CDZ Transgender in the Military Debate

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by jwoodie, Jul 27, 2017.

  1. task0778
    Offline

    task0778 Silver Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,853
    Thanks Received:
    401
    Trophy Points:
    90
    Location:
    Texas hill country
    Ratings:
    +1,693
    Oh, like it's easy to tell when a person walks in the door to recognize him/her as a likely suicide down the road. And BTW suicide is a big problem throughout our society, in and out of the military. I CAN tell you that supervisors in all branches of the military services are trained to look for and identify people who show any signs that might indicate a problem. And it's true that many vets who have left the military do have mental issues including but not limited to suicides. Too bad the VA (a Single Payer System) sucks so bad at helping them. You think that's the military's fault, or is it some other organizations? It ain't like going to war is a walk in the park, never has been.
     
  2. Coyote
    Offline

    Coyote Varmint Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    57,667
    Thanks Received:
    10,174
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    in between
    Ratings:
    +26,919
    • Funny Funny x 1
  3. jon_berzerk
    Offline

    jon_berzerk Gold Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2013
    Messages:
    27,865
    Thanks Received:
    6,632
    Trophy Points:
    280
    Ratings:
    +16,954

    except that guy was trying to get out of the service on a section 8 "crazy town" --LOL
     
    • Funny and Agree!! Funny and Agree!! x 2
  4. skye
    Online

    skye Platinum Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2012
    Messages:
    22,991
    Thanks Received:
    10,569
    Trophy Points:
    970
    Ratings:
    +28,238

    :laugh2: ~~~~
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  5. Coyote
    Offline

    Coyote Varmint Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    57,667
    Thanks Received:
    10,174
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    in between
    Ratings:
    +26,919
    If a person meets all the tests and qualifications necessary to serve...why not?
     
  6. jwoodie
    Offline

    jwoodie Gold Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2012
    Messages:
    10,076
    Thanks Received:
    1,514
    Trophy Points:
    280
    Ratings:
    +5,201
     
  7. task0778
    Offline

    task0778 Silver Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,853
    Thanks Received:
    401
    Trophy Points:
    90
    Location:
    Texas hill country
    Ratings:
    +1,693
    May I respectfully direct you to Post #10, where I put a few reasons out there.
     
  8. Coyote
    Offline

    Coyote Varmint Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    57,667
    Thanks Received:
    10,174
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    in between
    Ratings:
    +26,919
    There is no indication that being transgender "isn't good" for the military or that transgender service members are disproportionately unfit for the job. Do you have any data to show that it is?

    Other countries have no prohibitions against transgenders serving and don't seem to be adversely effected.
     
  9. Coyote
    Offline

    Coyote Varmint Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    57,667
    Thanks Received:
    10,174
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    in between
    Ratings:
    +26,919
    5. It's up to the army to make that decision isn't it? Presumably transgenders have been serving for years, just not openly. Before changing policies prior presidents asked the military to study it and how it might effect military readiness and then went by their recommendations.

    6. What if? Depends on the policy.

    7. Depends on the policy.

    9. So? If they served honorably, they should be treated like any other member of the military needing medical services.
     
  10. task0778
    Offline

    task0778 Silver Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2017
    Messages:
    1,853
    Thanks Received:
    401
    Trophy Points:
    90
    Location:
    Texas hill country
    Ratings:
    +1,693
    1. I don't care what other countries do, most of 'em are a little more into PC than we are. What works for them doesn't mean it'll work as well for us.

    2. There are indeed studies that indicate transgenders might be disproportionately unfit for the job. These are not people you want to give weapons to and send them off to war. Guess you didn't read Post #10, so I'll re-post some of it:


    The science is not settled on the effectiveness of gender transitioning, which is a good reason to resist forcing taxpayers to pay for what is quite likely to turn out to harm rather than help gender dysphoric people. Peer-reviewed studies have demonstrated a need for caution. After reassignment surgery, people still have excessive high rates of suicide attempts and unresolved mental disorders, indicating that changing genders is not effective in improving the lives of individuals who suffer with gender dysphoria.

    In 2004, an article in The Guardian reported that a review of more than 100 international medical studies of post-operative transsexuals found gender reassignment was not effective and in fact, many patients remain traumatized and suicidal afterwards. Chris Hyde, the director of the research facility, said: “There is a huge uncertainty over whether changing someone’s sex is a good or a bad thing. While no doubt great care is taken to ensure that appropriate patients undergo gender reassignment, there’s still a large number of people who have the surgery but remain traumatized – often to the point of committing suicide.”

    In 2009, researchers found that 90 percent of the last 10 patients at their gender clinic had at least one other significant form of psychopathology, a key factor in a person’s fitness for military service. They said, “This finding seems to be in marked contrast to the public, forensic, and professional rhetoric of many who care for transgendered adults.” The researchers also said that “Such clinical certainty would have to be based on carefully established sophisticated follow-up findings. These are lacking.”

    Transgender People Have High Rates of Mental Illness

    An endocrinologist in the early days of the sex change movement, Dr. Charles Ihlenfeld, administered cross-gender hormones to some 500 gender changers over six years. Based on his observations, Ihlenfeld sounded a warning in 1979 about hormone therapy and reassignment surgery: “There is too much unhappiness among people who have had the surgery,” he said. “Too many of them end as suicides.” Ihlenfeld retrained as a psychiatrist to be better equipped to treat the transgender population.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2017

Share This Page