Libl Hypocrit Watch-GroundZero Mosque = freedom, but cigarrettes and transfat don't??

[teapartysamurai]

Do you notice that when liberals are losing a debate, they claim you have a position (you have never taken) and then expect you to debate from that false premise?

When you have quotes of me being for anything you have claimed let me know.

Here you go:

It is a double standard for liberals to be for banning freedoms on one hand, and then preach about the ground zero mosque from the same position of "freedom."

You believe liberals are for banning freedoms. Since you apparently think it's hypocritical for a liberal to be in support of any freedom (e.g. freedom of religious expression), that implies you believe liberalism is predicated on opposing and banning all freedoms and, in fact, all things.

I'm not sure how you can say you didn't claim that when that's the premise of your thread ('OMG, liberals are hypocrites for supporting a single instance of freedom of expression!').

Well wait a minute!!!!

Don't liberals for marijuana use, preface that argument on "freedom???"

"I should be able to put in my body anything I want!!!!!!"

Don't those for abortion PREFACE THAT ARGUMENT ON FREEDOM??????????

"It's my body, blah blah blah."

Aren't they arguing for the ground zero mosque on "freedom???????"


BUT!!!!!!!!! Transfat and cigarettes are NOT about freedom???????

I'm not prefacing this thread about what *I* think about freedom, it's what LIBERALS THINK is about freedom.

They do argue for legalizing drugs, and killing the unborn, and on and on and on, on the grounds of FREEDOM.

But suddenly it's not about freedom with cigarettes and transfat?

Why can't we argue for transfat and cigarettes the way liberals argue for handing out condoms in schools?

"They are going to do it anyway!"

I just find it interesting how the argument for "freedom" changes depending on the subject.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Notice how when teapartysam starts losing a debate, she starts ignoring the posts that have destroyed her argument?

Very funny.

If my argument was "destroyed" you wouldn't be desperately trying to make the debate about me.

The only one desperate about here is you to get the subject off the GROUND ZERO MOSQUE.

The thread is about the ground zero mosque, not me!

No, the thread is about hypocrisy and inconsistency. I have demonstrated, clearly, by forcing you to refuse to take positions on issues of freedom,

that you can't even let your own opinions be known for fear it will expose you as being even more hypocritical than the people like me that you're attacking.

ha ha.

 

[blu]

I just find it interesting how the argument for "freedom" changes depending on the subject.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...arrettes-and-transfat-dont-3.html#post2642379

thoughts?

 

[teapartysamurai]

I support the right of the People of any given constituency/government to choose, by the democratic process, how cigarettes are regulated.

There is no constitutional protection for smoking. There is a constitutional protection for practicing one's religion.

Again, the two are incomparable.

But you say you are for FREEDOM!!!!!!!

I bet you are even for "medical marijuana" and that kind of "freedom."

I am for freedom of all. again you have freedom until you tread on my turf. meaning:

1) build the mosque

2) build the greek place (again its the owners fault its not done, not the city)

3) smoke weed but keep it out of my face

4) smoke cigs but do it in private

5) eat trans fat but get private insurance, don't make me pay for your obesity and eventual cancer

as long as you don't tread on my turf by blowing cancer in my face or using my tax money for your health insurance do all of the above

But Blu that's a hypocrisy.

We say build the mosque somewhere else (in other words "do it in private.")

It's not freedom if you can decide WHERE a person can smoke.

So, if you can decide where people smoke, why can't we decide where the mosque goes?

 

[blu]

But you say you are for FREEDOM!!!!!!!

I bet you are even for "medical marijuana" and that kind of "freedom."

I am for freedom of all. again you have freedom until you tread on my turf. meaning:

1) build the mosque

2) build the greek place (again its the owners fault its not done, not the city)

3) smoke weed but keep it out of my face

4) smoke cigs but do it in private

5) eat trans fat but get private insurance, don't make me pay for your obesity and eventual cancer

as long as you don't tread on my turf by blowing cancer in my face or using my tax money for your health insurance do all of the above

But Blu that's a hypocrisy.

We say build the mosque somewhere else (in other words "do it in private.")

It's not freedom if you can decide WHERE a person can smoke.

So, if you can decide where people smoke, why can't we decide where the mosque goes?

as john stated, the owner of a private place can certainly decide where smokers can smoke in their building and many of them have done that now. in publicly owned buildings, many cities have done the same and the citizens there are free to vote against if it they wish.

stopping people from smoking outside is a whole other thing though as the smoke has much more room to disperse. I think what ruined outside smoking is the lazy fucks who throw the cig butts on the ground and litter a place, which of course has nothing to do with the smoking of it.

 

[teapartysamurai]

Why do you oppose a woman's constitutionally protected FREEDOM to choose to have an abortion?

Do you oppose gays having the freedom to marry?

Do you oppose Muslims having the freedom to build a mosque?

Oh man!

You KNOW liberals are losing when they try to turn this into the "20 questions tactic."

That's when they drop the subject and start giving you the "third degree" looking desperately for something to put you on the defensive about.

Never fall for that one!

Just admit you have a double standard on this carbiner!

It's okay to ban trans fat and cigarrettes but a mosque at ground zero?????

OH THAT's about freedom.

You are admitting it's a double standard when you try to change the subject to about me.

You're the one claiming a double standard in OTHERS, but don't have the courage or integrity to state your own views?

Did you support prop 8 in California, taking away the FREEDOM of gays to marry?

Do you support rebuilding the Greek Orthodox church, but NOT the building of the mosque?

Desperate isn't he?

You want so bad to make this about me.

This is not about me. This is about how liberals pick and choose what respesents "freedom" to them.

Don't they argue for marijuana legalization on the grounds "I can do with my body what I want?"

But not cigarettes and transfat?

I haven't heard a PEEP out of liberals about rebuilding the Greek Orthodox Church, but ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY GET IN GEAR, when it comes to building a mosque at ground zero.

The double standards just scream.

 

[teapartysamurai]

as they should, and the compromise that came is the best result. schools have 'prayer time' now where students can silently pray whatever they want and the teacher isn't allowed to lead the class in a prayer as that would violate the students who aren't of the teacher's religion. why do you want kids who aren't christian to have it forced on them every day?

Why do liberals want a mosque on ground zero forced on us?????

did the government force it on you? nope a group of private citizens are on private land. they can do as they wish.

your lack of response shows that you have no argument to my post

As usual you are wrong.

The City of NY are allowing this mosque despite the fact most of their tax paying voters are against it.

And despite the obvious fact most of the COUNTRY is against it.

The US was attacked on 9/11, not just the City of NY.

 

[blu]

so sam do you agree that people who eat trans fat should be barred from receiving public paid health care?

 

[johnrocks]

People need to practice the art of M.Y.O.B., it would eradicate arguments like this. Let Ben marry Jerry, let a person do a line of coke or smoke a joint in the privacy of their home, let private business owners decide weather to allow smokers or cook with trans fats or not, iow's, mind your own business.

one thing I would like reported though at restaurants is if they do cook with/use trans fats or not. its really easy to see it on a label at a grocery store but not so much at a restaraunt that you know its doing everything from scratch

I don't mind the listing of ingredients, in this day and age though, if freedom of choice were truly allowed. I could find a niche in the market by catering to smokers or catering to the more health conscience, with government dictating and limiting freedom of choice, it is limiting our freedom of choices,imho anyway.

 

[uscitizen]

Then explain WHY it's okay for NY to do that????

Because liberals are all for that stuff.

NY has banned cigarettes. NOOOOOOOOOO cries about freedom from the left.

Has banned transfat. Noooooooooooooo cries of freedom from the left.

BUT YOU OBJECT TO A MOSQUE AT GROUND ZERO AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, the left have a holier than thou hissy fit!

And they are the defenders of freedom???????????????

Let me put it this way: most people (and if you're anti-stomach knifing, you're among them) believe some degree of regulation of behavior and products is acceptable. What that degree is would be something decided by the community or its duly elected representatives. Municipalities can ban smoking, transfats, foie gras, they can even stop you from building things by requiring permits and having zoning laws. All of this is perfectly acceptable in our society, even if your personal vision of freedom is regulation-less anarchy.

In this particular instance, the relevant New York City community board has approved this mosque or community center or whatever it is. So your claim is that the people that didn't protest when NYC representatives banned transfats aren't protesting when community representatives didn't disallow this mosque to be built? And somehow there's hypocrisy in there on someone's part?

I don't live in New York. As such, I don't give two shits what the city bans or what structures it allows to be built. Those are municipal issues and I don't live in that municipality.

The point is, liberals are ALL for bans on cigarrettes and transfat.

But when they get a chance to put a mosque on ground zero. A huge statement that the muslims won on 9/11? OH!!!!!!!! They preach to us about freedom????????

FUNNY!!!!!!!!!

I am not for Bans on cigarettes and transfats.

 

[blu]

Why do liberals want a mosque on ground zero forced on us?????

did the government force it on you? nope a group of private citizens are on private land. they can do as they wish.

your lack of response shows that you have no argument to my post

As usual you are wrong.

The City of NY are allowing this mosque despite the fact most of their tax paying voters are against it.

And despite the obvious fact most of the COUNTRY is against it.

The US was attacked on 9/11, not just the City of NY.

every poll I saw about NY people only was something like:

50% for
30% against
20% undecided/don't care

if you have other recent polls to disprove those numbers I would like to see it

 

[teapartysamurai]

as they should, and the compromise that came is the best result. schools have 'prayer time' now where students can silently pray whatever they want and the teacher isn't allowed to lead the class in a prayer as that would violate the students who aren't of the teacher's religion. why do you want kids who aren't christian to have it forced on them every day?

Why do liberals want a mosque on ground zero forced on us?????

Because you wingnut extremists don't get to force your unconstitutional anti-Muslim bigotry on "us"...

..."we" have the Constitution on our side.

FUNNY!

Liberals don't mind forcing their hate of religion on us in schools!

They don't mind removing the word God from state seals (or trying to).

They don't mind removing 150 year old crosses from state buildings!

They don't mind censoring the religious views of students.

They don't mind threatening students with not graduating that pray at their graduations.

But suddenly they are for religious freedom when it comes to a mosque at ground zero??????

 

[teapartysamurai]

cigarettes in public places.... where the smoke affects other people who aren't smoking. freedom only extends as far as the other persons nose as they say. once you cross into my territory by blowing cancer in my face, you are then violating my rights

And a Mosque at Ground Zero doesn't affect anyone?????

I guess you haven't heard of what the 9/11 families think of that!

anyone who is affected by a mosque being built blocks away from ground zero is irrational and its unprovable to affect people.

smoking on the other hand is proven to cause cancer and kill people

Thank you for proving my point!

 

[uscitizen]

As far as food ingredients go I am for clear labelling of all ingredients and countries of origin.
Let the informed consumer decide.

 

[blu]

I don't mind the listing of ingredients, in this day and age though, if freedom of choice were truly allowed. I could find a niche in the market by catering to smokers or catering to the more health conscience, with government dictating and limiting freedom of choice, it is limiting our freedom of choices,imho anyway.

i don't even think they should have to list all the ingredients since that would let the competition eventually figure out how to steal the recipe. I just want a simple checklist of things such as:

trans fat: yes or no
hf corn syrup: yes or no

that would be about it

 

[teapartysamurai]

But you say you are for FREEDOM!!!!!!!

I bet you are even for "medical marijuana" and that kind of "freedom."

I am for freedom of all. again you have freedom until you tread on my turf. meaning:

1) build the mosque

2) build the greek place (again its the owners fault its not done, not the city)

3) smoke weed but keep it out of my face

4) smoke cigs but do it in private

5) eat trans fat but get private insurance, don't make me pay for your obesity and eventual cancer

as long as you don't tread on my turf by blowing cancer in my face or using my tax money for your health insurance do all of the above

I will add a caveat though, private property owners such as those that own the clubs and restaurants should be able to say for themselves weather a place is smoke free or not, I'm not a smoker but I do believe in private property rights that much.

That's the point!

He doesn't believe in freedom.

Look at his number 4!

 

[blu]

And a Mosque at Ground Zero doesn't affect anyone?????

I guess you haven't heard of what the 9/11 families think of that!

anyone who is affected by a mosque being built blocks away from ground zero is irrational and its unprovable to affect people.

smoking on the other hand is proven to cause cancer and kill people

Thank you for proving my point!

what point did I prove exactly?

 

[johnrocks]

Why do liberals want a mosque on ground zero forced on us?????

Because you wingnut extremists don't get to force your unconstitutional anti-Muslim bigotry on "us"...

..."we" have the Constitution on our side.

FUNNY!

Liberals don't mind forcing their hate of religion on us in schools!

They don't mind removing the word God from state seals (or trying to).

They don't mind removing 150 year old crosses from state buildings!

They don't mind censoring the religious views of students.

They don't mind threatening students with not graduating that pray at their graduations.

But suddenly they are for religious freedom when it comes to a mosque at ground zero??????

Everything you listed to rebuke the Mosque being built on private property concerns religion on public property

 

[uscitizen]

I don't mind the listing of ingredients, in this day and age though, if freedom of choice were truly allowed. I could find a niche in the market by catering to smokers or catering to the more health conscience, with government dictating and limiting freedom of choice, it is limiting our freedom of choices,imho anyway.

i don't even think they should have to list all the ingredients since that would let the competition eventually figure out how to steal the recipe. I just want a simple checklist of things such as:

trans fat: yes or no
hf corn syrup: yes or no

that would be about it

I also want to know the country of origin.

 

[blu]

Liberals don't mind forcing their hate of religion on us in schools!

false. many people (both liberal and consv) simply don't want teachers forcing their religion on kids

They don't mind removing the word God from state seals (or trying to).

it should be removed. this country allows for atheism

They don't mind removing 150 year old crosses from state buildings!

debatable. it shouldn't be in/on/around courthouses, but others its okay. preserving history is a good thing, whether good or bad or indifferent

They don't mind censoring the religious views of students.

you have yet to show where kids weren't allowed to bring bibles. I would be very interested to hear about this

They don't mind threatening students with not graduating that pray at their graduations.

pray out loud? they shoulnd't be allowed to if everyone int he room isn't of the same religion

But suddenly they are for religious freedom when it comes to a mosque at ground zero??????

they have been all along