The Virtue of the Ordinary

[luiza]

So What's wrong with an ordinary life today?

That might be the end result .
But you have to earn your fulfillment by whatever your path requires .
Effort , determination and the ability to lie successfully

 

[Lisa558]

And you took the consumerism bait and are proud of it.

I never owned a new car and my work truck was my personal vehicle for most of my life. I guess I should be ashamed of that huh?

Why so defensive? Did I say you should be ashamed of how you chose to spend your money?

OTOH, you did criticize me for choosing to buy a new car. There are advantages to buying a new car, especially right before the next year’s model comes out.

 

[Blues Man]

Not to send your OP off topic, however if one aspires to have more, or accomplish more, it typically requires them to be more by doing more.

In the case of my earning a better grade than a C in algebra, it required me to apply myself MORE.

And as it turned out, doing MORE resulted in earning a far better grade in the class.

It wasn't a result of being more "adept" in the subject, it was a result of putting forth MORE effort.

What it appears to me that what you're actually saying is that some people feel the need to have more, or do more, based on external pressure as opposed to their own ambitions or the standards that they set for themselves, which I agree with.

Define what it means to be more.

If you are not going to pursue any type of career where algebra is going to make or break your chances what does being more of an algebra student get you?

Grades might have some correlation to the quality of a person's work but if it does it's minimal. How many times have you seen proof that A students work for C students?

 

[Blues Man]

Why so defensive? Did I say you should be ashamed of how you chose to spend your money?

OTOH, you did criticize me for choosing to buy a new car. There are advantages to buying a new car, especially right before the next year’s model comes out.

No you say people should be ashamed of having an ordinary life.

 

[Blues Man]

That might be the end result .
But you have to earn your fulfillment by whatever your path requires .
Effort , determination and the ability to lie successfully

It depends on what your sense of fulfillment is defined by.

 

[Lisa558]

Not to send your OP off topic, however if one aspires to have more, or accomplish more, it typically requires them to be more by doing more.

In the case of my earning a better grade than a C in algebra, it required me to apply myself MORE.

And as it turned out, doing MORE resulted in earning a far better grade in the class.

It wasn't a result of being more "adept" in the subject, it was a result of putting forth MORE effort.

What it appears to me that you're actually saying is that some people feel the need to have more, or do more, based on external pressure as opposed to their own ambitions or the standards that they set for themselves, which I agree with.

I would take it even one step further. While there’s nothing WRONG with people who are satisfied with an ordinary life, the people who work hard and put in the extra effort to be better than ordinary deserve postitive recognition of that.

It seems that in this era of “equity,” there is an unwillingness to recognize the extra efforts - and often talent - of those who achieve more via their own hand. Remember Obama’s scolding to business owners? “You didn’t build that!”

It is this type of thinking that leads to a decline in America.

 

[Lisa558]

No you say people should be ashamed of having an ordinary life.

Never said that, hon. But YOU revealed contempt for those who don’t.

 

[katsteve2012]

Define what it means to be more.

If you are not going to pursue any type of career where algebra is going to make or break your chances what does being more of an algebra student get you?

Grades might have some correlation to the quality of a person's work but if it does it's minimal. How many times have you seen proof that A students work for C students?

I'm didn't say that being MORE of an algebra student was going to "make or break me".

In my case, being the son of an educator required me to make more of an effort to apply myself in the classroom in that particular subject.

Living under my parents roof as a 13 year old middle school student required me to focus on what they believed to be important, because at that age, I obviously had no idea of what I wanted to do with my life.

What I did learn from that experience is that individual effort is typically the primary driver of positive results, and that was a life lesson that was extremely valuable.

Obviously, it's a given that there
are examples of those who were "C" students who end up achieving more than "A" students later in life because of the EFFORT that they put forth in their chosen profession.

Lastly, one persons definition of being "more", will likely be different than the definition of another, because that is directly related to an individuals hierarchy of needs.

Since it's your thread topic, I'll ask you the same question:

What is YOUR definition of what it means to be more?

 

[Woodznutz]

Does that include home equity? Also, it depends on your definition of middle class.

Includes all assets. It's their definition not mine.

"The latest census numbers indicate what income ranges constitute the middle class (as of 2020). This will depend on family size. For a single individual, a middle-class income ranges from $30,000 - $90,000 per year. For a couple it starts at $42,430 up to $127,300; for a family of three, $60,000 - $180,000; and four $67,100 - $201,270."

What Is Middle Class Income? Thresholds, Is It Shrinking

Which income class do you belong to, and what defines the different classes? It's said that the middle class is shrinking, but what does the data say?

www.investopedia.com

 

[Dekster]

What's wrong with the ordinary?

We seem to be stuck in this mindless pursuit of being more than, being better than, being richer than.......

It's a societal sickness that has been sold to us by our so called leaders in government and business and has resulted in an unprecedented level of anxiety, depression, stress induced diseases and a general sense of dissatisfaction.

Why is it an ordinary life by today's standards such a maligned thing? The ordinary person has a warm, dry place to live. Many ordinary people own their own homes and many more could if they didn't believe they need a a bigger house than their neighbors.

The ordinary person has access to far more food and comforts than they could ever partake in in any single day, month or year yet we have millions of people doom scrolling through the fake lives of so so called influencers and wishing they had that life that doesn't exist.

The ordinary person has access to all the knowledge he cares to pursue for little or no cost at all and yet believes he must spend tens of thousands of dollars to get an education.

So What's wrong with an ordinary life today?

How very European of you to advocate for a good enough life. Bravo. Now we need to exile you. Such an cancerous idea is simply unamerican.

 

[katsteve2012]

I would take it even one step further. While there’s nothing WRONG with people who are satisfied with an ordinary life, the people who work hard and put in the extra effort to be better than ordinary deserve postitive recognition of that.

It seems that in this era of “equity,” there is an unwillingness to recognize the extra efforts - and often talent - of those who achieve more via their own hand. Remember Obama’s scolding to business owners? “You didn’t build that!”

It is this type of thinking that leads to a decline in America.

IMO, it is up to the individual, to pursue whatever occupation that they choose, as long as they give it their all, and above all, are personally fulfilled.

To the OP'S point, I have known some people who have languished in jobs that they absolutely despised, because it was "expected" based on family history that they follow in the footsteps of other family members.

A good friend of mine from high school took over his father's family construction business after his dad passed away because he wanted to be a "good son" and spent 25 years of his life dreading waking up in the morning.

Eventually, he sold the business and went back to college and earned a degree in veterinary science and now operates a thriving animal hospital.
He's never been happier.

 

[Lisa558]

IMO, it is up to the individual, to pursue whatever occupation that they choose, as long as they give it their all, and above all, are personally fulfilled.

To the OP'S point, I have known some people who have languished in jobs that they absolutely despised, because it was "expected" based on family history that they follow in the footsteps of other family members.

A good friend of mine from high school took over his father's family construction business after his dad passed away because he wanted to be a "good son" and spent 25 years of his life dreading waking up in the morning.

Eventually, he sold the business and went back to college and earned a degree in veterinary science and now operates a thriving animal hospital.
He's never been happier.

I agree with all that except for one criterion you left out of your first paragraph: it Is up to the individual to pursue whatever occupation he chooses as long as he gives it his all and is personally fulfilled AND….this is what you left out….be able to support himself without requiring money from other people.

It is NOT acceptable to decide to spend one’s life writing novels or painting still pictures, even giving it his all and finding it personally fulfilling, if he cannot make enough money to feed himself and put a roof over his head.

 

[Libby von H]

What's wrong with the ordinary?

We seem to be stuck in this mindless pursuit of being more than, being better than, being richer than.......

It's a societal sickness that has been sold to us by our so called leaders in government and business and has resulted in an unprecedented level of anxiety, depression, stress induced diseases and a general sense of dissatisfaction.

Why is it an ordinary life by today's standards such a maligned thing? The ordinary person has a warm, dry place to live. Many ordinary people own their own homes and many more could if they didn't believe they need a a bigger house than their neighbors.

The ordinary person has access to far more food and comforts than they could ever partake in in any single day, month or year yet we have millions of people doom scrolling through the fake lives of so so called influencers and wishing they had that life that doesn't exist.

The ordinary person has access to all the knowledge he cares to pursue for little or no cost at all and yet believes he must spend tens of thousands of dollars to get an education.

So What's wrong with an ordinary life today?

I;ve noticed that my friends who travel become progressively more leaden, unfeeling, blase. And it appears to be related to what you say.
You gush about the Chinese food you had by the Great Wall and some Chinese come over here and gush about some Southern Cuisine restaurant and both go home and mope over the food the other was raving about.

 

[katsteve2012]

I agree with all that except for one criterion you left out of your first paragraph: it Is up to the individual to pursue whatever occupation he chooses as long as he gives it his all and is personally fulfilled AND….this is what you left out….be able to support himself without requiring money from other people.

It is NOT acceptable to decide to spend one’s life writing novels or painting still pictures, even giving it his all and finding it personally fulfilling, if he cannot make enough money to feed himself and put a roof over his head.

I would agree with that. Self sufficiency is part of being a responsible adult.

 

[Blues Man]

Never said that, hon. But YOU revealed contempt for those who don’t.

You have been railing against the word ordinary because you seem to think it means substandard which tells me you didn't understand the point of the OP

 

[Blues Man]

How very European of you to advocate for a good enough life. Bravo. Now we need to exile you. Such an cancerous idea is simply unamerican.

Another consumerist who doesn't get it.

It's better to spend all your money on crap because you have been conditioned to believe that that crap is what will make you happy.

That's the American way love it or leave it.

I choose to leave it because that is the way of ruin.

 

[Blues Man]

I'm didn't say that being MORE of an algebra student was going to "make or break me".

In my case, being the son of an educator required me to make more of an effort to apply myself in the classroom in that particular subject.

Living under my parents roof as a 13 year old middle school student required me to focus on what they believed to be important, because at that age, I obviously had no idea of what I wanted to do with my life.

What I did learn from that experience is that individual effort is typically the primary driver of positive results, and that was a life lesson that was extremely valuable.

Obviously, it's a given that there
are examples of those who were "C" students who end up achieving more than "A" students later in life because of the EFFORT that they put forth in their chosen profession.

Lastly, one persons definition of being "more", will likely be different than the definition of another, because that is directly related to an individuals hierarchy of needs.

Since it's your thread topic, I'll ask you the same question:

What is YOUR definition of what it means to be more?

You can learn that anywhere and that fact has nothing to do with the point of the thread.

You all seem to think I am saying don't excel at anything and be a slacker and you couldn't be more wrong.

You can excel in your profession and still live an ordinary life where you are not always trying to one up everyone.

You can make no more than an average salary and do the same thing.


I never said anyone has to be more than anyone else.

I grew up on the streets and literally lived on the streets for 2 years from are 14 to 16 after I was orphaned when my mother overdosed and I ran away from an abusive foster home . I quit high school school at the end of my sophomore year and got my GED when I was 16 so I could petition the court to be an emancipated minor at 17.

By today's standards I was a failure at age 17

I didn't see the need to compete with other people for bogus status symbols because I was too busy surviving.

The only person I ever felt the need to compete with was myself and I never gave a rat's ass what other people said or thought about me.

I learned to be happy with myself no matter where I was so the idea of not chasing material crap and fake status for some sort of personal validation never was part of my personal philosophy.

I realized I could be content and happy anywhere, anytime. My business grew because I wanted to build good homes for people not because I was chasing more income and more status symbols.

I retired at age 51 and am financially independent because I didn't feel the need to be better than anyone else buy buying a bigger house or a new car every other year or trying to prove I was better off than everyone else. I lived simply, ordinarily and I took my happiness from things that really mattered.

But today our society is fucking sick with the cancer of consumerism and one-upmanship and people are taught to feel worthless if they don't run the rat race.

It doesn;t have to be that way and that is the point of the thread.

 

[Lisa558]

You have been railing against the word ordinary because you seem to think it means substandard which tells me you didn't understand the point of the OP

I’m not railing against being ordinary, but it’s nothing to really brag about.

You, on the other hand, are looking with contempt upon those of us who set out to go beyond being ordinary - who put in the time and effort, and had the ability - by calling us “consumerist.”

Maybe we LIKE a beautiful home, travel to foreign countries, and the ability to afford a new car. What Is wrong with working to be able to enjoy that?

You are acting like liberals who are trying to say everybody is equal, and being mediocre is every bit as admirable as being extraordinary.

 

[katsteve2012]

You can learn that anywhere and that fact has nothing to do with the point of the thread.

You all seem to think I am saying don't excel at anything and be a slacker and you couldn't be more wrong.

You can excel in your profession and still live an ordinary life where you are not always trying to one up everyone.

You can make no more than an average salary and do the same thing.


I never said anyone has to be more than anyone else.

I grew up on the streets and literally lived on the streets for 2 years from are 14 to 16 after I was orphaned when my mother overdosed and I ran away from an abusive foster home . I quit high school school at the end of my sophomore year and got my GED when I was 16 so I could petition the court to be an emancipated minor at 17.

By today's standards I was a failure at age 17

I didn't see the need to compete with other people for bogus status symbols because I was too busy surviving.

The only person I ever felt the need to compete with was myself and I never gave a rat's ass what other people said or thought about me.

I learned to be happy with myself no matter where I was so the idea of not chasing material crap and fake status for some sort of personal validation never was part of my personal philosophy.

I realized I could be content and happy anywhere, anytime. My business grew because I wanted to build good homes for people not because I was chasing more income and more status symbols.

I retired at age 51 and am financially independent because I didn't feel the need to be better than anyone else buy buying a bigger house or a new car every other year or trying to prove I was better off than everyone else. I lived simply, ordinarily and I took my happiness from things that really mattered.

But today our society is fucking sick with the cancer of consumerism and one-upmanship and people are taught to feel worthless if they don't run the rat race.

It doesn;t have to be that way and that is the point of the thread.

I did not even remotely imply that you said "don't excel at anything".
If you were happy in your chosen profession, and you were fulfilled in doing the work that you did, more power to you.

That is more than many people ever achieve.

If you read my last post more thoroughly, you will see that I clearly stated in similar words that living ones life to satisfy others is not a healthy pursuit.

I even provided an example of someone that I know personally who fell into that trap, and how unhappy he was as a result of it, and how he eventually found happiness by doing what HE wanted to do.

 

[Blues Man]

I’m not railing against being ordinary, but it’s nothing to really brag about.

You, on the other hand, are looking with contempt upon those of us who set out to go beyond being ordinary - who put in the time and effort, and had the ability - by calling us “consumerist.”

Maybe we LIKE a beautiful home, travel to foreign countries, and the ability to afford a new car. What Is wrong with working to be able to enjoy that?

You are acting like liberals who are trying to say everybody is equal, and being mediocre is every bit as admirable as being extraordinary.

I wasn't bragging.

I was making a commentary on the cancer of consumerism and the idea that a person always has to be climbing the next rung on the ladder and always buying more shit to one up his neighbors to be happy.

And why do you assume a beautiful home has to be some big house where you don't even use all the rooms and jut fill it with stuff?

A smaller house can be a beautiful home but no one wants a 1200 sq ft home anymore they all want 4000 sq ft Mc-mansions and don't care if they are shoddily built as long as they are BIG because if their house isn't bigger it means they are not making it.


And you think I see contempt. I don't. It's actually pity.

And I never said anything was "wrong" that's all you.

You cannot deny the the fact that mental health in this country is declining and that the rampant consumerism is a large part of that. Social media algorithms are turning an entire generation into mindless drones who think they have to have the fake lives of the fake influencers or they are somehow failures.

All this is not accidental.

You seem to think I am saying people have to live like paupers and you're flat out wrong. The point is to stop trying to impress others with how much crap you own or how much money you make especially when all the money is barely supporting your lifestyle.

And I'm not a liberal whatever you think that is.