Keeping the Peace

[Derideo_Te]

Which brings up the fact that toxic people have no clue they're toxic. Not naming any names, but many posting on this thread are considered toxic to many others. They bait, demean, insult and lie all the whoe telling others how to behave.

You can remove yourself from a situation, but you cannot fix other people

Agreed, you cannot fix them because the only ones who can do that are the toxic people themselves. They have no incentive to fix themselves as long as their behavior is rewarded by your attention. Deny them that attention and refuse to give them any until they alter their behavior and then they will have an incentive to change themselves.

The problem is when the toxic people ....don't know they are toxic. Its of course...everyone else, just not them.

I find it rather funny to ignore them... they just spew more toxic. A win win as far as i am concerned

You bring up a good point, Syrenn. Most of the toxic people are not aware that they are toxic. They either lack empathy for others or they are simply not sufficiently self aware to appreciate how they come across. There is a inherent selfishness and childishness about them. As you observed when ignored they throw temper tantrums in order to gain attention. That is an immature response from a grown adult but inside them there is an undisciplined and selfish child in my opinion.

 

[Gracie]

The FZ is their playground.

 

[Wake]

The best thing to do is to not taunt others. Don't respond to attacks, while being the bigger adult. It's not a game, because there are no winners when people fight malevolently over the pettiest of things. No one is perfect, either. Least of all me. It doesn't feel good to be cruel, or to try and make others suffer. To make them feel miserable. Sometimes the best thing is to do nothing in response, and then find better places and people.

 

[Gracie]

This place is where I enjoy being at, wake. And the majority of people are the better than anywhere else, to ME. Yes, there are many great places on the net. Lots of great people too. But here is where i want to stay and plan to stay. Sometimes everyone just needs a break now and then. So...when I need one, I go somewhere else.

There has to be a happy medium. Each person has to find it for themselves. Mine is to avoid negative petri dish forums, and put on ignore those that never have anything decent to say. Not saying everyone should do that. Just saying I choose to do that.

 

[Wake]

This place is where I enjoy being at, wake. And the majority of people are the better than anywhere else, to ME. Yes, there are many great places on the net. Lots of great people too. But here is where i want to stay and plan to stay. Sometimes everyone just needs a break now and then. So...when I need one, I go somewhere else.

There has to be a happy medium. Each person has to find it for themselves. Mine is to avoid negative petri dish forums, and put on ignore those that never have anything decent to say. Not saying everyone should do that. Just saying I choose to do that.

If you're open to repairing our bridge together, you may send a PM to talk on this further.

 

[R.D.]

The best thing to do is to not taunt others. Don't respond to attacks, while being the bigger adult. It's not a game, because there are no winners when people fight malevolently over the pettiest of things. No one is perfect, either. Least of all me. It doesn't feel good to be cruel, or to try and make others suffer. To make them feel miserable. Sometimes the best thing is to do nothing in response, and then find better places and people.

With all due respect, Wake, you're wrong. It is a game.

You're still trying to fix a problem you claim effects everyone, it doesn't. No one is forced to participate. If you don't like certain players, just ignore them. Unfortunately you've ended up in the mud with these folks because you tried o "fix" them...no one wants someone to stroll in and try to fix them. It creates more hostility.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I've learned to stay away from toxic people, and not let their poisons affect me. Anyone who keeps alive malicious contention, whether it be through not letting go of selfish drama, or trying to bring people down and into depression with ill vibes, is toxic. The kind of people who taunt, ridicule, creates drama out of things that don't merit it, and stirs the pot without care or concern for others are toxic as well.

People like that aren't content to let things go, let people be, or remove themselves from the equation. They lash out at people who simply wanted you to back off and stop, find or create reasons to besmirch your image, tell you to go screw yourself because you refuse to take sides, and use non-tangential issues as tools to hurt other people. Vile, wicked, cruel, vicious, and mean. Pretending to be a good person while stabbing people who refuse to take sides or join in the pettiest of dramas.

All because someone wanted to break up a toxic fight. But I know better, and it's best to stay away from people who have made it extremely clear that they don't want peace. I had worn myself out caring too much to be the peacekeeper, and it was no longer worth it when all you got was venom and gashes. Sometimes toxic people deserve one another, because they love the contention, the hatred, and the struggle. It's so fun to do and say cruel and wicked things all while pretending to be caring for people. You're neither a good nor caring person if you pretend to be kind yet treat people wickedly behind the scenes.

When trying to help toxic people fails, you have no other recourse than to ignore them and let your heart be troubled no more. It's better to focus on the good things in life, instead of being dragged down into some dark, miserable place inside your soul. I don't care for it, so I'm shutting it out and walking away towards the people and things in life that make me happy and content. Might as well, while young and able.

Long ago, after my mom passed, a therapist helped me deal with my toxic sister. She told me, you are the one who decides if someone has the power to hurt your or not. You must not let her have that power. You must find people who are caring and keep the good people close for they are rare, and let the bad ones go, even family. She was right. I had to cut my sister off. It helped her too, to not be enabled by knowing I'll always be there if she did something toxic. She learned she won't get away with that with me. So things are better now. Not great, but I don't let her crap get to me. I live my life the best way I can and she isn't allowed, by me, to get in the way of my happiness. It isn't easy but cutting them out will work eventually. If they don't want help, they'll only get angry if you try. So walking away is sometimes the best option.

I have left abusive relationships (mother and spouse) but I finally had to cut off all contact with my siblings as well. I can't help them and they'll only keep on dragging me down just as they have our whole lives.

Its not just that it can be hard to identify toxic people. For some of us, its hard to believe we deserve to be treated better.

I have said before that it took me 60 years to get it right and its true. I have a perfect life now. I finally have what I have worked for my whole life. I allowed those people to treat me like crap and I never will again. No more guilting me into helping them, giving them money. No more letting them suck the life out of me.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

A serious thought I want to throw out there: I mean, I can't think of a person who is born to be toxic. He or she learns it with time.

One good question would be: why?

If you ever want to hear a truly heartbreaking story, I'll tell you about my mother's life.

That's the same mother who, daily, beat me, kicked me, put cigarettes on me and more.

Something else I've thought is -

If the people we've described as "toxic" read this thread, they would say the same as we have said here - that they have been victimized by toxic people.

 

[Gracie]

This place is where I enjoy being at, wake. And the majority of people are the better than anywhere else, to ME. Yes, there are many great places on the net. Lots of great people too. But here is where i want to stay and plan to stay. Sometimes everyone just needs a break now and then. So...when I need one, I go somewhere else.

There has to be a happy medium. Each person has to find it for themselves. Mine is to avoid negative petri dish forums, and put on ignore those that never have anything decent to say. Not saying everyone should do that. Just saying I choose to do that.

If you're open to repairing our bridge together, you may send a PM to talk on this further.

The bridge was untied at this end but never broken. With that said, I apprecaite some of the things you say. Some I don't. I prefer to speak in public just as we are doing right now. Nothing secret or "behind the scenes" about it and I prefer it that way.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I have only ever been forced to be around one toxic person. He was the friend of a friend and we used to go to gun shows together. Toxic person was always a dreary asshole. One day I asked my friend why he put up with him, and his response was that he felt obligated because they had been friends since grade school.

My response was on the order of, "but, he makes you miserable, he doesn't pay for his own food, you basically have to take care of him....what do YOU get out of the relationship?"

He couldn't answer that. So a few weeks pass and they meet me at the next gun show and once again I ask my friend what does he get from the relationship. And this time I asked him in front of the toxic one. And this time I addressed the toxic one directly and made it clear to my friend that the toxic person was a leech. A succubus who's sole reason for being was to make all of those around him miserable. That if my friend never saw him again the leech would take no notice and would merely find some other poor person to afflict.

A few weeks later just my friend showed up...no leech in tow.... He hasn't visited the toxic one in over 30 years now and he thanks me at least once a year for opening his eyes.

I agree 100%.

More bad vibes are dissipating, so that's a good thing for everyone in general. Toxicity is contagious, deceitful, and cruel. If you stay away from it, and don't feed the trolls you'll meet in life, you will keep your integrity intact. If it is hopeless, stay away from toxic people, and enjoy your life with loved ones and good people while you still can.

Just an FYI. If you really want to stay away for toxic people you should avoid the FZ as much as possible. There are more toxic people per post in this area of USMB than the rest of it combined in my opinion. And that goes across the entire spectrum of posters. Not singling anyone or any side out. Just my observation that the FZ has the highest concentration of toxicity.

I still venture down here and read some posts and make the occasional one too. But that is the exception rather than the rule. My personal rule is to abstain from getting involved down here. I don't care what anyone posts about me down here because I take it from whence it comes. I don't feel any need to defend myself or anyone else in this area.

I just walk away from it all because (a) I don't need the drama, and (b) anyone trying to bring you down is already beneath you to begin with.

Just my 2 cents. No offense intended to anyone personally. Just my honest opinion.

Peace
DT

Why is it that some people need to be so nasty here? None of them would talk like that face to face but they don't hesitate here. Why is that?

One thing that seems to be universal among abusers is that they can be charming and good to some people while being vile and vicious to others. And none of them will be abusive to anyone they believe can give it back to them in kind.

I leave this board every so often when I find that I'm getting nasty and rude. I don't want to be so lazy that I use name calling and foul language instead of intellect.

 

[Gracie]

Luddly...there are toxic people and there are abusive people and there are insane people. You mother sounds like all three. So was my mother. All three. My sister is just toxic. It is the results of my mother poisoning HER and her outlook on life. I ran the other way. My sister stayed.

We all feel certain people are toxic and take steps to avoid them in real life. We need to do the same thing with online people. It's harder to do because you don't know they are toxic until you are already friends with them. And by then, you have been sucked dry and either become an energy sucking hateful vampire, or you try to run as fast as you can with them snapping at your heels.

Do what you can to protect yourself. That's all you CAN do.

 

[Gracie]

I have only ever been forced to be around one toxic person. He was the friend of a friend and we used to go to gun shows together. Toxic person was always a dreary asshole. One day I asked my friend why he put up with him, and his response was that he felt obligated because they had been friends since grade school.

My response was on the order of, "but, he makes you miserable, he doesn't pay for his own food, you basically have to take care of him....what do YOU get out of the relationship?"

He couldn't answer that. So a few weeks pass and they meet me at the next gun show and once again I ask my friend what does he get from the relationship. And this time I asked him in front of the toxic one. And this time I addressed the toxic one directly and made it clear to my friend that the toxic person was a leech. A succubus who's sole reason for being was to make all of those around him miserable. That if my friend never saw him again the leech would take no notice and would merely find some other poor person to afflict.

A few weeks later just my friend showed up...no leech in tow.... He hasn't visited the toxic one in over 30 years now and he thanks me at least once a year for opening his eyes.

More bad vibes are dissipating, so that's a good thing for everyone in general. Toxicity is contagious, deceitful, and cruel. If you stay away from it, and don't feed the trolls you'll meet in life, you will keep your integrity intact. If it is hopeless, stay away from toxic people, and enjoy your life with loved ones and good people while you still can.

Just an FYI. If you really want to stay away for toxic people you should avoid the FZ as much as possible. There are more toxic people per post in this area of USMB than the rest of it combined in my opinion. And that goes across the entire spectrum of posters. Not singling anyone or any side out. Just my observation that the FZ has the highest concentration of toxicity.

I still venture down here and read some posts and make the occasional one too. But that is the exception rather than the rule. My personal rule is to abstain from getting involved down here. I don't care what anyone posts about me down here because I take it from whence it comes. I don't feel any need to defend myself or anyone else in this area.

I just walk away from it all because (a) I don't need the drama, and (b) anyone trying to bring you down is already beneath you to begin with.

Just my 2 cents. No offense intended to anyone personally. Just my honest opinion.

Peace
DT

Why is it that some people need to be so nasty here? None of them would talk like that face to face but they don't hesitate here. Why is that?

One thing that seems to be universal among abusers is that they can be charming and good to some people while being vile and vicious to others. And none of them will be abusive to anyone they believe can give it back to them in kind.

I leave this board every so often when I find that I'm getting nasty and rude. I don't want to be so lazy that I use name calling and foul language instead of intellect.

1. Because they can. They are behind a monitor.

2. Insecurities. No empathy. No compassion.

3. Me too. Other places let me be at peace and able to recharge my batteries and be who I want to be and the poison that seeped into my bones to wear off.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Luddly...there are toxic people and there are abusive people and there are insane people. You mother sounds like all three. So was my mother. All three. My sister is just toxic. It is the results of my mother poisoning HER and her outlook on life. I ran the other way. My sister stayed.

We all feel certain people are toxic and take steps to avoid them in real life. We need to do the same thing with online people. It's harder to do because you don't know they are toxic until you are already friends with them. And by then, you have been sucked dry and either become an energy sucking hateful vampire, or you try to run as fast as you can with them snapping at your heels.

Do what you can to protect yourself. That's all you CAN do.

Thank you but I'm quite healthy - mentally and physically. I have taken some real shit in my life and I'm stronger for it.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Just an FYI. If you really want to stay away for toxic people you should avoid the FZ as much as possible. There are more toxic people per post in this area of USMB than the rest of it combined in my opinion. And that goes across the entire spectrum of posters. Not singling anyone or any side out. Just my observation that the FZ has the highest concentration of toxicity.

I still venture down here and read some posts and make the occasional one too. But that is the exception rather than the rule. My personal rule is to abstain from getting involved down here. I don't care what anyone posts about me down here because I take it from whence it comes. I don't feel any need to defend myself or anyone else in this area.

I just walk away from it all because (a) I don't need the drama, and (b) anyone trying to bring you down is already beneath you to begin with.

Just my 2 cents. No offense intended to anyone personally. Just my honest opinion.

Peace
DT

Why is it that some people need to be so nasty here? None of them would talk like that face to face but they don't hesitate here. Why is that?

One thing that seems to be universal among abusers is that they can be charming and good to some people while being vile and vicious to others. And none of them will be abusive to anyone they believe can give it back to them in kind.

I leave this board every so often when I find that I'm getting nasty and rude. I don't want to be so lazy that I use name calling and foul language instead of intellect.

1. Because they can. They are behind a monitor.

2. Insecurities. No empathy. No compassion.

3. Me too. Other places let me be at peace and able to recharge my batteries and be who I want to be and the poison that seeped into my bones to wear off.

I should have made it clear that those are rhetorical questions and not asking for actual answers.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Why is it that some people need to be so nasty here? None of them would talk like that face to face but they don't hesitate here. Why is that?

One thing that seems to be universal among abusers is that they can be charming and good to some people while being vile and vicious to others. And none of them will be abusive to anyone they believe can give it back to them in kind.

I leave this board every so often when I find that I'm getting nasty and rude. I don't want to be so lazy that I use name calling and foul language instead of intellect.

1. Because they can. They are behind a monitor.

2. Insecurities. No empathy. No compassion.

3. Me too. Other places let me be at peace and able to recharge my batteries and be who I want to be and the poison that seeped into my bones to wear off.

I should have made it clear that those are rhetorical questions and not asking for actual answers.

BTW, the biggest reason for all abuse is fear.

Those who write the worst here are the most fearful in their everyday lives.

 

[Granny]

I had a toxic mother and it took me years to get myself to a place where I could become at least a reasonably whole person. I often thought over the years that I could forgive her if I thought she was mentally ill, but the truth is she was just mean. I spent my pre-school years in isolation - no kids to play with ... and I can clearly remember looking out across the road at this place where all these children were outside playing. I can remember in my older years my mother saying, in this voice intonement that I don't know how to describe, "You was so desperate for somebody to play with you'd even play with them little pickaninnies that came by when their parents came to buy flowers to sell."

I'll never know the truth about why I was put in an orphanage at age 7 - anytime I brought the subject up I'd be met with stone silence - and that silence spoke volumes. I didn't see my family that much during those years and I could never figure out why I was sent to one 120 miles from home when there were 3 orphanages right there in the city where we lived - all of them accessible by public transportation.

I have some memory loss about some things - I know I got one hell of a beating at the orphanage and I don't have a clue who gave me that beating or why - I only remember the aftermath. I learned to stifle my emotions, not to cry, only to laugh when appropriate and then very quietly. I was suicidal as a teenager, when I didn't think there was no other way out - and, ironically enough, it was the kids at the orphanage who always pulled me through: I couldn't let them find out that the "bad guys" finally got to me!! I didn't quite realize it at the time, but those kids were my brothers and sisters - and we reunited as a group some 30 years after the fact and it was just like we had seen each other "yesterday". We took up right where we left off so many years ago - and, oh, the stories we told during that reunion.

The nightmares and absolute fear started in when I returned to live with my mother and stopped "just like that" when I graduated HS and left home. The only real hangover I still have is that I HAVE to have covers on me when I sleep because it's the only way I feel safe.

I had a couple mental breakdowns along the way, one of which was a doozie, but I've gotten through it. Somehow, I managed to raise three truly great children who I am so proud of. I'm not quite sure how - I know I made mistakes along the way - but I think I had some sort of subconscious thought to do the opposite of what my mother did. I do remember at some point while under her roof making the decision that I did not want to be like her when I grew up. I also owe a great deal of thanks to my late in-laws. I was never allowed to see my grandparents - a promise my mother made to them. And that was a huge factor in making sure my children saw their grandparents. They spent all their summers living with their grandparents and getting a real sense of family. Even though their dad and I divorced I always remained a member of their family and love them all to this day.

Toxicity is a killer and anyone who can get away from it should do that as soon as possible. Don't walk - RUN!!!

 

[Gracie]

at you Granny.

You did good. You are stronger than you think. And I am sorry you, too, experienced that with the very person who should have protected you and loved you. Your mother.
Some are just not cut out to give birth. Ours were in that category.
I won't go into detail (weaponry by data miners and archivers), but I can feel your pain. But..like I said...you made it. Keep those covers over your head. We all need a sanctuary. For me..it's my dogs. And being alone in the garden. Just me and the animals. They have no hatred for me.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

I had a toxic mother and it took me years to get myself to a place where I could become at least a reasonably whole person. I often thought over the years that I could forgive her if I thought she was mentally ill, but the truth is she was just mean. I spent my pre-school years in isolation - no kids to play with ... and I can clearly remember looking out across the road at this place where all these children were outside playing. I can remember in my older years my mother saying, in this voice intonement that I don't know how to describe, "You was so desperate for somebody to play with you'd even play with them little pickaninnies that came by when their parents came to buy flowers to sell."

I'll never know the truth about why I was put in an orphanage at age 7 - anytime I brought the subject up I'd be met with stone silence - and that silence spoke volumes. I didn't see my family that much during those years and I could never figure out why I was sent to one 120 miles from home when there were 3 orphanages right there in the city where we lived - all of them accessible by public transportation.

I have some memory loss about some things - I know I got one hell of a beating at the orphanage and I don't have a clue who gave me that beating or why - I only remember the aftermath. I learned to stifle my emotions, not to cry, only to laugh when appropriate and then very quietly. I was suicidal as a teenager, when I didn't think there was no other way out - and, ironically enough, it was the kids at the orphanage who always pulled me through: I couldn't let them find out that the "bad guys" finally got to me!! I didn't quite realize it at the time, but those kids were my brothers and sisters - and we reunited as a group some 30 years after the fact and it was just like we had seen each other "yesterday". We took up right where we left off so many years ago - and, oh, the stories we told during that reunion.

The nightmares and absolute fear started in when I returned to live with my mother and stopped "just like that" when I graduated HS and left home. The only real hangover I still have is that I HAVE to have covers on me when I sleep because it's the only way I feel safe.

I had a couple mental breakdowns along the way, one of which was a doozie, but I've gotten through it. Somehow, I managed to raise three truly great children who I am so proud of. I'm not quite sure how - I know I made mistakes along the way - but I think I had some sort of subconscious thought to do the opposite of what my mother did. I do remember at some point while under her roof making the decision that I did not want to be like her when I grew up. I also owe a great deal of thanks to my late in-laws. I was never allowed to see my grandparents - a promise my mother made to them. And that was a huge factor in making sure my children saw their grandparents. They spent all their summers living with their grandparents and getting a real sense of family. Even though their dad and I divorced I always remained a member of their family and love them all to this day.

Toxicity is a killer and anyone who can get away from it should do that as soon as possible. Don't walk - RUN!!!

[MENTION=21926]Granny[/MENTION] - I'm sad for you because it sounds a lot like my own childhood. I don't know whether my mother was crazy or just mean but she hated me from the day I was born. She used to say that if she had known about abortion in 1946, I wouldn't be here now. She always wanted to make me cry. She would just keep hitting and hitting, trying to make me cry. So now I just don't. Can't.

After a childhood of beatings and being burned with cigarettes, I came home from school on my 16th birthday to find the door locked and my things thrown in the front yard. So, I was homeless, no money, no home, waited tables and lived over the cafe in a tiny town and no one at school had any idea. After I was in an accident that crushed the bottom half of my face, the authorities made my family take me be for a few months but I've worked since I was 13 and been on my own since 16.

I had 4 siblings, none of whom were abused or mistreated.

On my mother's deathbed, she had someone else call me. She told me she was sorry she had been such a bad mother. I remember going cold and shaking and quietly hanging up the phone. I didn't go to her funeral.

 

[Esmeralda]

I have only ever been forced to be around one toxic person. He was the friend of a friend and we used to go to gun shows together. Toxic person was always a dreary asshole. One day I asked my friend why he put up with him, and his response was that he felt obligated because they had been friends since grade school.

My response was on the order of, "but, he makes you miserable, he doesn't pay for his own food, you basically have to take care of him....what do YOU get out of the relationship?"

He couldn't answer that. So a few weeks pass and they meet me at the next gun show and once again I ask my friend what does he get from the relationship. And this time I asked him in front of the toxic one. And this time I addressed the toxic one directly and made it clear to my friend that the toxic person was a leech. A succubus who's sole reason for being was to make all of those around him miserable. That if my friend never saw him again the leech would take no notice and would merely find some other poor person to afflict.

A few weeks later just my friend showed up...no leech in tow.... He hasn't visited the toxic one in over 30 years now and he thanks me at least once a year for opening his eyes.

More bad vibes are dissipating, so that's a good thing for everyone in general. Toxicity is contagious, deceitful, and cruel. If you stay away from it, and don't feed the trolls you'll meet in life, you will keep your integrity intact. If it is hopeless, stay away from toxic people, and enjoy your life with loved ones and good people while you still can.

Just an FYI. If you really want to stay away for toxic people you should avoid the FZ as much as possible. There are more toxic people per post in this area of USMB than the rest of it combined in my opinion. And that goes across the entire spectrum of posters. Not singling anyone or any side out. Just my observation that the FZ has the highest concentration of toxicity.

I still venture down here and read some posts and make the occasional one too. But that is the exception rather than the rule. My personal rule is to abstain from getting involved down here. I don't care what anyone posts about me down here because I take it from whence it comes. I don't feel any need to defend myself or anyone else in this area.

I just walk away from it all because (a) I don't need the drama, and (b) anyone trying to bring you down is already beneath you to begin with.

Just my 2 cents. No offense intended to anyone personally. Just my honest opinion.

Peace
DT

Very true but what if you want to go there and laugh.

The FZ can be like a soap opera. I don't post in it when it's like that, and have very seldom posted in it anyway, but when it's a downright soap opera, it's more like entertainment than anything else. After a point, though, it gets kind of noxious and Jerry Springerish.

 

[Grandma]

Just an FYI. If you really want to stay away for toxic people you should avoid the FZ as much as possible. There are more toxic people per post in this area of USMB than the rest of it combined in my opinion. And that goes across the entire spectrum of posters. Not singling anyone or any side out. Just my observation that the FZ has the highest concentration of toxicity.

I still venture down here and read some posts and make the occasional one too. But that is the exception rather than the rule. My personal rule is to abstain from getting involved down here. I don't care what anyone posts about me down here because I take it from whence it comes. I don't feel any need to defend myself or anyone else in this area.

I just walk away from it all because (a) I don't need the drama, and (b) anyone trying to bring you down is already beneath you to begin with.

Just my 2 cents. No offense intended to anyone personally. Just my honest opinion.

Peace
DT

Not just the Flame Zone, but the Rubber Room and Badlands too.

Some of the threads are started there, but a lot are sent down from other forums upstairs because they're - toxic.

I read most of the junk there, I'll add in comments too. Why? Because I think it's a good idea to keep an eye on some of those people. I find it very strange that some members post only down there and avoid the rest of the USMB.

After rolling around in the waste down there I like to come up to the Lounge to relax and clean off the slimy residue.