact that you are not disgusted with this Administration's resort to lawfare at inconceivable lengths says it all.

See post #184, showing some of the actual docs.

Ok. Then the Jury can be made up of people with TS clearances, which means people aware of how the documents are supposed to be stored and the responsibility that comes with the clearances.

Yea, that would go a whole lot worse for Trump and I am sure his attorneys would try to object.

Correct, staged fiction.

You're arguing what, that these were planted by the FBI? Then he can make that argument in court. Its weird that of his multiple appeals and arguments, planting boxes of evidence has not been one. Also its hard to argue when there are two state witnesses saying he was having them move and hide the docs and get rid of the video evidence. But I am sure you knew that already.

 

[Rawley]

Or maybe we just expect Trump to follow the law like the rest of us.

He's not like the rest of us. He's a former President of the United States

It’s Trump’s belief he’s untouchable that is disgusting.

What's disgusting is hyperpartisan lunatics concocting ridiculous criminal and civil charges against a former President simply becasue you fear him and his policies.

The ironic thing is that your party's antics are so over the top, they are clearly helping propel him back into the Whit House.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Why is that evidence?

None of the indictments are for possessing classified documents.

Then no classified or national security documents will be mentioned? Or is the expectation for the jury to “just trust” Jack Smith?

According to CBS, ABC, and NBC there are 31 counts of willful retention of national security information. Have those been dropped?

The jury can see the covert pages and the classification status it shows but I don't why they would need to see that.

The indictments are for espionage violation, lying to investigaters, conspiracy to obstruct and obstruction of justice.

That said, their is a procedure for this type of case. As stated above the classified documents are neither helpful or relevant, again because classification status has nothing to with the indictments.

The Quick Guide to CIPA (Classified Information Procedures Act)

The fundamentals of the Classified Information Procedures Act (CIPA) – and how it will play a critical role in Donald Trump's prosecution.

www.justsecurity.org

Normally in criminal cases, information that is relevant to the preparation of a defense is discoverable. But under a series of cases, the most well-known of which is United States v. Yunis (DC Circuit), courts have held that if the information is classified, it must be both relevant and helpful to the defense to be discoverable, due to its highly-sensitive nature. The courts adopted the “relevant and helpful” standard that had been recognized by the Supreme Court for discovery of information involving informants, which also warranted heighted protections due to its sensitive nature.

Apparently Trumps attorneys believe that the documents are relevant and helpful to their case. They should know, correct?

Or are you the self appointed expert on the case that trumps attorneys will present?

 

[Rawley]

See post #184, showing some of the actual docs.

Yea, that would go a whole lot worse for Trump and I am sure his attorneys would try to object.


You're arguing what, that these were planted by the FBI? Then he can make that argument in court.

LOL and you think the FBI staging docs like that was helpful? LOL

Like I just told Marperson, the ridiculous length to which you are going after Trump are, ironically, going to put him back in the WH.

 

[Marener]

He's not like the rest of us. He's a former President of the United States

What's disgusting is hyperpartisan lunatics concocting ridiculous criminal and civil charges against a former President simply becasue you fear him and his policies.

The ironic thing is that your party's antics are so over the top, they are clearly helping propel him back into the Whit House.

Former presidents are actually required to follow the laws like the rest of us.

Unless you think you can show me where the law exempts former presidents from having to comply with grand jury subpoenas?

Nothing is being concocted. Trump chose this path.

 

[Zincwarrior]

LOL and you think the FBI staging docs like that was helpful? LOL

Like I just told Marperson, the ridiculous length to which you are going after Trump are, ironically, going to put him back in the WH.

You're arguing the FBI planted all those boxes and docs? Yes or no?

 

[Rawley]

Former presidents are actually required to follow the laws like the rest of us.

Unless they are Democrats

Unless you think you can show me where the law exempts former presidents from having to comply with grand jury subpoenas?

Nothing is being concocted. Trump chose this path.

LOL QED

 

[elektra]

This is a strawman.

It doesn't apply to lying to investigaters, conspiracy to obstruct, obstruction of justice or the espionage act.

A strawman is what you just presented, Trump has not been convicted