Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

[Inthemiddle]

Everyone does pay tax of some sort. That said, the fact that those who do not pay an income tax or property tax get to vote to raise taxes on those that do, is a total cluster fuck and is the root cause to partisan divides in this country.

Can you identify even one time when a person who pays no income tax was involved in passing a bill that raised income tax on others?

Can you identify even one time when a person who pays no property tax was involved in a passing a bill that raised taxes on others?

Are you equally as concerned with, oh say.....the plight of residents who live in Washington D.C., who incur federal taxation without any representation in Congress?

Owning property and being a citizen were the original test to voting rights. In other words a vested interest in the process. Now so many merely demand from government, (government being equal to those persons supporting it financially) without risk to themselves, a "free ride".

That's a ridiculously superficial analysis. The original voting laws were in place due to the unspoken caste system of early America. It was a form of discrimination, and served to preserve the "pureness" of the aristocracy.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Yeah.....Those fucken Obamas and their vacations on my dime are getting a little old.
So you're saying those second and third generation welfare recipients vote republican?
The problem with your theory on the rich is that they produce wealth and those jobs that the welfare recipients avoid. Big difference skippy.

Wealth is created by the consumer class of America, while the owners and managers exploit their advantages.

Well you better get busy exploiting....you're falling behind.
Some people are leaders....then there's people like you. It's your choice.

You make no sense. Try again.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Wealth is created by the consumer class of America, while the owners and managers exploit their advantages.

Well you better get busy exploiting....you're falling behind.
Some people are leaders....then there's people like you. It's your choice.

You make no sense. Try again.

I'm not surprised you dont get it.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Well you better get busy exploiting....you're falling behind.
Some people are leaders....then there's people like you. It's your choice.

You make no sense. Try again.

I'm not surprised you dont get it.

Even you don't understand what you say

 

[Care4all]

everyone pays taxes...of some kind....

 

[gwennie]

Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

When Socrates and his friends were talking of voters, they were talking of land owners. In today’s terms, that means, ---- taxpayer. The core of democracy.

There are two types of citizens. The taxpayer and the taxtaker.

Once the taxpayer hands over his wealth, he loses control of where it is spent.

This is counter to the taxpayer’s wishes.

Why do taxpayers allow this situation and defer their right to spend their wealth to others?

If taxtakers had done a good job with that wealth, I do not think any would complain. That is not the case.

Should those who pay the way of our society be the ones who decide where our wealth is spent?

Since the right to do so is tied to our vote, should only taxpayers be allowed to vote on spending issues?

Regards
DL

Yes.....

 

[gwennie]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

 

[gwennie]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

You are effective making the argument that people should be allowed to vote themselves money.

Hard to imagine how any Nation could survive that once the underclass is encouraged to do that in exchange for free gubmint stuff (the Democrat platform).

Straw Man.

No....that's the truth of the situation we now face. obama is creating more of the "underclass" so that dems keep getting voted into office. If people can get free anything, no matter what it is, they will vote to get their free shit. End of story. To say this is a Straw Man argument is idiotic at best. It's obvious that's what's occurring in this country.

 

[Sallow]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

It's not "millions". It's 1%.

Folks like Mitt "Bain Capital" Romney, Dick "Buh Bye Lehman" Fuld, John "Check These Mortgage Backed Securities Out" Thain..and a whole host of obscenely wealthy folks that absolutely enjoy fleecing people like yourself.

 

[Inthemiddle]

You are effective making the argument that people should be allowed to vote themselves money.

Hard to imagine how any Nation could survive that once the underclass is encouraged to do that in exchange for free gubmint stuff (the Democrat platform).

Straw Man.

No....that's the truth of the situation we now face. obama is creating more of the "underclass" so that dems keep getting voted into office. If people can get free anything, no matter what it is, they will vote to get their free shit. End of story. To say this is a Straw Man argument is idiotic at best. It's obvious that's what's occurring in this country.

Let's put the ideological pant-shitting aside for a moment.

Let's compare this to ecology. Let's assume for a moment that we really do have a case in our country of one class effectively preying off a second class. Liberals will say it's the rich feeding off the poor, conservatives will say its the poor feeding off the rich, both sides will mostly agree that both groups are themselves feeding off the middle class in some way or another. In any event, which ever way that you view it happening, a fundamental food chain is established.

Now, what happens when the coyotes eat too many rabbits and there aren't enough rabbits to feed everyone anymore? Well it's simple--coyotes start dying off when they can't get enough food. What happens then? Again, it's simple--rabbits start rebounding because there are fewer predators killing them. Probably, they'll reach a point of over population. What happens third? The coyotes start bouncing back because they have ample food supplies, and establish a more sustainable balance than existed before.

So, even if we were to entertain this doom-and-gloom argument that the "welfare queens" are going to swell in numbers like rampant parasites, it's pretty silly to expect it to be some kind of zombie apocalypse that will destroy the country. Bases on such an argument, we should already expect a cyclic fluctuation to go back and forth.

 

[JakeStarkey]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

The OP is not worthy, in my opinion. Citizens get to vote, period. Taxes have nothing to do with it, all of which was decided far more than 100 years ago. The end game, if the proponents of it had their way, would be that those who pay the most taxes would have the most votes. That won't happen.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

When Socrates and his friends were talking of voters, they were talking of land owners. In today’s terms, that means, ---- taxpayer. The core of democracy.

There are two types of citizens. The taxpayer and the taxtaker.

Once the taxpayer hands over his wealth, he loses control of where it is spent.

This is counter to the taxpayer’s wishes.

Why do taxpayers allow this situation and defer their right to spend their wealth to others?

If taxtakers had done a good job with that wealth, I do not think any would complain. That is not the case.

Should those who pay the way of our society be the ones who decide where our wealth is spent?

Since the right to do so is tied to our vote, should only taxpayers be allowed to vote on spending issues?

Regards
DL

In a perfect world, yes. We live in an imperfect world. Case closed.
The vote allows each adult over the age of 18 as long as one is a citizen and of sound mind and good character( not a convicted felon) the unique opportunity to use the voting place to make his or her voice heard. It's not a perfect system, but I view it as the best in the world.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Should only taxpayers be allowed to vote?

When Socrates and his friends were talking of voters, they were talking of land owners. In today’s terms, that means, ---- taxpayer. The core of democracy.

There are two types of citizens. The taxpayer and the taxtaker.

Once the taxpayer hands over his wealth, he loses control of where it is spent.

This is counter to the taxpayer’s wishes.

Why do taxpayers allow this situation and defer their right to spend their wealth to others?

If taxtakers had done a good job with that wealth, I do not think any would complain. That is not the case.

Should those who pay the way of our society be the ones who decide where our wealth is spent?

Since the right to do so is tied to our vote, should only taxpayers be allowed to vote on spending issues?

Regards
DL

In a perfect world, yes. We live in an imperfect world. Case closed.
The vote allows each adult over the age of 18 as long as one is a citizen and of sound mind and good character( not a convicted felon) the unique opportunity to use the voting place to make his or her voice heard. It's not a perfect system, but I view it as the best in the world.

Just so.

 

[gwennie]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

It's not "millions". It's 1%.

Folks like Mitt "Bain Capital" Romney, Dick "Buh Bye Lehman" Fuld, John "Check These Mortgage Backed Securities Out" Thain..and a whole host of obscenely wealthy folks that absolutely enjoy fleecing people like yourself.

It's far more than 1%....stop lying your ass off. Take your conservative hate somewhere else.....

 

[gwennie]

Straw Man.

No....that's the truth of the situation we now face. obama is creating more of the "underclass" so that dems keep getting voted into office. If people can get free anything, no matter what it is, they will vote to get their free shit. End of story. To say this is a Straw Man argument is idiotic at best. It's obvious that's what's occurring in this country.

Let's put the ideological pant-shitting aside for a moment.

Let's compare this to ecology. Let's assume for a moment that we really do have a case in our country of one class effectively preying off a second class. Liberals will say it's the rich feeding off the poor, conservatives will say its the poor feeding off the rich, both sides will mostly agree that both groups are themselves feeding off the middle class in some way or another. In any event, which ever way that you view it happening, a fundamental food chain is established.

Now, what happens when the coyotes eat too many rabbits and there aren't enough rabbits to feed everyone anymore? Well it's simple--coyotes start dying off when they can't get enough food. What happens then? Again, it's simple--rabbits start rebounding because there are fewer predators killing them. Probably, they'll reach a point of over population. What happens third? The coyotes start bouncing back because they have ample food supplies, and establish a more sustainable balance than existed before.

So, even if we were to entertain this doom-and-gloom argument that the "welfare queens" are going to swell in numbers like rampant parasites, it's pretty silly to expect it to be some kind of zombie apocalypse that will destroy the country. Bases on such an argument, we should already expect a cyclic fluctuation to go back and forth.

There's a lot of truth in what you say....the problem is, though, is that we need to fix it so that there is a relative balance of rabbits and coyotes. The liberals have no interest in that because they see it all as the coyotes deliberately kill off the rabbits because they love to watch them die vs the conservatives who, at least partly, want to see the rabbits caged in order to maintain the coyotes ability to maintain the status quo of "top dog" status. There are ways to fix this, but it will require liberals to stop constantly demonizing people who make a lot of money to accomplish it. It's a nonsense argument anyway, seeing as how the liberals surround themselves with wealthy individuals anyway.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

It's not "millions". It's 1%.

Folks like Mitt "Bain Capital" Romney, Dick "Buh Bye Lehman" Fuld, John "Check These Mortgage Backed Securities Out" Thain..and a whole host of obscenely wealthy folks that absolutely enjoy fleecing people like yourself.

It's far more than 1%....stop lying your ass off. Take your conservative hate somewhere else.....

Many from all sides cheat the government. Gwennie, Sallow is not a conservative. And I have seen "conservatives" here write far, far worse.

 

[gwennie]

These threads are always so pathetic. The desire to disinfranchise Americans is a desire to control the government by limiting whose voice is heard, a very totalitarian desire.

Btw- everyone pays taxes.

Dumbass.

Depends on what you mean by paying taxes.....do you mean that a person pays taxes via working a job and paying payroll taxes or buying cigarettes and liquor paying taxes??? Those are two different types of taxes, one of which is often used by those who cheat the system for years and years. This thread is not pathetic.....it's being used to determine "public" opinion about who should be allowed to vote, seeing as how those of us who pay taxes via work are often the ones who bear the burden of paying for those who deliberately refuse to pay their own way because it's easier to rely on the govt. That's not everyone....veterans, children, disabled, SS..those people are not included in the "cheaters" club. Get off your soapbox and put your head in reality....fact is, millions of people cheat the govt and take money away from those who really need it. The OP is not a dumbass at all.

The OP is not worthy, in my opinion. Citizens get to vote, period. Taxes have nothing to do with it, all of which was decided far more than 100 years ago. The end game, if the proponents of it had their way, would be that those who pay the most taxes would have the most votes. That won't happen.

The question wasn't whether they would have the most votes, but rather who gets to vote at all. Trust me, if the govt comes to take 75% of your paycheck to provide for people who refuse to take any personal responsibility, then you WILL scream your head off about it. No one should have to pay for people who refuse to take personal responsibility for themselves. There is no excuse for that.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The OP was settled long ago: all citizens get to vote regardless. No one is coming to take 75% of your pay check for anything. I agree that reform in entitlements is always a necessary mandate.

 

[gwennie]

It's not "millions". It's 1%.

Folks like Mitt "Bain Capital" Romney, Dick "Buh Bye Lehman" Fuld, John "Check These Mortgage Backed Securities Out" Thain..and a whole host of obscenely wealthy folks that absolutely enjoy fleecing people like yourself.

It's far more than 1%....stop lying your ass off. Take your conservative hate somewhere else.....

Many from all sides cheat the government. Gwennie, Sallow is not a conservative. And I have seen "conservatives" here write far, far worse.

I know he's not a conservative. What I mean was that Sallow vents his spleen against anyone who has conservative values, therefore, he can take his hate for conservatives elsewhere. See what I mean?

 

[gwennie]

The OP was settled long ago: all citizens get to vote regardless. No one is coming to take 75% of your pay check for anything. I agree that reform in entitlements is always a necessary mandate.

If obama and the libs have their way, they WILL take 75% of a wealthy person's money and use for their liberal govt purposes. It's in the works. Of course, obama will make concessions for his donors and create loopholes so that THEY don't have to pay the 75% tax. He's already done that with the Hollywood elites. 75% is a made up number right now, but it will come down the pipeline if liberal dems stay in office.