Cold Fusion38
SUPER GENIUS
Oh and if you look at their nifty graph of total military strength Turkey if FAR superior to Iraq.
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Iraq War To Do List
1. Defeat Iraqi Military
2. Overrun Baghdad
3. Capture Saddam
4. Begin Martial Law
5. Defeat Insurgency
6. Facilitate Elections
7. Establish New Currency
8. Establish New Constitution
9. Establish Fair Markets
10. Rebuild infrastructure
10 for 10. Chalk it up for the Good Guys.
The goal of war should be to achieve the country's objectives they failed to achieve by any other means. Typically that involves rendering the opposing country's military force ineffective. Often it means replacing the country's government and/or dictating terms of surrender.
So on that basis looks like we won.
Still waiting to hear on what basis we lost.
WOW libility chimes in for Rabbi. How ODD!
"I love the smell of Napalm in the morning. It smells like VICTORY."
Well Samson if you had read Rabbis link you would have noticed everything I put up on the last page DIRECTLEY contradicted Rabbis claim of Iraqi military strength. Sorry if the facts disturbed you.
The goal of war should be to achieve the country's objectives they failed to achieve by any other means. Typically that involves rendering the opposing country's military force ineffective. Often it means replacing the country's government and/or dictating terms of surrender.
So on that basis looks like we won.
Still waiting to hear on what basis we lost.
Ok, use your definition, however unrealistic and void of all evidence that The Goal has been to establish a Legitamate Democracy in Iraq, and there is no such thing, nor is it likely that there ever will be.
You can confidently vote in your poll, "YES."
I however, will vote "No," because I'm not going to ignore reality: This war, (or any other), is not waged just to destroy an existing military or government. If this was so, then it would have ended long ago.
The goal of war should be to achieve the country's objectives they failed to achieve by any other means. Typically that involves rendering the opposing country's military force ineffective. Often it means replacing the country's government and/or dictating terms of surrender.
So on that basis looks like we won.
Still waiting to hear on what basis we lost.
Ok, use your definition, however unrealistic and void of all evidence that The Goal has been to establish a Legitamate Democracy in Iraq, and there is no such thing, nor is it likely that there ever will be.
You can confidently vote in your poll, "YES."
I however, will vote "No," because I'm not going to ignore reality: This war, (or any other), is not waged just to destroy an existing military or government. If this was so, then it would have ended long ago.
Well, they have had at least one election that was judged free and fair. They appear to be on track to have a second such election. That makes them better off than anyone else in the region (except Israel).
So I guess it depends on what your definition of "legitimate" is.
And Cold Fusion is a total wanker who is working towards my "ignore" list, joining other anti-semites and people too stupid to be worthy of debate. Just saying.
The U.S. had and continues to have a military presence in both Japan and Germany. In the early days, esp with Germany, that was to keep an eye on things and keep the Soviets out.
But it is hard to compare 1st world countries like Germany with a 3rd world country like Iraq. In any case, the Iraqis appear to be needing our help less and less.
Oh yea. Go to use CP and on the left side is a tab that says edit ignore list and when you get to that type Cold Fusion and the nasty little bugger is gone.
All by themselves, really?
Germany was ruled by a kaiser up until 1918. As a result of Allied pressure the monarchy collapsed and a very weak democratic government took over. That didnt last too long until Germans voted themselves another dictatorship. It took another costly bloody war before Allies again dictated a government. Japan still has an emperor, albeit with no real power.
Yes, Iraq doesn't have much in the way of a democratic history, but the above examples show the power of ideas and military force. And currently Iraq seems to be doing fine in the democracy department.