Mexican flag flies at U.S. Post Office near Los Angeles

[dilloduck]

It wasn't you Dillo...

It was Pale Rider... I'm willing to give a free pass to him if it was just an exageration for dramatic effect...

sorry for the misunderstanding. I posted in the middle of your conversation. my bad.

np--it's hard to keep people and opinions straight here. I think the exagerations are just signs of frustration.

 

[Hagbard Celine]

np--it's hard to keep people and opinions straight here. I think the exagerations are just signs of frustration.

I think all yous guys are muy loco. Why can't we just pass federal laws making it a requirement for people to prove their citizenship when they apply for jobs or enroll their kids in school--maybe have a guest worker program? That would solve the problem wouldn't it?

 

[dilloduck]

I think all yous guys are muy loco. Why can't we just pass federal laws making it a requirement for people to prove their citizenship when they apply for jobs or enroll their kids in school--maybe have a guest worker program? That would solve the problem wouldn't it?

What makes you think all illegals apply for jobs or enroll thier kids in school ?
There's nothing loco about being in control of who lives in our country.

 

[insein]

Also if I say the KKK used to burn crosses and bomb churches and lynch Blacks its just truth not racist?

Your splitting hairs, your not stupid enough to come right out and say it but we are smart enough to decipher it when you say "they are prospering because the white man is letting them return to their old ways".

You need more time in the desert ingesting peyote.

Indians were a conquered nation just like any other in history. Then they were given land because some elitists felt bad. Its not good, its not bad. Its the way it was. The sooner people gte over it, the sooner we can work on getting over slavery. Then maybe we can bring America into the 21st century.

 

[musicman]

There's nothing loco about being in control of who lives in our country.

My sentiments exactly. What do we tell the immigrants who did it right - who came here legally, waited their turn, learned the language, and became productive citizens - "Sorry, stupidass"? "You fucked up - you trusted us"?

I don't care how you try to dress it up; we're either a nation of laws, or we're not.

 

[OCA]

My sentiments exactly. What do we tell the immigrants who did it right - who came here legally, waited their turn, learned the language, and became productive citizens - "Sorry, stupidass"? "You fucked up - you trusted us"?

I don't care how you try to dress it up; we're either a nation of laws, or we're not.

MM my friend don't take this as sarcasm but.......we've never been a nation of laws, we are a capitalist nation where the laws only mattered if the economy was benefiitting. The feds for many decades now have been letting people across that southern border with a wink and a nod because they knew it was good for the economy, now we are supposed to take a step backward economically because of some peoples xenophobia.

My friend my economic situation far outweighs any warped sense of American nationalism.....whatever that is.

Lets face it, if all illegals were deported tommorrow not a damn one of us would notice any difference in our daily lives, well except the trip to the grocery store would cost twice as much.

 

[OCA]

You bet----I'm dying to live where alcoholism is an epidemic. They should have stuck to peyote

What else is there to do with the billions they are making off the white boys?

 

[musicman]

MM my friend don't take this as sarcasm but.......we've never been a nation of laws, we are a capitalist nation where the laws only mattered if the economy was benefiitting. The feds for many decades now have been letting people across that southern border with a wink and a nod because they knew it was good for the economy, now we are supposed to take a step backward economically because of some peoples xenophobia.

My friend my economic situation far outweighs any warped sense of American nationalism.....whatever that is.

Lets face it, if all illegals were deported tommorrow not a damn one of us would notice any difference in our daily lives, well except the trip to the grocery store would cost twice as much.

I know what you're saying, OCA. And, I understand that laws are carried out by imperfect human beings - there's going to be some winking and nodding going on. But, that's no reason to ignore and disrespect the law out of hand. Rather, if one considers a law unjust or unworkable, he should take his case to the American people, and try to change it.

Isn't ignoring present immigration law a slap in the face to everyone who has obeyed it, and achieved his citizenship through legal channels? If we're not going to take it seriously, why should anyone - from anywhere - ever obey our laws again?

 

[OCA]

I know what you're saying, OCA. And, I understand that laws are carried out by imperfect human beings - there's going to be some winking and nodding going on. But, that's no reason to ignore and disrespect the law out of hand. Rather, if one considers a law unjust or unworkable, he should take his case to the American people, and try to change it.

Isn't ignoring present immigration law a slap in the face to everyone who has obeyed it, and achieved his citizenship through legal channels? If we're not going to take it seriously, why should anyone - from anywhere - ever obey our laws again?

No, I don't consider it to be a slap in the face, my own parents who fall into that category don't consider it to be and in fact their attitude is "hey, a man has to do what a man has to do".

Now you talk about reworking a law, iisn't that what Bush is trying to do? There has to be a middle ground oon immigration, the borders can't be wiide open and we can't deport every motherfucker here so if you stop and think about it without emotion Bush has found that middle ground.

I believe that either the anti-illegal crowd swallows the bitter pill and we get the wall up and get the ones already here on the path to citizenship or we just stay the status quo, now y'all don't want the status quo, do ya?

 

[007]

It wasn't you Dillo...

It was Pale Rider... I'm willing to give a free pass to him if it was just an exageration for dramatic effect...

sorry for the misunderstanding. I posted in the middle of your conversation. my bad.

I'm not exagerating anything. I "DO" wear my pistol around, and if I pasted an "AMERICAN" post office with a militant gang of illegal aliens around a flag pole where they had just lowered the American flag and sent up a mexican flag with the American flag UNDERNEATH IT, UPSIDE DOWN, I'd march right up to that pole to take that shit down, and the first illegal mother fucker that laid a hand on me, I'd make a fucking canoe out of his skull.

This is "MY" country, not your's. You respect the laws of "MY" country while you're here, OR DON'T FUCKING COME HERE.

THE AMERICAN FLAG FLIES OVER ALL OTHER FLAGS HERE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT, THEN GET THE FUCKING HELL OTTA HERE!!!

And another thing, I don't need or want your fucking free pass. If you're an illegal alien, take it back to mexico.

 

[OCA]

I'm not exagerating anything. I "DO" wear my pistol around, and if I pasted an "AMERICAN" post office with a militant gang of illegal aliens around a flag pole where they had just lowered the American flag and sent up a mexican flag with the American flag UNDERNEATH IT, I'd march right up to that pole to take that shit down, and the first illegal mother fucker that laid a hand on me, I'd make a fucking canoe out of his skull.

This is "MY" country, not your's. You respect the laws of "MY" country while you're here, OR DON'T FUCKING COME HERE.

THE AMERICAN FLAG FLIES OVER ALL OTHER FLAGS HERE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT, THEN GET THE FUCKING HELL OTTA HERE!!!

Yes, I believe that Pale would shoot first and talk later lol.

Pale you remind me of this fucking rodeo I was at in Kalispell,MT....we went to the local watering hole after our perf that night and so i'm sitting at the bar sipping on some Beam and this fucking guy sits next to me and when he sits down on the stool I hear this clanging of metal and a glint off the mirror, damned if this sumbitch wasn't carrying two pearl colt.44's hipped, know what I did? I bought that bastard a drink right quick! LMFAO!

 

[musicman]

No, I don't consider it to be a slap in the face, my own parents who fall into that category don't consider it to be and in fact their attitude is "hey, a man has to do what a man has to do".

I'm a big believer in that. But, sometimes, what a man has to do is find a better life for himself and his family. Other times, what a man has to do is protect his borders and the sanctity of his laws.

Now you talk about reworking a law, iisn't that what Bush is trying to do? There has to be a middle ground oon immigration, the borders can't be wiide open and we can't deport every motherfucker here so if you stop and think about it without emotion Bush has found that middle ground.

I believe that either the anti-illegal crowd swallows the bitter pill and we get the wall up and get the ones already here on the path to citizenship or we just stay the status quo, now y'all don't want the status quo, do ya?

It's all going to come down to the people and the rule of law. He who would change the law must first change people's minds.

 

[007]

Yes, I believe that Pale would shoot first and talk later lol.

Pale you remind me of this fucking rodeo I was at in Kalispell,MT....we went to the local watering hole after our perf that night and so i'm sitting at the bar sipping on some Beam and this fucking guy sits next to me and when he sits down on the stool I hear this clanging of metal and a glint off the mirror, damned if this sumbitch wasn't carrying two pearl colt.44's hipped, know what I did? I bought that bastard a drink right quick! LMFAO!

I wear my 9mm loaded with hollow points when I ride, as do many of my friends wear their pistols when we ride, and I wear my Uberti 45 Long Colt single action in a quick draw shoulder holster when I go up to Virginia City.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't shoot anyone just for the fun of it. I'd have to have a good reason. I think protecting my country's laws would be a good reason.

 

[OCA]

I wear my 9mm loaded with hollow points when I ride, as do many of my friends wear their pistols when we ride, and I wear my Uberti 45 Long Colt single action in a quick draw shoulder holster when I go up to Virginia City.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't shoot anyone just for the fun of it. I'd have to have a good reason. I think protecting my country's laws would be a good reason.

The only problem with that though is the country whose laws you were protecting would turn around and prosecute you under a different law and put you away for life, fucked up ain't it?

 

[007]

The only problem with that though is the country whose laws you were protecting would turn around and prosecute you under a different law and put you away for life, fucked up ain't it?

I'm not so sure they'd do that here in Nevada. This is a right to carry state. If I could prove that I was in immanent danger afraid of bodely harm, I'd get off.

Self defense.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

I think all yous guys are muy loco. Why can't we just pass federal laws making it a requirement for people to prove their citizenship when they apply for jobs or enroll their kids in school--maybe have a guest worker program? That would solve the problem wouldn't it?

I agree with those excellent ideas. In fact, just because we "close" the borders it does not mean that we stop letting in deserving immigrants who want to become Americans. However we definitely need to close our borders (including Canadian borders) to illegals, criminals, gangs, the diseased, and terrorists.

When they come across the border they need papers that confirm they can speak at least some English, they have a place to stay, they have a job lined up, they are healthy, they are not criminals, they swear to become law-abiding U.S. citizens and follow our laws, etc. or if they are here only temporarily they must return in the designated time table.

Companies that are looking for labor need to help set up the necessary centers in Mexico to help allow these immigrants find jobs and places to stay if needed. Companies that bring in large groups need to pay for the impact costs of the communities they affect.

We need to stop allowing immigrants to sign up on the various forms of government welfare as this negatively affects U.S. citizens everywhere.

 

[Hagbard Celine]

I agree with those excellent ideas. In fact, just because we "close" the borders it does not mean that we stop letting in deserving immigrants who want to become Americans. However we definitely need to close our borders (including Canadian borders) to illegals, criminals, gangs, the diseased, and terrorists.

When they come across the border they need papers that confirm they can speak at least some English, they have a place to stay, they have a job lined up, they are healthy, they are not criminals, they swear to become law-abiding U.S. citizens and follow our laws, etc. or if they are here only temporarily they must return in the designated time table.

Companies that are looking for labor need to help set up the necessary centers in Mexico to help allow these immigrants find jobs and places to stay if needed. Companies that bring in large groups need to pay for the impact costs of the communities they affect.

We need to stop allowing immigrants to sign up on the various forms of government welfare as this negatively affects U.S. citizens everywhere.

Don't you mean "yobs?" Yuck, yuck, yuck. I agree. To solve any immigration problem that may exist, we need better screening at the point of entry--the borders. Then we need to improve the infrastructure that keeps track of guest workers when they are within the borders. And I agree wholeheartedly with you--no one should be able to take advantage of our government programs unless they pay taxes.

 

[OCA]

We need to stop allowing immigrants to sign up on the various forms of government welfare as this negatively affects U.S. citizens everywhere.

How about the vast tens of millions of ablebodied people born right here in America who abuse the welfare system their whole lives? Can I ship them out?

 

[dilloduck]

How about the vast tens of millions of ablebodied people born right here in America who abuse the welfare system their whole lives? Can I ship them out?

It's about legal citizenship--not who does what. It's a question of law.

 

[nukeman]

That's a really simplistic view. The conquistadores were just as savage, if not more so. It all comes down to who has the best technology my friend. That's who gets to write history.

The genocide of native peoples here in the Americas by Europeans, even here in the US up into the nineteenth and twentieth centuries is a real shame and a black spot in our history that nobody ever talks about.

I don't support protests like the one in California at all. I think the protestors acted completely inappropriately. But I also think some of the reactions here on the board are just as bad. I see the terms "wetback" and "****" being thrown around along with exaggerated fantasies about murdering Mexican immigrants. That's really inappropriate, un-Christian and low-class too. These illegals are only trying to gain a better life for themselves and their families and I think there has got to be a better, smarter, more Christian and more humane way of dealing with them than just putting up a wall.[/QUOTE]


I know that what I stated is a very simplistic view. I wasn't going for a drawn out conversation. I know full well that in the PAST Europeans and Americans have done horrible things, but in history what group hasn't. The point I was attempting to convey is that it is very misguided on the part of the Mexicans to try to point at Europeans who came over so very long ago and say go home. This is in and of itself a very rascist statement because in essence what they are saying is white people go home. They have completely forgotten the fact that most of them come from spanish decent. Which the last time I checked was a European country.

The part of your response that I bolded I would like to say I agree to a point. They should be putting there time and energy into building up their own country. If they worked half as hard at that as they do trying to circumvent the US legal system their country could become just as free and prosperous as the US. The big question is why dont they do that and if they are coming over here for a better life why do they trample on one of our most honored symbols. Why do they attempt to bring the US down to the level of Mexico instead of bringing Mexico to the level of the US..

You can say what ever you want about the US and its past transgressions but we as a people have learned from them and strive to do better in our lives. Every country and government out in the world has done wicked, vile, and evil things in the past and present. It is the ones that learn from them and dont repeat them that make the difference!!!