Libertarians-A Question

Discussion in 'Politics' started by random3434, Apr 3, 2009.

  1. random3434
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    random3434 Senior Member

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    I am trying to understand some of your viewpoints better. I found this on Wiki, can you explain what it really means to you, as a Libertarian?

    Libertarianism and anarchism
    Main article: Anarchism
    Anarchism is a political philosophy encompassing many theories and traditions, all opposed to coercion of individuals, especially by government. Although anarchism is usually considered to be a left-wing ideology, it always has included individualists – including anarcho-capitalists – who support pro-property and market-oriented economic structures. Anarchists may support anything from extreme individualism to complete collectivism.

    Anarcho-capitalist Murray Rothbard has warned that the term anarchism refers to two schools of thought, the left-anarchism and the individualist anarchism.[53] Left-anarchism, as Rothbard exemplified, consists of anarcho-communism and syndicalism. He noted that, as Austrian School libertarians differ significantly in economics from the left-anarchists, most 19th century individualist anarchism never identified themselves as such. While Rothbard considers Tuckerite anarchism as a genuine form of libertarianism, Rothbard preferred the term libertarianism over anarchism due to the negative connotations of the latter.


    Non-propertarian libertarianism

    Libertarian socialism
    Main article: Libertarian socialism
    Libertarian socialism aims to create a society in which all violent or coercive institutions would be dissolved, and in their place every person would have free, equal access to tools of information and production, or a society in which such coercive institutions and hierarchies were drastically reduced in scope.[54]

    This equality and freedom would be achieved through the abolition of authoritarian institutions such as an individual's right to own private property,[55] in order that direct control of the means of production and resources will be gained by the working class and society as a whole.

    Political philosophies commonly described as libertarian socialist include: most varieties of anarchism (especially anarchist communism, anarchist collectivism, anarcho-syndicalism[56]), social ecology,[57] and council communism.[58]


    Left-libertarianism
    Main article: Left-libertarianism
    Left-libertarianism is usually regarded as doctrine that has an egalitarian view concerning natural resources, believing that it is not legitimate for someone to claim private ownership of resources to the detriment of others.[1][59][60] Most left libertarians support some form of income redistribution on the grounds of a claim by each individual to be entitled to an equal share of natural resources.[60] Left libertarianism is defended by contemporary theorists such as Peter Vallentyne, Hillel Steiner, Michael Otsuka, and Noam Chomsky.[61] The term is sometimes used as a synonym for libertarian socialism.[62]



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism
     
  2. Annie
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    Annie Diamond Member

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    I put myself more along these lines:

    The Libertarian Manifesto - Forbes.com

     
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  3. Agnapostate
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    The term "libertarian" was first used in print in an 1857 letter of the French anarcho-communist Joseph Dejacque, reflecting the reality that libertarianism was first and foremost an anarcho-socialist movement, which is why libertarian socialism remains the only legitimate form. Libertarianism is now falsely associated with capitalist economics in the U.S., which promotes the widespread misconception that "libertarian socialism" is an oxymoron. For instance, Murray Rothbard and his ilk had a major role in the promotion of "anarcho"-capitalism and "right"-libertarianism, aided by the Objectivist school of Ayn Rand and the Austrian economic school of Ludwig von Mises, Friedrich Hayek, and the current priestly class of Hans-Herman Hoppe, David Friedman, and the rest of the zoo down at the Mises Institute.

    In reality, capitalism is inconsistent with libertarianism because capitalist economic organization requires extensive reliance on hierarchy, and therefore internal firm authoritarianism, as well as external economic authoritarianism, which stems from capitalism's usage of wage labor. Despite the misappropriation of the term by classical liberals, legitimate libertarians are necessarily anti-capitalists, as they must oppose the exploitative usage of wage labor and the subordination of labor under capital that occurs in a capitalist economy.
     
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  4. random3434
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    random3434 Senior Member

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    See, that's why I'm confused, there are so many different takes on it, it's like they want to be a lot of different things to a lot of different people.

    Heck, I voted for the Libertarian candidate in a Presidential Election years ago, but that's because I thought he would have been the best leader for our country at that time.
     
  5. Annie
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    Annie Diamond Member

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    Agna has a point on the label, I think that is the term now applied to those that aren't today's liberals or conservatives, which are really the same thing when in power.
     
  6. Red Dawn
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    Red Dawn Senior Member

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    EZ, here's the deal. At least half, and maybe more, of self-identified "libertarians" on message boards are embarrased former Bush voters, or embarrased republicans.

    I've noticed even the word "liberal" isn't a dirty word anymore. Some cons are trying to attach themselves to the word liberal, by calling themselves "classic liberals" :lol:

    and the word liberal isn't an insult anymore, Sean H and Boss Limbaugh have been reduced to trying to use even more extreme words for leftys, like marxist, radical, and socialist. :lol:
     
  7. Agnapostate
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    The Libertarian Party of the U.S. also has to be distinguished from the political philosophy of (small 'l') libertarianism. Hence, one might be a libertarian, but not a Libertarian, and as we have seen, few Libertarians are legitimate libertarians, at least in my opinion. That party is based on the continuation of an inefficient and authoritarian capitalist economy.
     
  8. Annie
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    Annie Diamond Member

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    Twice in one day? Shocking. Right again. I would NOT join the Libertarian Party of a Ron Paul. Too many in that 'party' are racists and right wing nut jobs.
     
  9. Skull Pilot
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    Skull Pilot Platinum Member

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    I prefer not to call myself a libertarian anymore. I want to reclaim the title of "Liberal" in its true meaning and not the bastardized definition it now has thanks to the Dimocratic party.

    What Is Classical*Liberalism?
     
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  10. Skull Pilot
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    And in your limited view of politics, anyone who disagrees with you voted for GW.

    And you would be wrong again. I have never voted for GW and I have been trying to reclaim the liberal name from you pseudo liberal dimocrats for a long time now.
     

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