Texas Man Cleared of Shooting Burglars

[BrianH]

He didn't even know his neighbors, I'm saying his motivation was to kill two people because he knew he could. Preventing a burglary was a pretext. He didn't need to shoot to kill and he didn't need to kill twice.
So the cops were there? Why didn't he let the cops deal with it?

Apparently, there was an undercover or plain-clothed cop "Somewhere" watching. Personally, it's not what I would have done, but that's between Horn and his concience. But, he was with Texas Law.

"A plain clothes police detective responding to the 911 call had arrived at the scene before the shooting and witnessed the escalation and shootings, while remaining in his car.[3] His report on the incident indicated that the men who were killed "received gunfire from the rear".[1] Police Capt. A.H. Corbett stated the two men ignored Mr. Horn's order to freeze and one of the suspects ran towards Joe Horn before he angled away from him toward the street when he was shot in the back. Pasadena police confirmed that the two men were shot after they ventured into his front yard. The detective did not arrest Horn."

Joe Horn shooting controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The site also says that the two killed were already criminals on the run from Columbia and were part of a larger burglary ring in Houston. Good riddence I say...

 

[BrianH]

Texas Penal Code Sections 9.41, 9.42, & 9.43

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.41. Protection Of One's Own Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.42. Deadly Force To Protect Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.43. Protection Of Third Person's Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

THe third sections talks about protection of a third-person's property.

 

[JimH52]

This is Texas! It is where the "Decider" is going to retire soon. What did you expect?

 

[Anguille]

You are a waste of space. Your ignorant rant on guns gets dumber and dumber the more you spew the garbage.

So why do you waste your time posting to me?

 

[BrianH]

Wow, you are simple. Your statement justifying why it was ok to shoot the burglars ALSO can apply to cops. Which is why its retarded.

Because the Texas Penal Code specifically states that you cannot shoot law-enforcement for them carrying lawful duties that may include them breaking and entering or other seemingly illegal activies.....And on top of that, COPS do their job knowing good and well that they could be in harms way, so should they be absolutely taken off guard if their injured/killed on duty? No. It has nothing to do with right or wrong, but a matter of putting yourself in harms way. These guys had a illegal occupation that put them in harms way. The analogy is not an anology at all, but a fact.

I was not justifying the right or wrong of shooting the criminals dumbass. I was explaining that these men did not go out of their own way to stay out of harms way by continually breaking laws in a country they were not citizens of...especially since they were criminals and exiles from their own country.

 

[Steerpike]

Texas Penal Code Sections 9.41, 9.42, & 9.43

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.41. Protection Of One's Own Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.42. Deadly Force To Protect Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

Texas Penal Code - Section 9.43. Protection Of Third Person's Property - Texas Attorney Resources - Texas Laws

THe third sections talks about protection of a third-person's property.

Ok. Looks like under 9.42(2)(b) and 9.42(3), in combination with 9.43, the guy falls within Texas law

 

[BrianH]

This is Texas! It is where the "Decider" is going to retire soon. What did you expect?

I hate to say it Jim, but Bush has northern Genes...Connecticut genes to be exact. His dad was born in Mass.

 

[BrianH]

Ok. Looks like under 9.42(2)(b) and 9.42(3), in combination with 9.43, the guy falls within Texas law

Exactly, every bit of it.

 

[Anguille]

Apparently, there was an undercover or plain-clothed cop "Somewhere" watching. Personally, it's not what I would have done, but that's between Horn and his concience. But, he was with Texas Law.

"A plain clothes police detective responding to the 911 call had arrived at the scene before the shooting and witnessed the escalation and shootings, while remaining in his car.[3] His report on the incident indicated that the men who were killed "received gunfire from the rear".[1] Police Capt. A.H. Corbett stated the two men ignored Mr. Horn's order to freeze and one of the suspects ran towards Joe Horn before he angled away from him toward the street when he was shot in the back. Pasadena police confirmed that the two men were shot after they ventured into his front yard. The detective did not arrest Horn."

Joe Horn shooting controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The site also says that the two killed were already criminals on the run from Columbia and were part of a larger burglary ring in Houston. Good riddence I say...

I get your point, that he was within the law. My point is that he used the law to commit murder.
If those two guys were involved in a burglary ring, no chance now of using them to break the ring.

 

[BrianH]

I get your point, that he was within the law. My point is that he used the law to commit murder.
If those two guys were involved in a burglary ring, no chance now of using them to break the ring.

Well, that's just a shame then. There are two less burglars on the street. Like I said, I might have not done the same thing, however, I would have an extremely hard time seeing my neighbors get ripped off. A link I posted earlier claimes that the plain-clothed cop actually testified that one of the burglars actually ran toward Horn before turning around. We'll never know what "REALLY" happened.

Just some advice to those who don't agree with this, abid by the law when you're in Texas, and you won't have a problem.

 

[Ravi]

Well, that's just a shame then. There are two less burglars on the street. Like I said, I might have not done the same thing, however, I would have an extremely hard time seeing my neighbors get ripped off. A link I posted earlier claimes that the plain-clothed cop actually testified that one of the burglars actually ran toward Horn before turning around. We'll never know what "REALLY" happened.

Just some advice to those who don't agree with this, abid by the law when you're in Texas, and you won't have a problem.

The point is, you can abide the law and someone can "think" you're breaking into their house or your neighbor's house and kill you. Neighborhood kid selling Cutco knives...BOOM, off scot free. Brian's wife locked out of her house breaking in the backdoor....BOOM, off scot free.

Stupid law, really, really stupid. Why do you need such a law when self defense is already legal?

 

[Anguille]

Just some advice to those who don't agree with this, abid by the law when you're in Texas, and you won't have a problem.

My advice to those who don't agree with this, if you live in Texas, write your representatives.

 

[Anguille]

The point is, you can abide the law and someone can "think" you're breaking into their house or your neighbor's house and kill you. Neighborhood kid selling Cutco knives...BOOM, off scot free. Brian's wife locked out of her house breaking in the backdoor....BOOM, off scot free.

Stupid law, really, really stupid. Why do you need such a law when self defense is already legal?

Heaven forbid you live in a cookie cutter neighborhood and mistake someone else's front door for your own. I heard some years ago in TX a young kid was killed because he had the wrong address for a party.

 

[Steerpike]

The point is, you can abide the law and someone can "think" you're breaking into their house or your neighbor's house and kill you. Neighborhood kid selling Cutco knives...BOOM, off scot free. Brian's wife locked out of her house breaking in the backdoor....BOOM, off scot free.

Stupid law, really, really stupid. Why do you need such a law when self defense is already legal?

It's not a stupid law. May be that it starts to become a bit outdated in its current form and could stand to be tweaked. The law goes way back into English common law, and I think the underlying rationale behind its development was sound. In essence, your home gets special protection and you should not be under a duty to flee your own home. The law isn't limited to the U.S. either. It exists in other countries.

I think the application to third party properties could stand to be modified though (in places where it applies by statute - traditionally the castle doctrine only applied to defense of your own property, not others).

 

[BrianH]

The point is, you can abide the law and someone can "think" you're breaking into their house or your neighbor's house and kill you. Neighborhood kid selling Cutco knives...BOOM, off scot free. Brian's wife locked out of her house breaking in the backdoor....BOOM, off scot free.

Stupid law, really, really stupid. Why do you need such a law when self defense is already legal?

I see your point Rav, but that's pretty irrational. These men were climbing in and out of his neighbors windows with sacks. They had over $2,000 in stuff. Luckily, my neighbor's know what my wife and I look like. And if a neighborhood kid is crawling in and out of my window according to Cutco knife selling routine, then I WILL have a problem. The problem with the law before is you could only shoot someone if they were already in your house...by then it could be too late. Before this law, my wife and her family experienced someone TRYING to get in their window. They live in the middle of nowhere and their nearest neighbor is about 1/2 mile away. Her mom called the police (who had no cars anywhere close.) Her mom said that if they come get the window up, she's going to shoot. The dispatcher told her that they had to be inside for her to shoot. The dispatcher heard the racket on the window and then told her mom that if she had to, shoot when the window opens and drag them inside.....Luckily, they never could get the window opened and the police showed up after about 15 minutes.... Many times, once a burglar is inside, it's too late.

 

[DiamondDave]

Why do you need such a law when self defense is already legal?

because of liberals screaming about those who act in self defense, act upon stopping criminal scum, etc... and trying to ensure that those who do these acts get punished like the criminals they stop.. empowering criminals even more by weakening the law abiding public

 

[JimH52]

I hate to say it Jim, but Bush has northern Genes...Connecticut genes to be exact. His dad was born in Mass.

You are right my friend but he fits in so well there, don't you agree? You know, "shoot first and ask questions later." Only in his case, "bomb first and find the WMD later."

 

[Steerpike]

You are right my friend but he fits in so well there, don't you agree? You know, "shoot first and ask questions later." Only in his case, "bomb first and find the WMD later."

Yeah, and the person in the forefront of your avatar is one of the ones who authorized him to do it.

 

[Ravi]

I think the application to third party properties could stand to be modified though (in places where it applies by statute - traditionally the castle doctrine only applied to defense of your own property, not others).

Not in Texas. It can be applied to someone breaking into your neighbor's house. In Florida, it can be applied anywhere at any time. Someone at the mall disses you, you can say you thought they were threatening you and kill them.

There is currently a case where drug dealers are using the defense for killing other drug dealers. Sweet justice.

 

[Ravi]

I see your point Rav, but that's pretty irrational. These men were climbing in and out of his neighbors windows with sacks. They had over $2,000 in stuff. Luckily, my neighbor's know what my wife and I look like. And if a neighborhood kid is crawling in and out of my window according to Cutco knife selling routine, then I WILL have a problem. The problem with the law before is you could only shoot someone if they were already in your house...by then it could be too late. Before this law, my wife and her family experienced someone TRYING to get in their window. They live in the middle of nowhere and their nearest neighbor is about 1/2 mile away. Her mom called the police (who had no cars anywhere close.) Her mom said that if they come get the window up, she's going to shoot. The dispatcher told her that they had to be inside for her to shoot. The dispatcher heard the racket on the window and then told her mom that if she had to, shoot when the window opens and drag them inside.....Luckily, they never could get the window opened and the police showed up after about 15 minutes.... Many times, once a burglar is inside, it's too late.

Come on now, Brian, the guy was safe in his own house and went outside to kill them after telling the 911 dispatcher he was in his rights to do it. This law can be applied to anyone at any time. All you need to do is call 911 and act like you're scared.