Time to declare War on Islam

[Kristian]

It will never happening to Islams world. But Turkey can be attacking by Israel if they want a diktatur in Turkey with military chiefs as diktatur leadering then Turkish Armed Forces and little Turkish fans over military chiefs transgress ...

 

[flacaltenn]

And those verses matter HOW -- in the practice of Jewish/Christian life in the Western world? You think all those women on Christian Mingle or JewDate are just looking for abuse and domination? Those biblical passages do not HINDER in any way the power and independence of Western women. You think Golda Meir was "held back" by that Genesis quote?

You are missing the entire KEY to successful WESTERN religious practice.. And that is exactly what I just told you. That those 2 quotes are SUCCESSFULLY interpreted into the modern context of freedom and tolerance. And TODAY mean more about what happens WITHIN a family unit -- then they do about hobbling and hindering feminism. Nothing WRONG with the CHOICE of woman as head of house and family. OR of the religious practice that goes on AT HOME. Even IF -- the religious practice at the worship hall might have them sitting separately.

first...misogyny does not equal abuse. it equals treating women as lesser beings.... you know,, like not letting them read from the torah or be priests.

i don't know what you're arguing but it wasn't the point i was raising. why do you think one has to rape and beat women to be a misogynist?

That whole point has traveled too far to fight over now. You just went off on a Christian for not understanding how religious fundamentalists "repress" women. So I just tried to remind you of the "misogynous culture" of Orthodox Jews. NEITHER case comes CLOSE to the ACTUAL ABUSE of women as practiced in those foreign Muslim dominated lands.

again, i was talking about misogyny..... the major religions, in fundamentalist form, all have that. i will also point out that far more women were killed by abusive men in this country than have been killed by honor killings.

again, that is not to say that women aren't treated in disgusting fashion as a matter of course in Arab countries. But that wasn't the point i was making. It's the one you seem to need for some reason.

but we are a largely secular country, so the homicide rate would have very little to do with religion

true. but there have been assassinations (like dr till) and bombings (like Atlanta) and mass shootings like the one at planned parenthood,. I don't think I've ever suggested that solving the problem of terrorism (muslim, Christian or otherwise) would solve the problem of murders in this country.

As long as you consider and understand the INSPIRATIONS and motivations for atrocious mass murders and killings -- we're all on the same page. Except the book on extremist Muslim violence is a shit load thicker and more recent and more of a global concern right now.

 

[jillian]

first...misogyny does not equal abuse. it equals treating women as lesser beings.... you know,, like not letting them read from the torah or be priests.

i don't know what you're arguing but it wasn't the point i was raising. why do you think one has to rape and beat women to be a misogynist?

That whole point has traveled too far to fight over now. You just went off on a Christian for not understanding how religious fundamentalists "repress" women. So I just tried to remind you of the "misogynous culture" of Orthodox Jews. NEITHER case comes CLOSE to the ACTUAL ABUSE of women as practiced in those foreign Muslim dominated lands.

again, i was talking about misogyny..... the major religions, in fundamentalist form, all have that. i will also point out that far more women were killed by abusive men in this country than have been killed by honor killings.

again, that is not to say that women aren't treated in disgusting fashion as a matter of course in Arab countries. But that wasn't the point i was making. It's the one you seem to need for some reason.

but we are a largely secular country, so the homicide rate would have very little to do with religion

true. but there have been assassinations (like dr till) and bombings (like Atlanta) and mass shootings like the one at planned parenthood,. I don't think I've ever suggested that solving the problem of terrorism (muslim, Christian or otherwise) would solve the problem of murders in this country.

As long as you consider and understand the INSPIRATIONS and motivations for atrocious mass murders and killings -- we're all on the same page. Except the book on extremist Muslim violence is a shit load thicker and more recent and more of a global concern right now.

oh we're on the same page. and jihadis are a huge problem. but when I was in college my class was told by my favorite Mideast politics prof (who actually was an expert in the subject) that jihadis would be the largest problem of the 21st centruary. he wasn't wrong.

the problem for us as a society is being able to discern the difference between jihadis and decent muslims who do not want this type of violence.

 

[flacaltenn]

I don't even agree that it's misogyny for Ortho Christians and Jews.. But that's another argument. When practiced in tolerant secular societies -- the "misogeny" accusation is a POLITICAL interpretation. Not a religious one. Feminists derided women for choosing a domestic role. And about 2 decades later -- the left wing they were housed in -- were complaining about the resultant economy where TWO parents had to work to survive economically.

I see the misogeny label routinely applied to Islam - even in western countries. That's one of the things that bothers me. Take for example wearing a hajib - not a burkha - a simple headscarf. If a muslim woman in a western country chooses to wear it, it gets labeled a symbol of muslim misogeny. As if - because she's Muslim - it's never a free choice but compelled, while her Christian and Jewish sisters do so out of "choice". I think in many of the most conservative sects of these religions there is tremendous community and family pressure to conform and excercising free choice can lead to expulsion from our family, community or religion. Sometimes that pressure can force women into subservient roles or to stay in bad marriages or worse - to accept blame for domestic violence because of religious beliefs. That's when it can be misogenist in nature and it occurs among Christians and Jews, it's just not widely publicized.

misogyny is part of most fundamentalist belief systems. the difference is jews and Christians don't throw acid in the face of women for going to school.

No...they do it for other reasons...that somehow sound the same.

Acid attacks rising in Colombia

A cheap and quick way of destroying a woman’s life, acid attacks in India, Afghanistan and Bangladesh have received widespread attention in recent years, with a documentary about victims in Pakistan winning an Oscar this year. While the gruesome assaults have been rare in the West, a rising number of attacks in Colombia has alarmed prosecutors and public health officials and terrified women. Dozens of such attacks, in which assailants soak their victims with sulfuric or nitric acids, are believed to take place here each year.

The precise reason for the spike here — and not in, say, neighboring Peru — is not known. But women’s rights advocates in Colombia talk about an epidemic of violence against women, from spouse-battering cases so extreme that they make the nightly news to reports of illegal armed groups using rape as a weapon in a murky rural conflict.


“Sometimes in the West we make fast judgments and say, ‘Look how terrible they treat women in the East,’ and we don’t look first at ourselves,” said Monica Roa, the Bogota-based international programs director of Women’s Link Worldwide, a rights group. “The violence here may be different, but it emanates from the same place. This is a culture where machismo reigns, where men do what they want to do.”


If a woman is attacked over a dowry in India or because she ventured outside without a veil in Pakistan, in Colombia a woman might be attacked because of sheer rage over her independence or even by a disturbed man she doesn’t know. ​

That’s what happened in 2004 to Maria Cuervo when a complete stranger shouted, “This is so you don’t think you’re so pretty” and drenched her face with acid.​

Colombia cracks down on a horrific wave of acid attacks against women

Experts believe the root of Colombia’s problem lies in a dangerous cocktail of misogynistic attitudes ingrained in mainstream culture and high levels of violence following a half-century civil war that killed more than 200,000. That conflict is only coming to an end now through painfully slow peace talks between the government and the armed Marxist rebels of the group known as FARC.

One obvious historic marker of the country’s patriarchal culture is that women did not get the right to vote until 1954 — trailing some 20 of Colombia’s regional neighbors in Latin America which had already hit that milestone.

Potes says 87% of Colombia’s acid attack victims are women, while 90% of perpetrators are men. “Usually it is someone from the victim’s inner circle, a husband or the father of her children, who cannot accept being turned down or left,” she says. “The attitude is ‘If I can’t have you, then no one else can either.’”
​

So is this somehow less misgonistic?

It never gets into the mainstream news either.

we are not talking about attacks in Columbia

Acid Attacks on Women Spread Terror in Iran

Afghanistan: Schoolgirls hurt in acid attack in Herat - CNN.com

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

 

[flacaltenn]

That whole point has traveled too far to fight over now. You just went off on a Christian for not understanding how religious fundamentalists "repress" women. So I just tried to remind you of the "misogynous culture" of Orthodox Jews. NEITHER case comes CLOSE to the ACTUAL ABUSE of women as practiced in those foreign Muslim dominated lands.

again, i was talking about misogyny..... the major religions, in fundamentalist form, all have that. i will also point out that far more women were killed by abusive men in this country than have been killed by honor killings.

again, that is not to say that women aren't treated in disgusting fashion as a matter of course in Arab countries. But that wasn't the point i was making. It's the one you seem to need for some reason.

but we are a largely secular country, so the homicide rate would have very little to do with religion

true. but there have been assassinations (like dr till) and bombings (like Atlanta) and mass shootings like the one at planned parenthood,. I don't think I've ever suggested that solving the problem of terrorism (muslim, Christian or otherwise) would solve the problem of murders in this country.

As long as you consider and understand the INSPIRATIONS and motivations for atrocious mass murders and killings -- we're all on the same page. Except the book on extremist Muslim violence is a shit load thicker and more recent and more of a global concern right now.

oh we're on the same page. and jihadis are a huge problem. but when I was in college my class was told by my favorite Mideast politics prof (who actually was an expert in the subject) that jihadis would be the largest problem of the 21st centruary. he wasn't wrong.

the problem for us as a society is being able to discern the difference between jihadis and decent muslims who do not want this type of violence.

He'd lose his tenure today for those statements.

 

[jillian]

again, i was talking about misogyny..... the major religions, in fundamentalist form, all have that. i will also point out that far more women were killed by abusive men in this country than have been killed by honor killings.

again, that is not to say that women aren't treated in disgusting fashion as a matter of course in Arab countries. But that wasn't the point i was making. It's the one you seem to need for some reason.

but we are a largely secular country, so the homicide rate would have very little to do with religion

true. but there have been assassinations (like dr till) and bombings (like Atlanta) and mass shootings like the one at planned parenthood,. I don't think I've ever suggested that solving the problem of terrorism (muslim, Christian or otherwise) would solve the problem of murders in this country.

As long as you consider and understand the INSPIRATIONS and motivations for atrocious mass murders and killings -- we're all on the same page. Except the book on extremist Muslim violence is a shit load thicker and more recent and more of a global concern right now.

oh we're on the same page. and jihadis are a huge problem. but when I was in college my class was told by my favorite Mideast politics prof (who actually was an expert in the subject) that jihadis would be the largest problem of the 21st centruary. he wasn't wrong.

the problem for us as a society is being able to discern the difference between jihadis and decent muslims who do not want this type of violence.

He'd lose his tenure today for those statements.

no he wouldn't.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

IF all those other groups want to try to be considered "minority" groups - they're free to lobby for it, who said they can't? You seem rather resentful of "minorities"

I'm not sure if you realize it...but there ARE "special" interest groups and political lobbies for many of these people you think are unrepresented...in fact there are TWO for German Americans

Considering the number of people the German-American groups represent they obviously aren't receiving their fair share of the monies handed out to minority groupings. However we can change that by making the monies received/allotted from the government for these purposes proportional to the number of people these groups represent, in addition to limiting the number of lobbying groups a minority can have in play or having the government tell those groups that represent a certain minority that they'll have to split it amongst themselves... Does that seem fair or am I being to resentful?

*****SMILE*****

 

[Coyote]

I see the misogeny label routinely applied to Islam - even in western countries. That's one of the things that bothers me. Take for example wearing a hajib - not a burkha - a simple headscarf. If a muslim woman in a western country chooses to wear it, it gets labeled a symbol of muslim misogeny. As if - because she's Muslim - it's never a free choice but compelled, while her Christian and Jewish sisters do so out of "choice". I think in many of the most conservative sects of these religions there is tremendous community and family pressure to conform and excercising free choice can lead to expulsion from our family, community or religion. Sometimes that pressure can force women into subservient roles or to stay in bad marriages or worse - to accept blame for domestic violence because of religious beliefs. That's when it can be misogenist in nature and it occurs among Christians and Jews, it's just not widely publicized.

misogyny is part of most fundamentalist belief systems. the difference is jews and Christians don't throw acid in the face of women for going to school.

No...they do it for other reasons...that somehow sound the same.

Acid attacks rising in Colombia

A cheap and quick way of destroying a woman’s life, acid attacks in India, Afghanistan and Bangladesh have received widespread attention in recent years, with a documentary about victims in Pakistan winning an Oscar this year. While the gruesome assaults have been rare in the West, a rising number of attacks in Colombia has alarmed prosecutors and public health officials and terrified women. Dozens of such attacks, in which assailants soak their victims with sulfuric or nitric acids, are believed to take place here each year.

The precise reason for the spike here — and not in, say, neighboring Peru — is not known. But women’s rights advocates in Colombia talk about an epidemic of violence against women, from spouse-battering cases so extreme that they make the nightly news to reports of illegal armed groups using rape as a weapon in a murky rural conflict.


“Sometimes in the West we make fast judgments and say, ‘Look how terrible they treat women in the East,’ and we don’t look first at ourselves,” said Monica Roa, the Bogota-based international programs director of Women’s Link Worldwide, a rights group. “The violence here may be different, but it emanates from the same place. This is a culture where machismo reigns, where men do what they want to do.”


If a woman is attacked over a dowry in India or because she ventured outside without a veil in Pakistan, in Colombia a woman might be attacked because of sheer rage over her independence or even by a disturbed man she doesn’t know. ​

That’s what happened in 2004 to Maria Cuervo when a complete stranger shouted, “This is so you don’t think you’re so pretty” and drenched her face with acid.​

Colombia cracks down on a horrific wave of acid attacks against women

Experts believe the root of Colombia’s problem lies in a dangerous cocktail of misogynistic attitudes ingrained in mainstream culture and high levels of violence following a half-century civil war that killed more than 200,000. That conflict is only coming to an end now through painfully slow peace talks between the government and the armed Marxist rebels of the group known as FARC.

One obvious historic marker of the country’s patriarchal culture is that women did not get the right to vote until 1954 — trailing some 20 of Colombia’s regional neighbors in Latin America which had already hit that milestone.

Potes says 87% of Colombia’s acid attack victims are women, while 90% of perpetrators are men. “Usually it is someone from the victim’s inner circle, a husband or the father of her children, who cannot accept being turned down or left,” she says. “The attitude is ‘If I can’t have you, then no one else can either.’”
​

So is this somehow less misgonistic?

It never gets into the mainstream news either.

we are not talking about attacks in Columbia

Acid Attacks on Women Spread Terror in Iran

Afghanistan: Schoolgirls hurt in acid attack in Herat - CNN.com

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

Flac, Google it. Reasons include family honor (ie she is perceived as promiscuous), or HE wasn't happy with her dowry...

There is nothing specifically in Islam that calls for honor killing, fgm, or acid attacks. It is culture. And it's a culture that devalues women. That culture is the same, whether it's India or Pakistan or Columbia. What I don't understand is why you are trying differentiate it? Hindu as a faith ican be just as horrid to women as islam but you seem to be saying it's different?

 

[Coyote]

IF all those other groups want to try to be considered "minority" groups - they're free to lobby for it, who said they can't? You seem rather resentful of "minorities"

I'm not sure if you realize it...but there ARE "special" interest groups and political lobbies for many of these people you think are unrepresented...in fact there are TWO for German Americans

Considering the number of people the German-American groups represent they obviously aren't receiving their fair share of the monies handed out to minority groupings.

What is a "fair share" of moneys and what is the criteria? Minority status alone?

However we can change that by making the monies received/allotted from the government for these purposes proportional to the number of people these groups represent, in addition to limiting the number of lobbying groups a minority can have in play or having the government tell those groups that represent a certain minority that they'll have to split it amongst themselves... Does that seem fair or am I being to resentful?

I don't know about "resentful" but I think you are being "odd".

You are suggesting that we add a far more intrusive layer of government that will determine how many people comprise a "minority group" and then allocate all moneys - that come from a variety of sources I imagine - to these groups, not based on need but on numbers. That's one issue.

The second issue is one of the same issues that comes up with the slave reparation idea that some have floated. Who counts? Who counts as a "German American"? Half German? A quarter? Less than that? I have a some German ancestry...does that entitle me? Unfortunately...unlike blacks, there was never a "one drop of blood" rule that labeled someone black (for the purposes of segregation).

Third, as a taxpayer, I don't want my money going to people who are doing perfectly fine. "Need" is an important component. For example, scholarships to promote education in traditionally undereducated minorities. Ironically - Appalachian people fall into a minority category - the hillbilly minority (and I live in WV) - we have a scholarship called the Promise Scholarship to encourage higher education among a population that traditionally has never gone to college. It's worked well. It's state moneys though. Those are the kind of minority initiatives I would support because they add value and give back. As opposed to just distributing money.

So...that leaves one more question...what exactly are you after here? Do you think this is money ill spent? Should it be equally distributed regardless of need? I'm a white female of Welsh, Norwegian, Danish, English, German ancestry - plus a few other flavors I suspect. I don't need any of this. But others do.


Oh....and back atya


*****SMILE*****

 

[flacaltenn]

And those verses matter HOW -- in the practice of Jewish/Christian life in the Western world? You think all those women on Christian Mingle or JewDate are just looking for abuse and domination? Those biblical passages do not HINDER in any way the power and independence of Western women. You think Golda Meir was "held back" by that Genesis quote?

You are missing the entire KEY to successful WESTERN religious practice.. And that is exactly what I just told you. That those 2 quotes are SUCCESSFULLY interpreted into the modern context of freedom and tolerance. And TODAY mean more about what happens WITHIN a family unit -- then they do about hobbling and hindering feminism. Nothing WRONG with the CHOICE of woman as head of house and family. OR of the religious practice that goes on AT HOME. Even IF -- the religious practice at the worship hall might have them sitting separately.

first...misogyny does not equal abuse. it equals treating women as lesser beings.... you know,, like not letting them read from the torah or be priests.

i don't know what you're arguing but it wasn't the point i was raising. why do you think one has to rape and beat women to be a misogynist?

That whole point has traveled too far to fight over now. You just went off on a Christian for not understanding how religious fundamentalists "repress" women. So I just tried to remind you of the "misogynous culture" of Orthodox Jews. NEITHER case comes CLOSE to the ACTUAL ABUSE of women as practiced in those foreign Muslim dominated lands.

again, i was talking about misogyny..... the major religions, in fundamentalist form, all have that. i will also point out that far more women were killed by abusive men in this country than have been killed by honor killings.

again, that is not to say that women aren't treated in disgusting fashion as a matter of course in Arab countries. But that wasn't the point i was making. It's the one you seem to need for some reason.

I don't even agree that it's misogyny for Ortho Christians and Jews.. But that's another argument. When practiced in tolerant secular societies -- the "misogeny" accusation is a POLITICAL interpretation. Not a religious one. Feminists derided women for choosing a domestic role. And about 2 decades later -- the left wing they were housed in -- were complaining about the resultant economy where TWO parents had to work to survive economically.

you know, when I have to sit behind a curtain in an orthodox service, it isn't political to me. it's religious.

Of course it is.

But when un-named folks come into discussions and talk about the anti-feminist misogyny of not granting getts to a Ketubah contract (divorce). THAT's a political perception -- because there is no real civil law or public enforcement of those marriage rules. OR when someone suggests that Ortho Jewish women are more likely to be abused by spouses -- that's an opinion based on political agenda. And their definition of "abuse" is far stretch over actual abuse sanctioned by some cultures and religions.

 

[flacaltenn]

misogyny is part of most fundamentalist belief systems. the difference is jews and Christians don't throw acid in the face of women for going to school.

No...they do it for other reasons...that somehow sound the same.

Acid attacks rising in Colombia

A cheap and quick way of destroying a woman’s life, acid attacks in India, Afghanistan and Bangladesh have received widespread attention in recent years, with a documentary about victims in Pakistan winning an Oscar this year. While the gruesome assaults have been rare in the West, a rising number of attacks in Colombia has alarmed prosecutors and public health officials and terrified women. Dozens of such attacks, in which assailants soak their victims with sulfuric or nitric acids, are believed to take place here each year.

The precise reason for the spike here — and not in, say, neighboring Peru — is not known. But women’s rights advocates in Colombia talk about an epidemic of violence against women, from spouse-battering cases so extreme that they make the nightly news to reports of illegal armed groups using rape as a weapon in a murky rural conflict.


“Sometimes in the West we make fast judgments and say, ‘Look how terrible they treat women in the East,’ and we don’t look first at ourselves,” said Monica Roa, the Bogota-based international programs director of Women’s Link Worldwide, a rights group. “The violence here may be different, but it emanates from the same place. This is a culture where machismo reigns, where men do what they want to do.”


If a woman is attacked over a dowry in India or because she ventured outside without a veil in Pakistan, in Colombia a woman might be attacked because of sheer rage over her independence or even by a disturbed man she doesn’t know. ​

That’s what happened in 2004 to Maria Cuervo when a complete stranger shouted, “This is so you don’t think you’re so pretty” and drenched her face with acid.​

Colombia cracks down on a horrific wave of acid attacks against women

Experts believe the root of Colombia’s problem lies in a dangerous cocktail of misogynistic attitudes ingrained in mainstream culture and high levels of violence following a half-century civil war that killed more than 200,000. That conflict is only coming to an end now through painfully slow peace talks between the government and the armed Marxist rebels of the group known as FARC.

One obvious historic marker of the country’s patriarchal culture is that women did not get the right to vote until 1954 — trailing some 20 of Colombia’s regional neighbors in Latin America which had already hit that milestone.

Potes says 87% of Colombia’s acid attack victims are women, while 90% of perpetrators are men. “Usually it is someone from the victim’s inner circle, a husband or the father of her children, who cannot accept being turned down or left,” she says. “The attitude is ‘If I can’t have you, then no one else can either.’”
​

So is this somehow less misgonistic?

It never gets into the mainstream news either.

we are not talking about attacks in Columbia

Acid Attacks on Women Spread Terror in Iran

Afghanistan: Schoolgirls hurt in acid attack in Herat - CNN.com

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

Flac, Google it. Reasons include family honor (ie she is perceived as promiscuous), or HE wasn't happy with her dowry...

There is nothing specifically in Islam that calls for honor killing, fgm, or acid attacks. It is culture. And it's a culture that devalues women. That culture is the same, whether it's India or Pakistan or Columbia. What I don't understand is why you are trying differentiate it? Hindu as a faith ican be just as horrid to women as islam but you seem to be saying it's different?

I'm talking about the link you provided in Post 479 -- trying to compare Arab culture to Indian culture.

Still smiling

The perp in THAT instance was a freakin' pedophile looking to score. Had nothing to do with India or Hindus or family taking blood of their own because of sick cultures of death and violence.

And you're giving links to abuse in Pakistan in the same posts as Columbia. AS THO -- the motivations and inspirations are the same. And apparently ASSUMING that random crimes of passion in Columbia are the same magnitude and scope as the WORLDWIDE inspiration of radical Islamic terrorism. Blowing people up WEEKLY for a cause..

 

[Tilly]

My Jewish friends tell me that although a Jewish man can deny his wife a gett/divorce, this rarely works out for him as the Jewish community tend to pressurise these men - going as far to ostracise them - into doing the right thing by the woman who wants a divorce. The polar opposite of what happens in Islamic communities unless the man wants the divorce.

 

[Coyote]

No...they do it for other reasons...that somehow sound the same.

Acid attacks rising in Colombia

A cheap and quick way of destroying a woman’s life, acid attacks in India, Afghanistan and Bangladesh have received widespread attention in recent years, with a documentary about victims in Pakistan winning an Oscar this year. While the gruesome assaults have been rare in the West, a rising number of attacks in Colombia has alarmed prosecutors and public health officials and terrified women. Dozens of such attacks, in which assailants soak their victims with sulfuric or nitric acids, are believed to take place here each year.

The precise reason for the spike here — and not in, say, neighboring Peru — is not known. But women’s rights advocates in Colombia talk about an epidemic of violence against women, from spouse-battering cases so extreme that they make the nightly news to reports of illegal armed groups using rape as a weapon in a murky rural conflict.


“Sometimes in the West we make fast judgments and say, ‘Look how terrible they treat women in the East,’ and we don’t look first at ourselves,” said Monica Roa, the Bogota-based international programs director of Women’s Link Worldwide, a rights group. “The violence here may be different, but it emanates from the same place. This is a culture where machismo reigns, where men do what they want to do.”


If a woman is attacked over a dowry in India or because she ventured outside without a veil in Pakistan, in Colombia a woman might be attacked because of sheer rage over her independence or even by a disturbed man she doesn’t know. ​

That’s what happened in 2004 to Maria Cuervo when a complete stranger shouted, “This is so you don’t think you’re so pretty” and drenched her face with acid.​

Colombia cracks down on a horrific wave of acid attacks against women

Experts believe the root of Colombia’s problem lies in a dangerous cocktail of misogynistic attitudes ingrained in mainstream culture and high levels of violence following a half-century civil war that killed more than 200,000. That conflict is only coming to an end now through painfully slow peace talks between the government and the armed Marxist rebels of the group known as FARC.

One obvious historic marker of the country’s patriarchal culture is that women did not get the right to vote until 1954 — trailing some 20 of Colombia’s regional neighbors in Latin America which had already hit that milestone.

Potes says 87% of Colombia’s acid attack victims are women, while 90% of perpetrators are men. “Usually it is someone from the victim’s inner circle, a husband or the father of her children, who cannot accept being turned down or left,” she says. “The attitude is ‘If I can’t have you, then no one else can either.’”
​

So is this somehow less misgonistic?

It never gets into the mainstream news either.

we are not talking about attacks in Columbia

Acid Attacks on Women Spread Terror in Iran

Afghanistan: Schoolgirls hurt in acid attack in Herat - CNN.com

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

Flac, Google it. Reasons include family honor (ie she is perceived as promiscuous), or HE wasn't happy with her dowry...

There is nothing specifically in Islam that calls for honor killing, fgm, or acid attacks. It is culture. And it's a culture that devalues women. That culture is the same, whether it's India or Pakistan or Columbia. What I don't understand is why you are trying differentiate it? Hindu as a faith ican be just as horrid to women as islam but you seem to be saying it's different?

I'm talking about the link you provided in Post 479 -- trying to compare Arab culture to Indian culture.

Still smiling

The perp in THAT instance was a freakin' pedophile looking to score. Had nothing to do with India or Hindus or family taking blood of their own because of sick cultures of death and violence.

Did you read the whole article? It was about more women then just the first one. Did you read beyond the first one?

That's the first thing. The second thing is this - are you saying that Hindus DO NOT take blood of their own because of their sick cultures of death and violence? Are you saying they are different then certain Muslim cultures in this regard? It just doesn't get reported as often in the media.

Honor killing
Breaking News, Analysis, Politics, Blogs, News Photos, Video, Tech Reviews - TIME.com
http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-...f-love-and-honour-killings/article8361586.ece
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/10/world/asia/10honor.html?_r=0

And you're giving links to abuse in Pakistan in the same posts as Columbia. AS THO -- the motivations and inspirations are the same. And apparently ASSUMING that random crimes of passion in Columbia are the same magnitude and scope as the WORLDWIDE inspiration of radical Islamic terrorism. Blowing people up WEEKLY for a cause..

Ok...what ARE the motivations? How about not distracting the conversation with suicide bombings and terrorist attacks because those are really different things with different motivations.

Honor killings are cutlural as are acid attacks on women. What they have in common - ACROSS CULTURES - that practice them is an attitude that regards women as "less than" - less then men, responsible for family "honor", property of males. Honor can mean many things - acting promiscuously, marrying someone of the wrong caste...getting fucking raped.

There is nothing specifically in Islam, Hinduism or Christianity that calls for honor killings is there?

So do you REALLY think the motivations for honor killing in India and Pakistan are any different? Do you REALLY think that acid attacks on women in India are somehow DIFFERENT than acid attacks in Pakistan or acid attacks in Columbia? It the SAME SICK CULTURAL ATTITUDE.

 

[Coyote]

My Jewish friends tell me that although a Jewish many can deny his wife a gett/divorce, this rarely works out for him as the Jewish community tend to pressurise these men - going as far to ostracise them - into doing the right thing by the woman who wants a divorce. The polar opposite of what happens in Islamic communities unless the man wants the divorce.

From what I read, under Islam - woman can initiate a divorce.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

What is a "fair share" of moneys and what is the criteria? Minority status alone?

Shouldn't it be? Isn't that fair?

You are suggesting that we add a far more intrusive layer of government that will determine how many people comprise a "minority group" and then allocate all moneys - that come from a variety of sources I imagine - to these groups, not based on need but on numbers. That's one issue.

Why is that an issue? Isn't everybody equal?

The second issue is one of the same issues that comes up with the slave reparation idea that some have floated. Who counts? Who counts as a "German American"? Half German? A quarter? Less than that? I have a some German ancestry...does that entitle me? Unfortunately...unlike blacks, there was never a "one drop of blood" rule that labeled someone black (for the purposes of segregation).

I suspect they'll have to choose which group they wish to identify with.

Third, as a taxpayer, I don't want my money going to people who are doing perfectly fine. "Need" is an important component. For example, scholarships to promote education in traditionally undereducated minorities. Ironically - Appalachian people fall into a minority category - the hillbilly minority (and I live in WV) - we have a scholarship called the Promise Scholarship to encourage higher education among a population that traditionally has never gone to college. It's worked well. It's state moneys though. Those are the kind of minority initiatives I would support because they add value and give back. As opposed to just distributing money.

You have proof that some specific minority group is doing better than another? In what way is it doing better? Is it those damn Jews? The Brits? Is it the Nazis? How about the Japs? Could it be the Chinks? I'll bet it's those damn Bavarians with their frakking knickers! Or maybe the Swiss who've been hoarding all that wealth all these decades! Until then...

Every minority group has it's underclass.

So...that leaves one more question...what exactly are you after here? Do you think this is money ill spent?

If the majority of the money is spent on anything other than scholarships, educational assistance, and/or caring, for the less fortunate... I'm going to say yes.

However if we institute the changes I suggest I'll admit that I really don't care how the group spends the money. They can spend it attempting to educate and care for the less fortunate of their minority group or they can spend it all going out and protesting everything under the sun...

But when the allotted money for that minority group is gone for the year that's it.

Should it be equally distributed regardless of need?

Is it now?

I'm a white female of Welsh, Norwegian, Danish, English, German ancestry - plus a few other flavors I suspect. I don't need any of this. But others do.

I guess you'll have to choose what you want to identify as.

Oh....and back atya

*****CHUCKLE*****

 

[Coyote]

What is a "fair share" of moneys and what is the criteria? Minority status alone?

Shouldn't it be? Isn't that fair?

Is it? You meet needs, not wants.

You are suggesting that we add a far more intrusive layer of government that will determine how many people comprise a "minority group" and then allocate all moneys - that come from a variety of sources I imagine - to these groups, not based on need but on numbers. That's one issue.

Why is that an issue? Isn't everybody equal?

How do you measure equality?

The second issue is one of the same issues that comes up with the slave reparation idea that some have floated. Who counts? Who counts as a "German American"? Half German? A quarter? Less than that? I have a some German ancestry...does that entitle me? Unfortunately...unlike blacks, there was never a "one drop of blood" rule that labeled someone black (for the purposes of segregation).

I suspect they'll have to choose what who they wish to identify with.

Ah...self identification. Any one can claim to be anything and get free government money.

Third, as a taxpayer, I don't want my money going to people who are doing perfectly fine. "Need" is an important component. For example, scholarships to promote education in traditionally undereducated minorities. Ironically - Appalachian people fall into a minority category - the hillbilly minority (and I live in WV) - we have a scholarship called the Promise Scholarship to encourage higher education among a population that traditionally has never gone to college. It's worked well. It's state moneys though. Those are the kind of minority initiatives I would support because they add value and give back. As opposed to just distributing money.

You have proof that some specific minority group is doing better than another. Until then...

Every minority group has it's underclass.

Economic disparities are easy to track.

So...that leaves one more question...what exactly are you after here? Do you think this is money ill spent?

If the majority of the money is spent on anything other than scholarships, educational assistance, and/or caring, for the less fortunate... I'm going to say yes.

However if we institute this the changes I suggest I'll admit that I really don't care how the group spends the money. They can spend it attempting to educate and care for the less fortunate of their minority group or they can spend it all going out and protesting everything under the sun...

But when the allotted money for that minority group is gone for the year that's it.

I wouldn't agree. Each group has to make a good case for need. I was listening to something on student debt and assistance - and the host was interviewing families. One family was struggling with sending a child to a state college the other was struggling to send a child to a select private college. One is need, the other is want.

Out of curiosity- what federal money is given specifically to minorities?

Should it be equally distributed regardless of need?

Is it now?

You'd have to give some specific examples - this is way too general to answer.

I'm a white female of Welsh, Norwegian, Danish, English, German ancestry - plus a few other flavors I suspect. I don't need any of this. But others do.

I guess you'll have to choose what you want to identify as.

 

[flacaltenn]

we are not talking about attacks in Columbia

Acid Attacks on Women Spread Terror in Iran

Afghanistan: Schoolgirls hurt in acid attack in Herat - CNN.com

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

Flac, Google it. Reasons include family honor (ie she is perceived as promiscuous), or HE wasn't happy with her dowry...

There is nothing specifically in Islam that calls for honor killing, fgm, or acid attacks. It is culture. And it's a culture that devalues women. That culture is the same, whether it's India or Pakistan or Columbia. What I don't understand is why you are trying differentiate it? Hindu as a faith ican be just as horrid to women as islam but you seem to be saying it's different?

I'm talking about the link you provided in Post 479 -- trying to compare Arab culture to Indian culture.

Still smiling

The perp in THAT instance was a freakin' pedophile looking to score. Had nothing to do with India or Hindus or family taking blood of their own because of sick cultures of death and violence.

Did you read the whole article? It was about more women then just the first one. Did you read beyond the first one?

That's the first thing. The second thing is this - are you saying that Hindus DO NOT take blood of their own because of their sick cultures of death and violence? Are you saying they are different then certain Muslim cultures in this regard? It just doesn't get reported as often in the media.

Honor killing
Breaking News, Analysis, Politics, Blogs, News Photos, Video, Tech Reviews - TIME.com
Of love and honour killings
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/10/world/asia/10honor.html?_r=0

And you're giving links to abuse in Pakistan in the same posts as Columbia. AS THO -- the motivations and inspirations are the same. And apparently ASSUMING that random crimes of passion in Columbia are the same magnitude and scope as the WORLDWIDE inspiration of radical Islamic terrorism. Blowing people up WEEKLY for a cause..

Ok...what ARE the motivations? How about not distracting the conversation with suicide bombings and terrorist attacks because those are really different things with different motivations.

Honor killings are cutlural as are acid attacks on women. What they have in common - ACROSS CULTURES - that practice them is an attitude that regards women as "less than" - less then men, responsible for family "honor", property of males. Honor can mean many things - acting promiscuously, marrying someone of the wrong caste...getting fucking raped.

There is nothing specifically in Islam, Hinduism or Christianity that calls for honor killings is there?

So do you REALLY think the motivations for honor killing in India and Pakistan are any different? Do you REALLY think that acid attacks on women in India are somehow DIFFERENT than acid attacks in Pakistan or acid attacks in Columbia? It the SAME SICK CULTURAL ATTITUDE.

That article about India proved NOTHING about honor killings. Most all of the perps were PERVERTS or jilted lovers. Those are crimes of passion --- not allegiance to a twisted MOVEMENT or IDENTITY -- and acid is cheaper than milk in those countries. THAT'S the connection,.

So then you supply a story about a young Indian girl who was either killed or committed suicide. Trial is not yet even over. And MAYBE it's an "honor killing".. But here's the diff..

It is ILLEGAL to murder a family member in India. Honor killing or not. And when it all gets sorted out -- honor killings are crimes of passion committed WITHIN a family. To me --- doesn't make a large diff between an honor killing and a murder. 'Bout the same meaningless adjective as making a "hate crime" out of a killing.

The inspiration may be religious or cultural -- but it is NOT invading a night club and shooting up 100 random people. Or taking an axe to strangers because you identify with a sick international movement. Or tying a mass casualty weapon to your chest and wading into throngs of innocent people screaming religious dogma.


Can't follow you up and down the various rabbit holes. I'm only interested in the big picture of ACTUAL TERRORISM. Not religious divorces or Biblical verses about the role of men/women. Don't care if they come from the Koran or the OT or the NT or a Rastafarian.

Across Cultures -- you seem to believe that abuse and constraints on women are more or less equal regardless of Cultures. You can find it almost anyway. From New Zealand to India. But what you're MISSING -- is that NOWHERE in the world are women more SYSTEMATICALLY oppressed and abused by the law than in ARAB and tribal Muslim cultures. I asked you earlier if Golda Meir was held back by oppressive OT bible verses or culture. And even with challenges both Pakistan and India have HAD women leaders (Although Bhutto was ACTIVELY hunted thruout her career and eventually assassinated.) and the BULK of Muslim ARAB world has largely uneducated TRULY OPPRESSED women. Each and every one of them.

Although some are QUITE happy and accepting of that role --- it is by ANY MEASURE -- brutal and inhumane.

Now can we talk about ALL LIVES -- and not JUST women's lives?

 

[Coyote]

We talking about religion, mysoginy and acid attacks. We weren't restricting it to the Muslim world until just now apparently.

Columbia has one of the highest rates. It occurs also at high rates in India, among the Hindu - another fiercely chauvinistic culture.

Geez Coyote. What was the INSPIRATION for that acid attack in India? Was it the Hindu religion? Or was it just a pecker-head pedophile who was tormenting her for ages? It was NOT HER OWN FAMILY --- was it?

Flac, Google it. Reasons include family honor (ie she is perceived as promiscuous), or HE wasn't happy with her dowry...

There is nothing specifically in Islam that calls for honor killing, fgm, or acid attacks. It is culture. And it's a culture that devalues women. That culture is the same, whether it's India or Pakistan or Columbia. What I don't understand is why you are trying differentiate it? Hindu as a faith ican be just as horrid to women as islam but you seem to be saying it's different?

I'm talking about the link you provided in Post 479 -- trying to compare Arab culture to Indian culture.

Still smiling

The perp in THAT instance was a freakin' pedophile looking to score. Had nothing to do with India or Hindus or family taking blood of their own because of sick cultures of death and violence.

Did you read the whole article? It was about more women then just the first one. Did you read beyond the first one?

That's the first thing. The second thing is this - are you saying that Hindus DO NOT take blood of their own because of their sick cultures of death and violence? Are you saying they are different then certain Muslim cultures in this regard? It just doesn't get reported as often in the media.

Honor killing
Breaking News, Analysis, Politics, Blogs, News Photos, Video, Tech Reviews - TIME.com
Of love and honour killings
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/10/world/asia/10honor.html?_r=0

And you're giving links to abuse in Pakistan in the same posts as Columbia. AS THO -- the motivations and inspirations are the same. And apparently ASSUMING that random crimes of passion in Columbia are the same magnitude and scope as the WORLDWIDE inspiration of radical Islamic terrorism. Blowing people up WEEKLY for a cause..

Ok...what ARE the motivations? How about not distracting the conversation with suicide bombings and terrorist attacks because those are really different things with different motivations.

Honor killings are cutlural as are acid attacks on women. What they have in common - ACROSS CULTURES - that practice them is an attitude that regards women as "less than" - less then men, responsible for family "honor", property of males. Honor can mean many things - acting promiscuously, marrying someone of the wrong caste...getting fucking raped.

There is nothing specifically in Islam, Hinduism or Christianity that calls for honor killings is there?

So do you REALLY think the motivations for honor killing in India and Pakistan are any different? Do you REALLY think that acid attacks on women in India are somehow DIFFERENT than acid attacks in Pakistan or acid attacks in Columbia? It the SAME SICK CULTURAL ATTITUDE.

That article about India proved NOTHING about honor killings. Most all of the perps were PERVERTS or jilted lovers. Those are crimes of passion --- not allegiance to a twisted MOVEMENT or IDENTITY -- and acid is cheaper than milk in those countries. THAT'S the connection,.

So then you supply a story about a young Indian girl who was either killed or committed suicide. Trial is not yet even over. And MAYBE it's an "honor killing".. But here's the diff..

It is ILLEGAL to murder a family member in India. Honor killing or not. And when it all gets sorted out -- honor killings are crimes of passion committed WITHIN a family. To me --- doesn't make a large diff between an honor killing and a murder. 'Bout the same meaningless adjective as making a "hate crime" out of a killing.

Ok...so you are trying really really hard to claim it's NOT honor killing when it's done in India but it IS honor killing in Islamic countries??? Come on flacaltenn - in India it's about CASTE and FAMILY HONOR. How many more articles do you need? That particular article, while it highlighted one woman, talked also about honor killing in broader terms, in India. Here are some more:

Honour killings are a separate horror
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/20/w...l-codes-as-women-stream-to-indias-cities.html


Acid is cheaper than milk in all those countries, yet you are still trying to claim that throwing acid on women in Muslim countries has a different MOTIVATION than throwing acid on women in Hindu countries?

Honor killings to me are murder - there is no difference. It's murder, but flac - you brought in honor killings as symptomatic of a sick MUSLIM culture, seperate from "murder"....so.,....is it murder or something else? And if it is something else what makes a sick mysoginest MUSLIM culture any different than a sick mysogonist Hindu culture or a sick mysogonist Christian South American culture - all of which are very paternalistic and chauvanistic and treat women like crap?

Honor killings are illegal in most countries - as murder - but they are seldom prosecuted.

The inspiration may be religious or cultural -- but it is NOT invading a night club and shooting up 100 random people. Or taking an axe to strangers because you identify with a sick international movement. Or tying a mass casualty weapon to your chest and wading into throngs of innocent people screaming religious dogma.

And those are different issues than honor killing and disfiguring women with acid.

Can't follow you up and down the various rabbit holes. I'm only interested in the big picture of ACTUAL TERRORISM. Not religious divorces or Biblical verses about the role of men/women. Don't care if they come from the Koran or the OT or the NT or a Rastafarian.

Across Cultures -- you seem to believe that abuse and constraints on women are more or less equal regardless of Cultures. You can find it almost anyway. From New Zealand to India. But what you're MISSING -- is that NOWHERE in the world are women more SYSTEMATICALLY oppressed and abused by the law than in ARAB and tribal Muslim cultures. I asked you earlier if Golda Meir was held back by oppressive OT bible verses or culture. And even with challenges both Pakistan and India have HAD women leaders (Although Bhutto was ACTIVELY hunted thruout her career and eventually assassinated.) and the BULK of Muslim ARAB world has largely uneducated TRULY OPPRESSED women. Each and every one of them.

And that is where you are wrong because you won't even look at India or Nepal, you completely ignore the situation for women there. Like when people point out the horrors of acid disfigurement of women in Pakistan but completely ignore it in India (where it's as high) or Columbia (also one of the highest). It's like there is this weird disconnect where it's not happening in a Muslim culture, it doesn't count - no one looks any further or even seems to care.

Although some are QUITE happy and accepting of that role --- it is by ANY MEASURE -- brutal and inhumane.

Now can we talk about ALL LIVES -- and not JUST women's lives?

I'm concerned about the state of cockroache lives in the US and am planning on starting a movement. Will you join me? I'm working on the fundraising aspect right now but need some snappy slogens

 

[flacaltenn]

My Jewish friends tell me that although a Jewish man can deny his wife a gett/divorce, this rarely works out for him as the Jewish community tend to pressurise these men - going as far to ostracise them - into doing the right thing by the woman who wants a divorce. The polar opposite of what happens in Islamic communities unless the man wants the divorce.

In Ultra Orthox. the peer and authority pressure is there to do it RIGHT and get the Gett (divorce). But life goes on and you are not really blocked from participating (like in Catholicism)

All that drama is usually AFTER a civil divorce is filed and adjudicated. So it's NOT a matter of denying his wife a divorce -- HE CAN'T (or she can't). (If she/he has a good civil lawyer) It's a matter of clearing the Religious paperwork so that either of them can marry again.

NEITHER can marry in an ORTHODOX ceremony again. So it's a stalemate. OR -- Either of them can find a NON-orthodox rabbi to recognize the new marriage and just kiss the Orthox community good-bye. No where near as serious as bondage or slavery. And the new happy couple(s) can be nearly as Orthodox as they choose to be.

I think in the US -- Orthodox is something like 4 or 5% of all Jews who identify with a denomination. Literally like 20 or 25K people.

 

[flacaltenn]

Gawd Coyote --- you're trying to wear me down with all this formatting. And nuances and footwork about honor killings and honor acid attacks. The latter of which I don't even understand the relevance or your confident assertion that it occurs in places other than Muslim nations. But in Muslim Arab nations, they don't NEED acid. They arrest people for these offenses and stone them or jail them or kill them by the power of the state.

And I've yet to see evidence for acid as a weapon of choice for an honor killing anyway. Not like hitting your sister with a piece of lumber or drugging her and smothering her.

So I'm starting fresh.

Ok...so you are trying really really hard to claim it's NOT honor killing when it's done in India but it IS honor killing in Islamic countries??? Come on flacaltenn - in India it's about CASTE and FAMILY HONOR. How many more articles do you need? That particular article, while it highlighted one woman, talked also about honor killing in broader terms, in India. Here are some more:

NONE of these articles give ANY statistics on Honor Killings. I can't remember HOW you went off on Honor "acid attacks", but those are not killings. And I saw almost NO examples of FAMILIES (a prerequisite for an "honor anything" using acid as a weapon. These last 2 articles are mum on numbers. The NY Times article is confined to one RURAL area where traditions are ancient. And the article said SOMETIMES they result in NON-family members taking out violence. These are not NATIONAL problems. It is ILLEGAL in India. Honor killings and punishments in ARAB Muslim states are largely RECOGNIZED and SANCTIONED by the freakin' govt.

Families all over the world threaten to disown children over marriage choices. And BTW in India -- even if a child's choice is WITHIN a Caste it can still be vetoed by their parents. This is not malignant culture. My grandmother said if I married a Goyim it would kill her. About 2600 times. I married a nice Jewish girl and when we visited she pointed to a pic of an earlier girlfriend on her desk and told my wife how lovely she was in that photo. It's all drama.

Acid is cheaper than milk in all those countries, yet you are still trying to claim that throwing acid on women in Muslim countries has a different MOTIVATION than throwing acid on women in Hindu countries?

Honor killings to me are murder - there is no difference. It's murder, but flac - you brought in honor killings as symptomatic of a sick MUSLIM culture, seperate from "murder"....so.,....is it murder or something else? And if it is something else what makes a sick mysoginest MUSLIM culture any different than a sick mysogonist Hindu culture or a sick mysogonist Christian South American culture - all of which are very paternalistic and chauvanistic and treat women like crap?

Honor killings are illegal in most countries - as murder - but they are seldom prosecuted.

You failed to provide any evidence of WIDE SPREAD "honor acid attacks" in India that were due to being Hindu. Or even done by FAMILIES for their honor. Most all of those anecdotes were about perverts and jilted lovers taking revenge.

I brought up that Media star twerker in Pakistan and the other cases as an example of how much easier it is to GET AWAY with honor killings in Pakistan and Arab countries than it is ANY of the places that you dug up to blow smoke on the situation.. From articles just about the Quandeel murder I LEARNED and you apparently didn't ----

Brother of murdered Pakistani Kim Kardashian boasts of pride at death

Pakistani law allows families to 'forgive' their loved ones meaning they do not face charges for honour killings, but the government has stepped in to ban this from happening to Muhammad Waseem, according to Yahoo News.

Brother of Pakistan's Qandeel Baloch: I'm 'proud' of killing sister - CNN.com

On the list of 145 countries featured in the World Economic Forum's 2015 Gender Gap Report, Pakistan is second to last with regards to gender disparity.
According to the Independent Human Rights Commission of Pakistan, violence against women is rampant, with as many as 212 women being killed in the name of 'honor' in the first five months of 2016.
Pakistan's Prime Minister, Nawaz Sharif, has vowed to tackle the problem but critics say few concrete steps have been taken.

Forget the smoke about south africa and India and the other deflections. Do you understand the significance of the facts above? Can you MATCH THOSE? Don't think you can..

And those are different issues than honor killing and disfiguring women with acid.

I think mashing folks on a France boardwalk with a massive truck, while gunning them down out the window is more of an issue affecting WESTERN societies right now -- than honor killings or acid attacks. Excuse me for being focused. I'm wondering how you dismiss the weekly carnage from the radical Islamic Terror news. Because there seems to be a lot of dancing and NOT A LOT of remorse or even ACKNOWLEDGEMENT about Brussels, or Kenya or San Bernadino, or Istanbul or Nice or Orlando or the dozen other HIDEOUS attacks just THIS YEAR. All inspired by warped culture in Arab Muslim hell holes.

How da fuck do you do that? Post after post. Thread after thread?