salem witch trials

[koshergrl]

The salem witch trials were about government interference in people's lives, including their faith.

That's what happens when you allow the state to dictate what is properly religious, and what isn't.

Actually the gummint is what stopped it.

Yes, when they quit doing it.

 

[koshergrl]

"All three women were brought before the local magistrates and interrogated for several days..."
"The questioning got more serious in April when Deputy Governor Thomas Danforth and his assistants attended the hearings...."
"On May 27, 1692, Governor William Phipps ordered the establishment of a Special Court of Oyer (to hear) and Terminer (to decide) for Suffolk, Essex and Middlesex counties."

And it was a CHRISTIAN who begged them to stop. Sound familiar?

"Five days later, respected minister Cotton Mather wrote a letter imploring the court not to allow spectral evidence—testimony about dreams and visions. The court largely ignored this request and five people were sentenced and hanged in July, five more in August and eight in September. On October 3, following in his son's footsteps, Increase Mather, then president of Harvard, denounced the use of spectral evidence: "It were better that ten suspected witches should escape than one innocent person be condemned."


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[The Great Goose]

In January 1692, three young girls began having “fits”—they would scream, mutter strange sounds, bark like dogs when addressed, become unable to concentrate on tasks given, and contort themselves into “impossible” positions. This began occurring after the girls started experimenting with fortune telling to try to figure out how their lives would end up and what their husbands would do for a living. (This sort of thing was quite common at the time, such as one tradition using mistletoe put under one’s pillow at night and then burned the next day.)

One of the girls was Reverend Parris’ daughter, Betty Paris (9 years old), and another was his niece, Abigail Williams (11 years old). The third was Ann Putnam (12 years old), a member of one of the powerful families involved in the family feud going on in the region.

When prayer didn’t fix the problem, the Reverend called in a doctor who was unable to explain what was causing the fits. He declared that something supernatural was affecting the girls. In February, the victims of the “devil’s work” confessed to a judge that three women were responsible for giving them fits: Sarah Osborne, Sarah Good, and Tituba, the Parris’ slave.

The women were interrogated, but only Tituba confessed to the crime. All three were later put in prison—not burned at the stake.

Even though the three suspected witches were put away, the people of Salem became paranoid. In a fit of mass hysteria- and probably a dash of simply taking advantage of the situation to get rid of enemies- fingers were being pointed at supposed witches left and right, even for the mildest of offenses. When the hunt ended, some 200 people had been accused of witchcraft. However, only 20 people were executed.

The first to be formally executed was Bridget Bishop. She was perceived as a promiscuous woman and a gossip. (Clearly, she must be a witch!) Though she pleaded innocent, the Special Court of Oyer and Terminer—the court set up to deal with the witch trials—found her guilty. On June 10, 1692 she was hanged on what would become known as Gallows Hill.

Eighteen more women followed in Bishop’s footsteps, swinging on Gallows Hill. Additionally, one elderly man named Giles Corey was pressed to death by heavy stones. Many more people were tried and sent to prison, and several of them died while incarcerated, including Sarah Osborne, one of the first “witches” convicted.

No Witches Were Burned During the Salem Witch Trials




...As for the original little girls who started the whole thing, one of them, Ann Putnam, later apologized in 1706, stating:

" I desire to be humbled before God for that sad and humbling providence that befell my father’s family in the year about ninety-two; that I, then being in my childhood, should, by such a providence of God, be made an instrument for the accusing of several people for grievous crimes, whereby their lives was taken away from them, whom, now I have just grounds and good reason to believe they were innocent persons; and that it was a great delusion of Satan that deceived me in that sad time, whereby I justly fear I have been instrumental, with others, though ignorantly and unwittingly, to bring upon myself and this land the guilt of innocent blood; though, what was said or done by me against any person, I can truly and uprightly say, before God and man, I did it not out of any anger, malice, or ill will to any person, for I had no such thing against one of them; but what I did was ignorantly, being deluded by Satan.

And particularly, as I was a chief instrument of accusing Goodwife Nurse and her two sisters, I desire to lie in the dust, and to be humble for it, in that I was a cause, with others, of so sad a calamity to them and their families; for which cause I desire to lie in the dust, and earnestly beg forgiveness of God, and from all those unto whom I have given just cause of sorrow and offense, whose relations were taken away or accused."


Riiiight. So it's God's and Satan's fault now?

Yo,

"GTP"
View attachment 72998

Whats GTP?

No ones ever accused me of lacking courage mate.

or of making sense.

The article shows a period in history where finger pointing and lying leads to a communist like environment of executions by gossip.

you seem to be taking the article as a personal attack.

"Communist"?

Are you snorting cleaning products?

Mob mentality and zealotry have no relationship to "communism" or any other economic structure.

None.

Zero.

Bupkis.

Ok.

 

[idb]

"All three women were brought before the local magistrates and interrogated for several days..."
"The questioning got more serious in April when Deputy Governor Thomas Danforth and his assistants attended the hearings...."
"On May 27, 1692, Governor William Phipps ordered the establishment of a Special Court of Oyer (to hear) and Terminer (to decide) for Suffolk, Essex and Middlesex counties."

And it was a CHRISTIAN who begged them to stop. Sound familiar?

"Five days later, respected minister Cotton Mather wrote a letter imploring the court not to allow spectral evidence—testimony about dreams and visions. The court largely ignored this request and five people were sentenced and hanged in July, five more in August and eight in September. On October 3, following in his son's footsteps, Increase Mather, then president of Harvard, denounced the use of spectral evidence: "It were better that ten suspected witches should escape than one innocent person be condemned."


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Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

It yet again shows the importance of keeping Church and State separated.

 

[koshergrl]

"Governor Phipps, in response to Mather's plea and his own wife being questioned for witchcraft, prohibited further arrests, released many accused witches and dissolved the Court of Oyer and Terminer on October 29. Phipps replaced it with a Superior Court of Judicature, which disallowed spectral evidence and only condemned 3 out of 56 defendants. Phipps eventually pardoned all who were in prison on witchcraft charges by May 1693. But the damage had been done: 19 were hanged on Gallows Hill, a 71-year-old man was pressed to death with heavy stones, several people died in jail and nearly 200 people, overall, had been accused of practicing "the Devil's magic."

All because some pompous assholes thought they had the right to tell people how to practice their faith.

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[koshergrl]

"All three women were brought before the local magistrates and interrogated for several days..."
"The questioning got more serious in April when Deputy Governor Thomas Danforth and his assistants attended the hearings...."
"On May 27, 1692, Governor William Phipps ordered the establishment of a Special Court of Oyer (to hear) and Terminer (to decide) for Suffolk, Essex and Middlesex counties."

And it was a CHRISTIAN who begged them to stop. Sound familiar?

"Five days later, respected minister Cotton Mather wrote a letter imploring the court not to allow spectral evidence—testimony about dreams and visions. The court largely ignored this request and five people were sentenced and hanged in July, five more in August and eight in September. On October 3, following in his son's footsteps, Increase Mather, then president of Harvard, denounced the use of spectral evidence: "It were better that ten suspected witches should escape than one innocent person be condemned."


Read more: History, Travel, Arts, Science, People, Places | Smithsonian
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! Give the gift of Smithsonian
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

It yet again shows the importance of keeping Church and State separated.

The church had nothing to do with it. The church had absolutely no authority to try or execute people.

 

[Dhara]

In January 1692, three young girls began having “fits”—they would scream, mutter strange sounds, bark like dogs when addressed, become unable to concentrate on tasks given, and contort themselves into “impossible” positions. This began occurring after the girls started experimenting with fortune telling to try to figure out how their lives would end up and what their husbands would do for a living. (This sort of thing was quite common at the time, such as one tradition using mistletoe put under one’s pillow at night and then burned the next day.)

One of the girls was Reverend Parris’ daughter, Betty Paris (9 years old), and another was his niece, Abigail Williams (11 years old). The third was Ann Putnam (12 years old), a member of one of the powerful families involved in the family feud going on in the region.

When prayer didn’t fix the problem, the Reverend called in a doctor who was unable to explain what was causing the fits. He declared that something supernatural was affecting the girls. In February, the victims of the “devil’s work” confessed to a judge that three women were responsible for giving them fits: Sarah Osborne, Sarah Good, and Tituba, the Parris’ slave.

The women were interrogated, but only Tituba confessed to the crime. All three were later put in prison—not burned at the stake.

Even though the three suspected witches were put away, the people of Salem became paranoid. In a fit of mass hysteria- and probably a dash of simply taking advantage of the situation to get rid of enemies- fingers were being pointed at supposed witches left and right, even for the mildest of offenses. When the hunt ended, some 200 people had been accused of witchcraft. However, only 20 people were executed.

The first to be formally executed was Bridget Bishop. She was perceived as a promiscuous woman and a gossip. (Clearly, she must be a witch!) Though she pleaded innocent, the Special Court of Oyer and Terminer—the court set up to deal with the witch trials—found her guilty. On June 10, 1692 she was hanged on what would become known as Gallows Hill.

Eighteen more women followed in Bishop’s footsteps, swinging on Gallows Hill. Additionally, one elderly man named Giles Corey was pressed to death by heavy stones. Many more people were tried and sent to prison, and several of them died while incarcerated, including Sarah Osborne, one of the first “witches” convicted.

No Witches Were Burned During the Salem Witch Trials




...As for the original little girls who started the whole thing, one of them, Ann Putnam, later apologized in 1706, stating:

" I desire to be humbled before God for that sad and humbling providence that befell my father’s family in the year about ninety-two; that I, then being in my childhood, should, by such a providence of God, be made an instrument for the accusing of several people for grievous crimes, whereby their lives was taken away from them, whom, now I have just grounds and good reason to believe they were innocent persons; and that it was a great delusion of Satan that deceived me in that sad time, whereby I justly fear I have been instrumental, with others, though ignorantly and unwittingly, to bring upon myself and this land the guilt of innocent blood; though, what was said or done by me against any person, I can truly and uprightly say, before God and man, I did it not out of any anger, malice, or ill will to any person, for I had no such thing against one of them; but what I did was ignorantly, being deluded by Satan.

And particularly, as I was a chief instrument of accusing Goodwife Nurse and her two sisters, I desire to lie in the dust, and to be humble for it, in that I was a cause, with others, of so sad a calamity to them and their families; for which cause I desire to lie in the dust, and earnestly beg forgiveness of God, and from all those unto whom I have given just cause of sorrow and offense, whose relations were taken away or accused."


Riiiight. So it's God's and Satan's fault now?

Yo,

"GTP"
View attachment 72998

Whats GTP?

No ones ever accused me of lacking courage mate.

or of making sense.

The article shows a period in history where finger pointing and lying leads to a communist like environment of executions by gossip.

you seem to be taking the article as a personal attack.

Me? I'm taking the article personally. I'm asking you what prompted you to think about the witch trials?

 

[The Great Goose]

poor dhara isnt in control of her desires it does seem....

Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out.

Looks to me like she was simply the first to get here to question a thread whose raison d'être is absolutely bizarro.

And why does this particular snippet from religious history affront you into rushing to her aid?

Actually I clicked on YOUR thread to see what it was about because I know a bit about it, and I had the exact same question but she got here first. Which as far as I can see never got answered anyway -- what brought this up? And my original question, also unaddressed was --- who claimed they were "burned"? What's with all the strawmen?

In the immediate post I responded, again, directly to YOUR post which read, and I quote,
"Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out."

Well no -- it ain't. It's as though you posted a complete non sequitur thread out of nowhere seemingly in answer to a claim nobody made, supposedly to make a point about "communism".

---- Which is utterly bizarre.

I never presented an argument. So how can their be a strawman?

As for my later post, if you are unable to see e similarities between communism and witchhunts then you don't want to see.

Great Purge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

communism cant go any other way. It starts with allocating blame and dealing death and it continues that way. It's identical in it's histeria to a witch hunt. Neighbours acuse neighbours because of existing grudges etc as in the article in the OP.

 

[Meriweather]

The salem witch trials were about government interference in people's lives, including their faith.

That's what happens when you allow the state to dictate what is properly religious, and what isn't.

I didn't get that impression when doing my own research. Two of the girls were eleven and twelve when all this started. Some accounts say the girls were caught up and reveled in the attention they were getting. Important people were paying attention to them. At this time, one of my ancestors was married to Sarah Towne Cloyce, sister of Rebecca Nurse and Mary Easty. Rebecca and Mary were hanged. Peter Cloyce was able to have his wife, Sarah, imprisoned in Boston. Of course, when she was not convicted, he also had to pay prison fees to have her released. Peter, himself, was investigated when he didn't show up for a communion service. They gave him a pass when they learned he was in Boston visiting his imprisoned wife.

Another interesting bygone fact: When her case was not proven, it was (as all unproven cases were in those days) marked Ignoramus. It should also be clear that Reverend Mather, himself, spoke against anyone being convicted on "Spectral" evidence.

Fast forward to our time. The accusations of our time were about improper touching and fondling of young girls by older men. Three girls at the school where I worked most often in those years, thought it would be a lark to accuse a male teacher of this. Quite an uproar ensued until I overheard the girls giggling about how they had made it all up and who they were going to target next.

In our time as well, we saw a great spike of legal cases rise from "Repressed Memories" which often turned out to be "False Memories" of sexual abuse.

Anyway....a very long way of saying that the (perhaps other than Rev. Parris) the religious and government officials took just as seriously the girls reports then as officials in our time took reports of sexual abuse/fondling and repressed memories.

 

[Dhara]

I'm wondering if you have any current interest that causes you to think about the Salem witch trials?

The history doesn't fit your world view eh?

Weird, isn't it? Now he's saying I'm taking the OP personallly?

 

[Meriweather]

The Salem witch trials were an example of basic human hysteria, paranoia and groupthink. It wasn't new then and it sure as hell hasn't stopped now. To many examples to list.

Accurate, and well stated. Thank you.

 

[The Great Goose]

The salem witch trials were about government interference in people's lives, including their faith.

That's what happens when you allow the state to dictate what is properly religious, and what isn't.

Actually the gummint is what stopped it.

The authorities perhaps, may have been a better choice of words.

Why are you so pedantic today?

 

[The Great Goose]

I'm wondering if you have any current interest that causes you to think about the Salem witch trials?

The history doesn't fit your world view eh?

Weird, isn't it? Now he's saying I'm taking the OP personallly?

Im a woman, you race trading homosexual.

 

[Pogo]

poor dhara isnt in control of her desires it does seem....

Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out.

Looks to me like she was simply the first to get here to question a thread whose raison d'être is absolutely bizarro.

And why does this particular snippet from religious history affront you into rushing to her aid?

Actually I clicked on YOUR thread to see what it was about because I know a bit about it, and I had the exact same question but she got here first. Which as far as I can see never got answered anyway -- what brought this up? And my original question, also unaddressed was --- who claimed they were "burned"? What's with all the strawmen?

In the immediate post I responded, again, directly to YOUR post which read, and I quote,
"Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out."

Well no -- it ain't. It's as though you posted a complete non sequitur thread out of nowhere seemingly in answer to a claim nobody made, supposedly to make a point about "communism".

---- Which is utterly bizarre.

I never presented an argument. So how can their be a strawman?

As for my later post, if you are unable to see e similarities between communism and witchhunts then you don't want to see.

Great Purge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

communism cant go any other way. It starts with allocating blame and dealing death and it continues that way. It's identical in it's histeria to a witch hunt. Neighbours acuse neighbours because of existing grudges etc as in the article in the OP.

That shit has nothing to do with "communism". It may have to do with despotism but that's not an economic system.

If you never presented an argument ----- exactly WHO are you contradicting in making the point that the murdered were not burned? WHO claimed they were burned? WHO?

 

[The Great Goose]

Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out.

Looks to me like she was simply the first to get here to question a thread whose raison d'être is absolutely bizarro.

And why does this particular snippet from religious history affront you into rushing to her aid?

Actually I clicked on YOUR thread to see what it was about because I know a bit about it, and I had the exact same question but she got here first. Which as far as I can see never got answered anyway -- what brought this up? And my original question, also unaddressed was --- who claimed they were "burned"? What's with all the strawmen?

In the immediate post I responded, again, directly to YOUR post which read, and I quote,
"Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out."

Well no -- it ain't. It's as though you posted a complete non sequitur thread out of nowhere seemingly in answer to a claim nobody made, supposedly to make a point about "communism".

---- Which is utterly bizarre.

I never presented an argument. So how can their be a strawman?

As for my later post, if you are unable to see e similarities between communism and witchhunts then you don't want to see.

Great Purge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

communism cant go any other way. It starts with allocating blame and dealing death and it continues that way. It's identical in it's histeria to a witch hunt. Neighbours acuse neighbours because of existing grudges etc as in the article in the OP.

That shit has nothing to do with "communism". It may have to do with despotism but that's not an economic system.

If you never presented an argument ----- exactly WHO are you contradicting in making the point that the murdered were not burned? WHO claimed they were burned? WHO?

Communism is not an economic system, its a revolution system and it works by scapegoating and witch hunting. Thats all it is.

 

[Pogo]

The salem witch trials were about government interference in people's lives, including their faith.

That's what happens when you allow the state to dictate what is properly religious, and what isn't.

Actually the gummint is what stopped it.

The authorities perhaps, may have been a better choice of words.

Why are you so pedantic today?

When somebody posts the direct opposite of history --- I correct it.

So sue me.

 

[Pogo]

Looks to me like she was simply the first to get here to question a thread whose raison d'être is absolutely bizarro.

And why does this particular snippet from religious history affront you into rushing to her aid?

Actually I clicked on YOUR thread to see what it was about because I know a bit about it, and I had the exact same question but she got here first. Which as far as I can see never got answered anyway -- what brought this up? And my original question, also unaddressed was --- who claimed they were "burned"? What's with all the strawmen?

In the immediate post I responded, again, directly to YOUR post which read, and I quote,
"Its as though the Op was addressed to her and about her, the way she's freaking out."

Well no -- it ain't. It's as though you posted a complete non sequitur thread out of nowhere seemingly in answer to a claim nobody made, supposedly to make a point about "communism".

---- Which is utterly bizarre.

I never presented an argument. So how can their be a strawman?

As for my later post, if you are unable to see e similarities between communism and witchhunts then you don't want to see.

Great Purge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

communism cant go any other way. It starts with allocating blame and dealing death and it continues that way. It's identical in it's histeria to a witch hunt. Neighbours acuse neighbours because of existing grudges etc as in the article in the OP.

That shit has nothing to do with "communism". It may have to do with despotism but that's not an economic system.

If you never presented an argument ----- exactly WHO are you contradicting in making the point that the murdered were not burned? WHO claimed they were burned? WHO?

Communism is not an economic system, its a revolution system and it works by scapegoating and witch hunting. Thats all it is.

Bullshit. You clearly have no clue what you're babbling about.

 

[Dhara]

I'm wondering if you have any current interest that causes you to think about the Salem witch trials?

The history doesn't fit your world view eh?

Weird, isn't it? Now he's saying I'm taking the OP personallly?

Im a woman, you race trading homosexual.

Who cares if you're a woman or I'm gay? YOu're off topic on your own thread.

 

[idb]

This would have to be one of the strangest threads I've ever been in.
It must be the witches.

 

[Tilly]

I'm wondering if you have any current interest that causes you to think about the Salem witch trials?

The history doesn't fit your world view eh?

I didn't say that, did I?

You asked a question. So how about giving an opinion about the exponential harm caused by these people's lies?

I have an opinion about harm caused by lies, in general, but it has nothing to do with "the devil".

Why are you interested in the witch trials in Salem. I thought it was caused by moldy bread.

Ergotamine in rye.