The End Of Libertarianism?

[editec]

Kill the U.S. Dept. of Education.

It's not even remotely related to anything in the Constitution. It never educated anyone. Education is supposed to be local ,and at the very most, state. The founding fathers never, never would have gone for it.

But you know what?

It'll never happen. We're only going to add MORE branches of government. Government is like a ratchet: it only moves in one direction. Up. The only way it shrinks is when it explodes.

I would actually have no problem with that, William.

As currently practiced, the Federal intervention in education is worse than useless, it's making things worse. two words: UNFUNDED MANDATES

It probably wouldn't surprise you to know, however, that were editec in charge of education, I'd FEDERALIZE the whole thing.

By that I mean I would have the Federal government PAY for it all, and I would insure that every kid in the USA had access to the same course and educational opportunites no matter where they lived.

I would remove the burden of paying for education off the backs of property owners and pay for education out of the Federal coffers.

That would give every homeowner and business in America a huge LOCAL tax break, and probably result in an increase in FICA taxes (assuming we did nothing else to limit federal spending)

I'd also make education free right up to the first PhD for anyone who (by testing) qualified to go on. I'd also put a LOT more money into worker retraining and technical schools.

Our educational system is still run as though we lived in the 18th century.

That is one of the reasons that our kids overall are less well edcuated than in nations which have different (usually fully nationalized) education systems.

Now as an educator, I'd benefit more from a completely privatized educational system, like the Libertarians want.

But in the aggregate, I think that system would be disasterous for this nation.

 

[sparky]

anything would be better than what we have now

oh and, btw, as a product of the American educational system , i really have to ask.....

why doesn't this forum have spell check?

 

[Skull Pilot]

anything would be better than what we have now

oh and, btw, as a product of the American educational system , i really have to ask.....

why doesn't this forum have spell check?

download the google toolbar. there is a pretty good spell check with it

 

[William Joyce]

It probably wouldn't surprise you to know, however, that were editec in charge of education, I'd FEDERALIZE the whole thing.

Yeesh... that sounds like nightmare to me. By shifting the burden from property owners to income-earners, I'm not sure how much you change anything.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I would actually have no problem with that, William.

As currently practiced, the Federal intervention in education is worse than useless, it's making things worse. two words: UNFUNDED MANDATES

It probably wouldn't surprise you to know, however, that were editec in charge of education, I'd FEDERALIZE the whole thing.

By that I mean I would have the Federal government PAY for it all, and I would insure that every kid in the USA had access to the same course and educational opportunites no matter where they lived.

I would remove the burden of paying for education off the backs of property owners and pay for education out of the Federal coffers.

That would give every homeowner and business in America a huge LOCAL tax break, and probably result in an increase in FICA taxes (assuming we did nothing else to limit federal spending)

I'd also make education free right up to the first PhD for anyone who (by testing) qualified to go on. I'd also put a LOT more money into worker retraining and technical schools.

Our educational system is still run as though we lived in the 18th century.

That is one of the reasons that our kids overall are less well edcuated than in nations which have different (usually fully nationalized) education systems.

Now as an educator, I'd benefit more from a completely privatized educational system, like the Libertarians want.

But in the aggregate, I think that system would be disasterous for this nation.

I might not disagree with you ed. The only way to have states control education would be to get some sort of tax relief from the feds to allow those folks to pay higher state taxes.

If we let the feds control education, we would have to see state taxes lessened so again people aren't paying more. If the fed runs things, it should be by a completely independent committee comprised of a rep from each state that would make all decisions similar to senate voting rules.

Get all social programs out of school. Concentrate on hard core scholastics and communication skills. Testing for grade advancement that allows the brightest kids to finish school sooner and keeps every other student responsible for learning the material.

Vouchers should be an option for those either home schooling their kids or those paying for private schools.

There's obviously much much more to consider but I think we all agree there has to be a better way than the current system

 

[Paulie]

Government here is much like government anywhere. Too much corruption, too much negigence and incompetence, too many jobs for the boys and girls, too many lazy bastards, too many thick bastards, too many time-serving idiots....just like government anywhere

Right. So let's just keep adding MORE then.

 

[Paulie]

I might not disagree with you ed. The only way to have states control education would be to get some sort of tax relief from the feds to allow those folks to pay higher state taxes.

If we let the feds control education, we would have to see state taxes lessened so again people aren't paying more. If the fed runs things, it should be by a completely independent committee comprised of a rep from each state that would make all decisions similar to senate voting rules.

Get all social programs out of school. Concentrate on hard core scholastics and communication skills. Testing for grade advancement that allows the brightest kids to finish school sooner and keeps every other student responsible for learning the material.

Vouchers should be an option for those either home schooling their kids or those paying for private schools.

There's obviously much much more to consider but I think we all agree there has to be a better way than the current system

My daughter will start kindergarten next year. I just recently became aware that the new cirriculum for teaching reading is to use word recognition, instead of the traditional sounding out of words.

That much ALONE makes me want to seriously consider home-schooling, not that I haven't been already to some extent.

 

[Diuretic]

Right. So let's just keep adding MORE then.

That whistling noise you heard was the point sailing past you

 

[Annie]

My daughter will start kindergarten next year. I just recently became aware that the new cirriculum for teaching reading is to use word recognition, instead of the traditional sounding out of words.

That much ALONE makes me want to seriously consider home-schooling, not that I haven't been already to some extent.

It's called "Whole language." Math has a counterpart, it's called "New, new math or Fuzzy math." Run from them. If you can't homeschool, teach your daughter to read at home, before she hits the schools. A good place to begin, so you can teach phonics, is the appendix to "Why Johnny Can't Read". Get some high interest books of hers, help her learn to sound them out.

BTW, whole language has been 'the method' for over 40 years now. It was a good approach for the few kids who were unable to learn phonics, since being introduced into mainstream education, reading disabilities have shot up through the roof.

 

[Ravi]

Pauli, just teach her the other method at home. Between the two, she'll be reading like a champ in no time. Kids learn different ways and you won't know which way works best until she starts. But more importantly, just read with her every day.

My two have the vocabulary of pointy-headed liberal elitist college professors.



Oh, and content matters. My daughter was totally bored by books that had repetitive nonsense like, "Matt hit the rat with a bat that killed the cat." She came home and told me how boring the books were and that she didn't want to read them. Find something with a plot that engages her.

 

[kaz]

Please, I'm not in the blame game here, I just pointed out that libertarianism has a disconnect with reality.

A disconnect with reality is thinking lawyers can run our lives better then we can. Look how that turned out with Obama. Our problems were child's play for his giant brain. He had easy, common sense answers for everything. Turns out he had answers for nothing. People voted for him because they wanted easy, pain free answers to their problems. But you're right, take an imbecile, have him promise easy, pain free answers and they'll get voted in office no matter how many times it's proven they're wrong.

 

[Neotrotsky]

The end of the radical policies of the left

We can only hope

 

[Contumacious]

Show me a successful libertarian society........Well given the crisis in the global economy caused by laissez-faire economics it's not going to be seen any time soon.

HUH?

WTF.

Oh, I see, you are permanently confused. Carry on.

.

 

[editec]

The worst thing you can say about libertarians is that they are intellectually immature, frozen in the worldview many of them absorbed from reading Ayn Rand novels in high school. Like other ideologues, libertarians react to the world's failing to conform to their model by asking where the world went wrong. Their heroic view of capitalism makes it difficult for them to accept that markets can be irrational, misunderstand risk, and misallocate resources or that financial systems without vigorous government oversight and the capacity for pragmatic intervention constitute a recipe for disaster. They are bankrupt, and this time, there will be no bailout.

How the financial collapse killed libertarianism. - By Jacob Weisberg - Slate Magazine

This guy is fundamentally wrong about pretty much everything he talks about. He doesn't mention the Federal Reserve inflating the currency, doesn't mention how much we're spending per month on our overseas empire, and doesn't mention our national debt as causes of this crisis. He also neglects to mention that it was Libertarian's and Austrian economists who correctly identified this crisis years before it even happened. This crisis should have been vindication for Libertarian's and the free market, but too many people are believing the government's rhetoric about a "lack of regulation."

He failed, perhaps to entirely cover the litany of mistaken policies and systems in place that are leading to the bankriptsy of this nation.

\Neverhteless he's essantially right about most Libertarians.

They are people whose POV makes perfect sense for a preindustrial age.

But we don't happen to live in the 18th century.

As to the Austian school of economics?

Their reliance on supply sider economic policies makes good sense when we're in a demand side inflationary period.

Sadly we happen to find ourselves in exactly the opposite kind of economy, right now.

Much of their theory (but not all of it, which is part of the problem today) is what lead us into this mess, folks.

The rich have too much cash and the cosumers have too little, and the economy fibrilates because of those problems.