Impact Of Illegal Immigration An “exaggeration”

[editec]

Along with illegal immigration comes the drugs, crime and the gangs. We have our share of crime and do not need imported crime. Look at the stastics on how many Americans have been the victims of illegal aliens criminal activity. Here is Reno and Vegas, if not for the illegal alien crime we would not have crime to write about. So lets not go there. I have been a victim of these crimes and they are stealing from employers and doing every sort of illegal busines that are costing us.
There is not an illegal alien family that does not have a member who is not doing something illegal.
The story your girl friend is telling just do not fly with me so save it.

What the hell, Whathehell?

Perhaps you should reread my post.

Clearly you misconstrued its point.

 

[WillowTree]

This is what I worry about, though, since I work for a significant amount of time with lower income urban communities:


Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks

As long as Americans are still struggling (and they are), I don't really believe we should be allowing illegal immigration to increase their challenges. These impacts are also felt by native Hispanics, Native Americans, poor whites, and others. The economic impact of illegal immigration is the greatest on the poorest Americans.

way too bad and much too late, you've already bought their votes,, now you owe them. don't doublecross them.. that would be just slimey.

 

[SW2SILVERQUASI]

Ravi: I NEVER said anything about "brown people". That inference was yours. Don't EVER say that again, ever. I am getting a unflattering picture of were you are coming from on this issue, and you better think again before you answer my post, you hypocrite.

 

[Ravi]

Ravi: I NEVER said anything about "brown people". That inference was yours. Don't EVER say that again, ever. I am getting a unflattering picture of were you are coming from on this issue, and you better think again before you answer my post, you hypocrite.

mmmkay, Squishi, then tell me who you mean when you say you don't know who is shooting up your house but you know it is the Mexicans.

 

[catzmeow]

mmmkay, Squishi, then tell me who you mean when you say you don't know who is shooting up your house but you know it is the Mexicans.

The bullets smell like cumin.

 

[sky dancer]

Silver--

I'm really sorry to hear about what is happening in your neighborhood, and how trapped you feel there.

Sending you good thoughts. I'm willing to listen and learn.

 

[Gunny]

Mexico is pretty cheap I hear.

Yep, and if I wanted to live there I'd emigrate LEGALLY after I brushed up on my Spanish.

 

[catzmeow]

Yep, and if I wanted to live there I'd emigrate LEGALLY after I brushed up on my Spanish.

I hope most Americans don't have this idea, I'm planning on retiring there, once they're all here.

 

[sky dancer]

Adios!

 

[Agnapostate]

I don't think we can fully measure the impact, though it appears more negative than positive:

http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/87xx/doc8711/12-6-Immigration.pdf

...

This is what I worry about, though, since I work for a significant amount of time with lower income urban communities:

Immigration and African-American Employment Opportunities: The Response of Wages, Employment, and Incarceration to Labor Supply Shocks

As long as Americans are still struggling (and they are), I don't really believe we should be allowing illegal immigration to increase their challenges. These impacts are also felt by native Hispanics, Native Americans, poor whites, and others. The economic impact of illegal immigration is the greatest on the poorest Americans.

I don't think anyone here necessarily denies that illegal immigrants pose a burden to legal citizens in some instances. In fact, I'll openly say that they in many circumstances, their use of social services exceeds their tax payments.

But there are two factors to consider here. The first is one which only fellow consequentialists and utilitarians will likely care about, and which deontologists will likely scorn, which is the degree of the suffering caused to illegal immigrants through forcible deportation or border closing compared to the suffering caused to American taxpayers through the imposition of higher fees and taxes through the presence of illegal immigrants. I firmly believe that the suffering caused to illegal immigrants by forced residence in an inhumane and utterly destitute environment is more severe than that caused to American taxpayers through the imposition of higher taxes upon them. So, that's approaching the issue from a purely ethical perspective.

From a more "practical" perspective, we need to differentiate between causation and correlation as well as between cause and effect when it comes to analyzing the social and economic costs of illegal immigrants' presence in the U.S.

I believe a case can be made that the problems incurred by illegal immigration can be remedied by amnesty and the granting of legal status to illegal immigrants. Consider this:

Undocumented Immigrants in Georgia: Tax Contribution and Fiscal Concerns

The question lawmakers attempt to answer is: Do undocumented immigrants pay enough in taxes to cover the services used? For undocumented immigrants, the answer is unclear. However, for legal immigrants, studies have shown that first generation immigrants pay more in federal taxes than they receive in federal benefits. The same does not hold true for state taxes and services, however, as first generation immigrants often use more in services than they pay in taxes. However, the descendants of the first-generation immigrant correct that pattern and contribute more in taxes at both the federal and state level than they consume in services at both levels. Each generation successively contributes a greater share due to increased wages, language skills, and education.

I don't believe that those "increased wages, language skills, and education" can be obtained by immigrants while they retain an illegal status, as this places them into a disenfranchised segment of the population. The wages are probably the most obvious example of this.

While retaining an illegal status, immigrants are forced to either obtain low paying positions in the informal economy, (lawn mowing, house cleaning, etc.), or the lesser option that far fewer take of using fake social security numbers to obtain employment in the formal economy. In the former case, illegal immigrants' tax payments don't sufficiently cover their use of social services because of their low wages. In the latter case, immigrants' tax payments may cover their use of social services, but they are forced to commit a crime to obtain adequate employment. (It's also notable that in the latter case, immigrants do not reap the benefits of Social Security because of the fact that they use fake numbers, in which case the benefits will either go to the person who actually owns that number, or their payments will simply remain in federal coffers should no one have that number. So they're really only hurting themselves in that regard.)

Should illegal immigrants be granted amnesty, they would be able to unionize and demand higher salaries and benefits, at which point they could pay a corresponding amount of taxes.

Yep, and if I wanted to live there I'd emigrate LEGALLY after I brushed up on my Spanish.

I'm not sure where the idea that most Latin American immigrants were sullenly unwilling to learn English and demand that American communities promote Spanish came from. 92% of the Hispanic population believe that it's important for immigrants to learn English, while only 87% of whites and 83% of blacks believe the same. (www.pewhispanic.org/files/factsheets/20.pdf)

 

[SW2SILVERQUASI]

Ravi: I think YOU have some unresolved issues with "brown skin people" and you are over-compensating here. You have better come to grips with your own racial attitudes and stop projecting them on the rest of us. I have nothing to be ashamed of. Illegal aliens, dear, aren't a race. But they, and you, like to use RACE (or culture) as some kind of rationale or excuse. Funny how that works. Yes, indeed. You can't have it both ways. My house with the bullets in it, well, guess what ? That is a result of a dysfunctional mentality. One that ignores immigration law or any other law they can get away with. A mentality that thinks force and the barrel of a gun can solve problems, my poor ol' home just got in the way. It's like this : that could just as well could have been Me or YOU that took those slugs, as my house. It doesn't make any difference to those "friends" of yours, Ravi, either way. That little factoid you have yet to grasp. THE extent of contempt and disregard for safety or common sense, these are the traits of illegal aliens YOU don't understand. That is an understatement of the year. It's that little dysfunctional mind set illegal aliens have you seem to either ignore or underestimate. It's the very reason we have this board isn't it? Some of us don't have the luxury of hiding behind phoney idealism.

 

[Ravi]

Yet many hide behind phony hate.

Are you going to answer my questions or keep spinning around like a top?

 

[sky dancer]

Yikes. What happened to the topic?

 

[SW2SILVERQUASI]

Ravi, I like how you skirt the issue. What was the issue? Lions, tigers and bears,oh my!.. Please, Dorthy, I am no wizard, and this isn't Kansas any more, Toto. Would you like to recenter US on what the issue. Pease?

 

[sky dancer]

Ravi, I like how you skirt the issue. What was the issue? Lions, tigers and bears,oh my!.. Please, Dorthy, I am no wizard, and this isn't Kansas any more, Toto. Would you like to recenter US on what the issue. Pease?

Hey Silver-

The impact of illegal immigration--is it exaggerated? I would say no.

How do you keep your wits about you? Seriously. It sounds scary in your neighborhood.

 

[Harry Dresden]

i think the burden the illegals pose to society just might depend on the part of the country you live in...where i am at there are a few million,that puts a strain on things....if you live where there may be just a couple of thousand,it may not be that noticeable....we can see what it does in S.Cal.....the Colorado Gov. statement would be laughed at by most people here....

 

[Agnapostate]

i think the burden the illegals pose to society just might depend on the part of the country you live in...where i am at there are a few million,that puts a strain on things....if you live where there may be just a couple of thousand,it may not be that noticeable....we can see what it does in S.Cal.....the Colorado Gov. statement would be laughed at by most people here....

And I think the burden would be alleviated through amnesty, as I provided evidence for above.

 

[Lita456]

And I think the burden would be alleviated through amnesty, as I provided evidence for above.

I don't agree with total amnesty, but dang, I can't believe your for amnesty, I'm shocked actually......................

 

[Agnapostate]

I don't agree with total amnesty, but dang, I can't believe your for amnesty, I'm shocked actually......................

Is that right? Why would that be? And what portion of post #50 didn't indicate that total amnesty is the way to go?

 

[Lita456]

Is that right? Why would that be? And what portion of post #50 didn't indicate that total amnesty is the way to go?

Jeez I answered this last night? I'm confused..........