The United States Was Born Liberal

[KittenKoder]

We are social beings.

As society goes so too goes most of our individual fates.

I hear some of you rugged individualist out there thinking I'm overstating the case.

Tell me, rugged individuals, how well has all your will and ambition and hard work prevented your real estate from losing value this year?

We hang together or we hang separately, folks.

Simple as that.

That only works for robots.

 

[Bern80]

No implication at all intended that you are dependent on me or I am dependent on you for our livelihood. We, are dependent on each other. Big difference.

No we really aren't. Me kealing over isn't going to have any effect on the road that passes in front of your house.

Face it... if the organization called "We The People" hadn't been busy coordinating with private interests to construct the infrastructure we call The United States over the last 230 years, you and I would be making our livings very differently.

Even a different infrastructure would make life different. What if the world had started out with 3 times the number of whales than it did and ground oil had remained but a dirty nuisance for another 100 years? Would life be different if alternate choices had been forced on industry earlier in history?

-Joe

Sure, our society could have evolved any number of ways. If collectivism had actually worked for William Bradford our lives would indeed be much different. Fortunately it didn't. He learned about human nature very quickly in that he found that if someone is going to yield the same amount regadless of their level of input it is in their best interest to put forth as little effort as necessary. Why do more than you need to for no incremental gain in yield?

In my humble observation that is the road we are creaping down unfortunately, we expect more for less. We want conveniences and ease and evolved to become so used to that we have grown an aversion to actual effort regardless of the greater yield that may result. It is so cliche to say 'me and all my buddies work our asses off everyday'. Honestly how true is that? How many of your friends are really pushing themselves day in and day out and working at jobs that are really challenging everyday? I'm sorry, but working in an assemby line attaching part A to part B is not working your ass off. Being an ER doctor in the city is working your ass off. Running a business usually requires working your ass off. The skill sets involved with most middle class jobs aren't ones that one could be called challenging and they pay accordingly.

 

[Bern80]

We are social beings.

As society goes so too goes most of our individual fates.

I hear some of you rugged individualist out there thinking I'm overstating the case.

Tell me, rugged individuals, how well has all your will and ambition and hard work prevented your real estate from losing value this year?

We hang together or we hang separately, folks.

Simple as that.

Okay my brother. Tell me what you are going to do for me to improve my real estate value.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Yes he can. Back then, he was liberal.

The Conservatives back then wanted to stay a part of England.

Just like you conservatives got more conservative when you found out Clinton liked BJ's.

Absolute nonsense. Conservatives didn't get More conservative when Clinton dishonored himself, his family and his office;conservatives merely rejected his sorry ass.

US conservatives seek to conserve the principles on which the US was founded.

It's no more complex than that.

Now you want to distance yourselves from him? Yet you won't let us distance ourselves from Carter?

Bullshit! No conservative is distancing themselves from Bush; there have been many issues on which conservatives have disagreed with the President, not the least of which is the education, Medicare, amnesty and his initial SC pick, along with the whole 'compassionate conservative' thing; as such is repetitive and it feeds the myth you idiots trot out that conservatism is something other than compassionate.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

The US was born liberal. It was NOT however born LEFTIST.

There is absolutely NOTHING liberating about leftism.

 

[Mencken]

The United States wasn't born liberal. It was born in a revolutionary movement that while a little more egalitarian than the British, was far from "liberal." And today, we'd consider the birth of the United States more libertarian in nature than liberal. In the modern sense of the word, the ideology wasn't even in contention in 1776. You could argue it was classically liberal but today we'd designate that as libertarian - which is hardly aligned with liberalism.

(Hat tip: Reagan called libertarianism the soul of the Republican Party. And libertarians do more often than not vote GOP).

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

The United States wasn't born liberal. It was born in a revolutionary movement that while a little more egalitarian than the British, was far from "liberal." And today, we'd consider the birth of the United States more libertarian in nature than liberal. In the modern sense of the word, the ideology wasn't even in contention in 1776. You could argue it was classically liberal but today we'd designate that as libertarian - which is hardly aligned with liberalism.

(Hat tip: Reagan called libertarianism the soul of the Republican Party. And libertarians do more often than not vote GOP).

Indeed... but I believe one should never pass up a chance to educate the common leftist; as they're quite ignorant of the simple fact that leftism is the very antithesis of liberty. "Liberal" is rooted in the latin 'liber' meaning free... and liberalis, meaning roughly 'free man' or 'befitting to a free man.' As such the US Founders were the pure embodiment of liberals; and as I said above, the founders of the US were NOT, on ANY LEVEL, in ANY WAY... LEFTISTS. Leftism would have been anathema to those men and women and they would be ashamed of the US today, seeing us sit idly by watching our liberty slip from our grasp by the throngs of imbeciles and their leadership... the halfwits.

 

[Lycurgus]

Even after seeing it for days now, the title of this thread still cracks me up each time.

Incredible.

 

[Zoomie1980]

We are social beings.

As society goes so too goes most of our individual fates.

I hear some of you rugged individualist out there thinking I'm overstating the case.

Tell me, rugged individuals, how well has all your will and ambition and hard work prevented your real estate from losing value this year?

We hang together or we hang separately, folks.

Simple as that.

I liquidated my investment real estate back in 2005, converted to cash, mostly Treasuries. Same with stocks. Now I'm buying stocks and real-estate again, and the Government is going to give me 4.5% loans to do it with!!!!!

And yes, I am very much an Individual. I had very little help along the way. Yea I drive on the roads, and so does the WalMart greeter. Difference, I actually pay for them, they don't.

 

[Lycurgus]

I liquidated my investment real estate back in 2005, converted to cash, mostly Treasuries. Same with stocks. Now I'm buying stocks and real-estate again, and the Government is going to give me 4.5% loans to do it with!!!!!

And yes, I am very much an Individual. I had very little help along the way. Yea I drive on the roads, and so does the WalMart greeter. Difference, I actually pay for them, they don't.

Good for you. I too am of the opinion if you can afford to invest, do it now and do it wisely. Especially with properties. Take full advantage of these programs they are going to be offering.

We have several children, but one is in her last 18 months of nursing school. She works two jobs, raises her daughter and is pulling good grades. The plan has always been for her to purchase a home when she graduates as the present to herself and her daughter for all of the struggles now. Given the current situation, my wife and I are considering going ahead and helping her (even though she doesn't want it) so she too can take advantage of the market and new programs. With her projected income, she could get a lot of property and home for the buck right now.

 

[Lycurgus]

For more obscene trickle down economics?

What do you think the democrat controlled house and senate are doing right now?

 

[Ravi]

I had very little help along the way.

This is the biggest lie the libertarians tell themselves. I invite you to move to a country that doesn't have a stable government or economy or even a central bank and see how successful you are. Way to hate America, dude.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

This is the biggest lie the libertarians tell themselves. I invite you to move to a country that doesn't have a stable government or economy or even a central bank and see how successful you are. Way to hate America, dude.

No where in his post did he say he or even infer that he hates America. Way to make things up, dude.

 

[AVG-JOE]

...

(Hat tip: Reagan called libertarianism the soul of the Republican Party. And libertarians do more often than not vote GOP).

That is because for the most part, our choices are 'piss' and 'poor'.

One rarely hears a true libertarian support the GOP in general elections, even if they do end up voting GOP.

-Joe

 

[AVG-JOE]

No where in his post did he say he or even infer that he hates America. Way to make things up, dude.

He did do a pretty good job of looking with disdain down his nose at Americas minimum wage earners though...

-Joe

 

[sealybobo]

Absolute nonsense. Conservatives didn't get More conservative when Clinton dishonored himself, his family and his office;conservatives merely rejected his sorry ass.

US conservatives seek to conserve the principles on which the US was founded.

It's no more complex than that.



Bullshit! No conservative is distancing themselves from Bush; there have been many issues on which conservatives have disagreed with the President, not the least of which is the education, Medicare, amnesty and his initial SC pick, along with the whole 'compassionate conservative' thing; as such is repetitive and it feeds the myth you idiots trot out that conservatism is something other than compassionate.

You must only come here to argue with liberals, as I rarely talk to my liberal friends on this board. In case you haven't got the memo, ALL OF THE CONSERVATIVES have distanced themselves from Bush. Do you know who Richard Viguerie is from Conserativesbetrayed.com is? Perhaps you should look him up. You'll be put on his email list, as I am.

I think it's cute how all the conservatives, except you, have distance themselves from Bush and want us to forget they cupped his nuts for 7 years.

Ever take psychology? You're suffering from You're alright I'm alright. You voted for Bush, so if he's alright, you're alright too. If he's bad, then you must be bad too. Free therapy.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

That is because for the most part, our choices are 'piss' and 'poor'.

One rarely hears a true libertarian support the GOP in general elections, even if they do end up voting GOP.

-Joe

Well I suppose I didn't support the GOP in the general election, but I did support Ron Paul in the primaries and would have voted for him in the general had he won the nomination.

He did do a pretty good job of looking with disdain down his nose at Americas minimum wage earners though...

-Joe

That doesn't mean he hates America.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

No where in his post did he say he or even infer that he hates America. Way to make things up, dude.

You have to understand that Ravi is an imbecile and prone to delusion of every stripe.

But hey... what leftist isn't?

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

You must only come here to argue with liberals, as I rarely talk to my liberal friends on this board. In case you haven't got the memo, ALL OF THE CONSERVATIVES have distanced themselves from Bush.

Absolutely, wholly, totally, utterly... FALSE.

Pure unadulterated BULLSHIT.

Do you know who Richard Viguerie is from Conserativesbetrayed.com is? Perhaps you should look him up. You'll be put on his email list, as I am.

Never heard of him and with no other information abotu her than YOU SOURCED HER... My position on her... is FUCK HER.

I think it's cute how all the conservatives, except you, have distance themselves from Bush

Cool... I think its cute that you just refuted yourself and aren't bright enough to recognize it.

Ever take psychology? You're suffering from You're alright I'm alright. You voted for Bush, so if he's alright, you're alright too. If he's bad, then you must be bad too. Free therapy.

I've voted for GW Bush four times... twice as governor and twice as President. Each time I voted for GW because he was the best choice OF THE AVAILABLE CHOICES... And each of those decisions was spot on, resting in perfect reasoning and have left me with NO REGRET which was not present BEFORE I VOTED... which was that there was not an American running, for whom I could vote.

As I've said every single time it's been discussed, on this board and dozens of others... Bush was hands down the ONLY choice which Americans could have made in the two Presidential elections in which he has run and in which he has won; and where he has governed on American principle, I and America has supported him; and where he has governed as an anti-American, we have rejected his position.

That you feel that Bush is a rightwinger (an American) only exposes you as a prattling leftist... (fool).

No Americans are distancing themselves from GW Bush... Bush is everything he ever promised to be... he is EXACTLY who he campaigned as and stands as one of the most honest human beings to ever hold the office of President of the United States.

 

[del]

Absolutely, wholly, totally, utterly... FALSE.

Pure unadulterated BULLSHIT.



Never heard of him and with no other information abotu her than YOU SOURCED HER... My position on her... is FUCK HER.





Cool... I think its cute that you just refuted yourself and aren't bright enough to recognize it.



I've voted for GW Bush four times... twice as governor and twice as President. Each time I voted for GW because he was the best choice OF THE AVAILABLE CHOICES... And each of those decisions was spot on, resting in perfect reasoning and have left me with NO REGRET which was not present BEFORE I VOTED... which was that there was not an American running, for whom I could vote.

As I've said every single time it's been discussed, on this board and dozens of others... Bush was hands down the ONLY choice which Americans could have made in the two Presidential elections in which he has run and in which he has won; and where he has governed on American principle, I and America has supported him; and where he has governed as an anti-American, we have rejected his position.

That you feel that Bush is a rightwinger (an American) only exposes you as a prattling leftist... (fool).

No Americans are distancing themselves from GW Bush... Bush is everything he ever promised to be... he is EXACTLY who he campaigned as and stands as one of the most honest human beings to ever hold the office of President of the United States.

you're a moron.
have a nice day and make an appointment to have your meds appropriately adjusted.