The Lessons of History

[westwall]

Probably you will, from the far left. There are no far lefties who post on this message board with regularity; the far right is represented in large numbers.

No one left of center is advocating a radical departure from the past; most of those on the right hope to end Medicare and Social Security and privatize everything. In a huge bit of irony, the middle of the road Democrat is supporting the status quo with few exceptions. It is the far right who are the radicals, who demand change in terms of suppressing the rights of gays/lesbians, unionized workers, voters, immigrants and public employees.

Have middle road Democrats become the new conservatives?

There are no far lefties who post on this message board with regularity;

are you fucking serious?....

No, wry's intellectually dishonest.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Dean,Franco,Truthmatters,Luddy doright,Chris,Lakota...thats six..........these people will NEVER admit that the Democrats can be wrong,have fucked people over,have made money off of Wars,made money from the banning of things....they wont even criticize a Democrat for even being a part of a problem...but to them Republicans are responsible for EVERY SINGLE negative thing that happens in this Country....thats being Far Left Wry.....if you cant see that ....then maybe you are as far left as they are.....i dont think you are....but if you cant see that by what they post.....then maybe i am wrong about you....

Maybe you're wrong about them? ?

Now you sound disingenuous, if not outright dishonest.

Gee, I thought only assholes posted partial quotes ... Oh.

 

[daveman]

I think. I doubt that you do and I'm certain CrusaderFrank can't.

Prove to me there are fringe lefties who post regularly. Name them and explain in some detail why you believe they are far left.

Dean,Franco,Truthmatters,Luddy doright,Chris,Lakota...thats six..........these people will NEVER admit that the Democrats can be wrong,have fucked people over,have made money off of Wars,made money from the banning of things....they wont even criticize a Democrat for even being a part of a problem...but to them Republicans are responsible for EVERY SINGLE negative thing that happens in this Country....thats being Far Left Wry.....if you cant see that ....then maybe you are as far left as they are.....i dont think you are....but if you cant see that by what they post.....then maybe i am wrong about you....

Maybe you're wrong about them? Neither the Democratic or Republican Party advocate revolution or radicalism, both want change to occur thoughtfully and lawfully. Both see necessary change differently, yet both have the best interest of the nation in its entirety in mind. Those you named see - as do I - a radicalism on the right which puts liberty and freedom and our democratic traditions at risk.

You misspelled "the leftist agenda".

We have seen a sea change in the R party of late, one which I (and those you noted) see as dangerous and outside the parameters of slow and lawful change and at odds with the prinicples of democracy.

Do I need to outline for you our concerns once again?

You misspelled "leftist agenda".

And yes, you are a leftist.

 

[skookerasbil]

A people get the government they deserve. If the voters in WI or throughout the several states decide to elect those who define liberty as the will of the majority we will have turned our backs on the principles upon which the founding fathers risked everything.

The liberty of free association and the freedom to petition the government died in WI yesterday when the majority of voters decided to change the course of history. The fringe on the right wing of American politics is crowing in celebration not knowing - as none of us can know - what the consequences of such a vote will eventually mean; it seems President Jefferson had an idea of the meaning:

"All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression"

I knew youd see an escalation of the mental meltdowns this week..............


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tibLjnn_Nf4]Midget - YouTube[/ame]

 

[skookerasbil]

........and Dave..........in case you misssed i t...........check out this priceless gem. Ive watched it at least a dozen times........the fairy up in Wisconsin right after they made the call for Walker. Tell me this fruit didnt go home and ball his cat from behind!!! For months, I prayed for video like this on election night, and God Bless CNN...........I caught it live. Laughed my ballls off!!!!


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEwXa197uBU]The Most Disappointed Barrett Supporter In Wisconsin - YouTube[/ame]

 

[logical4u]

You may have chosen a frugal government, but is it wise?

"A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, which shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicities."
T. Jefferson

You do realize that overblown out of proportion government employee contracts take bread from the mouth of the tax payers don't you?

Curbing runaway egregiously expensive public union contracts leaves money with the majority who earn it.

Public employees work at the whim of the public and they are now reaping what they have sown over the years. Outrageous pay and benefits demands compared to those of the private sector will no longer be tolerated.

it's about time.

Interesting comment. I'd really like to know what you do for a living.

What I'm hearing from you is envy, an emotion which clouds judgment. You begrudge working people for their "outragious" salary and benefits yet fail to say anything about those whose great wealth comes not from their labor but inheritance and/or moving other peoples money around (Bankers, brokers, etc.).

Of course the great demon is taxes. Government employees don't pay taxes, and few actually do anything but get in the way. Isn't that what you believe?

In fact I'm a retired government employee, and earn a very nice retirement along with solid health care benefits. However, I do pay taxes; real estate, sales, state and federal income, excise and likely others, some hidden in the cost of goods or services.

In fact government employees do provide a service, some at the cost or risk of their life. That's a fact I know very well, I served as a pallbearer for several government emplyees (federal and local) who gave their life in service to their country/community.

But I digress, how do you earn your living?

... "What I'm hearing from you is envy, an emotion which clouds judgment. You begrudge working people for their "outragious" salary and benefits yet fail to say anything about those whose great wealth comes not from their labor but inheritance and/or moving other peoples money around (Bankers, brokers, etc.)." ....

This sounds a lot like the people that are disagreeing with the "99%" and against re-distributing the money they earned. Are you one of the 1%?

 

[logical4u]

If Falk has 30 million and Walker had just 3 million I think the election would have turn out differently.

But that's just me.

No. It wouldn't.

Why? Most Wisconsinites had their mind made up MONTHS before the Primary. The only questions were who was going to LOSE to the Incumbents. Everyone I knew turned off the political commercials before they got 5 seconds in regardless of party. They threw out all the mailers. They hung up on the robocalls.

That money did NOTHING to change the minds of Wisconsinites save for the totally ignorant.

What made up their mind?

How pissed off they were for the Madison Protests and the psychotics pushing the recall petitions in their face and acting like assholes if you didn't sign. We were/ARE fed up with lefties political bullying and want things back to normal.

So when the left pushes for a recall, it's political bullying. When the right pushes for a recall, like what happened in CA, it's political process.

I think the reason why the recall failed was because the Dems did not really have an established opponent against Walker before the recall process started.

Then, after it became clear the recall was going to happen, the Dems dusted off Barrett and he ran again. Bad move. I think you're right... the voters of WI had their minds made up during the first election between Walker and Barrett. Had they chosen someone different and maybe more charismatic (like an actor from Hollywood).........

Why did the voters in both states petition for recalls? Please explain why each state "allowed" a recall election.

 

[hortysir]

I don't agree with your premise on the main difference between the parties.

Don't put words in my mouth I didn't utter. I do believe in fiscal responsibility, my belief is rational not emotional, however I don't parrot the propaganda of the right. That does not make me a revolutionary or radical or even a liberal (in the pejorative sense of the word used by the right).

I don't disagree that spending needs to be controlled. I believe our priorities are screwed up and to achieve fiscal sanity we need to have a plan. The Romney plan is to cut taxes, cut regulations and cut government.

I find that to be myopic at best.

Cutting taxes when we are in debt is tantamount to cutting your works hours when bills are due.

A balanced budget amendment is stupid. Ask Alexander Hamilton why.

Not spending on our infrastructure is foolish, the GOP's opposition to the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act is foolish, myopic and politically motivated. Country First is nothing but a slogan (which I might add the GOP no longer asserts).

Cutting regulations depends on which regulations are to be cut. Allowing our water, air and soil to be polluted is foolish, myopic and is not cost effective.

Cutting government means cutting jobs, we already have a job crisis, why make it worse? If we are to make government smaller, we need to do so by attrition after setting priorities.

But what CUTS do you recommend?

You seem afraid to bring that in.

We can't throw anymore Chinese money at the problems.

Ah, good question (bad comment after the good question, but I'll respond as if you had a bit of class and left off the last two stupid remarks)

I would order an across the board freeze on hiring and require a written request from any department head who believed S/He needed to replace an employee who retired, quit or died.

I would order a freeze on all non essential off site training (let supervisors and managers do the training in house).

I would order a freeze on all non essential travel.

I would close all Federal Buildings every Friday at 1 PM and reduce salaries across the board an equivalent percentage.

I would order the DEA to remove Marijuana from Schedule I status and allow the states to determine its legality.

I would order each governor who wished to receive federal largess to provide within six months a list of shovel ready projects, the problems such project would mitigate and the number of unemployed citizens such projects would provide, short term and long term.

That's enough for now, most won't read more than three paragraphs in a post and I've way gone past that number.

While we're at it can we revert to the original definition of "spending cuts", where we actually CUT spending rather than just not increasing as much as we did last time?

 

[Unkotare]

Maybe you're wrong about them? ?

Now you sound disingenuous, if not outright dishonest.

Gee, partial quotes ... Oh.

Your avoiding the point doesn't change it.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Now you sound disingenuous, if not outright dishonest.

Gee, partial quotes ... Oh.

Your avoiding the point doesn't change it.

and of course as expected he did not comment on what i said to him....

 

[Unkotare]

Of course