Libl Hypocrit Watch-GroundZero Mosque = freedom, but cigarrettes and transfat don't??

[teapartysamurai]

I am not for Bans on cigarettes and transfats.

Good!

How about lets get the Greek Orthodox Church that was destroyed on 9/11 rebuilt first?

I showed you the link where the church is their own enemy, the city is already willing to let them build it

I saw no link. Could you please repost it.

 

[blu]

That's the point!

He doesn't believe in freedom.

Look at his number 4!

my number 4 agrees with john???

they have private balconies and rooms for smokers at many bars/restraunts/hotels etc do it there. my position aligns exactly with john's.

So, you can decide WHERE people do things?

Why can't we decide where a mosque goes?

If I own the property, I can certainly decide what activities are allowed or not, including smoking if at all or where it can be done.

you can't decide on where the mosque goes (or if it goes in the particular spot) because you don't own that land and have no say so in it.

its basic property rights here...

 

[teapartysamurai]

every poll I saw about NY people only was something like:

50% for
30% against
20% undecided/don't care

if you have other recent polls to disprove those numbers I would like to see it

As I stated before, the COUNTRY was attacked on 9/11, not just NY City.

so you lied about NY people being against it and my numbers are correct?

and from what I remember the physical attack relevant to this concussion happened in NY and the property of NY and its landowners so they should be able to do as they please without worrying about other states tax payers

I did not lie.

I don't buy your poll numbers.

The public protests don't fit your numbers either.

I simply stated that the COUNTRY was attacked on 9/11.

Apparently you don't want to talk about that, since the COUNTRY as a whole is against this mosque to the tune of about 60% the last time I heard.

 

[blu]

That's the point!

He doesn't believe in freedom.

Look at his number 4!

It starts and ends with personal freedom and private property rights with me, freedom is messy, it will lead to imperfections such as discriminating and such but it beats the alternatives invented thus far.

In other words it's okay to infringe on "freedom" when it comes to someone's pet peeves, but THAT MOSQUE ON GROUND ZERO!!!!!! Well that's different!

whose freedoms did he infringe on?

 

[teapartysamurai]

Everything you listed to rebuke the Mosque being built on private property concerns religion on public property

And where in the Constitution does it say you can ban religion on public property?????

it says you can't force it on other people which is exactly what teacher led prayer does

Who is talking about teacher led prayer?

I'm talking about stopping kids from carrying Bibles, taking down the 10 Commandments from court walls, etc etc.

Nice try at changing the subject to something I never even brought up!

 

[blu]

Good!

How about lets get the Greek Orthodox Church that was destroyed on 9/11 rebuilt first?

I showed you the link where the church is their own enemy, the city is already willing to let them build it

I saw no link. Could you please repost it.

no problem, its been a fast moving thread:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...arrettes-and-transfat-dont-4.html#post2642418

 

[blu]

And where in the Constitution does it say you can ban religion on public property?????

it says you can't force it on other people which is exactly what teacher led prayer does

Who is talking about teacher led prayer?

I'm talking about stopping kids from carrying Bibles, taking down the 10 Commandments from court walls, etc etc.

Nice try at changing the subject to something I never even brought up!

I am reading the links you posted about the bibles being taken away. some are certainly questionable. the story outside of houston with the girls getting their bibles thrown away etc is complete bullshit. I haven't been able to find any references to the court proceedings for it though so I am not sure if the girls told all the truth

 

[teapartysamurai]

my number 4 agrees with john???

they have private balconies and rooms for smokers at many bars/restraunts/hotels etc do it there. my position aligns exactly with john's.

So, you can decide WHERE people do things?

Why can't we decide where a mosque goes?

If I own the property, I can certainly decide what activities are allowed or not, including smoking if at all or where it can be done.

you can't decide on where the mosque goes (or if it goes in the particular spot) because you don't own that land and have no say so in it.

its basic property rights here...

Since WHEN are liberals for property rights, given all the things they do to take them away, from "wetlands" legislation, to the government just taking over HUGE TRACTS OF LAND, to endangered species crap that takes over private land if some stupid rat is "endangered?????"

That is a total joke!

Liberals for property rights? Har de har har!

 

[teapartysamurai]

It starts and ends with personal freedom and private property rights with me, freedom is messy, it will lead to imperfections such as discriminating and such but it beats the alternatives invented thus far.

In other words it's okay to infringe on "freedom" when it comes to someone's pet peeves, but THAT MOSQUE ON GROUND ZERO!!!!!! Well that's different!

whose freedoms did he infringe on?

How about the "freedom" to smoke where you want?

 

[teapartysamurai]

I showed you the link where the church is their own enemy, the city is already willing to let them build it

I saw no link. Could you please repost it.

no problem, its been a fast moving thread:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...arrettes-and-transfat-dont-4.html#post2642418

Um, that's a link to this thread and isn't a link to the info you claimed. Can you try again?

 

[blu]

So, you can decide WHERE people do things?

Why can't we decide where a mosque goes?

If I own the property, I can certainly decide what activities are allowed or not, including smoking if at all or where it can be done.

you can't decide on where the mosque goes (or if it goes in the particular spot) because you don't own that land and have no say so in it.

its basic property rights here...

Since WHEN are liberals for property rights, given all the things they do to take them away, from "wetlands" legislation, to the government just taking over HUGE TRACTS OF LAND, to endangered species crap that takes over private land if some stupid rat is "endangered?????"

That is a total joke!

Liberals for property rights? Har de har har!

neither john nor I are liberal. not sure where you got that from..

either way what does the examples of wetlands, endangered species etc have to do with private property owners being able to decide if they want to build a mosque or let people smoke in their place?

 

[blu]

I saw no link. Could you please repost it.

no problem, its been a fast moving thread:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...arrettes-and-transfat-dont-4.html#post2642418

Um, that's a link to this thread and isn't a link to the info you claimed. Can you try again?

its a link to my post in this thread that linked here:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...-to-rebuild-church-destroyed.html#post2630196

 

[Wry Catcher]

Religion is used by oppressors to make people feel better about the distress they experience due to being poor and/or exploited. If someone ran for office as an agnostic, the clergy - no less a power elite than they were centuries ago - would tell their flock not to vote for a godless creature.
Religion comforts people with unproven 'truths' and the promise of ever lasting salvation. It is classic marketing, used by snake oil salesmen for time eternal.
Religion has been the underlying cause or justification for war for centuries; "God is on our side" both sides believe as they march into the valley of death.

 

[blu]

In other words it's okay to infringe on "freedom" when it comes to someone's pet peeves, but THAT MOSQUE ON GROUND ZERO!!!!!! Well that's different!

whose freedoms did he infringe on?

How about the "freedom" to smoke where you want?

its a property rights issue. private owners should be able to decide if people smoke in their builds or not. cities should be able to decide if people can smoke in public buildings.

outside is a grey area where 99% of the time people should be able to smoke as they please as long as they dont litter the butts.

 

[blu]

Religion is used by oppressors to make people feel better about the distress they experience due to being poor and/or exploited. If someone ran for office as an agnostic, the clergy - no less a power eltie than they were centuries ago - would tell their flock not to vote for a godless creature.
Religion comforts people with unproven 'truths' and the promise of ever lasting salvation. It is classic marketing, used by snake oil salesmen for time eternal.
Religion has been the underlying cause or justification for war for centuries; "God is on our side" both sides believe as they march into the valley of death.

what does any of this have to do with the thread?

 

[Greenbeard]

Did you know you're not even allowed to walk down the street in New York and knife somebody in the stomach? What's that about?

Nice comparison. you are right banning behaviors like Smoking and eating fast food is just like outlawing assualt with a deadly weapon.

Typical Liberal Logic.

They're about as closely related as a transfat ban is to a municipal zoning regulation. Who am I to reject the premise of the OP that all bans on behaviors and actions are equivalent and acceptance of one requires acceptance of another (lest you be charged with hypocrisy)?

Although I believe you're incorrect in believing the OP's author should be considered a liberal.

 

[midcan5]

That comparison makes no sense. The food nuts cross all ideological positions, and since no one on either side of the divide wants to have sick Americans or wants to pay to care for sick Americans, the hypocrite is the thread starter who has run short of sense and now compares apples and crocodiles and sees similarity.

If you love trans-fat have at it, no one is stopping you from clogging your arteries or clouding your lungs, but I bet if someone said the food in our restaurant contains toxins and will eventually kill you, you'd eat somewhere else. Or maybe you are so ideological retarded you think only in the terms of freedom and eating poison proves you're one free soul. LOL


Take the Trans Fat Out of New York : Cardiovascular Disease Prevention & Control : NYC DOHMH

 

[Wry Catcher]

Religion is used by oppressors to make people feel better about the distress they experience due to being poor and/or exploited. If someone ran for office as an agnostic, the clergy - no less a power eltie than they were centuries ago - would tell their flock not to vote for a godless creature.
Religion comforts people with unproven 'truths' and the promise of ever lasting salvation. It is classic marketing, used by snake oil salesmen for time eternal.
Religion has been the underlying cause or justification for war for centuries; "God is on our side" both sides believe as they march into the valley of death.

what does any of this have to do with the thread?

Everything. I'm surprised you don't get it. It's not about property rights, as some argue. It's all about prejudice, hate, fear and hypocrisy. Red meat for the RW, stir up the masses for personal gain. Why else did Gingrich and Palin way in on this issue? The economy, stupid, that's were the energy ought to be, not on a local issue already vetted by the rule of law.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

I'm always incredibly skeptical of any Socialist/Progressive i see preaching about Freedom. Socialism & Freedom just aren't compatible. There is no evidence of any Socialist/Communist Governments around the World who believe in Freedom & Liberty. I just laugh whenever i see a Socialist/Progressive pretending they care about Freedom. Absurdities like Fat Police Gestapos are inevitabilities when you turn to Socialism. Wait till they usher in their "Global Warming" Gestapos. That's already beginning in some areas of the country. I read an article today which showed some communities in Chicago are now using electronic monitors in garbage bins & recycling bins to monitor whether or not their citizens are throwing away their garbage "properly." They already do this in other Socialist nations like Great Britain. Socialism never = Freedom. I think more & more people are figuring this out. Gotta make 2010 count at the ballot box. Get out and vote America.

 

[wihosa]

Ah Freedom, here we have the right wrapping themselves in the flag of freedom.

But no freedom for Americans who own a piece of property and wish to construct a religiously oriented community center.

Why? Because it's not the right religion!