Socialized Medicine

Discussion in 'Healthcare/Insurance/Govt Healthcare' started by babosam, May 27, 2011.

  1. babosam
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    babosam Rookie

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    Socialized medicine
    Do you know that congress has socialized medicine? So does the postal service and armed forces and veterans hospital workers and federal workers of all kinds. The government pays for their medical aide and prescriptions at a very, very low cost to the individual. Their retirement is among the best you can get paid for by the government. The government controls the cost of doctor visits, treatment and prescription. Guess what is the biggest socialized medicine received. Medicare! Social Security!
    We pay 8,000.00 per person in medical and second largest is Canada at 4,000.00. Half the cost
    Then Germany, France at about 3,000.00 and 2,000.00 and they are doing just fine.
     
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  2. shintao
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    shintao Take Down ~ Tap Out

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    But they are socialologically flawed.:lol:
     
  3. SFC Ollie
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    SFC Ollie Still Marching

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    Is it socialized medicine if you earn it as part of your pay?

    I don't think so.....
     
  4. frazzledgear
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    frazzledgear Senior Member

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    You think GOVERNMENT is paying for it? Because what? You think government GIVES us stuff? All good things come from...GOVERNMENT? You can't figure out why the rest of us DON'T have it? I hate to break the bad news to you -but their ELITIST medical plan that you and I are forbidden from having -is being paid for by us. Not government. Government gets its money from.....us. The reason you and I have to pay for it but can't have it ourselves is if we put 350 million on that identical elitist plan, it would collapse. Congress only gets it because they created and reserved it for THEMSELVES -while sticking us with the tab. The same one that also pays them "retirement" pay for LIFE after serving just five years in office. This is exactly what they have done in Cuba too -deliberately created a two-tiered health care system where the ruling elite have WONDERFUL care. It is the one tourists see and have access to if needed while there. But the ones stuck paying for it are FORBIDDEN from using it all and instead shunted off to deteriorating shacks called "clinics" where they enjoy a nonstop shortage of supplies and qualified staff. Isn't it great when the people receiving all the best benefits get to write their OWN ticket for life? But the ones stuck with the tab get the shaft? Don't you wish it was that way at YOUR job?

    Destroy our system and it isn't just Americans who will really suffer for it. 90% of ALL medical advancements in the world -come from OUR system. THAT is a HUGE indictment of socialized medicine. Nations around the globe benefit by OUR medical advancements. If ours is SO terrible -then how is that possible that it is responsible for 90% of all medical advancements in the WORLD? They DON'T come from the socialized system you leftwing extremist whackos think is superior. They ain't coming from Canada, the UK, China, France and Germany. I noticed you failed to mention the health care system the British are "enjoying" -especially now that the morbidity and mortality rates for diseases that are still dropping in this country -are on the RISE there, meaning people are MORE likely to die from them or the complications these diseases than they did before. Looks like waiting two years before you can see a doctor does have its downside after all, huh? And France is facing bankruptcy of its health care system and their government is trying to figure out how to go about PRIVATIZING it again.

    With socialized medicine you get ONLY one of two things. You either end up with a system that fails to provide quality care so everyone really pays for it by seeing the quality of their own care drop and even their life expectancy -or you get one with a short life expectancy because it will go bankrupt even faster than the lousy one. These are your ONLY two choices with socialized health care. And most choose to IMPOSE poor quality care for all (except the elite again of course who stick us with the tab) because it will have a longer life expectancy before it too goes bankrupt anyway.

    Obama is CUTTING $500 BILLION from Medicare -intent on forcing the elderly to take it right in the shorts. AND his bill calls for the creation of a panel to force the rationing of health care to the elderly -which only means that panel will exist for the purpose of DENYING medical care to some. The UNEQUAL treatment by government of its own citizens whereby some will get certain treatments and drugs -and others will not. Gee, do you really think THAT is Constitutional? For our government to treat its own citizens in an unequal manner based on their AGE? In the UK this is already being done -and people are being denied things like hip transplants and forced to spend their remaining years in a wheelchair. And the age cutoff at which point they are being denied a hip transplant is STILL dropping. Even though the earlier one ends up in a wheelchair, the more likely they are to die at an earlier age. See how that works out so nice when you need the elderly to just die? People are deliberately being denied curative treatment for things like SKIN CANCER because it is deemed to be "not cost effective"-which is a decision to MAKE them die of a disease that is CURABLE if its just TREATED or deliberately INCREASE their suffering while they are sick from some other condition already! Like I said -with socialized health care you get one of two things -a bankrupt system as France is rapidly approaching. Or a despicable, low quality system as the British have -which is only postponing its own bankruptcy with that low quality care, not avoiding it. Democrats with the passage of Obamacare and the massive schedule cut in Medicare and creation of a death/rationing panel have made it clear which one of the two options they pick.

    Even while Democrats campaign on the lie Republicans are trying to destroy it, Democrats themselves have laid the groundwork to cut the legs out from under it and make sure it becomes a system that fails to deliver quality care and then we too can enjoy seeing our morbidity and mortality rates do a 180 like they are in the UK. In PRACTICE, socialized medicine INCREASES human suffering because it is a system that INVARIABLY rations health care based on cost effectiveness as "cost effect" is defined by some ruling elite. Instead of whether it will improve the quality of life -which becomes a non-issue under socialized medicine. In the UK if someone isn't expected to live at least another 12 years, their quality of life for those remaining years is IRRELEVANT.

    The rest of your argument is bs. Social Security is not "socialized medicine" and it isn't even an entitlement program although Democrats want to turn it into one. It isn't a health care program at all. It is a retirement insurance program that is run by government intended to pay a monthly retirement stipend. You don't pay into it, you don't get it -period. It is broke for one reason and one reason ONLY. Government used that money for its other projects and when it did, it IMMEDIATELY turned that insurance policy into nothing but a PYRAMID SCHEME. If a private company had done what our own government did, people would have been thrown into prison and DESERVED IT!
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2011
  5. Greenbeard
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    Would that be the body that's forbidden in the statute from even recommending any kind of rationing? ("REQUIREMENTS- Each proposal submitted under this section in a proposal year shall meet each of the following requirements: [...] `(ii) The proposal shall not include any recommendation to ration health care..."). You've been listening to too much of Paul Ryan's demagoguery.
     
  6. Polk
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    But even if it did allow rationing, how is that different from their proposal? It isn't.
     
  7. Quantum Windbag
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    That depends on how you define socialism. The proper definition of socialism is a public provision of a non public good, and it also has use central planning to accomplish it.

    While it is true that the government pays for health care for members of Congress, they do not use central planning to accomplish it. They simply offer them the exact same plans that are offered to all federal employees, and gives them many options to chose from.

    Obamacare, on the other hand, does both and is therefore socialism.

    Can somebody please explain to me why the same people who are happy to point out that the techniques that work in small scale do not always work in a large scale if it is something they do not like are so willing to argue the opposite when it is something they do like? The reason this works for other countries is that they are small, and can easily control all t he various factors that make up the complex web of health care they deal with. If socialized health care is so good why did the Canadian Supreme Court order the government to privatize health care to improve services?
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2011
  8. Quantum Windbag
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    No, that would be the body that, by law, is mandated to make Medicare costs go down by reducing payments to doctors and hospitals to the point where they are getting less than they would under Medicaid. The fact that they are supposed to do this without rationing care just proves that the entire idea is nothing but smoke and mirrors, but thanks for playing.
     
  9. Quantum Windbag
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    Because Ryan's proposal actually works and the Obamacare solution just makes things worse?
     
  10. Douger
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    Douger BANNED

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    The taxes I pay ( in three countries) also cover my health care, dental, optical and prescriptions included.
    You get IsNtReal, primates in Africastan and endless war.........corporate subsidies are also high on duh list.

    Actually a spider bit me about an hour ago and it aint looking good. I'll head to the clinic in a little while and get fixed up.No matter what / it won't take one peso from my pocket. I already paid. As you idiots did. The difference is, I know that I get what I pay for ( and more).

    Young people pay in . We take out.
    It'll be their turn in 30 years.
    That's socialism.
     

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