CDZ Rio Olympics...Didn't we know seven years ago the choice of Rio was sure to be a pratfall?

[320 Years of History]

Rio is a lot of fun to visit, but it's not a place ready to warmly receive the quantities of people an Olympic event draws.

• Violence runs rampant in Rio's non-affluent areas. The police don't even go there, and worse, those parts of the city have the geographical advantage: they occupy the high ground.
• The bay is filthy. Officials have noted that "the part" of the bay where the competitions will occur are the cleanest parts. That's no comfort. The water in my toilet bowl is the cleanest one will find in any waste disposal plumbing system, but I don't want to drink it or swim in it. Plus, it's water. What happens to "stuff" in water? If you don't know, fill your bathtub with water, then drop in some food coloring at one end. Stir once to create a current and wait.
  
  It's no different with the water in Rio's Guanabara Bay. Watch the news and you'll see "islands" of floating refuse. Why? Because the currents in the bay work such that the water holds stuff in the bay rather than washing it out to the ocean.
• The national government is little but an elected crime syndicate comprised of officials whose sole redeeming value that they know they're essentially a conspiratorial cabal of white collar criminals who cop to being so. I guess that's something....It's at least better than their knowing it (or worse, not knowing it) and denying it. LOL
• Then there's Zika. Now I'm not terribly concerned about Zika in and of itself. It's a relatively innocuous virus. That said, It's the Summer Olympics we're talking about. The last thing the world needs is literally thousands of attractive, scantily clad and perpetually horny young adults running about in a Zika prone region. And that's just considering the athletes and other visitors to the region. Never mind that the place has plenty of topless/nude beaches and the indigenous population is, in the main, good looking and fit (maybe not "6-pack" fit, but two or four pack with no flab is quite common, especially in places frequented by young people). Short of deliberately aiming to do so, I can't think of a better way to rapidly spread a sexually transmitted virus.

Based on the above, should the U.S. abstain from the 2016 Summer Olympics?

 

[Two Thumbs]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

 

[LenKeis]

The article states a few of the obvious reasons why Brazil is a third world hell hole. Its choice to host summer Olympic event was by design to show the future America and other affluent western nations.

Brazilian style criminality WILL be coming to a neighborhood near you. Are you ready?

 

[320 Years of History]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

Okay...read this and tell me if you still have the same view.

• Exponential Outbreaks: The Mathematics of Epidemics
  
• Mathematical modelling of infectious diseases
  
• MATHEMATICAL MODELS OF EMERGENT AND RE-EMERGENT INFECTIOUS DISEASES: ASSESSING THE EFFECTS OF PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS ON DISEASE SPREAD (This one is longish for a paper..I think you can get the gist of what's relevant for this thread's by scanning the summaries of the various epidemics and examining the graphs provided for them. The stuff after that is the writer's postulate for a new measurement model.)

 

[Two Thumbs]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

Okay...read this and tell me if you still have the same view.

• Exponential Outbreaks: The Mathematics of Epidemics
  
• Mathematical modelling of infectious diseases
  
• MATHEMATICAL MODELS OF EMERGENT AND RE-EMERGENT INFECTIOUS DISEASES: ASSESSING THE EFFECTS OF PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS ON DISEASE SPREAD (This one is longish for a paper..I think you can get the gist of what's relevant for this thread's by scanning the summaries of the various epidemics and examining the graphs provided for them. The stuff after that is the writer's postulate for a new measurement model.)

I believe in freedom you believe in safe zones.

You should have said something 7 years ago

 

[waltky]

Yea...

... but when ya got visions o'...

... the girl from Ipanema waftin' thru yer head...

... whadaya thinks gonna happen?

 

[320 Years of History]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

Okay...read this and tell me if you still have the same view.

• Exponential Outbreaks: The Mathematics of Epidemics
  
• Mathematical modelling of infectious diseases
  
• MATHEMATICAL MODELS OF EMERGENT AND RE-EMERGENT INFECTIOUS DISEASES: ASSESSING THE EFFECTS OF PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS ON DISEASE SPREAD (This one is longish for a paper..I think you can get the gist of what's relevant for this thread's by scanning the summaries of the various epidemics and examining the graphs provided for them. The stuff after that is the writer's postulate for a new measurement model.)

I believe in freedom you believe in safe zones.

You should have said something 7 years ago

By no means would I deny you the freedom to leave "the safe zone."

Just keep in mind that if you were to do so, I'd require you to get a health check to get past Immigration and Customs, "safe zone" citizen or not, although I'm fine with placing you in quarantine until the risk you pose to the rest of us "safe zone" residents. (Of course, I'd also tell you, before you depart "the safe zone," what you should expect as go the health tests you must pass upon your attempt to reenter "the safe zone."....that is, assuming you survive the journey.)

Truly, I don't so much as give a tinker's dam about your taking the risk. I just don't want you coming back and having the potential to contribute to the emergence/spread of something that is, for all intents and purposes, a non-issue in "the safe zone."

In thinking about the matter, I could overlook that, as a terrorist's potential target, the Olympics are sui generis. Thus I, for myself, concluded that this will be an Olympics I will forgo, and for one main reason: the comedy of errors that currently is Brazil's daytime soap opera of a government doesn't seem to me one that is well prepared to protect Olympics inspired visitors from terrorism, and the Olympics are surely a prime target. It's not as though highly motivated terrorists haven't attacked Olympic athletes before.

• The quick and dirty of the Munich Olympics massacre
• A detailed examination of the events and their aftermath

As a mere observer and someone not remotely concerned about Zika, the nefarious denizens from the impoverished areas, or the filthy bay water, but for the terrorism risk, I'd go. I've been to Rio a few times. I swim in pools and don't make myself an easy or likely target. But I'm also not a naive teen or 20-something athlete with raging hormones, an innate, inviolable and "infallible" sense of invulnerability, and who has time on my hands (as will be the case once their competitions have happened) to explore the great fun that truly is Rio.

(FWIW, I don't at all worry about terrorism, except when it makes sense to do so, and the Rio Olympics strike me as such an occasion. I'd move out of the city center of D.C. if I were genuinely concerned about being a victim of terrorism. Were the competition being held in a place that seems like it's got its ducks in a row, I wouldn't hesitate to go there and have a good time.)

 

[candycorn]

The olympic idea is pretty much dead. So too should be the idea that it needs to be “awarded” to cities that cannot financially or logistically support the undertaking.

Whereas it was once amateur athletes competing on the levelest of playing fields, professional level (if not professional by definition) athletes began taking part for nothing other than self or national enrichment. One can draw a crooked parallel to the cities who vie for hosting the event. Seldom does the athletics infrastructure fit neatly into the society once the games are gone. Even more rarely does the financial costs fit into the bottom lines of the host cities. Cultures who are sports obsessed have easier times with this than those who are no so infected with the “we gotta be #1” virus. Atlanta in 1996—the last American City to host the Summer Games, did an admirable job of using existing venues then transforming them once the crowds were gone. The Olympic Stadium became Turner Field, for example and Fulton County Stadium which was used for some soccer training and athletics training was razed like a year after the games. Juxtaposed to Beijing who’s olympic centerpiece lays in ruins.

That is one of the nicer pictures!!!

I understand what you’re saying. RIO can be a bad place but all large cities have ghettoes and as a result, you can find examples of excess through-out the Olympics since only large cities attract the Games these days. But in the 2-4 week period, they are usually the best examples of modern cities. Then they go to hell.

My question is this; why keep this nutty rotation on-going when it is clear that few cities can withstand the 8-12 thousand athletes, 3x the number of coaches, media, support staff, etc…, the traffic, the “need” for new construction etc.. Out side of money for the IOC?

I would propose a 5-8 city rotation. If you look at the bid LA has put in for the 2024 games, they make the point that the stadiums are already there or are on the books to be built; it can be all about the athletes.

LA 2024 | Los Angeles 2024 Olympic Bid

I imagine that there are 6-7 other cities similarly situated around the world where you have a coastline, multiple stadiums of multiple sizes, enough hotel and dormitory rooms to host athletes, etc…

Just rotate the games, take their bi-decade tributes and be done with it.

 

[Two Thumbs]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

Okay...read this and tell me if you still have the same view.

• Exponential Outbreaks: The Mathematics of Epidemics
  
• Mathematical modelling of infectious diseases
  
• MATHEMATICAL MODELS OF EMERGENT AND RE-EMERGENT INFECTIOUS DISEASES: ASSESSING THE EFFECTS OF PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS ON DISEASE SPREAD (This one is longish for a paper..I think you can get the gist of what's relevant for this thread's by scanning the summaries of the various epidemics and examining the graphs provided for them. The stuff after that is the writer's postulate for a new measurement model.)

I believe in freedom you believe in safe zones.

You should have said something 7 years ago

By no means would I deny you the freedom to leave "the safe zone."

Just keep in mind that if you were to do so, I'd require you to get a health check to get past Immigration and Customs, "safe zone" citizen or not, although I'm fine with placing you in quarantine until the risk you pose to the rest of us "safe zone" residents. (Of course, I'd also tell you, before you depart "the safe zone," what you should expect as go the health tests you must pass upon your attempt to reenter "the safe zone."....that is, assuming you survive the journey.)

Truly, I don't so much as give a tinker's dam about your taking the risk. I just don't want you coming back and having the potential to contribute to the emergence/spread of something that is, for all intents and purposes, a non-issue in "the safe zone."

In thinking about the matter, I could overlook that, as a terrorist's potential target, the Olympics are sui generis. Thus I, for myself, concluded that this will be an Olympics I will forgo, and for one main reason: the comedy of errors that currently is Brazil's daytime soap opera of a government doesn't seem to me one that is well prepared to protect Olympics inspired visitors from terrorism, and the Olympics are surely a prime target. It's not as though highly motivated terrorists haven't attacked Olympic athletes before.

• The quick and dirty of the Munich Olympics massacre
• A detailed examination of the events and their aftermath

As a mere observer and someone not remotely concerned about Zika, the nefarious denizens from the impoverished areas, or the filthy bay water, but for the terrorism risk, I'd go. I've been to Rio a few times. I swim in pools and don't make myself an easy or likely target. But I'm also not a naive teen or 20-something athlete with raging hormones, an innate, inviolable and "infallible" sense of invulnerability, and who has time on my hands (as will be the case once their competitions have happened) to explore the great fun that truly is Rio.

(FWIW, I don't at all worry about terrorism, except when it makes sense to do so, and the Rio Olympics strike me as such an occasion. I'd move out of the city center of D.C. if I were genuinely concerned about being a victim of terrorism. Were the competition being held in a place that seems like it's got its ducks in a row, I wouldn't hesitate to go there and have a good time.)

That's as unamerican as it gets.

simply shocking that a person born in a free society would demand others jump through hoops for him, to re-enter the country.


news flash; people live in rio, there's not plague.

 

[Elvis Obama]

The Olympics have evolved way beyond their original concept, which was about amateur athletics and reviving the original Greek tradition. Now it's evolved into a bizarre struggle for international prestige. Some aspects of the modern games are simply dead. The idea of amateur athletics is dead. That's OK by me. Let's let the best athletes in the world compete. That was the real Greek tradition. No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount. This kind of contempt for the athlete's safety and comfort is found in all international competitions, like in the World Cup being sold to Qatar. It's 120 degrees on the pitch folks, and the heat waves are rising off the astroturf like flags of peace! Let's play football!

Zika. I've already seen doctors swearing it's all OK and others saying it's insane to risk it. Opinions! Everyone's got one, and it's usually for sale.

 

[320 Years of History]

No.

People spend their whole lives trying to be an Olympian, most only get one shot and then they are to old.


I know one of the swimmers. She sacrificed everything. Invites to party: comes, eats nothing, drinks water, leave 1 hour later. Boys; pfft, no time. Girls; pfft, no time. Socials, church, parades, normal kid stuff, no time.

eat, sleep, swim, repeat.

But we shouldn't allow her b/c something bad might happen.


Not allowing her would be the bad thing

Okay...read this and tell me if you still have the same view.

• Exponential Outbreaks: The Mathematics of Epidemics
  
• Mathematical modelling of infectious diseases
  
• MATHEMATICAL MODELS OF EMERGENT AND RE-EMERGENT INFECTIOUS DISEASES: ASSESSING THE EFFECTS OF PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS ON DISEASE SPREAD (This one is longish for a paper..I think you can get the gist of what's relevant for this thread's by scanning the summaries of the various epidemics and examining the graphs provided for them. The stuff after that is the writer's postulate for a new measurement model.)

I believe in freedom you believe in safe zones.

You should have said something 7 years ago

By no means would I deny you the freedom to leave "the safe zone."

Just keep in mind that if you were to do so, I'd require you to get a health check to get past Immigration and Customs, "safe zone" citizen or not, although I'm fine with placing you in quarantine until the risk you pose to the rest of us "safe zone" residents. (Of course, I'd also tell you, before you depart "the safe zone," what you should expect as go the health tests you must pass upon your attempt to reenter "the safe zone."....that is, assuming you survive the journey.)

Truly, I don't so much as give a tinker's dam about your taking the risk. I just don't want you coming back and having the potential to contribute to the emergence/spread of something that is, for all intents and purposes, a non-issue in "the safe zone."

In thinking about the matter, I could overlook that, as a terrorist's potential target, the Olympics are sui generis. Thus I, for myself, concluded that this will be an Olympics I will forgo, and for one main reason: the comedy of errors that currently is Brazil's daytime soap opera of a government doesn't seem to me one that is well prepared to protect Olympics inspired visitors from terrorism, and the Olympics are surely a prime target. It's not as though highly motivated terrorists haven't attacked Olympic athletes before.

• The quick and dirty of the Munich Olympics massacre
• A detailed examination of the events and their aftermath

As a mere observer and someone not remotely concerned about Zika, the nefarious denizens from the impoverished areas, or the filthy bay water, but for the terrorism risk, I'd go. I've been to Rio a few times. I swim in pools and don't make myself an easy or likely target. But I'm also not a naive teen or 20-something athlete with raging hormones, an innate, inviolable and "infallible" sense of invulnerability, and who has time on my hands (as will be the case once their competitions have happened) to explore the great fun that truly is Rio.

(FWIW, I don't at all worry about terrorism, except when it makes sense to do so, and the Rio Olympics strike me as such an occasion. I'd move out of the city center of D.C. if I were genuinely concerned about being a victim of terrorism. Were the competition being held in a place that seems like it's got its ducks in a row, I wouldn't hesitate to go there and have a good time.)

That's as unamerican as it gets.

simply shocking that a person born in a free society would demand others jump through hoops for him, to re-enter the country.


news flash; people live in rio, there's not plague.

Well, you can interpret what I wrote whatever way you want to inflame the discussion. The fact remains that legal, civil and political freedom does not force, require or even intimate that a nation offering those liberties behave with a tenor of blissful and insouciant ignorance with regard to known health risks taken by its citizens.

 

[320 Years of History]

No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount.

Off Topic:
There weren't most likely because it seems that in Ancient Greece, professional and amateur athletes competed synchronously and because it was common enough for competitors to do so for a sponsor.

There were no divisions in ancient sport between professionals and amateurs. Many athletes while not professionals nevertheless competed alongside them. However, because training generally produces a better athlete, professional athletes began to dominate the games.

Originally the prizes given for the winners of the athletic contests were very substantive, but eventually (and it is not clear when) only a crown of olive leaves was given to the victor. Although the official prize for victory in historic times was only a wreath, the cities to which the victors belonged gained great prestige from their winning and so would give great financial rewards to them. Often good athletes would hire themselves out to the highest bidder and so would come from "different" cities during different Olympiads.

Source: The Athletics of the Ancient Olympics: A Summary and Research Tool
​

I don't think the idea of amateur athletics is dead. I'm certain that the notion that Olympic competitors are amateur athletes and are never professional athletes is dead. Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

 

[Elvis Obama]

No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount.

Off Topic:
There weren't most likely because it seems that in Ancient Greece, professional and amateur athletes competed synchronously and because it was common enough for competitors to do so for a sponsor.

There were no divisions in ancient sport between professionals and amateurs. Many athletes while not professionals nevertheless competed alongside them. However, because training generally produces a better athlete, professional athletes began to dominate the games.

Originally the prizes given for the winners of the athletic contests were very substantive, but eventually (and it is not clear when) only a crown of olive leaves was given to the victor. Although the official prize for victory in historic times was only a wreath, the cities to which the victors belonged gained great prestige from their winning and so would give great financial rewards to them. Often good athletes would hire themselves out to the highest bidder and so would come from "different" cities during different Olympiads.

Source: The Athletics of the Ancient Olympics: A Summary and Research Tool
​

I don't think the idea of amateur athletics is dead. I'm certain that the notion that Olympic competitors are amateur athletes and are never professional athletes is dead. Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Yeah, that's an interesting argument, one which I have never been able to refute. The processes by which countries select for athletic talents and establish facilities for training those talents are arbitrary. They're based entirely on popularity. By the time the sport rises to the level of an Olympic sport, certain countries have an almost insurmountable advantage. In order for other countries to catch up, the sport must be popularized in those countries. As charming as they may be, the Jamaican bobsled team is always going to have some pretty difficult barriers to success. Basketball in Eastern Europe, though. That's a success story. Giving these countries a chance to go up against a "Dream Team" can really provide a means to further popularize the sport and a real measure of how far they have come and how far they still have to go.

I'm not sure I comprehend the concept of amateur athletics, period. It's absurd to refer to athletes as amateur when countries run state-sponsored training programs and provide them with perks. It's absurd to have multi-billion dollar sports networks associated with colleges and universities, but concern ourselves only with making sure the athletes receive no compensation for a situation in which they are required to maintain a professional athlete's regimen.

 

[320 Years of History]

No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount.

Off Topic:
There weren't most likely because it seems that in Ancient Greece, professional and amateur athletes competed synchronously and because it was common enough for competitors to do so for a sponsor.

There were no divisions in ancient sport between professionals and amateurs. Many athletes while not professionals nevertheless competed alongside them. However, because training generally produces a better athlete, professional athletes began to dominate the games.

Originally the prizes given for the winners of the athletic contests were very substantive, but eventually (and it is not clear when) only a crown of olive leaves was given to the victor. Although the official prize for victory in historic times was only a wreath, the cities to which the victors belonged gained great prestige from their winning and so would give great financial rewards to them. Often good athletes would hire themselves out to the highest bidder and so would come from "different" cities during different Olympiads.

Source: The Athletics of the Ancient Olympics: A Summary and Research Tool
​

I don't think the idea of amateur athletics is dead. I'm certain that the notion that Olympic competitors are amateur athletes and are never professional athletes is dead. Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Yeah, that's an interesting argument, one which I have never been able to refute. The processes by which countries select for athletic talents and establish facilities for training those talents are arbitrary. They're based entirely on popularity. By the time the sport rises to the level of an Olympic sport, certain countries have an almost insurmountable advantage. In order for other countries to catch up, the sport must be popularized in those countries. As charming as they may be, the Jamaican bobsled team is always going to have some pretty difficult barriers to success. Basketball in Eastern Europe, though. That's a success story. Giving these countries a chance to go up against a "Dream Team" can really provide a means to further popularize the sport and a real measure of how far they have come and how far they still have to go.

I'm not sure I comprehend the concept of amateur athletics, period. It's absurd to refer to athletes as amateur when countries run state-sponsored training programs and provide them with perks. It's absurd to have multi-billion dollar sports networks associated with colleges and universities, but concern ourselves only with making sure the athletes receive no compensation for a situation in which they are required to maintain a professional athlete's regimen.

Quite frankly, if I really wanted to put amateurs up against pros, I'd go out looking for autistic kids/young adults who, through their mental "malady," are inherently better than basically everyone at precisely one thing and field them in individual events corresponding to their extreme proficiency. I don't know if there are such autistic folks around, but if there are, hell, go find them.

Frankly, and in addition, I think it'd be a good thing to include them in so-called mainstream events and activities instead of relegating them to the Special Olympics. Moreover, I'd combine the Special Olympics events with the "mainstream" ones. For many of them, all that really need be separated is the judging but not the actual performance of the competition(s).

 

[Elvis Obama]

No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount.

Off Topic:
There weren't most likely because it seems that in Ancient Greece, professional and amateur athletes competed synchronously and because it was common enough for competitors to do so for a sponsor.

There were no divisions in ancient sport between professionals and amateurs. Many athletes while not professionals nevertheless competed alongside them. However, because training generally produces a better athlete, professional athletes began to dominate the games.

Originally the prizes given for the winners of the athletic contests were very substantive, but eventually (and it is not clear when) only a crown of olive leaves was given to the victor. Although the official prize for victory in historic times was only a wreath, the cities to which the victors belonged gained great prestige from their winning and so would give great financial rewards to them. Often good athletes would hire themselves out to the highest bidder and so would come from "different" cities during different Olympiads.

Source: The Athletics of the Ancient Olympics: A Summary and Research Tool
​

I don't think the idea of amateur athletics is dead. I'm certain that the notion that Olympic competitors are amateur athletes and are never professional athletes is dead. Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Yeah, that's an interesting argument, one which I have never been able to refute. The processes by which countries select for athletic talents and establish facilities for training those talents are arbitrary. They're based entirely on popularity. By the time the sport rises to the level of an Olympic sport, certain countries have an almost insurmountable advantage. In order for other countries to catch up, the sport must be popularized in those countries. As charming as they may be, the Jamaican bobsled team is always going to have some pretty difficult barriers to success. Basketball in Eastern Europe, though. That's a success story. Giving these countries a chance to go up against a "Dream Team" can really provide a means to further popularize the sport and a real measure of how far they have come and how far they still have to go.

I'm not sure I comprehend the concept of amateur athletics, period. It's absurd to refer to athletes as amateur when countries run state-sponsored training programs and provide them with perks. It's absurd to have multi-billion dollar sports networks associated with colleges and universities, but concern ourselves only with making sure the athletes receive no compensation for a situation in which they are required to maintain a professional athlete's regimen.

Quite frankly, if I really wanted to put amateurs up against pros, I'd go out looking for autistic kids/young adults who, through their mental "malady," are inherently better than basically everyone at precisely one thing and field them in individual events corresponding to their extreme proficiency. I don't know if there are such autistic folks around, but if there are, hell, go find them.

Frankly, and in addition, I think it'd be a good thing to include them in so-called mainstream events and activities instead of relegating them to the Special Olympics. Moreover, I'd combine the Special Olympics events with the "mainstream" ones. For many of them, all that really need be separated is the judging but not the actual performance of the competition(s).

I'm afraid the savants of the world are limited to mental feats. Physically they are often disabled, not made stronger by their condition. It's a perfectly natural thing to want to know, who's the fastest man alive? Who's the strongest? Personally, I couldn't care less about who the fastest woman is, or the fastest man in a wheelchair. I have no object to the race being open to women and the disabled, but they're not going to make it through the qualifying events. If we want to determine who the fastest human is, it's going to be a man.

To truly find out we have to first find out if we are civilized enough to gather together in peace. Then we have to be civilized enough to follow rules that transcend national interests. We need to have, for example, judging in the boxing events which do not cause tears of shame to well up in the eyes of everyone who is unlucky enough to watch one of those travesties of justice. Otherwise, it may demonstrate a failing of international amity, and many failings of the rules of good sportsmanship, but the Olympics also manages to produce many moments of great competition.

 

[candycorn]

No one was inquiring about corporate sponsorship back in classical times. No one back then could conceive of government sponsored development programs with blatant doping and transsexualism, either. It would be nice to see the zero-sum international gamesmanship stripped from the process and the athletes needs made paramount.

Off Topic:
There weren't most likely because it seems that in Ancient Greece, professional and amateur athletes competed synchronously and because it was common enough for competitors to do so for a sponsor.

There were no divisions in ancient sport between professionals and amateurs. Many athletes while not professionals nevertheless competed alongside them. However, because training generally produces a better athlete, professional athletes began to dominate the games.

Originally the prizes given for the winners of the athletic contests were very substantive, but eventually (and it is not clear when) only a crown of olive leaves was given to the victor. Although the official prize for victory in historic times was only a wreath, the cities to which the victors belonged gained great prestige from their winning and so would give great financial rewards to them. Often good athletes would hire themselves out to the highest bidder and so would come from "different" cities during different Olympiads.

Source: The Athletics of the Ancient Olympics: A Summary and Research Tool
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I don't think the idea of amateur athletics is dead. I'm certain that the notion that Olympic competitors are amateur athletes and are never professional athletes is dead. Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Quite simply, as a global society, we must merely choose whether we want the Olympics to be competitions between amateurs or whether we want it to be contests that give qualitative and quantitative validity to the claims of groups and individuals who assert they are "the best" at a given sport.

Yeah, that's an interesting argument, one which I have never been able to refute. The processes by which countries select for athletic talents and establish facilities for training those talents are arbitrary. They're based entirely on popularity. By the time the sport rises to the level of an Olympic sport, certain countries have an almost insurmountable advantage. In order for other countries to catch up, the sport must be popularized in those countries. As charming as they may be, the Jamaican bobsled team is always going to have some pretty difficult barriers to success. Basketball in Eastern Europe, though. That's a success story. Giving these countries a chance to go up against a "Dream Team" can really provide a means to further popularize the sport and a real measure of how far they have come and how far they still have to go.

I'm not sure I comprehend the concept of amateur athletics, period. It's absurd to refer to athletes as amateur when countries run state-sponsored training programs and provide them with perks. It's absurd to have multi-billion dollar sports networks associated with colleges and universities, but concern ourselves only with making sure the athletes receive no compensation for a situation in which they are required to maintain a professional athlete's regimen.

One has to realize that the IOC is not vertically integrated; it's reliance on the governing bodies to "certify" athletes is another way of their having plausible deniability of who is appearing in their games. So lets get rid of the charade of amateurs being the only Olympians. The IOC has dismissed entire events because one nation and it's "amateurs" had such dominance over the rest of the field.

I think that your idea of EE teams going up against a group of NBA players formulating a "dream team" is a force multiplier that the NBA uses down the road to staff it's teams is a great example of what benefits are there once we remove the mask of amateur participation.

Again, in the macro, the Games need to move some of the events to the Winter to shore up it's popularity. Gymnastics should be moved to the Winter games since they are all indoors and cold weather will have no effect on the athletes. I heard a stat one time that there are more events in Track and Field than there are sports in the Winter Olympics. That may have changed with the X-Games events being added.

 

[Kosh]

Rio is a lot of fun to visit, but it's not a place ready to warmly receive the quantities of people an Olympic event draws.

• Violence runs rampant in Rio's non-affluent areas. The police don't even go there, and worse, those parts of the city have the geographical advantage: they occupy the high ground.
• The bay is filthy. Officials have noted that "the part" of the bay where the competitions will occur are the cleanest parts. That's no comfort. The water in my toilet bowl is the cleanest one will find in any waste disposal plumbing system, but I don't want to drink it or swim in it. Plus, it's water. What happens to "stuff" in water? If you don't know, fill your bathtub with water, then drop in some food coloring at one end. Stir once to create a current and wait.
  
  It's no different with the water in Rio's Guanabara Bay. Watch the news and you'll see "islands" of floating refuse. Why? Because the currents in the bay work such that the water holds stuff in the bay rather than washing it out to the ocean.
• The national government is little but an elected crime syndicate comprised of officials whose sole redeeming value that they know they're essentially a conspiratorial cabal of white collar criminals who cop to being so. I guess that's something....It's at least better than their knowing it (or worse, not knowing it) and denying it. LOL
• Then there's Zika. Now I'm not terribly concerned about Zika in and of itself. It's a relatively innocuous virus. That said, It's the Summer Olympics we're talking about. The last thing the world needs is literally thousands of attractive, scantily clad and perpetually horny young adults running about in a Zika prone region. And that's just considering the athletes and other visitors to the region. Never mind that the place has plenty of topless/nude beaches and the indigenous population is, in the main, good looking and fit (maybe not "6-pack" fit, but two or four pack with no flab is quite common, especially in places frequented by young people). Short of deliberately aiming to do so, I can't think of a better way to rapidly spread a sexually transmitted virus.

Based on the above, should the U.S. abstain from the 2016 Summer Olympics?

Well you may get your wish:

Zika virus and the Olympic and Paralympic Games Rio 2016
WHO statement
12 May 2016

WHO and the Pan American Health Organization (PAHO) recognize that athletes and visitors are seeking more information on the risks of Zika and ways to prevent infection while attending the Olympic and Paralympic Games Rio 2016 (5 August to 18 September 2016).

Brazil is one of the 58 countries and territories which to-date report continuing transmission of Zika virus by mosquitoes. While mosquitoes are the primary vectors, a person infected with Zika virus can also transmit the virus to another person through unprotected sex. Zika virus disease usually causes mild symptoms1, and most people will not develop any symptoms. However, there is scientific consensus that Zika virus is a cause of microcephaly (children being born with unusually small heads) and other brain malformations and disorders in babies born to women who were infected with Zika virus during pregnancy, and Guillain-Barré syndrome (a rare but serious neurological disorder that could lead to paralysis and death).

Athletes and visitors to Rio de Janeiro, and other areas where Zika virus is circulating, are being encouraged to:

• follow the travel advice2provided by WHO and their countries’ health authorities, and consult a health worker before travelling;
• whenever possible, during the day, protect themselves from mosquito bites by using insect repellents and by wearing clothing – preferably light-coloured – that covers as much of the body as possible;
• practice safer sex (e.g. use condoms correctly and consistently) or abstain from sex during their stay and for at least 8 weeks* after their return, particularly if they have had or are experiencing symptoms of Zika virus;
• choose air-conditioned accommodation (windows and doors are usually kept closed to prevent the cool air from escaping, and mosquitoes cannot enter the rooms);
• avoid visiting impoverished and over-crowded areas in cities and towns with no piped water and poor sanitation (ideal breeding grounds of mosquitoes) where the risk of being bitten is higher.

Pregnant women continue to be advised not to travel to areas with ongoing Zika virus transmission. This includes Rio de Janeiro. Pregnant women’s sex partners returning from areas with circulating virus continue to be counselled to practice safer sex or abstain throughout the pregnancy3. The Games will take place during Brazil’s wintertime, when there are fewer active mosquitoes and the risk of being bitten is lower.

WHO/PAHO is providing public health advice to the Government of Brazil, the International Olympic Committee and, by extension, and the Rio 2016 Local Organizing Committee on ways to further mitigate the risk of athletes and visitors contracting Zika virus during the Games. An important focus of WHO advice revolves around measures to reduce populations of Aedes mosquitoes which transmit chikungunya, dengue and yellow fever in addition to Zika virus.

WHO/PAHO will continue to monitor the Zika virus transmission and risks in Brazil and in other affected areas to provide updates on how Zika virus outbreaks, risks and prevention interventions develop between now and August and beyond.

Zika virus and the Olympic and Paralympic Games Rio 2016

 

[320 Years of History]

Well you may get your wish:

I haven't stated what my position is on whether the U.S. should abstain from the Rio Olympics. My OP only identifies some reasons why it may make sense to do so and it asks what the members/readers of the OP think the U.S. should do. FWIW, I have alluded elsewhere in the thread as to what part of my position is.