The hard cold truth of modern style racism

Discussion in 'Race Relations/Racism' started by IM2, Aug 11, 2019.

  1. IM2
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    IM2 Gold Member

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    Recognizing a problem exists is the first step to a solution. Legal experts created this study and their concern is based on a complete knowledge of how this system operates. They are not some white person in a discussion thread who enters the thread to dismiss racism as a factor.

    Only a fool ignores that the study was about a national problem. Only a fool tries to argue basted on a few mostly white states.

    This is the title of the study.

    State Supreme Courts Don’t Reflect the Diversity of the Communities They Serve
    A new Brennan Center report details vast racial and gender disparities on state supreme courts around the country.

    State Supreme Courts Don’t Reflect the Diversity of the Communities They Serve

    It is not just about blacks.

    State Supreme Court Diversity

    "This deficit of diversity among judges threatens the legitimacy of the judiciary in the eyes of the communities it serves. As former Ohio Supreme Court Justice Yvette McGee Brown observed, “The public’s perception of justice suffers . . . when the only people of color in a courthouse are in handcuffs.” This is particularly so in light of the vast racial disparities in the American criminal justice system, where 1 in 3 Black men are incarcerated in their lifetimes, compared with 1 in 17 white A 2015 National Center for State Courts survey of public confidence in state courts found a “massive racial gap” in trust in the fairness of the courts, revealing a “deep distrust of courts among African Americans.”

    An absence of judicial diversity also limits the perspectives available to inform judicial deliberations, undermining state courts’ ability to develop a legal jurisprudence for an increasingly diverse America. Research shows that judicial diversity enriches judicial decision-making, promotes public confidence in the judiciary, and establishes role models across demographic groups.

    Many factors drive this, including a long history of racial and gender discrimination and inequities in access to law schools and the legal bar (see Part II, “A History of Discrimination and Structural Hurdles”). Women and people of color continue to be underrepresented in the legal profession, and prior research has found that structural barriers — including implicit and explicit biases, disparities in access to mentoring, and unequal work assignments — impact their advancement into leadership positions in the law, which can in turn impact who reaches the bench.”


    And these guys made some suggestions you chose not to read.

    upload_2019-8-13_15-42-51.png

    Racial and Gender Diversity Sorely Lacking in America’s Courts - Center for American Progress

    I have not argued against my OP's opinions. Wyoming has just over 500,000 whites and 100,000 people of color. Washington has 5 million whites and over 2 million people of color. Montana has 884,000 whites and 122,000 people of color. Vermont has 600,000 whites and 38,000 people of color. Ok? You offer nothing but an excuse because we aren't talking about states with no people of color.

    Alabama has 3.2 million whites and 1.7 million people of color.

    And this is the Alabama state supreme court.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. CrusaderFrank
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    CrusaderFrank Diamond Member

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    "I see racists, they be everywhere 'cept theyz don't know theyz racist. So what if our democrat governor wore black face"

    [​IMG]
     
  3. Olde Europe
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    Olde Europe Diamond Member

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    I have to admit, I am a bit pissed about the above.

    Acknowledging the problem would be a huge first step. It might be followed by smart folks sitting down and devising strategies how to mitigate, or even solve, it. That's not easy, and the fact that IM2 doesn't have a solution doesn't make him a troll.

    The national statistic shows that the problem is more prevalent than just pertaining to a hand full of States. Including statistics of all people of color acknowledges that not just Blacks are not properly represented. Doing so not a mistake; it adds to the description of the problem.

    Solutions are particularly hard, since states have a panoply of ways to appoint / elect State justices and judges, and every solution would have to be modeled according these modes of selection. Moreover, in case you are, as I think, interested in improving racial justice, it is within your purview to think about solutions as much as it is within IM2's, if not more so.

    I take it, you mean that as you said it: "States are legitimately entitled to a fair representation of their populations in their State offices." That, the Fleegle-Principle, should be the starting point. And if half of a state's population is black, that means every other newly appointed / elected State Justice has to be black, no? And if the portion of blacks is just 1/23, make every twenty third justice a black person. Oh, just in case, same goes for Hispanics and Asians, and, while you're at it, make at least every other judge / justice a woman.
     
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  4. EvilEyeFleegle
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    EvilEyeFleegle Gold Member

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    Nope..that is not what I think makes him a troll..it is his..call it...'body of work'..here..and I have reviewed it. He is a one trick pony whose vast majority of posts could be termed 'race-baiting'...I stand by my opinion. I am NOT of the prevalent opinion that a Black person cannot be racist against white men or that it is somehow, 'excusable', given the historical context.

    Acknowledgement without action is just hot air..used to propel politicians hopes..at the expense of action.
    Thank you for your suggestions...for the most part they make sense. My 'Fleegle' principle cuts both ways though..in States with very small percentages.....many on the national level would still be upset at what they perceive of as..all white benches. I'm totally on board with using the same principle as regard women and other significant portions of a State's demographic.Women are still underrepresented at the top level of society..including the Judiciary. I would love to see Native American Judges in Montana and North/South Dakota...I do believe that if a State is majority Black...that the government should reflect that..top to bottom. I'm against using national statistics, as regards Demographic Proportioning...applied willy-nilly to State Government. The major stumbling block to the Fleegle principle would be in those states that elect their Justices. I'm not sure how any application in those cases would not run afoul of the courts. Constitutional change in the State's Constitutions would be the only answer I could see.

    My point in the exchange with IM2 was to see if he had it in him to propose any cogent reform on his own. He did not. Instead he indulged in rhetorical footwork and played fast and loose with the stats. As he has stated time and again..in fact, it is a theme of his....he feels no need to engage with a white man about black problems. So be it.

    Sorry if you got upset....sometimes I apply my peculiar code in an overly obtuse and abrasive manner.''

    Just for a laugh..this was my first post..on this thread:

    The hard cold truth of modern style racism
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  5. EvilEyeFleegle
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    EvilEyeFleegle Gold Member

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    I did not..at any time..dismiss racism as a factor..in most cases..I've acknowledged it several times in fact. I do not see it as a meaningful factor in State's where the Black population is so low as to render the point moot. In other States, it is the defining factor. This is not to leave out other people of color..in those states where they have a significant percentage. Also, as Olde Europe reminded me..women are underrepresented....grossly so..in many states. 50% of the population should get 50% of the offices. Assuming that there exists a qualified pool of applicants.

    We are talking about all 50 states. Each is unique...Alabama is a disgrace..Idaho is a 'meh'. Despite many people's belief...Idaho is not busting at the seams with ardent racists. It is as stupid a belief as saying that every inner city kid in Chicago has a bag of crack in one hand and a gun in the other.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  6. Correll
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    Correll Diamond Member

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    Judges are not supposed to represent ethnic groups. They are to interpret the law.
     
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  7. protectionist
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    protectionist Platinum Member

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    Well, if you wish to bury yourself, you can do that. Every person in America, of every race, knows that AA discriminates against whites, and in many cases, discriminates against other non-black races too, when the favors are given only to blacks.

    Everything you just stated here is preposterous and was completely refuted in my post (# 173) that you quoted.

    Simply put, you're just another black supremacist, racist, supporter of AA discrimination, who is completely comfortable with that # 1 largest and worst racial discrimination in America, since it benefits blacks, and you don't care who it hurts.

    You are the # 1 loudest spokesman for white supremacism in America. If anybody fuels their fore, YOU AND YOUR BULLSHIT DO.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  8. protectionist
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    protectionist Platinum Member

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    Maybe it just so happens they are the most QUALIFIED.

    But you'd rather stick somebody on there just because he's black, you Affirmative Action racist pig.
     
  9. IM2
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    IM2 Gold Member

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    BS. I am engaging whites now. What I will not do is have somebody that has not face white racism call blacks racist because they got called a name. You ask me for a solution, and yet you don't provide an argument that makes sense. Your whole argument wants to exclude what legal experts have determined on an excuse of sparsely populated states.What you call racism by blacks isn't. And until you live as a person of color and live, you aren't qualified to be making the claim that blacks can be as racist as whites. I don't race bait, but it's easier for you to call a thread showing how whites benefit because of your race baiting then accepting the fact that you get shown ii's true and you can't dispute it.

    This thread is about the underrepresentation of people of color in state supreme courts. You can try making all the excuses you want here in a most alt right echo chamber, but if I had you on a debate stage, you have already lost.

    Links are provided for a reason. Learn to read the information in them. You see, people like you want to look for reasons to deny racism. You can't face the truth so you try the personal attack. You've not reviewed ng. You are just another angry white racist who is mad because I don't say what you want and need to hear.

    "A federal lawsuit alleges the voting system for some Arkansas judges violates black residents' rights by diluting the strength of the vote.

    Lawyers for the NAACP's Legal Defense and Education Fund filed the lawsuit Tuesday. It says that because the state's seven Supreme Court judges are elected statewide instead of by district, the white voting bloc overpowers the votes of black Arkansas residents. The suit says that's why no black judge has ever been elected to the court."


    NAACP files federal suit against Arkansas judicial voting

    NAACP sues Alabama because voters elected all white judges to the state’s top courts

    https://yellowhammernews.com/naacp-...ctions-resulted-in-all-white-judges/undefined
    Voting rights lawsuits challenge lack of black high court justices
    Louisiana High Court Races Rigged Against Blacks, NAACP Says (1)
    Fair Courts E-lert: NAACP Challenges At-Large Voting in Judicial Elections; President Obama Makes Mark on Bay Area Courts

    "Five states—California, Connecticut, Minnesota, North Carolina, and Oregon—have a higher proportion of people of color on their state supreme courts than their minority populations as a whole.

    In the 22 states that have judicial elections, the report found that far fewer minority judges initially made it onto the bench through elections, and were far more likely to voted out after an interim appointment. Only 17 judges of color, or 4% of initially elected judges, reached the bench for the first time through an election between 1960 and 2018, according to the report. By contrast, 141 judges of color were initially appointed to the bench, representing 12 percent of all appointees.

    Advocacy groups have raised concern in recent years about racial bias in judicial elections. In recent years, the Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights Under Law has filed two lawsuits to challenge election processes."


    Almost Half of State Supreme Courts Have Only White Judges, Report Finds

    And I find it funny how white men talk about the Fleegle Principle like there's no problem with 58 percent of the state judges coming from 33 percent of the population. So again, the argument about states with sparse populations of people of color is irrelevant when states with large populations of people of color have all white supreme courts.
     
  10. IM2
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    IM2 Gold Member

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    Yawn! I've been to Idaho.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019

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