Is America Doomed to Become a Failed European-Style Welfare State?

Stephanie

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Jul 11, 2004
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Are we?
a lot links in article and a video at site


SNIP:
When I give speeches around the country, I often get asked whether it’s time to give up.

More specifically, has America reached a tipping point, with too many people riding in the wagon of government dependency and too few people creating wealth and pulling the wagon in the right direction?

These questions don’t surprise me, particularly since my speeches frequently include very grimBIS, OECD, and IMF data showing that the long-run fiscal problem in the United States is larger than it is in some nations that already are facing fiscal crisis.

But that doesn’t mean I have a good answer. I think there is a tipping point, to be sure, but I’m not sure whether there’s a single variable that tells us when we’ve reached the point of no return.

Is it when government spending consumes 50 percent of economic output? That would be a very bad development if the burden of government spending reached that level, but it’s not necessarily fatal. Back in the early 1990s, the public sector was that big in Canada, yet policy makers in that country were able to restrain budgetary growth and put the country on a positive path. Sweden is another nation that has turned the corner. Government spending peaked at 67 percent of GDP in the early 1990s, but is now down to 47 percent of GDP after years of free-market reforms.

Is it when a majority of households are getting government handouts? That’s also a worrisome development, especially if those folks see the state as a means of living off their fellow citizens. But taking a check from Uncle Sam doesn’t automatically mean a statist mindset. As one of my favorite people opined, “some government beneficiaries – such as Social Security recipients – spent their lives in the private sector and are taking benefits simply because they had no choice but to participate in the system.”

Is it when a majority of people no longer pay income taxes, leaving a shrinking minority to bear all the burden of financing government? It’s not healthy for society when most people think government is “free,” particularly if they perceive an incentive to impose even higher burdens on those who do pay. And there’s no question that the overwhelming majority of the tax burden is borne by the top 10 percent. There’s little evidence, though, that the rest of the population thinks there’s no cost to government – perhaps because many of them pay heavy payroll taxes.

I explore these issues in this interview with Charles Payne.

all of it here and comments
Is America Doomed to Become a Failed European-Style Welfare State? - Daniel J. Mitchell - Townhall Finance Conservative Columnists and Financial Commentary - Page full
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

This is a conversation that should be had, and the Left doesn't appear ready to participate in such a conversation. At least yet. You'll say positive things about a Euro-social democracy, you'll do everything you can to push us in that direction, but you won't just come out and say that's what you want. That's the "fundamental change" you're after.

The Right continues to miss the target by screaming "socialism" and "Marxism" and "communism", allowing you to avoid the real conversation. A Euro-social Democracy is a different animal.

Wouldn't it be helpful for the Left to just put their cards on the table and open the topic? It's clearly getting closer, but we can't have an honest, constructive conversation until you're up front with it.

.
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

This is a conversation that should be had, and the Left doesn't appear ready to participate in such a conversation. At least yet. You'll say positive things about a Euro-social democracy, you'll do everything you can to push us in that direction, but you won't just come out and say that's what you want. That's the "fundamental change" you're after.

The Right continues to miss the target by screaming "socialism" and "Marxism" and "communism", allowing you to avoid the real conversation. A Euro-social Democracy is a different animal.

Wouldn't it be helpful for the Left to just put their cards on the table and open the topic? It's clearly getting closer, but we can't have an honest, constructive conversation until you're up front with it.

.

The "left" won't say it because it's probably not what they want. It's what I want, but I don't speak for the entire "left" like you do.
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

This is a conversation that should be had, and the Left doesn't appear ready to participate in such a conversation. At least yet. You'll say positive things about a Euro-social democracy, you'll do everything you can to push us in that direction, but you won't just come out and say that's what you want. That's the "fundamental change" you're after.

The Right continues to miss the target by screaming "socialism" and "Marxism" and "communism", allowing you to avoid the real conversation. A Euro-social Democracy is a different animal.

Wouldn't it be helpful for the Left to just put their cards on the table and open the topic? It's clearly getting closer, but we can't have an honest, constructive conversation until you're up front with it.

.

The "left" won't say it because it's probably not what they want. It's what I want, but I don't speak for the entire "left" like you do.

Well, I'll be more specific. Just as the Tea Party represents most of the energy on the Right (probably not a good thing for the Right), the social Democrats represent most of the energy on the Left. Size is less important than energy, passion and volume.

I strongly suspect the conversation is coming, but not yet.

.
 
People are not honest about their intent because they don't want it to become the target. In other words say I want to buy a new truck. I don't tell my wife that I tell her about all the problems I am having with my old truck to which she can not argue. If I just said we need a new truck that would become the argument, I don't want that argument. I want it to appear to be her idea or inevitable. (interestingly enough the wife does want me to replace my 2000 s-10)

Comparing Canada or Sweden to the US is an unfair comparisons, in my opinion. Neither have an uncontrolled immigration policy that is flooding their country with low skilled and low educated people. If our boarders were being flooded with engineers and doctors that would be actually a great thing.
 
This is a conversation that should be had, and the Left doesn't appear ready to participate in such a conversation. At least yet. You'll say positive things about a Euro-social democracy, you'll do everything you can to push us in that direction, but you won't just come out and say that's what you want. That's the "fundamental change" you're after.

The Right continues to miss the target by screaming "socialism" and "Marxism" and "communism", allowing you to avoid the real conversation. A Euro-social Democracy is a different animal.

Wouldn't it be helpful for the Left to just put their cards on the table and open the topic? It's clearly getting closer, but we can't have an honest, constructive conversation until you're up front with it.

.

The "left" won't say it because it's probably not what they want. It's what I want, but I don't speak for the entire "left" like you do.

Well, I'll be more specific. Just as the Tea Party represents most of the energy on the Right (probably not a good thing for the Right), the social Democrats represent most of the energy on the Left. Size is less important than energy, passion and volume.

I strongly suspect the conversation is coming, but not yet.

.

What is your opinion on the apparent disconnect between the left and right on immigration? It just can't be because the left wants more votes, I just don't believe that. Do you think it is because they want to have a cause to fight for and don't realize the damage or worse yet don't care? Or is this just another wedge issue that they see will unite the Hispanic vote for them against the right?
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

Only because they had Angela Merkel and we had Barack Obama. Germany resisted most of the crap policies pushed here on deficit spending etc.
But traditionally over the last 30 years Germany's economy has sucked compared to ours. In fact, between 1980 and 2000 the US economy grew by the entire amount of the German economy. That includes jobs.
Go look at the book Cowboy Capitalism, which details all this. Of course that would require you to get off your ass and do something educational so we know that wont happen.
 
As the Bilderbergs would have it, yes. Usher in a new Caste system. Yes, that is pretty much the goal as I see it.
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

You agree we should have a strict border control policy and should not grant blanket amnesty to illegals who came here by illegal means?

Oh, you did not mean that aspect of those European states? Yeah, that is what I thought.

Liberals and their lack of including all factors into their half baked bullshit never ceases to amaze me.

Now, back to the border control. Are you against blanket amnesty? If so, turn in your liberal moron card.
 
Hey a cut and paste

Has a liberal ever expressed an original thought? If so, when? Cut and paste that original thought.

Hey....."plasmaball" do you know what a hypocrite means?

Hey....."plasmaball" do you know what obfuscation means?

Hey......"plasmaball," do you know what left wing puppets are?

Hey......"plasmaball," tell us how you are so original so we can all laugh in your face.
 
Considering that the super-rich control the strings, if America becomes any type of "socialist" police state, it will be at the behest of the super-rich, not leftist liberal Democrats.

So while we're waiting to see what the rich people do with our democracy, let's hang Bush for war crimes.
 
Germany is a European "Welfare State"...we should be doing so poorly. :rolleyes:

Only because they had Angela Merkel and we had Barack Obama. Germany resisted most of the crap policies pushed here on deficit spending etc.
But traditionally over the last 30 years Germany's economy has sucked compared to ours. In fact, between 1980 and 2000 the US economy grew by the entire amount of the German economy. That includes jobs.
Go look at the book Cowboy Capitalism, which details all this. Of course that would require you to get off your ass and do something educational so we know that wont happen.

:lol:

You have no fucking idea what you are talking about.

The big "hits" to Germany's economy came when it reunited with Eastern Germany and again when with the Bush financial collapse.

But Germany? Has so many social programs you folks think it's a communist nation.
 
Our class has been assigned a paper on the welfare state. Could a knowledgeable conservative please post a list of modern, non-wefare states that are successful? Hurry please, the paper is due Monday.
 
Most European nations are not failures.

Oh, so you too agree we should have strict border policies too like them?

Real simple question. Do not think for one second that I do not notice you hypocrties avoiding that aspect of those european countries that you all love so much.

 
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Most European nations are not failures.

Oh, so you too agree we should have strict border policies too like them?

Real simple question. Do not think for one second that I do not notice you hypocrties avoiding that aspect of those european countries that you all love so much.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hk_...the need to continue your off topic trolling?
 
During the Great Depression, the racist white establishment blamed high unemployment on drug-using Mexicans.

It's good to know that bigoted assholes have evolved socially and mentally over the decades.
 

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