Methodist Divisions Over Gays Intensify

[The ClayTaurus]

Hey, I've always thought we should be intolerant of intolerant people.
What did I say about "Christian gatherings" that isn't true? Don't people get dressed up to go to church? Don't services include "feel-good" praise sessions and forgiveness of sins? Don't many, if not most church congregations have big picnics where every family brings a dish?
And I'm not intolerant of people who don't agree with me. I become intolerant when I am insulted. I am perfectly willing to engage in thoughtful, open debate with anyone on this board who does not throw insults and prod me to start a name-calling contest.

The truth of this matter is that if a church wants to have a homo preach to them, they can and will. Those who don't like it will leave the church. Those who do like it will flock to the church. Some might even think that a homo might have a unique outlook on sin that might further qualify him or her for the position. The point is that you don't have to go to the homo church if you don't want to, hell, you don't even have to like it. You don't go to Islam services do you? And I know most posters on this board don't agree with Muslim teachings. What's the point of being intolerant if you aren't being forced to attend the homo's services?

Are you a golden rule follower?

 

[Hagbard Celine]

Are you a golden rule follower?

I try to be, why?

 

[dmp]

You're just a bigot who hates queers and anybody who accepts them as people and not some disease to be quarantined away from the rest of society.

You and your kind fancy yourselves as social architects who would fashion a soul-less, static and uninterestingly prudish existence for mankind if the rest of us let you. You disguise hate, intolerance and fear as religious conviction because it makes you feel righteous, which is exactly what egotists and megalomaniacs like to feel.

You are the disease and progressive thinkers, brandishing ideas like tolerance, love and open-mindedness will eventually prevail over your kind because hate is evil and intolerance breeds intolerance.

struck a nerve didn't I? You are pointing to my assessment of your moral condition, and adding validity to my opinion.

 

[dmp]

Hey, I've always thought we should be intolerant of intolerant people.
What did I say about "Christian gatherings" that isn't true? Don't people get dressed up to go to church? Don't services include "feel-good" praise sessions and forgiveness of sins? Don't many, if not most church congregations have big picnics where every family brings a dish?
And I'm not intolerant of people who don't agree with me. I become intolerant when I am insulted. I am perfectly willing to engage in thoughtful, open debate with anyone on this board who does not throw insults and prod me to start a name-calling contest.

The truth of this matter is that if a church wants to have a homo preach to them, they can and will. Those who don't like it will leave the church. Those who do like it will flock to the church. Some might even think that a homo might have a unique outlook on sin that might further qualify him or her for the position. The point is that you don't have to go to the homo church if you don't want to, hell, you don't even have to like it. You don't go to Islam services do you? And I know most posters on this board don't agree with Muslim teachings. What's the point of being intolerant if you aren't being forced to attend the homo's services?

back-peddling...owns.

 

[Hagbard Celine]

struck a nerve didn't I? You are pointing to my assessment of your moral condition, and adding validity to my opinion.

Of course you would percieve it that way. All megalomaniacs think they are righteous.

back-peddling...owns.

I don't exactly know what this means. Is back-peddling a person's nickname? Is that what you think I'm doing by reiterating a past post? And what is it that he/she owns? I own? You own? Clay owns? Way to be incoherent man.

 

[dmp]

Of course you would percieve it that way. All megalomaniacs think they are righteous.

I don't exactly know what this means. Is back-peddling a person's nickname? Is that what you think I'm doing by reiterating a past post? And what is it that he/she owns? I own? You own? Clay owns? Way to be incoherent man.

see what you are doing? You are 'debating' like a classical liberal boob. Taking my 'opinion' and using a very harsh word to describe me. It's like calling Bush Hitler, etc.

Clickme

 

[Hagbard Celine]

see what you are doing? You are 'debating' like a classical liberal boob. Taking my 'opinion' and using a very harsh word to describe me. It's like calling Bush Hitler, etc.

Clickme

Maybe. Should I have used "egotist" instead of "megalomaniac?" They are synonyms you know. Anyway, you struck the first blow. You did the same thing to me because I don't subscribe to your personal set of values. Where exactly is the absolute truth in this issue other than the fact that you are being intolerant of a homo holding a position in a church?

Of course you don't understand the outrage - you don't seem to hold anything dear...you don't seem to have the backbone to make a stand for absolute truth. I doubt you believe in anything.

 

[5stringJeff]

[MOD HAT]

dmp and Hagbard, to your corners, please.

[/MOD HAT]

 

[Gunny]

Of course you don't understand the outrage - you don't seem to hold anything dear...you don't seem to have the backbone to make a stand for absolute truth. I doubt you believe in anything.

Most of the people I've heard denounce God/Christianity simply don't want their human desires inconvenienced by any morals and/or common sense. Instead of getting rid of and/or repenting heathen beahvior, they instead get rid of God. No God -- no rules.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Of course you don't understand the outrage - you don't seem to hold anything dear...you don't seem to have the backbone to make a stand for absolute truth. I doubt you believe in anything.

Absolutes...We love to dabble in absolutes. Why? Because we want absolute certainty in the face of an uncertain world. The notion of absolutes is like a warm blanket which insulates us from the harshness of a world full of uncertainty and the fear which that uncertainty breeds. But over time this blanket, like any other becomes careworn and moth-eaten. So it is with absolutes. Since they are absolutes, they are immutable...they cannot change to fit new cricumstances or new knowledge. As a result, they stifle the change and growth needed to keep any society healthy.

Absolutes are rooted in mysticism...they are measured not in terms of their consequences to this life, in this world. Rather they are measured by their consequences in some mythical, metaphysical after-life. Thus they can unintentionally, and in some case intentionally, become inhuman in their consquences to this life, in this world.

 

[Annie]

[MOD HAT]

dmp and Hagbard, to your corners, please.

[/MOD HAT]

Once in awhile a display of temper is a good thing!

 

[Annie]

Absolutes...We love to dabble in absolutes. Why? Because we want absolute certainty in the face of an uncertain world. The notion of absolutes is like a warm blanket which insulates us from the harshness of a world full of uncertainty and the fear which that uncertainty breeds. But over time this blanket, like any other becomes careworn and moth-eaten. So it is with absolutes. Since they are absolutes, they are immutable...they cannot change to fit new cricumstances or new knowledge. As a result, they stifle the change and growth needed to keep any society healthy.

Absolutes are rooted in mysticism...they are measured not in terms of their consequences to this life, in this world. Rather they are measured by their consequences in some mythical, metaphysical after-life. Thus they can unintentionally, and in some case intentionally, become inhuman in their consquences to this life, in this world.

Damn Bully, I already know you're smart, don't have to prove it with gibberish!

 

[Bullypulpit]

Most of the people I've heard denounce God/Christianity simply don't want their human desires inconvenienced by any morals and/or common sense. Instead of getting rid of and/or repenting heathen beahvior, they instead get rid of God. No God -- no rules.

Then those people are idiots, and have succumbed to the nihilism that adherence to absolutist metphysics can ultimately lead to. For our morals and values to have any meaning at all they must have, as their foundation, an understanding of their consequences to this human life in this world. Human life...here...now...must be the yardstick by which our morals and values are measured.

No rules - no civilization...

 

[Bullypulpit]

Damn Bully, I already know you're smart, don't have to prove it with gibberish!

Analogy, dear lady...analogy.

 

[Mr. P]

Another thing I find fascinating is how all homosexual "rights" supporters always ignore the fact that about 80% of all homosxuals have their first sexual experience as a very young teen with an ADULT,,,,

Where can enquiring minds find this "fact"?
Sounds like a fairy tale to me. No pun intended.

 

[Mr. P]

Absolutes...We love to dabble in absolutes. Why? Because we want absolute certainty in the face of an uncertain world. The notion of absolutes is like a warm blanket which insulates us from the harshness of a world full of uncertainty and the fear which that uncertainty breeds. But over time this blanket, like any other becomes careworn and moth-eaten. So it is with absolutes. Since they are absolutes, they are immutable...they cannot change to fit new cricumstances or new knowledge. As a result, they stifle the change and growth needed to keep any society healthy.

Absolutes are rooted in mysticism...they are measured not in terms of their consequences to this life, in this world. Rather they are measured by their consequences in some mythical, metaphysical after-life. Thus they can unintentionally, and in some case intentionally, become inhuman in their consquences to this life, in this world.

Home run, Bully! Now, if you'll lay off Bush we'll be buds, he's toast anyway.

 

[dmp]

There are absolutely no such things as absolutes...right?

 

[Bullypulpit]

There are absolutely no such things as absolutes...right?

Are you so certain?

 

[Gunny]

Then those people are idiots, and have succumbed to the nihilism that adherence to absolutist metphysics can ultimately lead to. For our morals and values to have any meaning at all they must have, as their foundation, an understanding of their consequences to this human life in this world. Human life...here...now...must be the yardstick by which our morals and values are measured.

No rules - no civilization...

Sorry, no sale. It is the consequences to the immortal soul that far outweigh any mortal consequences.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Sorry, no sale. It is the consequences to the immortal soul that far outweigh any mortal consequences.

Prove the existence of an immortal soul, and I'll buy your argument. Until then, I stick by my guns.

Our morals and values are the product of human perception and conception, and are thus bound by the same limitations as those of perception and conception. Raising them to the status of absolutes if both unwarranted and inappropriate.

Values are relevant only to the extent to which they give rise to individual and social well-being. Beyond this they become nothing more than the seeds of discord, contention and destruction.