John Kerry on Rush Limbaugh’s Comments on Israel

[red states rule]

Crickets Chirping in the background.

or the voices in your head

 

[Gunny]

I have listened to one of the men who was on the boat with Kerry during that fight. Remember, this is an eye-witness account, not some Swiftie looking from a distance, and the version I heard (not read) from the person's lips. From what he said, the guy was not shot in the back; they thought he was reloading his weapon.

As for treason, I only have one thing to say: was he charged with treason? If not, your point is moot.

First, save your "eyewitness" explanation. I laready have stated I will not judge him on his actions without verifiable evidence. You say some "eyewitness" who was not a "Swiftie" (if not, then WHO and WHAT was this eyewitness -- a Vietnamese?) said he didn't, and other witnesses said he did. So what do you have? Hearsay from both sides.

The fact is, he was engaged in combat, and if he felt the Vietnamese he shot was a threat by undescernable actions, then he was justified in opening fire, IMO, and I cannot say I would not have done the same without having been there.

As for treason, whether or not he was charged with it, he committed it. I still recall the political climate of the day. Charging an anti-war jackass with being one would have raised such a wail the Man in the Moon would have heard it. It was popular to be anti-government, and anti-Vietnam, and basically an unpatriotic, UnAmerican piece of shit. Simple as that.

 

[red states rule]

First, save your "eyewitness" explanation. I laready have stated I will not judge him on his actions without verifiable evidence. You say some "eyewitness" who was not a "Swiftie" (if not, then WHO and WHAT was this eyewitness -- a Vietnamese?) said he didn't, and other witnesses said he did. So what do you have? Hearsay from both sides.

The fact is, he was engaged in combat, and if he felt the Vietnamese he shot was a threat by undescernable actions, then he was justified in opening fire, IMO, and I cannot say I would not have done the same without having been there.

As for treason, whether or not he was charged with it, he committed it. I still recall the political climate of the day. Charging an anti-war jackass with being one would have raised such a wail the Man in the Moon would have heard it. It was popular to be anti-government, and anti-Vietnam, and basically an unpatriotic, UnAmerican piece of shit. Simple as that.

Kerry showed his true self when he spit in the face of all Viet Nam troops when he called them war criminals

He called US troops in Iraq terrorists

He has turned his back on Joe Liberman

and he made the insane statement Israel would not be cat war if he was elected

The man is a loon

 

[Bonnie]

What's worse: A man that lied in the past, or a man that lies right now?

Your so right with Kerry we get BOTH!!!

 

[Bonnie]

As is Bush. They both are easy to pick apart. Sometimes I get the impression with the 2004 elections, a lot of the MOR people voted for who they disliked the least as opposed to who they actually liked...

And if you look at it from that persepctive it says even less about Kerry

I don't know, many many people stood in line for hours to vote, that usually means people are pretty invested in the outcome.

 

[Gunny]

Kerry showed his true self when he spit in the face of all Viet Nam troops when he called them war criminals

He called US troops in Iraq terrorists

He has turned his back on Joe Liberman

and he made the insane statement Israel would not be cat war if he was elected

The man is a loon

You don't have to sell me on Kerry. I've been pretty outspoken about him. I'm just not willing to do exactly what he has done and unjustly accuse another person in the military of a crime without evidence, for his split-second judgement in a firefight.

 

[red states rule]

And if you look at it from that persepctive it says even less about Kerry

I don't know, many many people stood in line for hours to vote, that usually means people are pretty invested in the outcome.

The last time the Dems got more then 50% of the vote in a Presidental election was Peanut Carter

That is proof of how low the Dems have sunk

 

[CharlestonChad]

When did Bush say that, and why do you consider that a lie?

He said that before we began the war in Iraq. I consider it a lie because there has NEVER been any evidence that Saddam and Al-Qaeda have ever had an operational connection.

If I remember correctly, didn't Saddam Hussein have a standing policy of paying the family of Palestinian suicide bombers $25,000?

Yes, Saddam paid the families $15,000 more than the industry standard. Not sure how this relates to Al-Qaeda.

You do know what Al Qaeda is, don't you? I'm sure you've heard the term Islam before? Shirley you must know that they are all connected.

So what if Al Qaeda is a radical Islamic terror group. We're talking about Iraq being connect to Al Qaeda through means other than association by religion.

What was the name of that well known terrorist who was found dead in Iraq? Jeez, the name escapes me now. But they all sound the same after a while, don't they?

Muhammad Aliasshtazzaysh

Try the next lie.

You have to find some credible source that can find a connection between Iraq and Al-Qaeda in which Mr. Bush described.

 

[red states rule]

Let's think about this:

You have a problem with President Bush because he served in the Military but wasnt assigned to Vietnam, he isnt worthy of being President.

Yet, President Clinton dodged the draft altogether and you guys declared for years that it didnt matter...

You cant figure out why Clinton is being brought up? Its easy. To demonstrate how hypocritical you are.

John "I served in Viet Nam" Kerry reads a book everyday - his wife's bank book

 

[red states rule]

Here are links between Al-Qaeda and Saddam


http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp



The CIA has confirmed, in interviews with detainees and informants it finds highly credible, that al Qaeda's Number 2, Ayman al-Zawahiri, met with Iraqi intelligence in Baghdad in 1992 and 1998. More disturbing, according to an administration official familiar with briefings the CIA has given President Bush, the Agency has "irrefutable evidence" that the Iraqi regime paid Zawahiri $300,000 in 1998, around the time his Islamic Jihad was merging with al Qaeda. "It's a lock," says this source. Other administration officials are a bit more circumspect, noting that the intelligence may have come from a single source. Still, four sources spread across the national security hierarchy have confirmed the payment.

In interviews conducted over the past six weeks with uniformed officers on the ground in Iraq, intelligence officials, and senior security strategists, several things became clear. Contrary to the claims of its critics, the Bush administration has consistently underplayed the connections between Saddam Hussein and al Qaeda. Evidence of these links existed before the war. In making its public case against the Iraq regime, the Bush administration used only a fraction of the intelligence it had accumulated documenting such collaboration. The intelligence has, in most cases, gotten stronger since the end of the war. And through interrogations of high-ranking Iraqi officials, documents from the regime, and further interrogation of al Qaeda detainees, a clearer picture of the links between Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein is emerging.

To better understand the administration's case on these links, it's important to examine three elements of this debate: what the administration alleged, the evidence the administration had but didn't use, and what the government has learned since the war.


WHAT THE ADMINISTRATION ALLEGED
TOP U.S. OFFICIALS linked Iraq and al Qaeda in newspaper op-eds, on talk shows, and in speeches. But the most detailed of their allegations came in an October 7, 2002, letter from CIA director George Tenet to Senate Intelligence chairman Bob Graham and in Secretary of State Colin Powell's February 5, 2003, presentation to the United Nations Security Council.

The Tenet letter declassified CIA reporting on weapons of mass destruction and Iraq's links to al Qaeda. Two sentences on WMD garnered most media attention, but the intelligence chief's comments on al Qaeda deserved notice. "We have solid reporting of senior level contacts between Iraq and al Qa'ida going back a decade," Tenet wrote. "Credible information indicates that Iraq and al Qa'ida have discussed safe haven and reciprocal non-aggression. Since Operation Enduring Freedom [in Afghanistan], we have solid evidence of the presence in Iraq of al Qa'ida members, including some that have been in Baghdad. We have credible reporting that al Qa'ida leaders sought contacts in Iraq who could help them acquire WMD capabilities. The reporting also stated that Iraq has provided training to al Qa'ida members in the areas of poisons and gases and making conventional bombs." In sum, the letter said, "Iraq's increasing support to extremist Palestinians, coupled with
growing indications of a relationship with al Qa'ida, suggest that Baghdad's links to terrorists will increase, even absent US military actions."

That this assessment came from the CIA--with its history of institutional skepticism about the links--was significant. CIA analysts had long contended that Saddam Hussein's secular regime would not collaborate with Islamic fundamentalists like bin Laden--even though the Baathists had exploited Islam for years, whenever it suited their purposes. Critics of the administration insist the CIA was "pressured" by an extensive and aggressive intelligence operation set up by the Pentagon to find ties where none existed. But the Pentagon team consisted of two people, at times assisted by two others. Their assignment was not to collect new intelligence but to evaluate existing intelligence gathered by the CIA, with particular attention to any possible Iraq-al Qaeda collaboration. A CIA counterterrorism team was given a similar task, and while many agency analysts remained skeptical about links, the counterterrorism experts came away convinced that there had been cooperation.

For one thing, they cross-referenced old intelligence with new information provided by high-level al Qaeda detainees. Reports of collaboration grew in number and specificity. The case grew stronger. Throughout the summer and fall of 2002, al Qaeda operatives held in Guantanamo corroborated previously sketchy reports of a series of meetings in Khartoum, Sudan, home to al Qaeda during the mid-90s. U.S. officials learned more about the activities of Abu Abdullah al-Iraqi, an al Qaeda WMD specialist sent by bin Laden to seek WMD training, and possibly weapons, from the Iraqi regime. Intelligence specialists also heard increasingly detailed reports about meetings in Baghdad between al Qaeda leaders and Uday Hussein in April 1998, at a birthday celebration for Saddam.

In December 2002, as the Bush administration prepared its public case for war with Iraq, White House officials sifted through reams of these intelligence reports on ties between Saddam Hussein's regime and al Qaeda. Some of the reporting was solid, some circumstantial. The White House identified those elements of the reports it wanted to use publicly and asked the CIA to declassify them. The Agency agreed to declassify some 75 percent of the requested intelligence.

According to administration sources, Colin Powell, in his presentation before the U.N. Security Council, used only 10 or 15 percent of the newly declassified material. He relied heavily on the intelligence in Tenet's letter. Press reports about preparations for the Powell presentation have suggested that Powell refused to use the abundance of CIA documents because he found them thin and unpersuasive. This is only half right. Powell was certainly the most skeptical senior administration official about Iraq-al Qaeda ties. But several administration officials involved in preparing his U.N. presentation say that his reluctance to focus on those links had more to do with the forum for his speech--the Security Council--than with concerns about the reliability of the information.

Powell's presentation sought to do two things: make a compelling case to the world, and to the American public, about the threat posed by Saddam Hussein; and more immediately, win approval for a second U.N. resolution explicitly authorizing the use of force. The second of these objectives, these officials say, required Powell to focus the presentation on Hussein's repeated violations of Security Council resolutions. (Even in the brief portion of Powell's talk focused on Iraq-al Qaeda links, he internationalized the case, pointing out that the bin Laden network had targeted "France, Britain, Spain, Italy, Germany, and Russia.") Others in the administration, including Vice President Dick Cheney, favored using more of the declassified information about Hussein's support of international terrorism and al Qaeda.

Powell spent just 10 minutes of a 90-minute presentation on the "sinister nexus between Iraq and the al Qaeda terrorist network." He mentioned intelligence showing that Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a known al Qaeda associate injured in Afghanistan, had traveled to Baghdad for medical treatment. Powell linked Zarqawi to Ansar al-Islam, an al Qaeda cell operating in a Kurdish region "outside Saddam Hussein's controlled Iraq." Powell told the Security Council that the United States had approached an unnamed "friendly security service"--Jordan's--"to approach Baghdad about extraditing Zarqawi," providing information and details "that should have made it easy to find Zarqawi." Iraq did nothing. Finally, Powell asserted that al Qaeda leaders and senior Iraqi officials had "met at least eight times" since the early 1990s.

These claims, the critics maintain, were "hyped" and "exaggerated."



WHAT THE ADMINISTRATION DIDN'T USE
IF THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION had been out to hype the threat from an al Qaeda-Saddam link, it stands to reason that it would have used every shred of incriminating evidence at its disposal. Instead, the administration was restrained in its use of available intelligence. What the Bush administration left out is in some ways as revealing as what it included.

* Iraqi defectors had been saying for years that Saddam's regime trained "non-Iraqi Arab terrorists" at a camp in Salman Pak, south of Baghdad. U.N. inspectors had confirmed the camp's existence, including the presence of a Boeing 707. Defectors say the plane was used to train hijackers; the Iraqi regime said it was used in counterterrorism training. Sabah Khodada, a captain in the Iraqi Army, worked at Salman Pak. In October 2001, he told PBS's "Frontline" about what went on there. "Training is majorly on terrorism. They would be trained on assassinations, kidnapping, hijacking of airplanes, hijacking of buses, public buses, hijacking of trains and all other kinds of operations related to terrorism. . . . All this training is directly toward attacking American targets, and American interests."

But the Bush administration said little about Salman Pak as it demonstrated links between Iraq and al Qaeda. According to administration sources, some detainees who provided credible evidence of other links between Iraq and al Qaeda, including training in terrorism and WMD, insist they have no knowledge of Salman Pak. Khodada, the Iraqi army captain, also professed ignorance of whether the trainees were members of al Qaeda. "Nobody came and told us, 'This is al Qaeda people,'" he explained, "but I know there were some Saudis, there were some Afghanis. There were some other people from other countries getting trained."

* On February 13, 2003, the government of the Philippines asked Hisham al Hussein, the second secretary of the Iraqi embassy in Manila, to leave the country. According to telephone records obtained by Philippine intelligence, Hussein had been in frequent contact with two leaders of Abu Sayyaf, an al Qaeda affiliate in South Asia, immediately before and immediately after they detonated a bomb in Zamboanga City. That attack killed two Filipinos and an American Special Forces soldier and injured several others. Hussein left the Philippines for Iraq after he was "PNG'd"--declared persona non grata--by the Philippine government and has not been heard from since.

According to a report in the Christian Science Monitor, an Abu Sayyaf leader who planned the attack bragged on television a month after the bombing that Iraq had contacted him about conducting joint operations. Philippine intelligence officials were initially skeptical of his boasting, but after finding the telephone records they believed him.

* No fewer than five high-ranking Czech officials have publicly confirmed that Mohammed Atta, the lead September 11 hijacker, met with Ahmed Khalil Ibrahim al-Ani, an Iraqi intelligence officer working at the Iraqi embassy, in Prague five months before the hijacking. Media leaks here and in the Czech Republic have called into question whether Atta was in Prague on the key dates--between April 4 and April 11, 2001. And several high-ranking administration officials are "agnostic" as to whether the meeting took place. Still, the public position of the Czech government to this day is that it did.

That assertion should be seen in the context of Atta's curious stop-off in Prague the previous spring, as he traveled to the United States. Atta flew to Prague from Germany on May 30, 2000, but did not have a valid visa and was denied entry. He returned to Germany, obtained the proper paperwork, and took a bus back to Prague. One day later, he left for the United States.

Despite the Czech government's confirmation of the Atta-al Ani meeting, the Bush administration dropped it as evidence of an al Qaeda-Iraq connection in September 2002. Far from hyping this episode, administration officials refrained from citing it as the debate over the Iraq war heated up in Congress, in the country, and at the U.N.



WHAT THE GOVERNMENT HAS LEARNED SINCE THE WAR
THE ADMINISTRATION'S CRITICS, including several of the Democratic presidential candidates, have alluded to new "evidence" they say confirms Iraq and al Qaeda had no relationship before the war. They have not shared that evidence.

Even as the critics withhold the basis for their allegations, evidence on the other side is piling up. Ansar al-Islam--the al Qaeda cell formed in June 2001 that operated out of northern Iraq before the war, notably attacking Kurdish enemies of Saddam--has stepped up its activities elsewhere in the country. In some cases, say national security officials, Ansar is joining with remnants of Saddam's regime to attack Americans and nongovernmental organizations working in Iraq. There is some reporting, unconfirmed at this point, that the recent bombing of the U.N. headquarters was the result of a joint operation between Baathists and Ansar al-Islam.

And there are reports of more direct links between the Iraqi regime and bin Laden. Farouk Hijazi, former Iraqi ambassador to Turkey and Saddam's longtime outreach agent to Islamic fundamentalists, has been captured. In his initial interrogations, Hijazi admitted meeting with senior al Qaeda leaders at Saddam's behest in 1994. According to administration officials familiar with his questioning, he has subsequently admitted additional contacts, including a meeting in late 1997. Hijazi continues to deny that he met with bin Laden on December 21, 1998, to offer the al Qaeda leader safe haven in Iraq. U.S. officials don't believe his denial.

For one thing, the meeting was reported in the press at the time. It also fits a pattern of contacts surrounding Operation Desert Fox, the series of missile strikes the Clinton administration launched at Iraq beginning December 16, 1998. The bombing ended 70 hours later, on December 19, 1998. Administration officials now believe Hijazi left for Afghanistan as the bombing ended and met with bin Laden two days later.

Earlier that year, at another point of increased tension between the United States and Iraq, Hussein sought to step up contacts with al Qaeda. On February 18, 1998, after the Iraqis repeatedly refused to permit U.N. weapons inspectors into sensitive sites, President Bill Clinton went to the Pentagon and delivered a hawkish speech about Hussein's weapons of mass destruction and his links to "an unholy axis of terrorists, drug traffickers, and organized international criminals." Said Clinton: "We have to defend our future from these predators of the 21st century. . . . They will be all the more lethal if we allow them to build arsenals of nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons and the missiles to deliver them. We simply cannot allow that to happen. There is no more clear example of this threat than Saddam Hussein."

The following day, February 19, 1998, according to documents unearthed in Baghdad after the recent war by journalists Mitch Potter and Inigo Gilmore, Hussein's intelligence service wrote a memo detailing upcoming meetings with a bin Laden representative traveling to Baghdad. Each reference to bin Laden had been covered with Liquid Paper. The memo laid out a plan to step up contacts between Iraq and al Qaeda. The Mukhabarat, one of Saddam's security forces, agreed to pay for "all the travel and hotel costs inside Iraq to gain the knowledge of the message from bin Laden and to convey to his envoy an oral message from us to bin Laden." The document set as the goal for the meeting a discussion of "the future of our relationship with him, bin Laden, and to achieve a direct meeting with him." The al Qaeda representative, the document went on to suggest, might be "a way to maintain contacts with bin Laden."

I emailed Potter, a Jerusalem-based correspondent for the Toronto Star, about his findings last month. He was circumspect about the meaning of the document. "So did we find the tip of the iceberg, or the whole iceberg? Did bin Laden and Saddam agree to disagree and that was the end of it? I still don't know." Still, he wrote, "I have no doubt that what we found is the real thing. We plucked it out of a building that had been J-DAMed and was three-quarters gone. Beyond the pale to think that the CIA or someone else planted false evidence in such a dangerous location, where only lunatics would bother to tread. And then to cover over the incriminating name Osama bin Laden with Liquid Paper, so that only the most stubborn and dogged of translators would fluke into spotting it?"

Four days after that memo was written, on February 23, 1998, bin Laden and his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, issued a famous fatwa about the plight of Iraq. Published that day in al Quds al-Arabi, it reads in part:

First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples. . . . The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, still they are helpless. Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, in excess of 1 million . . . despite all this, the Americans are once again trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation.

Bin Laden urges his followers to act. "The ruling to kill all Americans and their allies--civilians and military--is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it." It was around this time, U.S. officials say, that Hussein paid the $300,000 to bin Laden's deputy, Zawahiri.


ACCORDING TO U.S. officials, soldiers in Iraq have discovered additional documentary evidence like the memo Potter found. This despite the fact that there is no team on the ground assigned to track down these contacts--no equivalent to the Iraq Survey Group looking for evidence of Saddam's weapons of mass destruction. Interviews with detained senior Iraqi intelligence officials are rounding out the picture.

The Bush administration has thus far chosen to keep the results of its postwar findings to itself; much of the information presented here comes from public sources. The administration, spooked by the media feeding frenzy surrounding yellowcake from Niger, is exercising extreme caution in rolling out the growing evidence of collaboration between al Qaeda and Baathist Iraq. As the critics continue their assault on a prewar "pattern of deception," the administration remains silent.

This impulse is understandable. It is also dangerous. Some administration officials argue privately that the case for linkage is so devastating that when they eventually unveil it, the critics will be embarrassed and their arguments will collapse. But to rely on this assumption is to run a terrible risk. Already, the absence of linkage is the conventional wisdom in many quarters. Once "everybody knows" that Saddam and bin Laden had nothing to do with each other, it becomes extremely difficult for any release of information by the U.S. government to change people's minds.


Stephen F. Hayes

 

[CharlestonChad]

If those are the links they are using to justify their claims, then we are much more guilty than Saddam has ever been. Bush has direct ties with the Bin Laden family, and every government in the middle east.

Either you can admit you are wrong and that secular Iraq did not have operational relations with Saddam and Iraq, or you can keep you can keep hugging Bush's nuts b/c you know that by 2009, your party will no longer inhabit the WhiteHouse.

 

[Bonnie]

If those are the links they are using to justify their claims, then we are much more guilty than Saddam has ever been. Bush has direct ties with the Bin Laden family, and every government in the middle east.

Either you can admit you are wrong and that secular Iraq did not have operational relations with Saddam and Iraq, or you can keep you can keep hugging Bush's nuts b/c you know that by 2009, your party will no longer inhabit the WhiteHouse.

Oh yes because Hussein would never have any ties to terrorism, yet Bush is the evil overlord...

If you are actually being anything other than sarcastic you have my sympathies..

 

[Gunny]

He said that before we began the war in Iraq. I consider it a lie because there has NEVER been any evidence that Saddam and Al-Qaeda have ever had an operational connection.



Yes, Saddam paid the families $15,000 more than the industry standard. Not sure how this relates to Al-Qaeda.

He paid it to families of Hezbollah and Hamas. Islamic terrorist organizations, both. Thus, the claim that he supported terrorism and terrorist organizations is true. End of story.

So what if Al Qaeda is a radical Islamic terror group. We're talking about Iraq being connect to Al Qaeda through means other than association by religion.

Leftwing, literalist argument. I don't care WHAT the specific name of the Islamic terrorist organizations he supported and dealt with were. The fact remains he can be directly linked to Islamic terrorist organizations.

Muhammad Aliasshtazzaysh

You have to find some credible source that can find a connection between Iraq and Al-Qaeda in which Mr. Bush described.

Right. And Saddam never used WMDs because they can't be produced, except for the fact that he DID use them. You lefties sure are willing to literalize and stick your heads in the sand when it suits you.

 

[CharlestonChad]

1. Learn how to quote a post

2. We are in no way debating if he had ties to terrorists outside of Al Qaeda. We are debating the statement made many times by the current admin. that Saddam had operational ties with Al Qaeda.

3. Stick our heads in the sand? WTF? You are the one who ignores every logical statement made by a person who did not vote for the same candidate as you.

 

[CharlestonChad]

Oh yes because Hussein would never have any ties to terrorism, yet Bush is the evil overlord...

If you are actually being anything other than sarcastic you have my sympathies..

No sarcasm Mrs. Mod. Please refer to the #2 in the post above to answer all of your questions regarding this particular debate.

 

[nt250]

He said that before we began the war in Iraq. I consider it a lie because there has NEVER been any evidence that Saddam and Al-Qaeda have ever had an operational connection.

Oh, now it's "operational connection". It never ceases to amaze me the hoops posters like you will jump through to keep from admitting you're wrong.

Yes, Saddam paid the families $15,000 more than the industry standard. Not sure how this relates to Al-Qaeda.

Not funny, and one more indication of how a liberals outrage is always relative.

So what if Al Qaeda is a radical Islamic terror group. We're talking about Iraq being connect to Al Qaeda through means other than association by religion.

Moron. I even made Islam bold and you still didn't get it. When will people like you wake up to the fact that the root cause, the real problem, the true threat, is Islam? Not, apparently, until Abdul Marwan Al-Killerinfidels comes up behind you and slowly cuts your head off.

Muhammad Aliasshtazzaysh

What wit.

You have to find some credible source that can find a connection between Iraq and Al-Qaeda in which Mr. Bush described.

Try reading a fucking newspaper once in a while.

 

[CockySOB]

Either you can admit you are wrong and that secular Iraq did not have operational relations with Saddam and Iraq, or you can keep you can keep hugging Bush's nuts b/c you know that by 2009, your party will no longer inhabit the WhiteHouse.

Now, far be it from me to correct such an astute and enlightened poster such as yourself, but don't you mean to say something like "Either you can admit you are wrong and that secular Iraq (i.e. Saddam's regime) did not have operational relations with Usama bin Laden, or blah, blah, blah." Of course, you are forgetting that the Clinton administration first identified the link between bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. So this is not simply an issue you can lay at GWB's feet - unless of course, you are intellectually dishonest. Note that I am not laying blame at Clinton's feet either, rather I am using his administration's findings to help support the GWB administration argument that Usama bin Laden had direct, operational ties with Saddam Hussein's regime in secular Iraq.

 

[nt250]

Note that I am not laying blame at Clinton's feet either, rather I am using his administration's findings to help support the GWB administration argument that Usama bin Laden had direct, operational ties with Saddam Hussein's regime in secular Iraq.

Secular Iraq. What a fucking joke.

sec·u·lar ( P ) Pronunciation Key (sky-lr)
adj.
Worldly rather than spiritual.
Not specifically relating to religion or to a religious body: secular music.
Relating to or advocating secularism.
Not bound by monastic restrictions, especially not belonging to a religious order. Used of the clergy.
Occurring or observed once in an age or century.
Lasting from century to century.

Iraq was never "secular".

 

[CharlestonChad]

Oh, now it's "operational connection". It never ceases to amaze me the hoops posters like you will jump through to keep from admitting you're wrong.

Not the first time I used that rhetoric in this thread. Sorry if the fact that they have met before isn't considered "ties with AlQaeda".

Please forgive me if you're just being sarcastic.

Not funny, and one more indication of how a liberals outrage is always relative.

So you don't acknowledge suicide bombing as a job? They get paid, have a set of skills, and are dedicated to their work.

Moron. I even made Islam bold and you still didn't get it. When will people like you wake up to the fact that the root cause, the real problem, the true threat, is Islam?

Oh wow, personal attacks. A speciality of political dividers like yourself.

Radical Islamic terrorists pose the threat to America, not secular nations. Iraq was a secular nation under Saddam.

Is the only religion to ever be based on peaceful events the root, or are the extrimists who, are factions that misuse the teachings of Islam as a bases for violence, are the real root of the problem?

That's a rhetorical question.

Not, apparently, until Abdul Marwan Al-Killerinfidels comes up behind you and slowly cuts your head off.

Sweet FOX News scare tactics. BTW: What's the terror level today?

What wit. "Killerinfidels" hahahaha where do you come up with gems like that?

Try reading a fucking newspaper once in a while.

But aren't all newspapers run by evil liberals who are out to ruin America? I mean, that's what half the post on this message board are about.

 

[CharlestonChad]

Now, far be it from me to correct such an astute and enlightened poster such as yourself, but don't you mean to say something like "Either you can admit you are wrong and that secular Iraq (i.e. Saddam's regime) did not have operational relations with Usama bin Laden, or blah, blah, blah." .

correct