Mystics and Saints

[Sky Dancer]

There are mystics and saints in many different religious and spiritual traditions. When I was a child, being raised as a Catholic, I read the lives of the saints. Now my ideas of what sainthood is, and who is a mystic have expanded.

I thought we could discuss which saints or mystics inspire us the most. Here is my beginning list:

Francis of Assissi
Hildengard of Bingen
Gandhi
Jesus of Nazareth
Rumi
Hafiz
Kabir
Anandamayima
Padmasambhava
Prince Siddhartha
Milarepa
Angulimala
Shantideva
Anthony DeMello
Lao Tsu

Tell us who inspires you and why. I have reasons for each of these that I've listed. More will come to me.

Let's have fun with this.

 

[Caroljo]

First of all, i follow no saints or mystics...and i don't believe Jesus should be on your list. He is the Son of God, not a saint. And Jesus is the ONLY one that inspires me. This is what is wrong with catholics. They pray to the saints (and mystics??) for intercession. The Bible PLAINLY states we're to pray to NOBODY but God, through His son Jesus Christ. That doesn't include praying to Mary or any of the so called saints. To me that's the same as idol worship.

 

[Sky Dancer]

First of all, i follow no saints or mystics...and i don't believe Jesus should be on your list. He is the Son of God, not a saint. And Jesus is the ONLY one that inspires me. This is what is wrong with catholics. They pray to the saints (and mystics??) for intercession. The Bible PLAINLY states we're to pray to NOBODY but God, through His son Jesus Christ. That doesn't include praying to Mary or any of the so called saints. To me that's the same as idol worship.

Thank you for your opinion. Jesus is on my list because I consider him a bodhisattva, not God. I don't believe in God or follow bible teachings.

A bodhisattva is a highly realized saint or master of spiritual realization and attainment Jesus performed 'miracles'. He was able to do so, IMO, because he had 'siddhis' or spiritual gifts.

Jesus is not alone in having such powers. Buddhist masters of awareness achieve a state called 'rainbow body', much like Jesus attained, where the body of flesh and blood dissolves into light. They are also capable of leaving footprints and handprints in rock, raising their body temperature, changing weather and other 'miracles', although we don't call them miracles.

I mean no disrespect to you personally. You are free to see Jesus as God. I do not.

 

[Sunni Man]

I believe that you would be fascinated by the life of Ghazali


Abu Hāmed Mohammad ibn Mohammad al-Ghazzālī (1058-1111) (Persian: ابو حامد محمد ابن محمد الغزال&#1740, known as Algazel to the western medieval world, born and died in Tus, in the Khorasan province of Persia (modern day Iran) was a Persian [3] Muslim theologian, jurist, philosopher, and mystic.

Ghazali has sometimes been referred to by historians as the single most influential Muslim after the Islamic prophet Muhammad. [4] Besides his work that successfully changed the course of Islamic philosophy—the early Islamic Neoplatonism developed on the grounds of Hellenistic philosophy, for example, was so successfully refuted by Ghazali that it never recovered—he also brought the orthodox Islam of his time in close contact with Sufism. [4] The orthodox theologians still went their own way, and so did the mystics, but both developed a sense of mutual appreciation which ensured that no sweeping condemnation could be made by one for the practices of the other.

wikipedia.org

 

[Sky Dancer]

I believe that you would be fascinated by the life of Ghazali


Abu Hāmed Mohammad ibn Mohammad al-Ghazzālī (1058-1111) (Persian: ابو حامد محمد ابن محمد الغزال&#1740, known as Algazel to the western medieval world, born and died in Tus, in the Khorasan province of Persia (modern day Iran) was a Persian [3] Muslim theologian, jurist, philosopher, and mystic.

Ghazali has sometimes been referred to by historians as the single most influential Muslim after the Islamic prophet Muhammad. [4] Besides his work that successfully changed the course of Islamic philosophy—the early Islamic Neoplatonism developed on the grounds of Hellenistic philosophy, for example, was so successfully refuted by Ghazali that it never recovered—he also brought the orthodox Islam of his time in close contact with Sufism. [4] The orthodox theologians still went their own way, and so did the mystics, but both developed a sense of mutual appreciation which ensured that no sweeping condemnation could be made by one for the practices of the other.

wikipedia.org

Thanks. I've never heard of him. I do love Rumi and Hafiz.

I don't think I want to get into really technical Islam philosophy, is there anything you could recommend that would be simple?

 

[zzzz]

And what turned you from a Catholic to an atheist? Or do you believe in many Gods? The belief in mystics and saints does imply that you do believe in a higher power.

Saints are humans put on a pedestal by other humans. There is only one God and to worship or pray to any other being or image is idol worship and a sin. No one is sinless even the saints.

 

[Sunni Man]

I was just recommending his life story not philosophy.

He was a child prodigy who quickly became known far and wide as a scholar.

Later through introspection he realized he had become arrogant.

So he left his wife and family for about a dozen years and wandered the earth as a quiet common man to clean stables and sweep floors.

It was during this period of self discovery that he became aware of the essence of of life.

And finally returning to teach on a much higher and esoteric level.

Yet write in the parlance of the common man.

Also his works were translated into Latin and read by the monks of the Christian church.

Much of which was incorporated into early Christian thought.

 

[editec]

My nomination for cannization leading to SAITHOOD is Tim Berners-Lee.

He invented the World Wide Web and HTML or hypertext markup language and GAVE IT AWAY TO MANKIND.

If that man doesn't get to heaven then God is a dick.

 

[Sky Dancer]

And what turned you from a Catholic to an atheist? Or do you believe in many Gods? The belief in mystics and saints does imply that you do believe in a higher power.

Saints are humans put on a pedestal by other humans. There is only one God and to worship or pray to any other being or image is idol worship and a sin. No one is sinless even the saints.

What turned me from being a Catholic? It's a long story.

 

[Caroljo]

First of all, i follow no saints or mystics...and i don't believe Jesus should be on your list. He is the Son of God, not a saint. And Jesus is the ONLY one that inspires me. This is what is wrong with catholics. They pray to the saints (and mystics??) for intercession. The Bible PLAINLY states we're to pray to NOBODY but God, through His son Jesus Christ. That doesn't include praying to Mary or any of the so called saints. To me that's the same as idol worship.

Thank you for your opinion. Jesus is on my list because I consider him a bodhisattva, not God. I don't believe in God or follow bible teachings.

A bodhisattva is a highly realized saint or master of spiritual realization and attainment Jesus performed 'miracles'. He was able to do so, IMO, because he had 'siddhis' or spiritual gifts.

Jesus is not alone in having such powers. Buddhist masters of awareness achieve a state called 'rainbow body', much like Jesus attained, where the body of flesh and blood dissolves into light. They are also capable of leaving footprints and handprints in rock, raising their body temperature, changing weather and other 'miracles', although we don't call them miracles.

I mean no disrespect to you personally. You are free to see Jesus as God. I do not.

No disrespect taken..thank you. Because i have such a strong faith in God and Jesus, it's hard for me to understand how others can follows saints and mystics and whatever. I also do not mean any disrespect to you for what you believe, but i pray for many that feel this way because to me it's just not right . This doesn't mean i think anyone that doesn't feel as i do is any less a good person as i try to be. However you feel about things, God still loves you just as he loves me.

 

[zzzz]

And what turned you from a Catholic to an atheist? Or do you believe in many Gods? The belief in mystics and saints does imply that you do believe in a higher power.

Saints are humans put on a pedestal by other humans. There is only one God and to worship or pray to any other being or image is idol worship and a sin. No one is sinless even the saints.

What turned me from being a Catholic? It's a long story.

I am not a Catholic, have never been in a Catholic church but I am a Christian. What denomination? I have none. I believe that in Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church;..." does not create a Catholic church and the line of evil Popes have proven this out. The church to me is the Word and divine guidance as given to each soul in this world.

Why do I have faith? I have experienced many things in life, among them, intercession by what I believe too be guardian Angels that have prevented me from being killed at least twice. These only strengthened my faith but when I took the Lord as my Savior I felt his presence and the lifting of sin from my shoulders. Yes, there are and will always be skeptics but my faith is unshakable.

 

[Caroljo]

And what turned you from a Catholic to an atheist? Or do you believe in many Gods? The belief in mystics and saints does imply that you do believe in a higher power.

Saints are humans put on a pedestal by other humans. There is only one God and to worship or pray to any other being or image is idol worship and a sin. No one is sinless even the saints.

What turned me from being a Catholic? It's a long story.

I am not a Catholic, have never been in a Catholic church but I am a Christian. What denomination? I have none. I believe that in Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church;..." does not create a Catholic church and the line of evil Popes have proven this out. The church to me is the Word and divine guidance as given to each soul in this world.

Why do I have faith? I have experienced many things in life, among them, intercession by what I believe too be guardian Angels that have prevented me from being killed at least twice. These only strengthened my faith but when I took the Lord as my Savior I felt his presence and the lifting of sin from my shoulders. Yes, there are and will always be skeptics but my faith is unshakable.

Wow...i soooooo agree with you! The more I've learned of the catholic church the more i'm so against their teaching. I've experienced many things too that there's no other answer but that God / Angels interceded in what was going on

 

[Sky Dancer]

And what turned you from a Catholic to an atheist? Or do you believe in many Gods? The belief in mystics and saints does imply that you do believe in a higher power.

Saints are humans put on a pedestal by other humans. There is only one God and to worship or pray to any other being or image is idol worship and a sin. No one is sinless even the saints.

What turned me from being a Catholic? It's a long story.

I am not a Catholic, have never been in a Catholic church but I am a Christian. What denomination? I have none. I believe that in Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church;..." does not create a Catholic church and the line of evil Popes have proven this out. The church to me is the Word and divine guidance as given to each soul in this world.

Why do I have faith? I have experienced many things in life, among them, intercession by what I believe too be guardian Angels that have prevented me from being killed at least twice. These only strengthened my faith but when I took the Lord as my Savior I felt his presence and the lifting of sin from my shoulders. Yes, there are and will always be skeptics but my faith is unshakable.

Interesting. You're describing an experience of being spiritually protected. I've had that experience quite a few times myself.

 

[zzzz]

What turned me from being a Catholic? It's a long story.

I am not a Catholic, have never been in a Catholic church but I am a Christian. What denomination? I have none. I believe that in Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church;..." does not create a Catholic church and the line of evil Popes have proven this out. The church to me is the Word and divine guidance as given to each soul in this world.

Why do I have faith? I have experienced many things in life, among them, intercession by what I believe too be guardian Angels that have prevented me from being killed at least twice. These only strengthened my faith but when I took the Lord as my Savior I felt his presence and the lifting of sin from my shoulders. Yes, there are and will always be skeptics but my faith is unshakable.

Interesting. You're describing an experience of being spiritually protected. I've had that experience quite a few times myself.

Yes, protected for what reason? Why was I saved? What have I done in life that needed to be done that warranted protection? I've often asked myself those questions and I cannot see the answer. I have influenced several lives, saved a few through my actions, taught some people among other things. It may have been one small thing in life. And then again the reason may be yet to come. God is omniscience and only God knows.

Oh I have been touched by mysticism and demons and out of body experiences at times through out life and even though these things exist they are not Gods way. They are Satan's way of corrupting our souls so he can enslave us through eternity.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Have you ever read the writings of Anthony Demello, SJ? He is a modern Christian mystic.

"Before enlightenment, I used to be depressed; after enlightenment, I continue to be depressed. You don't make a goal out of relaxation and sensitivity. Have you ever heard of people who get tense trying to relax? If one is tense, one simply observes one's tension. You will never understand yourself if you seek to change yourself. The harder you try to change yourself the worse it gets. You are called upon to be aware."
"Hidden Agenda" p. 145 Awareness
http://www.demello.org/

 

[Sky Dancer]

"I shall remain a wanderer until mankind has learned the way of peace, walking until I am given shelter and fasting until I am given food.”

Peace Pilgrim

 

[Sky Dancer]

"Let me be a feather on the breath of God". Hildegard von Bingen

 

[Avatar4321]

I've always found alot of truth in this quote from Joseph Smith.

“The Saints can testify whether I am willing to lay down my life for my brethren. If it has been demonstrated that I have been willing to die for a ‘Mormon,’ I am bold to declare before Heaven that I am just as ready to die in defending the rights of a Presbyterian, a Baptist, or a good man of any other denomination; for the same principle which would trample upon the rights of the Latter-day Saints would trample upon the rights of the Roman Catholics, or of any other denomination who may be unpopular and too weak to defend themselves.

“It is a love of liberty which inspires my soul—civil and religious liberty to the whole of the human race. Love of liberty was diffused into my soul by my grandfathers while they dandled me on their knees. …

“If I esteem mankind to be in error, shall I bear them down? No. I will lift them up, and in their own way too, if I cannot persuade them my way is better; and I will not seek to compel any man to believe as I do, only by the force of reasoning, for truth will cut its own way.”(Teachings of the Presidents of the Church: Joseph Smith)

 

[Sky Dancer]

Do you consider Joseph Smith a saint or a mystic?

 

[Avatar4321]

Do you consider Joseph Smith a saint or a mystic?

Saint. But then I doubt I have the same definition of Saint that is commonly used. A saint is merely a name for those who accept the Gospel and are baptized into the Church of Christ.