The gigantic elephant in the room, the fairy-tale of 9/11

[LA RAM FAN]

I believe that one must be one of two things to believe the fairy-tale of 9/11 .. An American, or a moron.

Americans get somewhat of a pass because cognitive dissonance will not allow their minds to interpret what is clearly in front of the faces.

Morons get a pass .. because they're morons.

yep.they're are either a moron or they are intelliegent people who are afraid of the truth as the apologists who have come on here to defend the official version have demonstrated.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

God BAC, are you really one of these conspiracy whackos? My best friends father was the director of OEM during 9/11 whose new office was located in building 7....the shit was not imploded.

It takes months for a demoliton team to go into a building to do a planned implosion.


WTC 7 Collapse
Claim: Seven hours after the two towers fell, the 47-story WTC 7 collapsed. According to 911review.org: "The video clearly shows that it was not a collapse subsequent to a fire, but rather a controlled demolition: amongst the Internet investigators, the jury is in on this one."
Fire Storm: WTC 7 stands amid the rubble of the recently collapsed Twin Towers. Damaged by falling debris, the building then endures a fire that rages for hours. Experts say this combination, not a demolition-style implosion, led to the roofline "kink" that signals WTC 7's progressive collapse. (Photograph by New York Office of Emergency Management)

FACT: Many conspiracy theorists point to FEMA's preliminary report, which said there was relatively light damage to WTC 7 prior to its collapse. With the benefit of more time and resources, NIST researchers now support the working hypothesis that WTC 7 was far more compromised by falling debris than the FEMA report indicated. "The most important thing we found was that there was, in fact, physical damage to the south face of building 7," NIST's Sunder tells PM. "On about a third of the face to the center and to the bottom — approximately 10 stories — about 25 percent of the depth of the building was scooped out." NIST also discovered previously undocumented damage to WTC 7's upper stories and its southwest corner.

NIST investigators believe a combination of intense fire and severe structural damage contributed to the collapse, though assigning the exact proportion requires more research. But NIST's analysis suggests the fall of WTC 7 was an example of "progressive collapse," a process in which the failure of parts of a structure ultimately creates strains that cause the entire building to come down. Videos of the fall of WTC 7 show cracks, or "kinks," in the building's facade just before the two penthouses disappeared into the structure, one after the other. The entire building fell in on itself, with the slumping east side of the structure pulling down the west side in a diagonal collapse.

According to NIST, there was one primary reason for the building's failure: In an unusual design, the columns near the visible kinks were carrying exceptionally large loads, roughly 2000 sq. ft. of floor area for each floor. "What our preliminary analysis has shown is that if you take out just one column on one of the lower floors," Sunder notes, "it could cause a vertical progression of collapse so that the entire section comes down."

There are two other possible contributing factors still under investigation: First, trusses on the fifth and seventh floors were designed to transfer loads from one set of columns to another. With columns on the south face apparently damaged, high stresses would likely have been communicated to columns on the building's other faces, thereby exceeding their load-bearing capacities.

Second, a fifth-floor fire burned for up to 7 hours. "There was no firefighting in WTC 7," Sunder says. Investigators believe the fire was fed by tanks of diesel fuel that many tenants used to run emergency generators. Most tanks throughout the building were fairly small, but a generator on the fifth floor was connected to a large tank in the basement via a pressurized line. Says Sunder: "Our current working hypothesis is that this pressurized line was supplying fuel [to the fire] for a long period of time."

WTC 7 might have withstood the physical damage it received, or the fire that burned for hours, but those combined factors — along with the building's unusual construction — were enough to set off the chain-reaction collapse.


Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report - Popular Mechanics

The only conspiracy whakos are the apologists who defend the official version-the coincidence theorists.Yes it WAS imploded just like the twin towers were.You talk about your best friends dad being the OEM director in that building,so what,.that means crap.I highly doubt he saw EVERY single worker that was in that building in those prior months.To do so,he would have to be there and live there 24 hours a day.He didnt LIVE in there at the building right? so what,my best friend has a friend there I met this past fall the first time I been up to new york since it happened,who I was fortunate enough to meet, who is a top high ranking Police official there.He was there on 9/11 and has a scar on his face from debris that hit him while helping people get out of the towers and he confirmed to me what David Griffith talks about in his excellent book -DEBUNKING THE 9/11 DEBUNKING.An answer to popular mechanics and other defenders of the official 9/11 conspiracy theory.He confirmed to me what Griffith says in his book,that most everybody in the fire dept and police dept who was there that day,knows it was an inside job and explosives were used to bring down those towers,that they are keeping their mouths shut because they have had death threats given to their familys if they talk about explosives being used or how it was an inside job.

He debunks popular mechanics in that book taking those disinformation specialists to school. Matter of fact there was a video out there I have seen that was made in 93 after the first bombing there that took place, where one of the lead engineers-i can post all that with the guys name and everything if you like,I have his book.He talks about how the buildings were designed so that they could withstand the impact of a boeing 707-i believe is the number,not sure,which was the most powerful jet at that time designed,and said that it could take MULTIPLE hits from airliners and it would still be withstanding.surely you've seen that video?Im sure I can find it.

You also obviously dont know about willie rodriguez,the janitor who was there that day who was on like the 10th floor when it happened.He talks about how he heard an explosion from the BASEMENT about 10 seconds or so before the plane struck from above and he was seen by many people and coworkers-who have corrobaratted his story,that he was helping a man who had come out of the elevater shaft from the basement on fire. That alone puts to end the debate that the towers collapsing were the cause of the jets hitting it. As for building 7,you obvioulsy dont know about that man who went up to Silversteins office bld just minutes before the building collapsed who went into his office and someone else rushed into the buiding as well and asked him-what are you doing here in this building? and he replied back-I was here because I had a scheduled meeting with Mr Silverstein.I dont see him is he here? Then the man yelled out-You havent seen him,he's not in the building? and when the man replied NO, that he hadnt seen him and looked all over for him,the man yelled-Get out of here fast,this building is about to explode!!!! and they jumped out of a window minutes before the building came down and fortuantely survived.The man said he heard explosions going on in the building as well while it came down.

Please enough of this B.S crap that the fires caused the collapse crap.and PLEASE,stop using POPULAR MECHANICS as your source,that disinformation magazine has been proven to be full of lies and been debunked countless of times by the experts.And like I said,David Ray Griffith debunks them in his book DEBUNKING THE 9/11 DEBUNKING.Popular mechanics is the warren commission report of 9/11.

Like the thread starter said so well in this thread,to believe that fairy tale 9/11 commission report, someone would have to be a moron.Popular mechanics is as big of a joke of a source as that other fairy tale commission-the warren commission report that oswald killed kennedy. Nist kept changing their story and lying all the time cause the experts proved how their stories did not stand up under scrutiny and were lying all the time.Yes the one thing right in your post here is that it DOES take months of planning to plant the explosives but you got to remember,Bush's cousin and brother were in charge of the security towers during that time.They had no problem planting the explosives in the towers,they sure would have less trouble doing it with bld 7.It only takes around a couple hundred people to plant them during those months.

the only 9/11 myth is the popular mechanics version and the 9/11 coverup commission report.

 

[Andrew2382]

lol "please stop this crap that fire caused the collapse"

ok, tinfoil hat man

Why believe scientific evidence when we have your word.

Fire weakens steel, when steel gets weakened it can not support as much weight.

This isn't rocket science

 

[LA RAM FAN]

It's ok BAC, totally dismiss the cold hard facts that I linked from Popular mechanics how they debunk every myth of 9/11


View attachment 6306

Just like I said,read David Ray Griffiths excellent book-DEBUNKING THE 9/11 DEBUNKING.AN answer to popular mechanics and other defenders of the official 9/11 conspiracy theory.His book proves it was an inside job and shows how popular mechanics is a bunch of liars and DOESNT have any hard cold facts in them to back them up.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

lol "please stop this crap that fire caused the collapse"

ok, tinfoil hat man

Why believe scientific evidence when we have your word.

Fire weakens steel, when steel gets weakened it can not support as much weight.

This isn't rocket science

Read my last two posts tinfoil hat wearer.the towers were designed to withstand the impact of an airliner and even Leslie Robertson- the lead engineer of the towers back in the 80's said there would be a great loss of life from the impact and the fires,but the structures themsleves would remain standing.again stop listening to the fairy tales and lies of popular mechanics,their version of the warren commission,and start reading the truth which is in David Ray Griffiths excellent book-Debunking the 9/11 Debunking.

 

[Andrew2382]

Dude,

the towers could have taken multiple plan hits.

However, they didn't take into effect that when the planes tore into the building it also tore off most of the fire resistant shit the buildings frame was equipped with.

Couple that with the 90,000 pounds of jet fuel and all the combustible items in the offices it was enough to weaken the steal significantly.

It was just a matter of time, and my friends father who you purely dismissed was in charge of 9/11 efforts the day it happened. Director of OEM has more power then the mayor in that situation, so yeah I am going to trust a lot of what he tells me

 

[LA RAM FAN]

It was an inside job obviously.

You obviously know more then everyone.

While everyone was preoccupied with the towers the government secretly ran a demoliton team in there and wired up the buidling for a controlled implosion in only a few hours.

Thats exactly what happened

He sure as hell knows more than you 9/11 coincidence theorists.yeah thats exactly what happened as you mentioned EXCEPT the only thing you got wrong was they did it months in advance in secret.Not hours.you got that right the first time when you said it would take months.

 

[Andrew2382]

and let me guess, of the 20,000 people that worked in the complex noone saw people placing explosives in the building.

Those buildings was populated day and night

 

[LA RAM FAN]

Sure .. is that why NIST left out of its report the evidence of thermite found and documented in the FEMA Report?

Popular Mechanics .. isn't that best known for shit like how to fix a toliet?

Oh yeah .. with ace reporter Chertoff

exactly.well said. and for the person that said belittle the source? AGAIN popular mecahincs is the warren commission report of the 9/11 commission.It HAS NO FACTS. nuff said.for tonight anyways.

 

[Andrew2382]

lol, I posted more shit then popular mechanics, do some research, and I totally debunked your thermite theory bullshit

 

[editec]

I believe that one must be one of two things to believe the fairy-tale of 9/11 .. An American, or a moron.

Americans get somewhat of a pass because cognitive dissonance will not allow their minds to interpret what is clearly in front of the faces.

Morons get a pass .. because they're morons.

Americans don't believe fairy tales, BAC. I wish they did.

Fairy tales have an underlying truth in them. They are instructive, often cautionary tales. People who read fairly tales benefit from the experience.

What most Americans believe aren't fairy tales.

What most American's believe are lies -- lies sometime of such monumental audacity, that they reach mythic proportions.

But I agree with you that it's not their fault.

Merely being intelligent will not insulate us from the big lies overwhelming us.

Some of these lies are crafted by brilliant liars, and then we are barraged by them in the media.

Anyone however intelligent can be mislead if the misinformation campaign is done subtly enough.

I often wonder how much of what I think I know is just plain wrong.

I just discovered something today, as a matter of fact.

I was under the impression that Prescot Bush was something of a villian.

But I did not know things about him, and the choices he made, which force me to reevaluate not only who he is, but what his ilk was like, generally.

It's damned hard for any of us to know, for sure, what is going on in this world of ours.

I cannot comment on 9-11.

I avoid those kinds of conspiracy/technical questions because generally they end up just laymen dueling with someone else's expert opinions.

I think the idea of a very large conspiracy within ou own government highly unlikely, because logic informs me that very large conspiracies cannot stand very long.

As to the issues of whether the building could have fallen and so forth?

My eyes glaze over because I know I am not qualified to see through the smoke to find the fire.

 

[Sunni Man]

The most miraculous event that happen on 9/11 was how alleged hijacker Muhammad Atta's passport survived the gigantic fireball of the plane hitting the tower. Then floated down to the street and was almost immediatly found among millions of tons of rubble and debree.

Amazingly, the passport was found on top of a pile of rubble, by of all people, an FBI agent.

For a passport made out of paper to have survived such an inferno. Is the type of miracle usually found in the Bible.

Remember in this event, solid steel became like a wet noodle, and two buildings collasped. But a paper passport is left intact and only slightly burnt around the edges!!

www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=43653

 

[eots]

It's ok BAC, totally dismiss the cold hard facts that I linked from Popular mechanics how they debunk every myth of 9/11


View attachment 6306

what is ridiculous is getting information from the Hearst owned popular mechanics but ignoring these patriots and scholars


Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 ...
This website provides responsible criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report by senior military, intelligence and government officials. It provides experienced ...
Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

I mean listen to this unqualified liar.. piece of crap...


popular mechanics debunked - Google Video

 

[eots]

lol "please stop this crap that fire caused the collapse"

ok, tinfoil hat man

Why believe scientific evidence when we have your word.

Fire weakens steel, when steel gets weakened it can not support as much weight.

This isn't rocket science

Clip from 9/11 Mysteries: Clip from 9/11 Mysteries: Kevin Ryan of Underwriters Laboratories (UL), the company which
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBZTsa6j0Ag]YouTube - 911 Truth: The Bogus NIST Report & The Lingering Questions[/ame]

underwriters stated the temperatures reached would have no weakening effect...and further more...random and uneven temperatures would not create
a even collapse as all the steel would not give way and the exact same moment ..nor would it facilitate a collapse of free fall speed...and speaking of rocket science....

Capt. Edgar Mitchell, U.S. Navy (ret), BS Industrial Management, BS Aerontautical Engineering, Doctor of Science, Aeronautics and Astronautics from MIT – Pilot and Astronaut. Sixth man to walk on the moon (Apollo 14 mission). Patrol bomber and attack plane pilot, U.S. Navy. Test Pilot, Air Test and Evaluation Squadron 5 (VX-5). Chief of Project Management Division, Navy Field Office for the Manned Orbiting Laboratory Project. Graduated first in his class from the Aerospace Research Pilot School, and served as an instructor there. Recipient of many awards and honors including the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the USN Distinguished Medal and three NASA Group Achievement Awards. Inducted to the Space Hall of Fame in 1979 and the Astronaut Hall of Fame in 1998. Recipient of honorary doctorates in engineering from New Mexico State University, the University of Akron, Carnegie Mellon University, and a ScD from Embry-Riddle University. Founder of the Institute of Noetic Sciences.
Endorser of and proposed Commissioner of a New Investigation into 9/11 as described in the New York City Ballot Initiative 11/08: "Petition to Create a NYC Independent Commission with Subpoena Power to Conduct a Comprehensive and Fact-Driven Investigation of All Relevant Aspects of the Tragic Events of September 11, 2001 and Issue a Report.

WHEREAS, many New York City voters believe that there remain many unanswered questions critical to establishing the truth about all relevant events leading up to, during and subsequent to the tragic attacks occurring on September 11, 2001 (“9/11”), and

WHEREAS, no prior investigation by any New York City agency or any other governmental entity has resulted in the citizens being provided with those critical answers or information necessary to establish the truth about those tragic events, ...

An independent, temporary New York City commission (the “Commission”) is hereby created to conduct a comprehensive, factdriven investigation into the events that took place on 9/11, as well as to thoroughly examine related events before and after the attacks, including any activities attempting to hide, cover up, impede or obstruct any investigation into these 9/11 events, following wherever the facts may lead. The Commission shall publish one or more reports of their findings."


Website: Ed Mitchell


Lt. Col. Robert Bowman, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Director of Advanced Space Programs Development under Presidents Ford and Carter. U.S. Air Force fighter pilot with over 100 combat missions. (PhD in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering, Cal Tech). Former Head of the Department of Aeronautical Engineering and Assistant Dean at the U.S. Air Force Institute of Technology. 22-year Air Force career. Also taught Mathematics and English at the University of Southern California, the University of Maryland, and Phillips University.
Video 9/11/04: "A lot of these pieces of information, taken together, prove that the official story, the official conspiracy theory of 9/11 is a bunch of hogwash. It’s impossible. … There’s a second group of facts having to do with the cover up. … Taken together these things prove that high levels of our government don’t want us to know what happened and who’s responsible.…

Who gained from 9/11? Who covered up crucial information about 9/11? And who put out the patently false stories about 9/11 in the first place? When you take those three things together, I think the case is pretty clear that it’s highly placed individuals in the administration with all roads passing through Dick Cheney.

I think the very kindest thing that we can say about George W. Bush and all the people in the U.S. Government that have been involved in this massive cover-up, the very kindest thing we can say is that they were aware of impending attacks and let them happen. Now some people will say that’s much too kind, however even that is high treason and conspiracy to commit murder." http://video.go


Signatory: Petition requesting a reinvestigation of 9/11:
"We want truthful answers to question. … As Americans of conscience, we ask for four things:
An immediate investigation by New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer
Immediate investigation in Congressional Hearings.
Media attention to scrutinize and investigate the evidence.
The formation of a truly independent citizens-based inquiry." http://www.911truth.org/article
Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

 

[dilloduck]

Clip from 9/11 Mysteries: Clip from 9/11 Mysteries: Kevin Ryan of Underwriters Laboratories (UL), the company which
YouTube - 911 Truth: The Bogus NIST Report & The Lingering Questions

underwriters stated the temperatures reached would have no weakening effect...and further more...random and uneven temperatures would not create
a even collapse as all the steel would not give way and the exact same moment ..nor would it facilitate a collapse of free fall speed...and speaking of rocket science....

Capt. Edgar Mitchell, U.S. Navy (ret), BS Industrial Management, BS Aerontautical Engineering, Doctor of Science, Aeronautics and Astronautics from MIT – Pilot and Astronaut. Sixth man to walk on the moon (Apollo 14 mission). Patrol bomber and attack plane pilot, U.S. Navy. Test Pilot, Air Test and Evaluation Squadron 5 (VX-5). Chief of Project Management Division, Navy Field Office for the Manned Orbiting Laboratory Project. Graduated first in his class from the Aerospace Research Pilot School, and served as an instructor there. Recipient of many awards and honors including the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the USN Distinguished Medal and three NASA Group Achievement Awards. Inducted to the Space Hall of Fame in 1979 and the Astronaut Hall of Fame in 1998. Recipient of honorary doctorates in engineering from New Mexico State University, the University of Akron, Carnegie Mellon University, and a ScD from Embry-Riddle University. Founder of the Institute of Noetic Sciences.
Endorser of and proposed Commissioner of a New Investigation into 9/11 as described in the New York City Ballot Initiative 11/08: "Petition to Create a NYC Independent Commission with Subpoena Power to Conduct a Comprehensive and Fact-Driven Investigation of All Relevant Aspects of the Tragic Events of September 11, 2001 and Issue a Report.

WHEREAS, many New York City voters believe that there remain many unanswered questions critical to establishing the truth about all relevant events leading up to, during and subsequent to the tragic attacks occurring on September 11, 2001 (“9/11”), and

WHEREAS, no prior investigation by any New York City agency or any other governmental entity has resulted in the citizens being provided with those critical answers or information necessary to establish the truth about those tragic events, ...

An independent, temporary New York City commission (the “Commission”) is hereby created to conduct a comprehensive, factdriven investigation into the events that took place on 9/11, as well as to thoroughly examine related events before and after the attacks, including any activities attempting to hide, cover up, impede or obstruct any investigation into these 9/11 events, following wherever the facts may lead. The Commission shall publish one or more reports of their findings."


Website: Ed Mitchell


Lt. Col. Robert Bowman, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Director of Advanced Space Programs Development under Presidents Ford and Carter. U.S. Air Force fighter pilot with over 100 combat missions. (PhD in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering, Cal Tech). Former Head of the Department of Aeronautical Engineering and Assistant Dean at the U.S. Air Force Institute of Technology. 22-year Air Force career. Also taught Mathematics and English at the University of Southern California, the University of Maryland, and Phillips University.
Video 9/11/04: "A lot of these pieces of information, taken together, prove that the official story, the official conspiracy theory of 9/11 is a bunch of hogwash. It’s impossible. … There’s a second group of facts having to do with the cover up. … Taken together these things prove that high levels of our government don’t want us to know what happened and who’s responsible.…

Who gained from 9/11? Who covered up crucial information about 9/11? And who put out the patently false stories about 9/11 in the first place? When you take those three things together, I think the case is pretty clear that it’s highly placed individuals in the administration with all roads passing through Dick Cheney.

I think the very kindest thing that we can say about George W. Bush and all the people in the U.S. Government that have been involved in this massive cover-up, the very kindest thing we can say is that they were aware of impending attacks and let them happen. Now some people will say that’s much too kind, however even that is high treason and conspiracy to commit murder." http://video.go


Signatory: Petition requesting a reinvestigation of 9/11:
"We want truthful answers to question. … As Americans of conscience, we ask for four things:
An immediate investigation by New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer
Immediate investigation in Congressional Hearings.
Media attention to scrutinize and investigate the evidence.
The formation of a truly independent citizens-based inquiry." http://www.911truth.org/article
Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

Have you notified our new leader that you want ANOTHER investigation into 9/11 ?

 

[DavidS]

I believe BAC. I think there was something else that happened on 9/11 that we don't know about. I also think there were several key areas of the 9/11 report that were somehow struck out.

I think Obama knows now as well. His demeanor was completely different today.

 

[dilloduck]

I believe BAC. I think there was something else that happened on 9/11 that we don't know about. I also think there were several key areas of the 9/11 report that were somehow struck out.

I think Obama knows now as well. His demeanor was completely different today.

The election is over---I expect his demeanor to be different but that still doesn't answer my question.

 

[eots]

Have you notified our new leader that you want ANOTHER investigation into 9/11 ?

the issue is not so much what i want as what these patriots and honored hero's are requesting

to them by those with direct and first-hand information. Both these acts were selective and intentional. Contrary to their pledge to establish accountability: They refused to hold anyone accountable and lamely justified it by saying, "We don’t want to point a finger at anyone." National Security Whistleblowers Coalition


Bio: UTEP / College of Liberal Arts / Political Science / Faculty - William Weaver





Letter to Congress regarding the 9/11 Commission Report 9/13/04, signed by the following 25 military, intelligence, and law enforcement veterans: Project On Government Oversight


"[W]e the undersigned wish to bring to the attention of the Congress and the people of the United States what we believe are serious shortcomings in the report and its recommendations. …

Omission is one of the major flaws in the Commission’s report. We are aware of significant issues and cases that were duly reported to the commission by those of us with direct knowledge, but somehow escaped attention. …

The omission of such serious and applicable issues and information by itself renders the report flawed, and casts doubt on the validity of many of its recommendations. ...

The Commission, with its incomplete report of "facts and circumstances", intentional avoidance of assigning accountability, and disregard for the knowledge, expertise and experience of those who actually do the job, has now set about pressuring our Congress and our nation to hastily implement all its recommendations. ...

We the undersigned, who have worked within various government agencies (FBI, CIA, FAA, DIA, Customs) responsible for national security and public safety, call upon you in Congress to include the voices of those with first-hand knowledge and expertise in the important issues at hand. We stand ready to do our part." Project On Government Oversight


Edward J. Costello, Jr. – Former Special Agent, Counterterrorism, FBI. Former Judge pro tem., Los Angeles, CA.


John M. Cole – Former Intelligence Operations Specialist, in the FBI’s Counterintelligence Division. In charge of FBI’s foreign intelligence investigations covering India, Pakistan and Afghanistan. 18-year FBI career.


Mark Conrad, JD – Retired Agent in Charge, Internal Affairs, U.S. Customs, responsible for the internal integrity and security for areas encompassing nine states and two foreign locations. Former Federal Sky Marshall. 27-year U.S. Customs career. Currently Associate General Counsel, National Association of Federal Agents. Assistant Professor of Criminal Justice at Troy University.


Rosemary N. Dew – Former Supervisory Special Agent, Counterterrorism and Counterintelligence, FBI. Former member of The President's National Security Telecommunications Advisory Committee (NSTAC) and the Electronic Commerce/Cyber Crime Working Group. 13-year FBI career.


Bogdan Dzakovic – Witness before the 9/11 Commission. 14-year Counter-terrorism expert in the Security Division of the Federal Aviation Administration. Team Leader of the FAA's Red (Terrorism) Team, which conducted undercover tests on airport security through simulated terrorist attacks. Former Team Leader in the Federal Air Marshal program. Former Coast Guard officer. (See also individual statement above.)


Sibel D. Edmonds – Witness before the 9/11 Commission. Former Language Translation Specialist, performing translations for counterterrorism and counterintelligence operations, FBI. (See also individual statement above.)


Steve Elson – Former Special Agent with the U.S. Navy and the FAA. Specialist in Counterterrorism, Intelligence, and Security. Twenty-two years military experience, primarily in Naval Special Warfare and nine years Federal service with the FAA and DEA. Retired Navy SEAL. (See also individual statement above.)


David Forbes – Former head of Thames Valley Police Fraud Squad, trained at New Scotland Yard. Over 30 years experience in law enforcement, commercial and industrial security-related risk management, and service sector business management. Currently Aviation, Logistics and Govt. Security Analyst, BoydForbes, Inc.


Melvin A. Goodman – Former Division Chief and Senior Analyst at the Office of Soviet Affairs, CIA,1966 - 1990. Senior Analyst at the Bureau of Intelligence and Research, State Department, 1974 - 1976. Professor of International Security at the National War College 1986 - 2004. Currently Senior Fellow at the Center for International Policy and Adjunct Professor of International Relations at Johns Hopkins University. He is the author and co-author of five books on international relations. (See also individual statement above.)


Mark Graf – Former Security Supervisor, Planner, and Derivative Classifier, Department of Energy. Former Chairman of the Rocky Flats (DOE) Physical Security Systems Working Group from 1990 through 1995.


Gilbert M. Graham – Retired Special Agent, Counterintelligence, FBI. 24-year FBI career.


Diane Kleiman – Former Special Agent, US Customs.


Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former Political-Military Affairs Officer in the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Also served on the staff of the Director of the National Security Agency. 20-year Air Force veteran. (See also individual statement above.)


Lynne A. Larkin – Former CIA Operations Officer. Served in several CIA foreign stations and in the CIA's counter-intelligence center helping chair a multi-agency task force and seminars on coordinating intelligence among intelligence and crime prevention agencies.


David MacMichael, PhD – Former Senior Estimates Officer with special responsibility for Western Hemisphere Affairs at the CIA's National Intelligence Council. Former Captain, U.S. Marine Corps.


Raymond L. McGovern – Former Chairman, National Intelligence Estimates, CIA, responsible for preparing the President’ Daily Brief (PDB) for Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. 27-year CIA veteran. Former U.S. Army Intelligence Officer. (See also individual statement above.)


Theodore J. Pahle – Former Senior Intelligence Officer with the Defense Intelligence Agency. His 37-year intelligence career was exclusively as a HUMINT (Human Intelligence) operations officer with DIA, Office of Naval Intelligence and U.S. Army Intelligence. He is a Middle East and Latin American operations specialist. Today, he continues to support the HUMINT effort as a contract instructor.


Behrooz Sarshar – Retired Language Translation Specialist, performing Farsi translations for counterterrorism and counterintelligence operations dealing with Iran and Afghanistan, FBI.


Brian F. Sullivan – Retired Special Agent and Risk Management Specialist, FAA. Retired Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police.


Commander Larry J. Tortorich, U.S. Navy (ret) – Former Deputy Program Manager for Logistics – Tomahawk Cruise Missiles. 24-year Navy career in the fields of aviation and counterterrorism. Two years as a federal employee with DHS/TSA in the fields of security and counterterrorism.


Jane A. Turner – Retired Special Agent, FBI. 24-year FBI career.


John B. Vincent – Retired Special Agent, Counterterrorism, FBI. 27-year FBI career.


Fred Whitehurst, JD, PhD – Retired Supervisory Special Agent / Laboratory Forensic Examiner, FBI. 16-year FBI career. Former U.S. Army Intelligence Officer.


Col. Ann Wright, U.S. Army (ret) – Retired Army officer and former U.S. Diplomat. Served 13 years on active duty with the U.S. Army and 16 years in the U.S. Army Reserves. She was a member of the International law team in Operation Urgent Fury in Grenada and served in Panama and Somalia. She joined the Foreign Service in 1987 and served as Deputy Chief of Mission of U.S. Embassies in Sierra Leone, Micronesia and Afghanistan. She helped reopen the US Embassy in Kabul in December, 2001. One of three U.S. State Department officials to publicly resign in direct protest of the invasion of Iraq in March, 2003. (See also individual statement above.)


Matthew J. Zipoli – Special Response Team (SRT) Officer, DOE. Vice President, Security Police Officer's Association, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory

Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

 

[dilloduck]

the issue is not so much what i want as what these patriots and honored hero's are requesting

to them by those with direct and first-hand information. Both these acts were selective and intentional. Contrary to their pledge to establish accountability: They refused to hold anyone accountable and lamely justified it by saying, "We don’t want to point a finger at anyone." National Security Whistleblowers Coalition


Bio: UTEP / College of Liberal Arts / Political Science / Faculty - William Weaver





Letter to Congress regarding the 9/11 Commission Report 9/13/04, signed by the following 25 military, intelligence, and law enforcement veterans: Project On Government Oversight


"[W]e the undersigned wish to bring to the attention of the Congress and the people of the United States what we believe are serious shortcomings in the report and its recommendations. …

Omission is one of the major flaws in the Commission’s report. We are aware of significant issues and cases that were duly reported to the commission by those of us with direct knowledge, but somehow escaped attention. …

The omission of such serious and applicable issues and information by itself renders the report flawed, and casts doubt on the validity of many of its recommendations. ...

The Commission, with its incomplete report of "facts and circumstances", intentional avoidance of assigning accountability, and disregard for the knowledge, expertise and experience of those who actually do the job, has now set about pressuring our Congress and our nation to hastily implement all its recommendations. ...

We the undersigned, who have worked within various government agencies (FBI, CIA, FAA, DIA, Customs) responsible for national security and public safety, call upon you in Congress to include the voices of those with first-hand knowledge and expertise in the important issues at hand. We stand ready to do our part." Project On Government Oversight


Edward J. Costello, Jr. – Former Special Agent, Counterterrorism, FBI. Former Judge pro tem., Los Angeles, CA.


John M. Cole – Former Intelligence Operations Specialist, in the FBI’s Counterintelligence Division. In charge of FBI’s foreign intelligence investigations covering India, Pakistan and Afghanistan. 18-year FBI career.


Mark Conrad, JD – Retired Agent in Charge, Internal Affairs, U.S. Customs, responsible for the internal integrity and security for areas encompassing nine states and two foreign locations. Former Federal Sky Marshall. 27-year U.S. Customs career. Currently Associate General Counsel, National Association of Federal Agents. Assistant Professor of Criminal Justice at Troy University.


Rosemary N. Dew – Former Supervisory Special Agent, Counterterrorism and Counterintelligence, FBI. Former member of The President's National Security Telecommunications Advisory Committee (NSTAC) and the Electronic Commerce/Cyber Crime Working Group. 13-year FBI career.


Bogdan Dzakovic – Witness before the 9/11 Commission. 14-year Counter-terrorism expert in the Security Division of the Federal Aviation Administration. Team Leader of the FAA's Red (Terrorism) Team, which conducted undercover tests on airport security through simulated terrorist attacks. Former Team Leader in the Federal Air Marshal program. Former Coast Guard officer. (See also individual statement above.)


Sibel D. Edmonds – Witness before the 9/11 Commission. Former Language Translation Specialist, performing translations for counterterrorism and counterintelligence operations, FBI. (See also individual statement above.)


Steve Elson – Former Special Agent with the U.S. Navy and the FAA. Specialist in Counterterrorism, Intelligence, and Security. Twenty-two years military experience, primarily in Naval Special Warfare and nine years Federal service with the FAA and DEA. Retired Navy SEAL. (See also individual statement above.)


David Forbes – Former head of Thames Valley Police Fraud Squad, trained at New Scotland Yard. Over 30 years experience in law enforcement, commercial and industrial security-related risk management, and service sector business management. Currently Aviation, Logistics and Govt. Security Analyst, BoydForbes, Inc.


Melvin A. Goodman – Former Division Chief and Senior Analyst at the Office of Soviet Affairs, CIA,1966 - 1990. Senior Analyst at the Bureau of Intelligence and Research, State Department, 1974 - 1976. Professor of International Security at the National War College 1986 - 2004. Currently Senior Fellow at the Center for International Policy and Adjunct Professor of International Relations at Johns Hopkins University. He is the author and co-author of five books on international relations. (See also individual statement above.)


Mark Graf – Former Security Supervisor, Planner, and Derivative Classifier, Department of Energy. Former Chairman of the Rocky Flats (DOE) Physical Security Systems Working Group from 1990 through 1995.


Gilbert M. Graham – Retired Special Agent, Counterintelligence, FBI. 24-year FBI career.


Diane Kleiman – Former Special Agent, US Customs.


Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force (ret) – Former Political-Military Affairs Officer in the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Also served on the staff of the Director of the National Security Agency. 20-year Air Force veteran. (See also individual statement above.)


Lynne A. Larkin – Former CIA Operations Officer. Served in several CIA foreign stations and in the CIA's counter-intelligence center helping chair a multi-agency task force and seminars on coordinating intelligence among intelligence and crime prevention agencies.


David MacMichael, PhD – Former Senior Estimates Officer with special responsibility for Western Hemisphere Affairs at the CIA's National Intelligence Council. Former Captain, U.S. Marine Corps.


Raymond L. McGovern – Former Chairman, National Intelligence Estimates, CIA, responsible for preparing the President’ Daily Brief (PDB) for Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. 27-year CIA veteran. Former U.S. Army Intelligence Officer. (See also individual statement above.)


Theodore J. Pahle – Former Senior Intelligence Officer with the Defense Intelligence Agency. His 37-year intelligence career was exclusively as a HUMINT (Human Intelligence) operations officer with DIA, Office of Naval Intelligence and U.S. Army Intelligence. He is a Middle East and Latin American operations specialist. Today, he continues to support the HUMINT effort as a contract instructor.


Behrooz Sarshar – Retired Language Translation Specialist, performing Farsi translations for counterterrorism and counterintelligence operations dealing with Iran and Afghanistan, FBI.


Brian F. Sullivan – Retired Special Agent and Risk Management Specialist, FAA. Retired Lieutenant Colonel, Military Police.


Commander Larry J. Tortorich, U.S. Navy (ret) – Former Deputy Program Manager for Logistics – Tomahawk Cruise Missiles. 24-year Navy career in the fields of aviation and counterterrorism. Two years as a federal employee with DHS/TSA in the fields of security and counterterrorism.


Jane A. Turner – Retired Special Agent, FBI. 24-year FBI career.


John B. Vincent – Retired Special Agent, Counterterrorism, FBI. 27-year FBI career.


Fred Whitehurst, JD, PhD – Retired Supervisory Special Agent / Laboratory Forensic Examiner, FBI. 16-year FBI career. Former U.S. Army Intelligence Officer.


Col. Ann Wright, U.S. Army (ret) – Retired Army officer and former U.S. Diplomat. Served 13 years on active duty with the U.S. Army and 16 years in the U.S. Army Reserves. She was a member of the International law team in Operation Urgent Fury in Grenada and served in Panama and Somalia. She joined the Foreign Service in 1987 and served as Deputy Chief of Mission of U.S. Embassies in Sierra Leone, Micronesia and Afghanistan. She helped reopen the US Embassy in Kabul in December, 2001. One of three U.S. State Department officials to publicly resign in direct protest of the invasion of Iraq in March, 2003. (See also individual statement above.)


Matthew J. Zipoli – Special Response Team (SRT) Officer, DOE. Vice President, Security Police Officer's Association, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory

Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report

please don't confuse this board for Obama's inbox--send this shit to him.

 

[eots]

so to you the concerns of these patriots and hero's is...shit...as compared to a research writer at popular mechanics. ?...not only is that un-American and disrespectful ....well..it is just ...silly