Our Thirty Year Experiment

Discussion in 'Economy' started by wihosa, Aug 21, 2010.

  1. wihosa
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    wihosa VIP Member

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    Well, it's been thirty years now. Thirty years since "Reaganomics" was begun and what has been the result? For many at this site I suspect that this time frame may exceed their memories (they may not be old enough). Some of us though do remember a time before soaring budget deficits, wild military spending and destructive un-restrained greed.

    There was a time when one worker could support a family. Typically mom could stay home to raise the children and nurture productive citizens. Now it takes two or even three incomes just to keep a family in a home.

    Middle class families could expect to send their children to college, save for retirement, go to the doctor and even have two weeks of paid vacation. Not any more. Now more and more people are slipping into a "new" class of American citizens, that being the "working class", those who work low paying jobs which provide no benifits and leave people living pay check to pay check. AKA the working poor.

    Before "supply siders" began setting national policy America was the greatest producer of finished goods in the world. Now we are the greatest importer of finished goods, sending our money to other countries for the necessities of daily life. We were the greatest crediter nation, now we are the greatest debter nation.

    Huge tax cuts for the wealthy and corporations along with massive government spending on the military was suppossed to spur our economy. It did to an extent because the government outlays amounted to a economic "stimulus package".

    Unfortunately, the huge tax cuts coupled with foolish reductions on import tariffs were simply an incentive for the capitalists to liquidate assets here in America, pocket the proceeds and then use some of it to re-open the factories they closed in other countries where labor and environmental standards were weak or non-exisitent. It's been great for capitalists, bad for the vast majority of Americans. High taxes on capitalists provide and incentive for profits to be re-invested in the companies thus enlarging and strengthening them, leading to higher employment and wages.

    "Trickle-down" theory coupled with the right wing assault on organized labor has served to drive down the cost of labor. Now you may think that you are immune to this lowering of the wage base because you have a college education, but there are people in China and India with the equivalent education who will work for a third what you will. I'm a General Building Contractor and one of the structural engineers I work with was shocked to find out that he had lost a job to a firm in India which engineered an entire house for only $1500.00, far less than the $7600.00 he had bid.

    Of course some jobs can't be out sourced, like construction or meat packing. So, for those jobs the capitalists imported labor, all those illegal immigrants the right wing pretends to be so upset about. But of course, we don't have an illegal immigration problem, we have an illegal employment problem. Start rounding up illegal employers, fining or even sending them to jail and over night the illegal immigration problem would go away. As a side benifit we could stop demonizing Americans who "look" foreign.

    So, now after this thirty years experiment the results are definitive. Huge federal debt, ever inceasing budget deficits, falling wages, falling rates of home ownership, almost non existent personal savings rates. And some how half of America has been fooled into believeing it is the result of "socialism".

    It is important to note that free enterprise and capitlalism are not necessarily the same thing. Remember that a capitalist is one who makes all their money from intrest and dividends, everyone else is labor, regardless of what color your collar is.

    It is imperative that we raise the wage base. Falling wages lead to a diminished tax base, the results of which can be seen in our crumbling infrastructure which decreases the chance of economic oportunity.

    For almost fifty years after WWII America had rising wages and prosperity for all, then came the "Reagan Revolution" and we can see the results of this Thirty Year Experiment.
     
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  2. iamwhatiseem
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    iamwhatiseem Gold Member

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    Hmm...you are concentrating on one page of the multi-volume book entitled "how America ruined themselves".
    Expand your mind.
    There is a greater story beyond red vs blue.
     
  3. uscitizen
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    uscitizen Senior Member

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    We just did not deregulate and cut taxes enough!
    It is the darn Democrats fault!
    It would have worked if not for those obstructionist libtards.
     
  4. wihosa
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    wihosa VIP Member

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    That's it if we just cut taxes some more then we can have a country where all the proceeds go to a handful of capitalists.

    It'll be great!
     
  5. wihosa
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    wihosa VIP Member

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    imwhatiseem
    What are you talking about? This isn't about Repub vs Dem. This is about capitalists vs Americans.
     
  6. saveliberty
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    saveliberty Diamond Member

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    We have not applied Reaganomics to that entire period of time, so you fail on that count immediately. Raising the wage base simply causes inflation. Crumbling infrastructure is the result of governments focusing on building more and bigger public entitlement prorams. Had they focused on things like security and infratstructure, we would not be in this fix. The fastest growing and second largest economyon the worl is China. Are you looking to them for guidance on wages, health care and deficits? Keyesian economics was a total failure, what you are sugsesting is a return to that system. No thank you.
     
  7. wihosa
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    wihosa VIP Member

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    So we had a stable and expanding economy for alsmot fifty years and since the "conservative era" started we have had falling wages, soaring deficits, crumbling infrastructure but somehow it was the result of Keynsian economics?

    It was Keynsian economixs which built this country into the manufacturing powerhouse it was until Reagan.

    The proof is in the pudding!
     
  8. uscitizen
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    uscitizen Senior Member

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    Our national debt was about 700 billion when Reagan took office. Where are we now?
     
  9. boedicca
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    boedicca Uppity Water Nymph Supporting Member

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    Hmmm...Obama spent more than that on the failed Stimulus Package alone.
     
  10. iamwhatiseem
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    iamwhatiseem Gold Member

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    :lol::lol::lol::lol::cuckoo:
    When you grow into your pants let me know, we'll have the conversation then.
     

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