The best healthcare in America is government run

[MadDog]

And those Vets are more satisfied with their care than the average for profit patient.

Sorry to bother you with the facts.

Interesting. I'd sure like to see the data on that one. Can you back it up or are you making it up?

 

[Chris]

Most private hospitals can only dream of the futuristic medicine Dr. Divya Shroff practices today. Outside an elderly patient's room, the attending physician gathers her residents around a wireless laptop propped on a mobile cart. Shroff accesses the patient's entire medical history--a stack of paper in most private hospitals. And instead of trekking to the radiology lab to view the latest X-ray, she brings it up on her computer screen. While Shroff is visiting the patient, a resident types in a request for pain medication, then punches the SEND button. Seconds later, the printer in the hospital pharmacy spits out the order. The druggist stuffs a plastic bag of pills into what looks like a tiny space capsule, then shoots it up to the ward in a vacuum tube. By the time Shroff wheels away her computer, a nurse walks up with the drugs.

Life in a big-name institution like the Mayo Clinic? Not hardly. Shroff, 31, a specialist in internal medicine, works at the Veterans Affairs hospital in Washington, where the vets who come for the cutting-edge treatment are mostly poor.

If you're surprised, that's understandable. Until the early 1990s, care at VA hospitals was so substandard that Congress considered shutting down the entire system and giving ex-G.I.s vouchers for treatment at private facilities. Today it's a very different story. The VA runs the largest integrated health-care system in the country, with more than 1,400 hospitals, clinics and nursing homes employing 14,800 doctors and 61,000 nurses. And by a number of measures, this government-managed health-care program--socialized medicine on a small scale--is beating the marketplace. For the sixth year in a row, VA hospitals last year scored higher than private facilities on the University of Michigan's American Customer Satisfaction Index, based on patient surveys on the quality of care received. The VA scored 83 out of 100; private institutions, 71. Males 65 years and older receiving VA care had about a 40% lower risk of death than those enrolled in Medicare Advantage, whose care is provided through private health plans or HMOs, according to a study published in the April edition of Medical Care. Harvard University just gave the VA its Innovations in American Government Award for the agency's work in computerizing patient records.

And all that was achieved at a relatively low cost. In the past 10 years, the number of veterans receiving treatment from the VA has more than doubled, from 2.5 million to 5.3 million, but the agency has cared for them with 10,000 fewer employees. The VA's cost per patient has remained steady during the past 10 years. The cost of private care has jumped about 40% in that same period.

How Veterans' Hospitals Became the Best in Health Care - TIME

Oh Chris... really?

I didn't think there was anyone that didn't know most VA hospitals were performing miserably.

I recently had to see a specialist. I won't go into details, the old ladies here are much too rabid, but my bf found me a great doc and paid the bill. I felt like I'd stepped into the future. If you want the very best health care, IMO, you will find a great doc and pay them yourself. HMO's suck. PPO's suck. And I'm betting anything the gov't cooks up will make HMO's and PPO's look like they know what they're doing.

I think everyone in the world should get the very best health care. I wish there was a way to provide it. I'm like a bleeding heart Lib where health is concerned, but.... I don't think what I've heard so far is the solution. Is reform needed? Absolutely. Have I heard a workable idea from the Dems? No F'ing way. And holding up the VA as the beacon of hope... I wish it were true, Chris, truly I do, but I know better.

Bill Kristol admitted to Jon Stewart, on Monday night, that the US provides the very best care for our military...better than private care. Kristol was obviously pissed that he had admitted to such a thing.

That was hysterical.

But the issue is not government run healthcare. This issue is a single payer system. A single payer system is what we need, but people in America are too stupid for that. We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat.

The rest of the world is smarter than we are on this issue.

 

[elvis]

Oh Chris... really?

I didn't think there was anyone that didn't know most VA hospitals were performing miserably.

I recently had to see a specialist. I won't go into details, the old ladies here are much too rabid, but my bf found me a great doc and paid the bill. I felt like I'd stepped into the future. If you want the very best health care, IMO, you will find a great doc and pay them yourself. HMO's suck. PPO's suck. And I'm betting anything the gov't cooks up will make HMO's and PPO's look like they know what they're doing.

I think everyone in the world should get the very best health care. I wish there was a way to provide it. I'm like a bleeding heart Lib where health is concerned, but.... I don't think what I've heard so far is the solution. Is reform needed? Absolutely. Have I heard a workable idea from the Dems? No F'ing way. And holding up the VA as the beacon of hope... I wish it were true, Chris, truly I do, but I know better.

Bill Kristol admitted to Jon Stewart, on Monday night, that the US provides the very best care for our military...better than private care. Kristol was obviously pissed that he had admitted to such a thing.

That was hysterical.

But the issue is not government run healthcare. This issue is a single payer system. A single payer system is what we need, but people in America are too stupid for that. We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat.

The rest of the world is smarter than we are on this issue.

a lot of ignorance by you, fuckface. you got your ass handed to you in the second post.

 

[MadDog]

That is why every other industrialized nation has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and get as good or better results. Those are the facts.

For profit healthcare is morally wrong. Pure and simple.

Germany, Belgium, and Holland would be interested to know that they are not industrialized (and that they are immoral). All three have multiple payer systems.

 

[Oddball]

And those Vets are more satisfied with their care than the average for profit patient.

Sorry to bother you with the facts.

Interesting. I'd sure like to see the data on that one. Can you back it up or are you making it up?

He's making it up....Does that with alarming regularity.

 

[elvis]

And those Vets are more satisfied with their care than the average for profit patient.

Sorry to bother you with the facts.

Interesting. I'd sure like to see the data on that one. Can you back it up or are you making it up?

He's making it up....Does that with alarming regularity.

regularity meaning the opposite of irregularity.

diarrhea of bullshit

 

[Political Junky]

Let me put it to you this way Chris this healthcare your seeking from the Federal Govt. will have too survive many many challenges before it becomes a reality. Not the least of which is passing congress and the President placing his signature on the bill. This bill must survive state laws that may prohibit it's implementation and constitutional challenges as well as individuals downright ignoring it. So before you start dancing in the streets over the new social nirvana that your party is attempting to create here I'd advise you to temper that a little. I'm sure after all the Seniors get wind of what this bill has in store for them that this new agenda you and other wish to push off on the nation that they might find Obama's version of healthcare that wants them to all just die is not something they will find acceptable.

More lies from the right.

A single payer healthcare system is the most efficient and the most fair. That is why every other industrialized nation has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and get as good or better results. Those are the facts.

For profit healthcare is morally wrong. Pure and simple.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Let me put it to you this way Chris this healthcare your seeking from the Federal Govt. will have too survive many many challenges before it becomes a reality. Not the least of which is passing congress and the President placing his signature on the bill. This bill must survive state laws that may prohibit it's implementation and constitutional challenges as well as individuals downright ignoring it. So before you start dancing in the streets over the new social nirvana that your party is attempting to create here I'd advise you to temper that a little. I'm sure after all the Seniors get wind of what this bill has in store for them that this new agenda you and other wish to push off on the nation that they might find Obama's version of healthcare that wants them to all just die is not something they will find acceptable.

More lies from the right.

A single payer healthcare system is the most efficient and the most fair. That is why every other industrialized nation has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and get as good or better results. Those are the facts.

For profit healthcare is morally wrong. Pure and simple.

OK Let's make this clear.

Chris states that every other industrialized nation with some type of government run single payer system gets equal or better results than the current US system.

Five Year Survival Rates, Selected Countries and Cancers




Source: Arduino Verdecchia et al., “Recent Cancer Survival in Europe: A 2000-02 Period Analysis of EUROCARE-4 Data,” Lancet Oncology 8 (September 2007): 784-96.

So Chris tell us again how quality and results of foreign government run health care is equal to or better than our current system.

 

[DiveCon]

Let me put it to you this way Chris this healthcare your seeking from the Federal Govt. will have too survive many many challenges before it becomes a reality. Not the least of which is passing congress and the President placing his signature on the bill. This bill must survive state laws that may prohibit it's implementation and constitutional challenges as well as individuals downright ignoring it. So before you start dancing in the streets over the new social nirvana that your party is attempting to create here I'd advise you to temper that a little. I'm sure after all the Seniors get wind of what this bill has in store for them that this new agenda you and other wish to push off on the nation that they might find Obama's version of healthcare that wants them to all just die is not something they will find acceptable.

More lies from the right.

A single payer healthcare system is the most efficient and the most fair. That is why every other industrialized nation has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and get as good or better results. Those are the facts.

For profit healthcare is morally wrong. Pure and simple.

chris has a fan
LOL
must be an even bigger moron that chris is

 

[Bern80]

That was hysterical.

But the issue is not government run healthcare. This issue is a single payer system. A single payer system is what we need, but people in America are too stupid for that. We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat.

The rest of the world is smarter than we are on this issue.

Which would be a monoply. Explain to us all why a monopoly would be good way to provide health care.

 

[Oddball]

......We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat (sic)...

Funny thing about irony is that it's so...well...ironic.

 

[MadDog]

Interesting. I'd sure like to see the data on that one. Can you back it up or are you making it up?

He's making it up....Does that with alarming regularity.

regularity meaning the opposite of irregularity.

diarrhea of bullshit

Well, I'm new here. Didn't realize Chris was such a "fabricator", though other words come to mind as well.

 

[DiveCon]

He's making it up....Does that with alarming regularity.

regularity meaning the opposite of irregularity.

diarrhea of bullshit

Well, I'm new here. Didn't realize Chris was such a "fabricator", though other words come to mind as well.

do the words "moronic bullshiter" ring a bell?

 

[Skull Pilot]

Sorry for the repeat post but i wanted to make the chart bigger so Chris would have no trouble seeing it.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/healthcare-insurance-govt-healthcare/83407-the-best-healthcare-in-america-is-government-run-4.html#post1378781


Five Year Survival Rates, Selected Countries and Cancers

 

[Chris]

That was hysterical.

But the issue is not government run healthcare. This issue is a single payer system. A single payer system is what we need, but people in America are too stupid for that. We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat.

The rest of the world is smarter than we are on this issue.

Which would be a monoply. Explain to us all why a monopoly would be good way to provide health care.

How does a union get a better deal for its members?

Collective bargaining! Why are drugs cheaper in Canada? Because the government negotiates for everyone with the drug companies. In America the drug companies have the patients by the balls.

Likewise, which is a more efficient system, paying admin, marketing, and profit for 150 different insurance companies or paying admin alone with no marketing or profit for one insurance company that we all own together.

These cost efficiencies are why all the other Western democracies pay HAlf per capita what we pay for healthcare.

 

[Chris]

Let me put it to you this way Chris this healthcare your seeking from the Federal Govt. will have too survive many many challenges before it becomes a reality. Not the least of which is passing congress and the President placing his signature on the bill. This bill must survive state laws that may prohibit it's implementation and constitutional challenges as well as individuals downright ignoring it. So before you start dancing in the streets over the new social nirvana that your party is attempting to create here I'd advise you to temper that a little. I'm sure after all the Seniors get wind of what this bill has in store for them that this new agenda you and other wish to push off on the nation that they might find Obama's version of healthcare that wants them to all just die is not something they will find acceptable.

More lies from the right.

A single payer healthcare system is the most efficient and the most fair. That is why every other industrialized nation has a single payer system, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and get as good or better results. Those are the facts.

For profit healthcare is morally wrong. Pure and simple.

OK Let's make this clear.

Chris states that every other industrialized nation with some type of government run single payer system gets equal or better results than the current US system.

Five Year Survival Rates, Selected Countries and Cancers

View attachment 7859


Source: Arduino Verdecchia et al., “Recent Cancer Survival in Europe: A 2000-02 Period Analysis of EUROCARE-4 Data,” Lancet Oncology 8 (September 2007): 784-96.

So Chris tell us again how quality and results of foreign government run health care is equal to or better than our current system.

Interesting that you don't provide an actual link to that study, but something off a GOP website.

Of course that study also includes Eastern European countries like Slovenia, Poland, etc.. who don't have the wealth of say France or Sweden, so you aren't really comparing apples to apples or oranges to oranges.

Also one of the big reasons for the survival rates in the U.S. is that almost everyone over 65 has government sponsored healthcare, Medicare, so you may be proving my point!

 

[DiveCon]

That was hysterical.

But the issue is not government run healthcare. This issue is a single payer system. A single payer system is what we need, but people in America are too stupid for that. We see a lot of this ignorance on display in this threat.

The rest of the world is smarter than we are on this issue.

Which would be a monoply. Explain to us all why a monopoly would be good way to provide health care.

How does a union get a better deal for its members?

Collective bargaining! Why are drugs cheaper in Canada? Because the government negotiates for everyone with the drug companies. In America the drug companies have the patients by the balls.

Likewise, which is a more efficient system, paying admin, marketing, and profit for 150 different insurance companies or paying admin alone with no marketing or profit for one insurance company that we all own together.

These cost efficiencies are why all the other Western democracies pay HAlf per capita what we pay for healthcare.

if you try and do what Canada gets, you can bet the prices for Canada would go up to equal the price in the US

 

[Maple]

Chris- do you know any vets? I do, and they sure aren't telling me that, it's just the opposite.

 

[Chris]

Chris- do you know any vets? I do, and they sure aren't telling me that, it's just the opposite.

From my original post....

For the sixth year in a row, VA hospitals last year scored higher than private facilities on the University of Michigan's American Customer Satisfaction Index, based on patient surveys on the quality of care received. The VA scored 83 out of 100; private institutions, 71. Males 65 years and older receiving VA care had about a 40% lower risk of death than those enrolled in Medicare Advantage, whose care is provided through private health plans or HMOs, according to a study published in the April edition of Medical Care. Harvard University just gave the VA its Innovations in American Government Award for the agency's work in computerizing patient records.

 

[Oddball]

Chris- do you know any vets? I do, and they sure aren't telling me that, it's just the opposite.

I believe that answer would be a big NO.

Hence, his entire OP premise has been ripped to shreds.