Terrorist Bumper Stickers

[Bonnie]

Funniest comedy routine I think I've ever seen!

Without question!!!! From beginning to end. I saw Eddie on Broadway do a very dark play called "The Life of Joe Egg"
and he was amazing in it. I had first row seats center stage. I have yet to see his comedy live though. I have all his tapes but one. "Glorious" is very funny as well.

 

[Nienna]

The Iraq Quagmire isn't defending my freedom and I'm not safer because we are over there killing a bunch of people oppressed by a dictator we supported.

Is it me or has every military action since Vietnam been labeled a "quagmire"? Or is it only military actions initiated by conservative administrations?

 

[Nienna]

Here's your return

cool smiliey!

 

[Bonnie]

Is it me or has every military action since Vietnam been labeled a "quagmire"? Or is it only military actions initiated by conservative administrations?

Mostly conservative administrations, however it was Pres Johnson (a liberal) that got us into Vietnam and Nixon who brought our boys home.

 

[Annie]

Mostly conservative administrations, however it was Pres Johnson (a liberal) that got us into Vietnam and Nixon who brought our boys home.

Not to be argumentative, but it was Eisenhower that wanted to help the French, Kennedy that accepted the challenge, LBJ followed and escalated, and Nixon pulled out. Enough blame for all.

 

[KarlMarx]

Is it me or has every military action since Vietnam been labeled a "quagmire"? Or is it only military actions initiated by conservative administrations?

It's not you..... the "Q" word seems to have a long history

Bush I faced very stiff opposition from Congress before invading Kuwait (the opposition of course, was headed up by our favorite drunk - Ted Kennedy). I remember the prediction of tens of thousands dying and yes, they used the "Q" word.

And of course Bush II as you already know got his share of criticism with the use of the "Q" word as well......

Of course, no one ever compared Kosovo or Bosnia to the "Q" word, because of course, that paragon of virtue, the poster child for Viagra, the man who redefined the meaning of "is", our ol' pal Bill Clinton waged it. Nevermind that we've been there for over a decade.....

Of course, if you really want to use the "Q" word to compare something to a hopeless cause, just look at some of the liberal social programs and you get a sinking feeling just like you were in the middle of a quagmire....

1. "The war on poverty" begun in the early Johnson Administration did not significantly change the poverty rate in America even after 4 decades and 5 trillion dollars. Of course, they'll tell you that they would have had poverty licked by now if it wasn't for all those Reagan and Bush tax cuts and the fact that there are Republicans in Congress.

2. Liberal foreign policy which ranged from detente to the 1994 agreed framework with the North Koreans did not overthrow a single dictatorship nor save a single life. Of course, it doesn't help when Senators and former presidents cozy up to bearded, cigar chomping thugs whose wardrobe consist of military fatigues.

3. Liberalized education which stresses self esteem over traditional methods of educating our young has produced a generation of people who don't know how to write, read, solve simple Math problems, don't know who George Washington was and can't find the United States on a map of the world. Of course, it's not because of the Teacher's Unions (which practically own the Democratic Party and oppose anything that remotely resembles reform)... it's because of the mean spirited conservatives who want school vouchers and accountability in the education system.

4. Liberal antagonism against capitalism and the free market has helped to chase jobs and businesses overseas so that now, the Communist Chinese are acquiring an industrial infrastructure with American investment that they will eventually nationalize and use against us in time of war. Of course, the real threat comes from those greedy CEOs and corporations that are scheming with Bush, Cheney and Karl Rove to turn the country over to Haliburton and flood the world with Iraqi oil.

5. Liberal values that go against traditional Western moral virtues of chastity, frugality, hard work have helped to produce an epidemic of sexually transmitted diseases amongst the young, teen pregnancy, out of wedlock births, divorce and abortion.... No, those were really caused by the fact that people have low self esteem and that we need more touchy feely social programs that help kids feel good about themselves even though they're a dumb as a brick.Anyway, we have to stop a few desperate women from using coat hangers to give themselves abortions, so we wiped out 40 million babies over the past three decades instead.

Need I go on? I think I've proven my point..... when a liberal uses the "Q" word.... they are well acquainted with getting stuck in the muck and mire... after all they are well practiced at it..... you can always count on liberals to screw up .... they not only couldn't figure their way out of a paper bag, they also could screw up a one car funeral.....

Yes, sir, a liberal never met a quagmire he/she didn't like. Why if liberals weren't so busy pointing out all the quagmires that the conservatives and the Republicans are foisting on the rest of us, they'd probably notice that they're up to their necks in quick sand.

 

[Bonnie]

Not to be argumentative, but it was Eisenhower that wanted to help the French, Kennedy that accepted the challenge, LBJ followed and escalated, and Nixon pulled out. Enough blame for all.

Agreed, I wasn't aware how involved Ike was, I was always under the impression that he kept his distance on this issue for fear of angering the Soviets?

 

[Annie]

Agreed, I wasn't aware how involved Ike was, I was always under the impression that he kept his distance on this issue for fear of angering the Soviets?

I don't think he really had enough time to react, but I'll check.

 

[Bonnie]

It's not you..... the "Q" word seems to have a long history

Bush I faced very stiff opposition from Congress before invading Kuwait (the opposition of course, was headed up by our favorite drunk - Ted Kennedy). I remember the prediction of tens of thousands dying and yes, they used the "Q" word.

And of course Bush II as you already know got his share of criticism with the use of the "Q" word as well......

Of course, no one ever compared Kosovo or Bosnia to the "Q" word, because of course, that paragon of virtue, the poster child for Viagra, the man who redefined the meaning of "is", our ol' pal Bill Clinton waged it. Nevermind that we've been there for over a decade.....

Of course, if you really want to use the "Q" word to compare something to a hopeless cause, just look at some of the liberal social programs and you get a sinking feeling just like you were in the middle of a quagmire....

1. "The war on poverty" begun in the early Johnson Administration did not significantly change the poverty rate in America even after 4 decades and 5 trillion dollars. Of course, they'll tell you that they would have had poverty licked by now if it wasn't for all those Reagan and Bush tax cuts and the fact that there are Republicans in Congress.

2. Liberal foreign policy which ranged from detente to the 1994 agreed framework with the North Koreans did not overthrow a single dictatorship nor save a single life. Of course, it doesn't help when Senators and former presidents cozy up to bearded, cigar chomping thugs whose wardrobe consist of military fatigues.

3. Liberalized education which stresses self esteem over traditional methods of educating our young has produced a generation of people who don't know how to write, read, solve simple Math problems, don't know who George Washington was and can't find the United States on a map of the world. Of course, it's not because of the Teacher's Unions (which practically own the Democratic Party and oppose anything that remotely resembles reform)... it's because of the mean spirited conservatives who want school vouchers and accountability in the education system.

4. Liberal antagonism against capitalism and the free market has helped to chase jobs and businesses overseas so that now, the Communist Chinese are acquiring an industrial infrastructure with American investment that they will eventually nationalize and use against us in time of war. Of course, the real threat comes from those greedy CEOs and corporations that are scheming with Bush, Cheney and Karl Rove to turn the country over to Haliburton and flood the world with Iraqi oil.

5. Liberal values that go against traditional Western moral virtues of chastity, frugality, hard work have helped to produce an epidemic of sexually transmitted diseases amongst the young, teen pregnancy, out of wedlock births, divorce and abortion.... No, those were really caused by the fact that people have low self esteem and that we need more touchy feely social programs that help kids feel good about themselves even though they're a dumb as a brick.Anyway, we have to stop a few desperate women from using coat hangers to give themselves abortions, so we wiped out 40 million babies over the past three decades instead.

Need I go on? I think I've proven my point..... when a liberal uses the "Q" word.... they are well acquainted with getting stuck in the muck and mire... after all they are well practiced at it..... you can always count on liberals to screw up .... they not only couldn't figure their way out of a paper bag, they also could screw up a one car funeral.....

Yes, sir, a liberal never met a quagmire he/she didn't like. Why if liberals weren't so busy pointing out all the quagmires that the conservatives and the Republicans are foisting on the rest of us, they'd probably notice that they're up to their necks in quick sand.

Wowsa Karl!!

 

[Annie]

I don't think he really had enough time to react, but I'll check.

quickie check, links at site:

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAeisenhower.htm

On 20th January, 1953 Eisenhower became the first soldier-President since Ulysses Grant (1869-77). Eisenhower left party matters to his vice-president, Richard Nixon. His political philosophy was never clearly defined. He was against enlarging the role of government in economic matters but he did support legislation fixing a minimum wage and the extension of social security. Eisenhower also refused to speak out against Joe McCarthy and members of the House of Un-American Activities Committee (HUAC) until they began to attack his army commanders in 1954.

Eisenhower's government was severely concerned about the success of communism in South East Asia. Between 1950 and 1953 they had lost 142,000 soldiers in attempting to stop communism entering South Korea. The United States feared that their efforts would have been wasted if communism were to spread to South Vietnam. Eisenhower was aware that he would have difficulty in persuading the American public to support another war so quickly after Korea. He therefore decided to rely on a small group of Military Advisers' to prevent South Vietnam becoming a communist state.

In 1956 Eisenhower defeated Adlai Stevenson again. This time the margin was even greater with Eisenhower winning 35,585,316 votes to Stevenson's 26,031,322. The following year he controversially sent federal troops to Little Rock to enforce the Supreme Court decision to desegregate schooling.

In foreign affairs during this period he relied heavily on Richard Nixon and his secretary of state, John Foster Dulles. During the Suez Crisis President Dwight Eisenhower refused to support the Anglo-French action against Gamal Abdel Nasser in Egypt. Afterwards his Secretary of State, John Foster Dulles, became concerned about the growing influence of the Soviet Union in the Middle East.

In January 1957 made a speech in Congress where Eisenhower recommended the use of American forces to protect Middle East states against overt aggression from nations "controlled by international communism". He also urged the provision of economic aid to those countries with anti-communist governments. This new foreign policy became known as the Eisenhower Doctrine.

 

[KarlMarx]

Not to be argumentative, but it was Eisenhower that wanted to help the French, Kennedy that accepted the challenge, LBJ followed and escalated, and Nixon pulled out. Enough blame for all.

Let's see, the Communist Vietnamese wanted to overrun Southeast Asia, so we stepped in and tried to prevent a blood bath. Over 13 years of American involvement, about 53,000 American deaths occured in Vietnam. After we pulled out in 1975, hundreds of thousands of Vietnamese were imprisoned, tortured and murdered and 2 million Cambodians died as a result of the Vietnamese backed Khmer Rouge. The "Domino Theory" had some validity after all.

In spite of all their talk of just wanting to get "our boys home", the liberals in Congress pulled the plug on funding the South Vietnamese resistance to the Communist North's aggression. That's why we lost the Vietnam war.... it wasn't because it was a quagmire, it was because there were forces within our own country that wanted to see a Communist victory in Vietnam and that's what they got.

Nixon didn't pull out, he resigned in 1974 because of Watergate remember? I guess he was so distracted with that, that Vietnam took a back seat. Of course, it didn't help that Nixon was involved in the McCarthy hearings that exposed a lot (and I mean a lot) of Communists in high places within our government. The Left never forgave him for that, and they paid him back during the 1970s.

Maybe Nixon wasn't such an ogre after all...

 

[Bonnie]

quickie check, links at site:

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAeisenhower.htm

Interesting. I never realized how much influence Nixon had on Ike.

 

[Annie]

Let's see, the Communist Vietnamese wanted to overrun Southeast Asia, so we stepped in and tried to prevent a blood bath. Over 13 years of American involvement, about 53,000 American deaths occured in Vietnam. After we pulled out in 1975, hundreds of thousands of Vietnamese were imprisoned, tortured and murdered and 2 million Cambodians died as a result of the Vietnamese backed Khmer Rouge. The "Domino Theory" had some validity after all.

In spite of all their talk of just wanting to get "our boys home", the liberals in Congress pulled the plug on funding the South Vietnamese resistance to the Communist North's aggression. That's why we lost the Vietnam war.... it wasn't because it was a quagmire, it was because there were forces within our own country that wanted to see a Communist victory in Vietnam and that's what they got.

Nixon didn't pull out, he resigned in 1974 because of Watergate remember? I guess he was so distracted with that, that Vietnam took a back seat. Of course, it didn't help that Nixon was involved in the McCarthy hearings that exposed a lot (and I mean a lot) of Communists in high places within our government. The Left never forgave him for that, and they paid him back during the 1970s.

Actually Karl Marx, while I was too young-something I can rarely say anymore-if my memory serves me right, Nixon ran on the platform of ending Vietnam with 'honor.' Yet in the end, he capitulated. No honor, no peace. Slaughter by millions I do believe. The war was NOT his fault, but his 'administration's choices, with his own machinations' made it all worse.

My own take, Congress was at fault, moreso the media-though they were just in the process of discovering their might. Nixon et al handed them the cake with Watergate-nothing would be the same.

 

[Bonnie]

KarlMarx

In spite of all their talk of just wanting to get "our boys home", the liberals in Congress pulled the plug on funding the South Vietnamese resistance to the Communist North's aggression. That's why we lost the Vietnam war.... it wasn't because it was a quagmire, it was because there were forces within our own country that wanted to see a Communist victory in Vietnam and that's what they got.

See this is chilling. I always have to wonder why there are some in this country that actually want Communism abroad and here, and the only conclusion I can come to is power. They want complete power over everyone and here people are scared of those that talk of a New World Order. Maybe that will come in the form of Communism?

 

[Bonnie]

Actually Karl Marx, while I was too young-something I can rarely say anymore-if my memory serves me right, Nixon ran on the platform of ending Vietnam with 'honor.' Yet in the end, he capitulated. No honor, no peace. Slaughter by millions I do believe. The war was NOT his fault, but his 'administration's choices, with his own machinations' made it all worse.

My own take, Congress was at fault, moreso the media-though they were just in the process of discovering their might. Nixon et al handed them the cake with Watergate-nothing would be the same.

Absolutely that Nixon was for lack of a better term Wishy Washy on this probably as you suggest due to his own problems of cleaning house. My take is that Nixon wasn't really a conservative but more of a Liberal Republican, but like you I was very young during his presidency.

 

[KarlMarx]

Actually Karl Marx, while I was too young-something I can rarely say anymore-if my memory serves me right, Nixon ran on the platform of ending Vietnam with 'honor.' Yet in the end, he capitulated. No honor, no peace. Slaughter by millions I do believe. The war was NOT his fault, but his 'administration's choices, with his own machinations' made it all worse.

My own take, Congress was at fault, moreso the media-though they were just in the process of discovering their might. Nixon et al handed them the cake with Watergate-nothing would be the same.

One of the risks that Ho Chi Minh and his generals made was that by waging the Tet Offensive against the South in 1968 that the Americans would cut and run. The North Vietnamese army was decimated during the Tet Offensive (over 40,000 deaths).... if the American military were so inclined, there was little standing between them and Hanoi. But Ho Chi Minh was right, Americans lost the will to fight and cut and ran.....

Fast forward to the 21st century.... a bunch of Moslem fanatics with pure hatred of America and the west looked at what happened in Vietnam... they calculated that Americans did not have the will to fight them, thus they waged a guerilla war against us.... they depended on a protracted conflict eroding the American will to fight, and that the American media and the Left would also help erode that will to fight. Therefore, even undermanned and under armed, they embarked on their quest because they counted on the American Media to undermine any war effort, just like they did in Vietnam.....

And you know what? They were right.....

 

[KarlMarx]

KarlMarx

See this is chilling. I always have to wonder why there are some in this country that actually want Communism abroad and here, and the only conclusion I can come to is power. They want complete power over everyone and here people are scared of those that talk of a New World Order. Maybe that will come in the form of Communism?

Yes, they're the ones who are always complaining about the Religious Right "trying to force their morals on everyone else" and "telling everyone else what to do"..... but what does the Left do?

1. They pass taxation to fund their programs
2. They pass laws or get judges to rule on laws that compromise our freedoms
3. They want to tell you how you should think, talk and vote. And they'll do anything to get their way.....

So... who is that really wants to force their morals on everyone else? That's right, the Left.

 

[Annie]

Dang, I may have to reveal my relative age! I was in jr. high when Nixon was elected. I didn't 'like' him, though my mother thought he was 'the neatest thing since sliced bread.' Funny coming from someone that had 'love' JFK when I was in kindergarten! :shocked:

Vietnam droned on after his election, as did school. By my junior year of high school, WaPo was rife with Watergate. I was reading, Garry Wills, my mom was cursing MSM.

By graduation, troops were coming home, it had been over 2 years since the guys in my class were worried about the 'draft.' It was over.

My first year of college, I'll never forget the front page of the Chicago Daily News with the pictures of 'indicted' and 'unindicted co-conspirators.' Mike Royko's column was deleted from the 'national' edition that day. I called my mom, she was crying.

What Nixon did to the troops and country were unforgiveable. That doesn't mean that others were not worse, but his were the sins we saw.

The troops really never lost a battle, their commanders ordered them to take and release real estate, we are living with those problems to a certain degree even now.

 

[nosarcasm]

Dang, I may have to reveal my relative age!

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The troops really never lost a battle, their commanders ordered them to take and release real estate, we are living with those problems to a certain degree even now.

It reminds me alot of the WW1 Germany Dolchstoss legende. Undefeated
in the field, betrayed at home. Where they betrayed or did the government
adhere to democratic demands of the loyal opposition? (in your hindsight)

 

[Annie]

yummy marriage material



It reminds me alot of the WW1 Germany Dolchstoss legende. Undefeated
in the field, betrayed at home. Where they betrayed or did the government
adhere to democratic demands of the loyal opposition? (in your hindsight)

I agree with the WWI analogy, a pointless war in the long haul. We not only sold out the Vietnamese, we sold out our troops. Not right, not fair, not forgivable.

Gulf War I was the first real salvo for redemption of US people. They did rise. Truth is, the UN actions were NOT supported by the US folks, ie Kosovo.