Taxes-how many are self employed?

[SpidermanTuba]

Are you serious? Even when a new corporation is created large suppliers require, among other things "personal guarantees." Small suppliers are sometimes ignorant of the risks they are taking when supplying to a corporation, but are you suggesting that an honest man should create a corporation with an eye towards using it to dodge personal responsibility for indebtedness, and have that dodge especially hurt the small business owner?

What the heck does honesty have to do with it? A prudent businessman will set up an LLC so that if someone slips and falls in his store the lawyers don't take his house and his retirement. It much more about protecting yourself from unforeseen liabilities than liabilities you decide to take on to run your business.

 

[Eccgmike]

You know, I always say this is the major difference between entrepeneurs, and W-2 recipient's ; people that own small business's don't punch a time clock because we're never finished working. We live breath, and eat our work, sometimes, admittedly, to a fault. Often we lie awake in bed obsessing over a certain project, or a flaw in a SOP, or just how to do it better. We awke in the morning either still thinking about it, or excited about the prospect of implementing the fix we came up with. Basically we never stop thinking about our work. We love it, it is a labor of love, and while it is ours, we also understand we're only as good as the team of people we employ. That being said, I believe MOST, not all, but the majority of W-2 recipients view a job az something they must show up for for eight hours a day for in order to receive a paycheck in order that they can then do/concentrate/spend time doing the things that are important to them. Again, not all, but some even view their job as an annoyance that must be tolerated. Now, I am in no way insinuating that one group is "better" than another in ANY way. Simply stating that while some want to get their job finished so that they can turn their attention to what is important to them. Others want to get their jobs finished because it IS what is most important to them. I knew when I saw this thread that the people that would bash us would be from the latter category, and they would not have a clue about small business, and reading through it, I was correct. The notion that business owners are all wealthy is a stigma that you can't escape, especially from your employees sometimes. But here is a fact; No, we may not have to worry about putting gas in our personal vehicle, or paying our motgage, or buying groceries, but we DO have to worry about things like being $4500.00 short on payroll one week, or going without a paycheck, sometimes for extended periods of time, to make sure everyone else has one, not because we're so giving, because it's business. I've only borrowed money from the bank one time in my life, and it was to cover ONE PART of a weeks payroll. So no sooner was it deposited, than "poof" it was gone! It took me a year to pay it back, but less than seconds for it to be spent. Not complaining, just explaining. So next time your looking at your boss and thinking what a "rich jerk" he is,... maybe this will give you a different perspective. Finally, ask yourself this question,..... did u ever get a job from a poor man??

 

[SpidermanTuba]

You know, I always say this is the major difference between entrepeneurs, and W-2 recipient's ; people that own small business's don't punch a time clock because we're never finished working.

LOL! I guess you've never heard of salaried employees?

We live breath, and eat our work, sometimes, admittedly, to a fault.

Right - there's no one on a payroll that does that - you're special.

Often we lie awake in bed obsessing over a certain project, or a flaw in a SOP, or just how to do it better.

So does any scientist or engineer.

I've only borrowed money from the bank one time in my life, and it was to cover ONE PART of a weeks payroll

You've probably missed out on a lot of expansion opportunities then.

 

[The Rabbi]

Are you serious? Even when a new corporation is created large suppliers require, among other things "personal guarantees." Small suppliers are sometimes ignorant of the risks they are taking when supplying to a corporation, but are you suggesting that an honest man should create a corporation with an eye towards using it to dodge personal responsibility for indebtedness, and have that dodge especially hurt the small business owner?

What the heck does honesty have to do with it? A prudent businessman will set up an LLC so that if someone slips and falls in his store the lawyers don't take his house and his retirement. It much more about protecting yourself from unforeseen liabilities than liabilities you decide to take on to run your business.

Sorry but you are too stupid and ignorant to participate in this discussion.
The OP is right: He can invest his money in other people's companies (i.e. the stock market) where he has no control over how business decisions are made or he can invest in his own company which he knows intimately.
He is tying up a lot of money in his businesses, which seem diversified, in order to make excellent returns. There is a risk that goes with that which he is obviously aware of. He thinks it's worth it and I can't disagree.

 

[Gadawg73]

How many are self employed and have their life savings at risk daily running their businesses?

? Incorporate, and that won't be a problem.

I own 3 CORPORATIONS!

All a corporation ever is IS AN ENTITY.

Corporations ARE PEOPLE!!

NO bank anywhere loans to a small business corporation. They ALL require a personal guarantee from A PERSON.

And that person has to have resources, equity and THEIR OWN $ in the corporation.

Geez, amazing the myths in society today and how little or nothing Americans know about business, finances and the economy.

 

[Gadawg73]

If you have your life savings all tied up in your business it isn't a business, it's a hobby.

You have no clue how hard it is to run a business. My detective agency certainly is no hobby.

If taxes were not so high on small business then I would not have to put so much of my savings into making sure others are employed.

A simple thank you to your employer would be sufficient.

The federal income tax on a small business is the exact same as the tax on any other personal income, quit your baseless whining.

I pay the taxes. People, NOT CORPORATIONS, always pay the taxes.

Why the fuck do you think you should be exempt from taxation? What makes you so fucking special? You think you're better than everyone else?

Please show me where I stated I wanted to be exempt from taxes.
I do not think I am "better than everyone else".
However, I am smarter than YOU.
Wham it zero on set.

 

[Ravi]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

 

[The Rabbi]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

More wisdom from the "BIg Book of Worn-Out Investing Cliches."

 

[Ravi]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

More wisdom from the "BIg Book of Worn-Out Investing Cliches."

It might be a cliche but it is true.

Here we have the OP claiming all his life savings are in one basket (his own ability to turn a profit) and claiming that somehow because Obama is president his "businesses" have no chance of success.

He's either a fool or a liar.

 

[Eccgmike]

Are you serious? Even when a new corporation is created large suppliers require, among other things "personal guarantees." Small suppliers are sometimes ignorant of the risks they are taking when supplying to a corporation, but are you suggesting that an honest man should create a corporation with an eye towards using it to dodge personal responsibility for indebtedness, and have that dodge especially hurt the small business owner?

What the heck does honesty have to do with it? A prudent businessman will set up an LLC so that if someone slips and falls in his store the lawyers don't take his house and his retirement. It much more about protecting yourself from unforeseen liabilities than liabilities you decide to take on to run your business.

Sorry but you are too stupid and ignorant to participate in this discussion.
The OP is right: He can invest his money in other people's companies (i.e. the stock market) where he has no control over how business decisions are made or he can invest in his own company which he knows intimately.
He is tying up a lot of money in his businesses, which seem diversified, in order to make excellent returns. There is a risk that goes with that which he is obviously aware of. He thinks it's worth it and I can't disagree.

Thank you for pointing out "spidey's" incompetence. I would have done it myself, but I've boycotted him as it's useless to argue with him.

 

[American Horse]

Are you serious? Even when a new corporation is created large suppliers require, among other things "personal guarantees." Small suppliers are sometimes ignorant of the risks they are taking when supplying to a corporation, but are you suggesting that an honest man should create a corporation with an eye towards using it to dodge personal responsibility for indebtedness, and have that dodge especially hurt the small business owner?

What the heck does honesty have to do with it? A prudent businessman will set up an LLC so that if someone slips and falls in his store the lawyers don't take his house and his retirement. It much more about protecting yourself from unforeseen liabilities than liabilities you decide to take on to run your business.

That's all fine and good about avoiding liability; I've managed that with insurance which one needs in any event, but that's peripheral to the discussion that's been going on here, which has been about running a business profitably by managing costs and taxes. The risks of losing an investment from all other causes far exceed losing in a lawsuit like you just mentioned. And I suspect that was the last thing on your mind too.

 

[The Rabbi]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

More wisdom from the "BIg Book of Worn-Out Investing Cliches."

It might be a cliche but it is true.

Here we have the OP claiming all his life savings are in one basket (his own ability to turn a profit) and claiming that somehow because Obama is president his "businesses" have no chance of success.

He's either a fool or a liar.

No, it's not true.
Like most things, it's more complicated. Diversification is a substitute for knowledge. Most people cannot learn everything there is about a publicly traded company to know how they are doing. So they diversify.
In the case of the entrepreneur, he knows more or less everything there is to know about his company and its market. So he eliminates a lot of risk just through knowledge.
In fact the OP has separate discrete businesses so he is diversified. His complaint, justly, is that the gov'ts new mandates and taxes make it that much harder for an entriepreneur to operate a company succesfully. And he is right. Ijust had pretty much this conversation with a friend who owns a very large flower nursery, with over 70 employees.

 

[Eccgmike]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

More wisdom from the "BIg Book of Worn-Out Investing Cliches."

It might be a cliche but it is true.

Here we have the OP claiming all his life savings are in one basket (his own ability to turn a profit) and claiming that somehow because Obama is president his "businesses" have no chance of success.

He's either a fool or a liar.

Again let me explain something that you apparently have no concept of. When a new administration takes office and starts implimenting their ideological policies, especially the policies toward business in general, you know within a fairly short period of time, right or left, if that administration is "business friendly" or not. The indicators are often new tax codes, new EPA reg's (or the lack thereof), new OSHA regs, changes in insurance structure or requirements, and just the increase or reduction of red tape and/or contact required with regulatory agencies. Believe you me, we've already felt the bite of the current administrations "teeth" in creating a hostile environment for small business. Hell, we all new when the "El Presidente" held his first "job summit", which was supposed to be focused on small business, that he was AGAINST us because "oops!" he forgot to invite the two largest advocates for small business, the NFIB and the Chamber! We knew then that we'de better start getting used bending over and guess what?? It's been downhill ever since, so do yourself a favor and stop talking because the more you do, the dumber you sound.

 

[antagon]

You are obviously "wealthy" and your wealth needs to be redistributed and spread around.

I'm not sure how that works. There is no federal tax on wealth until you die (the estate tax). There is a federal tax on income. That's a huge difference.

taxing income beyond deductions is taxing wealth for all intents and purposes. spreading that around like the man said, is the basis of modern, developed economies... so you both know how that works.

 

[antagon]

the chamber and the nfib are garbage lobbies. at some point, they need to shoulder the blame for their impotence in DC compared to their more-specialized interest competitors. their biggest contribution is networking and education among businesses, not advocacy in the least.

 

[CMike]

You are obviously "wealthy" and your wealth needs to be redistributed and spread around. Fortunately Obama is going to help you with that. On the bright side you won't have to worry about putting gas in your car no more or making your mortgage payment.

Got a link to where Obama plans to confiscate wealth and redistribute it?

Here you go sewer worker left winger

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRPbCSSXyp0]YouTube - Meet Joe Plumber/ Obama talks to Joe Plumber (FULL VIDEO)[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvGsWQ69Tzk]YouTube - Obama admits AGAIN that he wants to redistribute wealth![/ame]

 

[CMike]

In Michigan I have the pleasure of paying three sets of takes; federal taxes, state taxes, and Michigan's small business tax.

 

[antagon]

Only a fool puts all his eggs in one basket.

More wisdom from the "BIg Book of Worn-Out Investing Cliches."

It might be a cliche but it is true.

Here we have the OP claiming all his life savings are in one basket (his own ability to turn a profit) and claiming that somehow because Obama is president his "businesses" have no chance of success.

He's either a fool or a liar.

i'd agree that it would take an idiot to fail an enterprise over taxes.

i'll say that tax-cut policy is not pro-small business, per sa. no clearer a case than bush's cuts.

it should be considered, however, that tying up savings in your own enterprise offers the best return and the most shelter from tax of any methods i could think of. the exposure to risk relative to the return is terrific if you know what you are doing and you are doing the right thing.

 

[CMike]

In other words, you're bitching about nothing. Phony asshole.

Sounds like "i'm making lots of money but my greedy ass wants even more and more". Fuck the working class man. waaaa

Yep. But I actually think he's not making anything if all his life savings are being risked in the manner he claims. He's basically crying for someone to save him from himself.

Hey Gadwag, you don't work in your business?

 

[Eccgmike]

the chamber and the nfib are garbage lobbies. at some point, they need to shoulder the blame for their impotence in DC compared to their more-specialized interest competitors. their biggest contribution is networking and education among businesses, not advocacy in the least.

While I agree with you as far as the inability of the Chamber, and NFIB in D.C., I should have pointed at who Barry DID invite to the job summit, ie; the labor unions and academics. In comparison, he may as well have called it a "get together of my buddies."