Questioning Isra-El

Discussion in 'Israel and Palestine' started by JBeukema, May 31, 2011.

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  1. JBeukema
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    JBeukema BANNED

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    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_T61BstBqQ]YouTube - ‪Are Criticisms of Israel Anti-Semitic?‬‏[/ame]
     
  2. docmauser1
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    docmauser1 Gold Member

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    So, what was that toob crap about?
     
  3. alexa
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    Of course the video is correct. Is there any question?

    The stealth like censorship of intellectual thought in the US which has resulted from buying this 'new antisemitism' propaganda was very astutely seen when all your politicians, Republicans Democrats and Liberals stood up and raucously applauded a right wing Nationalist leader....something the US should think about if it still values free speech so much. What we can see is that the fear of loss of job or position or even being labelled antisemetic from people who are not, is just as effective at controlling their behaviour as fear of violence.

    Obviously Nationalism and far right policies do not have a good reputation so in their own right need to be carefully analysed but possibly for most people there is an unnoticed extra dimension to this which is not good for regular Jews. That is, if the Israeli Governemnt claims to speak for all Jews or rather if the Israeli government chooses to stereotype all Jews as in agreement with Netanyahu, which is the reality of talking criticism of Israel as antisemitism, then the there is danger of a backlash.

    Having by with this propaganda of 'new antisemitism' overstepped the boundaries, those uneducated in this area then believe that ,for instance Cast Lead, has the approval of all Jews. The rent a thug among them then go on to indiscriminately attack Jewish property and sometimes even people. We saw this everywhere including the US after Cast Lead.

    Using the concept of discrimination to enforce censorship then has the consequence of being likely to increase antisemitism. It does exactly what prejudice does, stereotypes all Jews to being alike in favour of settlements, ethnic cleansing and depriving the Palestinians of even the basics of human rights.

    Many people believe that this is actually what the government of Israel wants. The Israeli government, they believe, want Jews to suffer from antisemitism so that they will all go to Israel, which of course will then need to take over more land which does not belong to them, all because of the awful antisemitism in the world.

    However, Hello, doesn't work. Jews themselves started criticism Israel. At first those who had even lost relatives in the Holocaust were called 'self hating' or even antisemetic, but they held to it and nowadays many Jews are among the most critical of Israel, not because they are self hating or antisemetic but because they have a more liberal perspective, believe in human rights and justice and are not desperately keen on right wing Nationalism.

    Criticising a countries political stance is Politics, nothing else. Not allowing intellectual argument is Censorship, nothing else. Pretending all Jews think alike is itself antisemetic.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2011
  4. Truthseeker420
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    Truthseeker420 Gold Member

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    I made an anology which included Hitler on one of my threadfs then jokingly said maybe I was too hard on Hitler and the very next post some accused me of being a Jew Hater. Americans are brainwashed by the zionists.
     
  5. Sunni Man
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    Sunni Man Diamond Member

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    The brainwashing of America starts in grade school when kids are forced fed the Holocaust myth.
     
  6. Baruch Menachem
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    Baruch Menachem '

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    This thread is an example of the problem.

    Every country does weird self centered stuff. Israel is like all other countries in that regard. However, there is a world of difference in questioning a stupid act by Israel, and using jew hatred or any particular event to justify jew hatred to question the existence of Israel.

    How about moving the question forward? Do we Question Germany? Question Russia? Rwanda? Cambodia? Burkina Faso? Monaco?

    It is perfectly reasonable to hold Israel to a high standard. Given their general attitude, even a higher standard might be arguably sensible. However making the discussion start from their existence as a jewish state, and and holding no one else to any kind of standard at all make folks doubt your bona fides.
    What standard do you require of Egypt? Of Syria? Of France? Of Equador?
     
  7. alexa
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    The holocaust is well documented. What was it at least 11 million people murdered. Gays, Jehovah's Witnesses, Romani Gypsies, political prisoners, the mentally ill and Jews. Far too many people witnessed it and stayed alive to tell.

    The holocaust happened and it was one of the biggest disgraces this world has ever known and we do well to make sure nothing of that sort ever happens again to anyone...

    I certainly believe that without the holocaust Israel would not have come into being - there would not have been the interest from Jews themselves.

    That being said, now Israel is here and it is coming up to 70 years since the holocaust, it does not have a great reference to the current problems.
     
  8. alexa
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    I was not talking about people who are genuinely antisemetic but only about the question of freedom of intellectual thought. With regard to what you say above you get things back to front. The US is not going to applaud any other country disregarding international law and colonising another country in this day and age.

    It is not that there is a higher demand from Israel, it is that there is a lower demand.
     
  9. Jos
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    Does Israel respect and abide by the International agreements?
    You know, like The United nations resolutions?
    The Geneva conventions?
    International Maritime law?
     
  10. peach174
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    peach174 Gold Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Oh yeah, all of our American World War II Vets were liars.
     
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