Independent Learns Why Conservatives Are Right (and so very misguided)

[gnarlylove]

The following is a lead in to the point of this thread: Why Conservatives are right and wrong. The intro about division of labor is not the issue I am trying to take up here.

Everybody reads the first paragraph of The Wealth of Nations where he talks about how wonderful the division of labor is. But not many people get to the point hundreds of pages later, where he says that division of labor will destroy human beings and turn people into creatures as stupid and ignorant as it is possible for a human being to be. And therefore in any civilized society the government is going to have to take some measures to prevent division of labor from proceeding to its limits."

He did give an argument for markets, but the argument was that under conditions of perfect liberty, markets will lead to perfect equality.

From Education is Ignorance, by Noam Chomsky (Excerpted from Class Warfare)

Makes sense, the more time we spend on specialized skills the less likely we are to spend time developing our general self. That is to say develop the mind in logical and creative capacities resulting in a well-rounded person. Too bad conservatives tend to stick to habit ([ame="http://www.amazon.com/The-Power-Habit-What-Business-ebook/dp/B0055PGUYU"]aka addiction[/ame]) and tradition rather than being open to new experiences that can help round them out--this is a psychological fact ([ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openness_to_experience[/ame]).

He [Adam Smith] simply observed in passing...the principal architects of policy are the 'merchants and manufacturers,' and they make certain that their own interests are, in his words, 'most peculiarly attended to,' no matter what the effect on others, including the people of England who, he argued, suffered from their policies.

"He didn't have the data to prove it at the time, but he was probably right."

Education is Ignorance, by Noam Chomsky (Excerpted from Class Warfare)

Conservatives have always been knee-jerk supporters of the status quo (as long as Master tosses them a few scraps from the big table) so, maybe in that respect, they would be more susceptible to ignorance and stupidity.

You hit the nail on the head. The lumpy conservative inelastic head. Hollowed out by decades of following desires/demands shaped by the status quo from within by appealing to emotions (i.e. anger) and then getting them to repeat it uncritically with eternal fervor. Their range of concern begins and ends with their inner circle. The empathetic part of their brain has been lobotomized by decades of mass media/FOX. Any outsider to their groupthink is the most despicable shit-eating pussy-fagot pot-smoking libturd.

FOX spends over a billion/yr to reach these people. Why do they want to reach them? Because a person is most likely to act when they are angry (or scared). Actions lead to votes and certain votes make the rich very happy (i.e. in control). It turns out Americans are easily incited in large numbers to fear and anger if you use the right emotionally charged words and graphics. Karl Rove helped Fox identify this "anger points" as highly effective in 2004. It has been their overt approach since and the Republican community at large.

The truth oftentimes gets in the way of their self-indulgent worldviews so they now have billionaire funded research to produce false facts. For example, Rep. congressman said his statement was not intended to be factual. But he only admitted that upon being called out; if you're already inclined to accept what a Rep. says or FOX, they won't tell you its a lie, instead, they'll just lie and you'll just belief.

No wonder our conservative friends are so sure liberals are wrong. They are now a walking automatons of anger and fear ready to vote for the interests of the 2% (aka job creators), who have told them its in their best interest.

Truth for conservatives is false for most people in the real world. Conservatives have accurate beliefs, their only misstep is working with an entirely flawed framework of beliefs (they misunderstand reality). For example, they believe what helps economic growth helps them, but this is another way of saying give more money to the rich so they can be that much happier and watch it "trickle down" like it has for the last 32 years.

"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." -Bertrand Russell.

 

[HenryBHough]

Show me a liberal with a "well rounded education" and I'll show you an unemployed and unemployable student of everything and master of nothing that supports earning a living.

Exception: Some do become well enough connected to feed at the BIG public trough (government jobs).

 

[emilynghiem]

I think the more energy we invest in "either/or" paradigms
such as "specialized education" being in conflict with "developing ourselves holistically
or as a society"
THAT dichotomy is what causes this segregation and deterioration.

Why not embrace both?

We can still have divisions in education, per class level or per department,
and NOT lose sight of all levels of society!

This either/or, them/us, liberal/conservative, polarization
is what keeps people limited and stagnating.

Look at how any orchestra works. Yes, the sections are separated, and the flutes only practice their own music and don't worry about the other parts or sections.

but when this is coordinated right, all parts work together.
it does NOT make someone "less skilled in music overall"
by specializing and mastering ONE instrument.

you can be a good artist and a good mathematician;
a religious believer and a research scientist.

you can have teachers, students, workers and leaders at all levels of education
or management within the same school system or city, and still work with
overall sustainable development, inside and out, locally and globally in
conjunction with schools in other cities or states. why not use that educational
system as a tool to organize resources and people across all levels of society?

how is that not empowering to teach people to develop all areas and interests in life?

 

[HenryBHough]

It should be a federal crime for any "institute of higher learning" to grant any form of graduation to any individual who has failed to learn at least one marketable skill as part of their education.

 

[Stephanie]

holy smokes, all them words for what?

to say we are misguided

 

[bendog]

It should be a federal crime for any "institute of higher learning" to grant any form of graduation to any individual who has failed to learn at least one marketable skill as part of their education.

Why hate on W? (-:

 

[LoneLaugher]

Show me a liberal with a "well rounded education" and I'll show you an unemployed and unemployable student of everything and master of nothing that supports earning a living.

Exception: Some do become well enough connected to feed at the BIG public trough (government jobs).

Say what? I am a liberal with a well rounded education. Haven't been unemployed for a single day since I was 15.

Next.

 

[gnarlylove]

holy smokes, all them words for what?

to say we are misguided

Well, the point isn't that conservatives are wrong, it's that they are right. But that's only because they have very misguided interpretation of reality. I know we all have interpretations of reality, but when you start with anger and fear as the fundamental basis for understanding the world, you are going to produce a lot of knee-jerk beliefs instead of rational and well-thought out beliefs.

I am not a Democrat. I do not support Obama. This is not a personal attack on anyone, and I am only trying to reveal why Conservatives would be so sure of themselves--there's good reason if you tend to get your information from emotionally charged mass media. In fact, it's almost impossible to get information that is strictly facts. Most facts are not facts but a narrative of delusion to get votes and keep the country bowing before the mightiest in our nation.

 

[OKTexas]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

 

[Stephanie]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

Liberals really believe they are superior over others

I don't know how anyone can stand them myself...they're boorish, snobby and downright ugly

 

[gnarlylove]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

We aren't talking about Democrats. Of course Democrats play the same exact tactics. But conservatives do it best, IMHO. Of course you can start a thread to talk about how stupid and gullible liberals are and I agree with you. But one thing at a time, two wrongs don't make a right. Tis the reason I said independent in the title. That's cause I don't accept the policies on either side of our country.

 

[LoneLaugher]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

We aren't talking about Democrats. Of course Democrats play the same exact tactics. But conservatives do it best, IMHO. Of course you can start a thread to talk about how stupid and gullible liberals are and I agree with you. But one thing at a time, two wrongs don't make a right. Tis the reason I said independent in the title. That's cause I don't accept the policies on either side of our country.

Are you one of those guys who thinks everyone is an idiot except you?

 

[gnarlylove]

Are you one of those guys who thinks everyone is an idiot except you?

I use to, then I realized I didn't know what I was talking about like I thought. of course no one is perfect and so I find myself sometimes slipping back into habit but can identify it more readily. So I am trying to start a discussion and see if my idea has validity and weight or is genuinely bad thinking...so far I've not really heard a challenge to any of the critical ideas in my thread. But that seems to prove my point. What do yall think...

 

[OKTexas]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

We aren't talking about Democrats. Of course Democrats play the same exact tactics. But conservatives do it best, IMHO. Of course you can start a thread to talk about how stupid and gullible liberals are and I agree with you. But one thing at a time, two wrongs don't make a right. Tis the reason I said independent in the title. That's cause I don't accept the policies on either side of our country.

Still think you're projecting, but that's just my opinion. But on the bright side you're good for entertainment value.

 

[The T]

MY GOD, you are so full of shit. Who the hell runs political adds depicting granny getting wheeled of a fucking cliff? And you have the balls the say conservatives play on fear and emotions, give me a fucking break. All you're doing is projecting, how about you just run off in your corner and engage in a little self-fornication.

We aren't talking about Democrats. Of course Democrats play the same exact tactics. But conservatives do it best, IMHO. Of course you can start a thread to talk about how stupid and gullible liberals are and I agree with you. But one thing at a time, two wrongs don't make a right. Tis the reason I said independent in the title. That's cause I don't accept the policies on either side of our country.

YOU must be talking of REPUBICANS...note I didn't spell Republicans. YOU have NO idea what you're saying OR who Conservatives ARE.

 

[gnarlylove]

YOU must be talking of REPUBICANS...note I didn't spell Republicans. YOU have NO idea what you're saying OR who Conservatives ARE.

So there is a difference between those under the influence of rhetoric and then there are mild or centrist republicans. I don't think being extreme Republican (or anything) can bring anything but bad views. But most common sense Reps even admit the Republican party has become much more akin to your idea of Repubicans. We are working with a majority of harebrained folks and a few genuine centrist Republicans in American politics. In European politics and the normal political spectrum, centrist Reps can be moderately right wing but in America this dichotomy is not robust. It's a lot more Repubicans than Republicans.

But this is no official distinction without saying much of anything you look like someone who has a lot to assert, but nothing to say. But it sounds like you have something to say so give it another shot and reveal the flaw of connecting anger points to mass media and hollowed out skulls/uncritical repetition of statements. Don't tell me. *gasps* Has the mass media got you too? Naw, they simply couldn't have! Listening to you, I gather you are educated with a lot of important valid points to make, so I can't imagine why you'd go firing off statements that shut down a discussion, unless of course, you don't have anything to say.