The OLDER Official Discussion Thread for the creation of Israel, the UN and the British Mandate

[Divine Wind]

What is your avatar a picture of? Looks like a wizard to me. I used the adjective 'grand' because you so often boast of being smarter than anyone else. That is all.

If you want to think I meant something else, that's all on you, pal.

You are correct, Monte is not only overly sensitive, but he thinks he's smarter than anyone else and, as you've observed, he uses a wizard as an avatar. In that case, Merlin from the TV mini-series "The Mists of Avalon".

The Mists of Avalon (TV Mini-Series 2001– ) - IMDb

The Mists of Avalon Photos - The Mists of Avalon Picture Gallery - FamousFix

Time until Monte reports me for "libel": 10...9...8.....

Back on topic; Israel was the only true democracy in the ME for decades. They've been under constant attack for almost 70 years. No wonder they act assholish at times, but that doesn't change the fact that it's the assholes attacking them who are causing the problems.

 

[Challenger]

Tell me, is it the Jews or the Palestinians that strap on suicide belts and blow up city buses full of noncombatants or markets?

Isn't that what happens during American and Zionist Israeli drone strikes? The delivery systems may be different but the effect is the same.

It depends on both the target and intentions. In one the intention is a military target but involves collateral damage such as civilian casualties. In the other it's a deliberate attempt to commit mass murder against civilians including children.

Really? Given the pervasive militarisation in Zionist society, the bus network, for example, plays is an integral part during periods of mobilisation, the Palestinian Resistence can legitimately argue that they have always pursued military targets who just happened to be surrounded by "civilian" human shields...

Nice spin. Fine. You can continue to support flying airplanes into buildings, beheading journalists and suicide bombers on public transportation. I'll continue to support Western ideals. We'll see who wins in the end.

Do tell, how many members of Hamas flew planes into buildings or beheaded journalists? As I said earlier, suicide attacks or drone strikes, the effect is the same; each side just uses the best technology available to it. Western ideals? Oh, you mean control of the oil supply, got it.

 

[Challenger]

Israel was the only true democracy in the ME for decades.

Drivel. Zionist Israel is what's known as an "Herrenvolk Democracy"- look it up. The other democracies in the Middle East were systematically destabilised or overthrown by "Western idealists" That's why they hate us out there.

 

[Divine Wind]

You are free to believe all actions are equal and the same. Keep supporting your suicide bombers, trucks running over innocent people and Jihadists committing mass murder. I'll keep supporting Western ideals. May we all live long enough to see who wins in the end.

 

[Challenger]

You are free to believe all actions are equal and the same. Keep supporting your suicide bombers, trucks running over innocent people and Jihadists committing mass murder. I'll keep supporting Western ideals. May we all live long enough to see who wins in the end.

Do tell, what "western ideals" do you support?

 

[Divine Wind]

You are free to believe all actions are equal and the same. Keep supporting your suicide bombers, trucks running over innocent people and Jihadists committing mass murder. I'll keep supporting Western ideals. May we all live long enough to see who wins in the end.

Do tell, what "western ideals" do you support?

Several but where this discussion is concerned, the ideal that deliberately targeting civilians in order to maximize casualties among innocent people, including children, is wrong.

You are free to claim killing everyone aboard a public bus is moral because a few onboard were IDF reservists carrying their weapons, but I disagree. The idea of blowing up a bus is to kill everyone onboard. Killing a few IDF reservists is just a bonus for people like you.

 

[montelatici]

The Israelis target civilians all the time. That's how they hope to subjugate the non-Jews, through fear.

This is a residential apartment building in Gaza housing more than 50 families, civilian men, women and children. Attacking buses filled with IDF soldiers, reservists or active duty, is not terrorism. It's resisting a foreign military occupation force.

This is terrorism:





"...Israeli actions toward Palestinians are much worse: Israel is politically and strategically determined to subjugate the Gazans through fear. They do this through commando raids, mass arrests, and air strikes — all with the most sophisticated army Tel Aviv and its U.S. partners can buy. It has not gone unnoticed by all. ..............For Israel, the time will come when its remaining supporters in the U.S. government and establishment media will label Israel’s actions, if continued, as terrorism. It is already happening across the rest of the world including Europe. For the suffering Palestinians trapped in Gaza with nowhere to hide, this broader acknowledgment could not come soon enough."

Israel Terrorizes Palestinians in Gaza | The Huffington Post

 

[Challenger]

You are free to believe all actions are equal and the same. Keep supporting your suicide bombers, trucks running over innocent people and Jihadists committing mass murder. I'll keep supporting Western ideals. May we all live long enough to see who wins in the end.

Do tell, what "western ideals" do you support?

Several but where this discussion is concerned, the ideal that deliberately targeting civilians in order to maximize casualties among innocent people, including children, is wrong.

You are free to claim killing everyone aboard a public bus is moral because a few onboard were IDF reservists carrying their weapons, but I disagree. The idea of blowing up a bus is to kill everyone onboard. Killing a few IDF reservists is just a bonus for people like you.

You seem to jump to conclusions like a gazelle on steroids. "People like me?" A white English Humanist?

Where is the moral (western) difference then, between a suicide bomber taking out a bus (an integral part of the Zionist military transport infrasturcture), killing both armed and unarmed reservists along with genuine civilians and a remotely controlled drone or smart missile demolishing a whole building full of genuine civilians in the hope that an enemy military commander or a few fighters may be taken out as well?

 

[Divine Wind]

You seem to jump to conclusions like a gazelle on steroids. "People like me?" A white English Humanist?...

Is that what you call terrorist supporters? "A white English Humanist"? Interesting. You Brits have all kinds of different slang words like lorry for truck, lift for elevator, bonnet for car hood, fanny for beaver and now "A white English Humanist" for murdering suicide bomber.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

As I figured you ignorant piece of crap.....

The expected response from angry, highly emotional but poorly educated ISIS supporters.

Weak Response Is Treason

Anyone who doesn't advocate the confiscation of all Muslim oil and nuking Mecca is an ISIS supporter. The first should have happened after the 1973 Arab Oil Embargo, the second after 9/11. That was this century's Pearl Harbor, so Islam should have been punished the same way Japan was.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Tell me, is it the Jews or the Palestinians that strap on suicide belts and blow up city buses full of noncombatants or markets?

Isn't that what happens during American and Zionist Israeli drone strikes? The delivery systems may be different but the effect is the same.

It depends on both the target and intentions. In one the intention is a military target but involves collateral damage such as civilian casualties. In the other it's a deliberate attempt to commit mass murder against civilians including children.

Really? Given the pervasive militarisation in Zionist society, the bus network, for example, plays is an integral part during periods of mobilisation, the Palestinian Resistence can legitimately argue that they have always pursued military targets who just happened to be surrounded by "civilian" human shields...

Nice spin. Fine. You can continue to support flying airplanes into buildings, beheading journalists and suicide bombers on public transportation. I'll continue to support Western ideals. We'll see who wins in the end.

Allowing Chickenhawks to Live Meant the Death of Civilization

Appeasement is not a Western ideal; neither is having Rules of Engagement.

 

[Divine Wind]

Tell me, is it the Jews or the Palestinians that strap on suicide belts and blow up city buses full of noncombatants or markets?

Isn't that what happens during American and Zionist Israeli drone strikes? The delivery systems may be different but the effect is the same.

It depends on both the target and intentions. In one the intention is a military target but involves collateral damage such as civilian casualties. In the other it's a deliberate attempt to commit mass murder against civilians including children.

Really? Given the pervasive militarisation in Zionist society, the bus network, for example, plays is an integral part during periods of mobilisation, the Palestinian Resistence can legitimately argue that they have always pursued military targets who just happened to be surrounded by "civilian" human shields...

Nice spin. Fine. You can continue to support flying airplanes into buildings, beheading journalists and suicide bombers on public transportation. I'll continue to support Western ideals. We'll see who wins in the end.

Allowing Chickenhawks to Live Meant the Death of Civilization

Appeasement is not a Western ideal; neither is having Rules of Engagement.

As a military man, I tend to agree, but as a civilized and educated American, I understand we should not be as brutal as the assholes we are fighting. When we become like the terrorists, they've won, not us. When we give up our ideals to fight an abusive, cruel and barbaric enemy, we lower ourselves to be equally abusive, cruel and barbaric.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

Isn't that what happens during American and Zionist Israeli drone strikes? The delivery systems may be different but the effect is the same.

It depends on both the target and intentions. In one the intention is a military target but involves collateral damage such as civilian casualties. In the other it's a deliberate attempt to commit mass murder against civilians including children.

Really? Given the pervasive militarisation in Zionist society, the bus network, for example, plays is an integral part during periods of mobilisation, the Palestinian Resistence can legitimately argue that they have always pursued military targets who just happened to be surrounded by "civilian" human shields...

Nice spin. Fine. You can continue to support flying airplanes into buildings, beheading journalists and suicide bombers on public transportation. I'll continue to support Western ideals. We'll see who wins in the end.

Allowing Chickenhawks to Live Meant the Death of Civilization

Appeasement is not a Western ideal; neither is having Rules of Engagement.

As a military man, I tend to agree, but as a civilized and educated American, I understand we should not be as brutal as the assholes we are fighting. When we become like the terrorists, they've won, not us.

VICTORY Is the Only Rule of Engagement

That's what you're told to feel by ignorant weakling pacifist traitors. Instead of this nonsense of "sinking to the enemy's level," you should think of it as crawling into the mud with them and fighting it out there where they have set up the arena. I'm sure that when guns were first invented, some fools thought it was more honorable to fight it out face-to-face with swords. The epitaph of their gravestones was WE DIDN'T SINK TO THEIR LEVEL. INSTEAD, WE SANK SIX FEET UNDER.

 

[Divine Wind]

.... The epitaph of their gravestones was WE DIDN'T SINK TO THEIR LEVEL. INSTEAD, WE SANK SIX FEET UNDER.

Which is not a problem for those who think in spiritual terms.

Still, the logic of rolling in the gutter with barbarians makes as little sense as "We had to burn the village in order to save it".

What good does it do to fight for America if we destroy it by letting go of American ideals?

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

.... The epitaph of their gravestones was WE DIDN'T SINK TO THEIR LEVEL. INSTEAD, WE SANK SIX FEET UNDER.

What good does it do to fight for America if we destroy it by letting go of American ideals?

It Is a Contradiction to Call Anyone in a Combat Zone a "Non-Combatant"

Being queasy about what you have to do to win is a recipe for defeat. It also shows contempt for fighting men, saying it is OK to shoot those on the other side and let them die screaming, as long as we don't harm their human shields. And you dishonestly use examples that don't apply, equivalent to "If someone is raping my daughter, I have the right to rape his daughter" instead of "I have the right to kill him."

A less-sensitive generation had no problem bombing enemy civilians--old people, women, and children--in World War II. Or do you think we should be ashamed of winning that one, "Because it made us sink to the level of the Nazis"? I can picture what would have happened to childish pacifist protesters calling the Army Air Corps "babykillers."

 

[Divine Wind]

.... The epitaph of their gravestones was WE DIDN'T SINK TO THEIR LEVEL. INSTEAD, WE SANK SIX FEET UNDER.

What good does it do to fight for America if we destroy it by letting go of American ideals?

It Is a Contradiction to Call Anyone in a Combat Zone a "Non-Combatant"

Being queasy about what you have to do to win is a recipe for defeat. It also shows contempt for fighting men, saying it is OK to shoot those on the other side and let them die screaming, as long as we don't harm their human shields. And you dishonestly use examples that don't apply, equivalent to "If someone is raping my daughter, I have the right to rape his daughter" instead of "I have the right to kill him."

A less-sensitive generation had no problem bombing enemy civilians--old people, women, and children--in World War II. Or do you think we should be ashamed of winning that one, "Because it made us sink to the level of the Nazis"? I can picture what would have happened to childish pacifist protesters calling the Army Air Corps "babykillers."

Disagreed. If a seven year old is carrying a grenade to a group of GIs, yes, do what you need to do. If a sniper is running away and happens to run through a crowd of children, no, you not mow everyone down.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

.... The epitaph of their gravestones was WE DIDN'T SINK TO THEIR LEVEL. INSTEAD, WE SANK SIX FEET UNDER.

What good does it do to fight for America if we destroy it by letting go of American ideals?

It Is a Contradiction to Call Anyone in a Combat Zone a "Non-Combatant"

Being queasy about what you have to do to win is a recipe for defeat. It also shows contempt for fighting men, saying it is OK to shoot those on the other side and let them die screaming, as long as we don't harm their human shields. And you dishonestly use examples that don't apply, equivalent to "If someone is raping my daughter, I have the right to rape his daughter" instead of "I have the right to kill him."

A less-sensitive generation had no problem bombing enemy civilians--old people, women, and children--in World War II. Or do you think we should be ashamed of winning that one, "Because it made us sink to the level of the Nazis"? I can picture what would have happened to childish pacifist protesters calling the Army Air Corps "babykillers."

Disagreed. If a seven year old is carrying a grenade to a group of GIs, yes, do what you need to do. If a sniper is running away and happens to run through a crowd of children, no, you not mow everyone down.

Get Off Your High Horse; It Makes Your Ass Look Big

Let him live to later kill your men? We really need a draft to send your own kind to war if that's the only way you'll wake up about what needs to be done on the battlefield. Pacifists aren't idealists; they are self-righteous cowards and traitors who prefer to live in a childish fantasy world. That's why we must eliminate the "conscientious" objector privilege

 

[P F Tinmore]

 

[abu afak]

Whenever I seed PF Tinhead showing at the end of a string..
I KNOW it's a Boobtube withOUT a word.
Tinhead is a Non-conversant TROLL.
.

 

[Challenger]

Whenever I seed PF Tinhead showing at the end of a string..
I KNOW it's a Boobtube withOUT a word.
Tinhead is a Non-conversant TROLL.
.

At least he can spell; it takes one to know one, I suppose.