If Santorum defeats Romney in Michigan...then what?

[VaYank5150]

.

I realize the hardcore Republicans want us to believe they're just thrilled with their candidates (wink wink), but Jonah Goldberg serves up a pretty entertaining column today:

Jonah Goldberg: The GOP's quest for Mr. Right - latimes.com

Starts off with:

"If we could just take a little bit from each of them."

I've lost track of how many people I have heard say some version of this in the last couple of months. The "each of them" refers to the final four combatants for the Republican nomination.

You could take Newt Gingrich's verbal dexterity, encyclopedic grasp of politics and techno-optimism. Add in Rick Santorum's authenticity and religious conviction. Combine that with the essence of Ron Paul's principled passion for liberty and limited government. Stir vigorously and then pour into the handsome, squeaky-clean vessel of Mitt Romney (while keeping his business acumen and analytical skill). And voila, you'd have the perfect candidate.

Of course, you could just as easily have a Frankenstein's monster with Gingrich's verbal pomposity, Santorum's resentful and dour sanctimony, Paul's conspiratorial nuttiness and the full suite of Romney's Stepford Republican qualities. It calls to mind Homer Simpson's scheme to forcibly mate his pets in a burlap sack so as to create "a miracle hybrid, with the loyalty of a cat and the cleanliness of a dog."

.

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

All one has to do is look at the Republican controlled House and see the gridlock Obama has been faced with since 2010...

 

[GuyPinestra]

.

I realize the hardcore Republicans want us to believe they're just thrilled with their candidates (wink wink), but Jonah Goldberg serves up a pretty entertaining column today:

Jonah Goldberg: The GOP's quest for Mr. Right - latimes.com

Starts off with:

"If we could just take a little bit from each of them."

I've lost track of how many people I have heard say some version of this in the last couple of months. The "each of them" refers to the final four combatants for the Republican nomination.

You could take Newt Gingrich's verbal dexterity, encyclopedic grasp of politics and techno-optimism. Add in Rick Santorum's authenticity and religious conviction. Combine that with the essence of Ron Paul's principled passion for liberty and limited government. Stir vigorously and then pour into the handsome, squeaky-clean vessel of Mitt Romney (while keeping his business acumen and analytical skill). And voila, you'd have the perfect candidate.

Of course, you could just as easily have a Frankenstein's monster with Gingrich's verbal pomposity, Santorum's resentful and dour sanctimony, Paul's conspiratorial nuttiness and the full suite of Romney's Stepford Republican qualities. It calls to mind Homer Simpson's scheme to forcibly mate his pets in a burlap sack so as to create "a miracle hybrid, with the loyalty of a cat and the cleanliness of a dog."

.

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

All one has to do is look at the Republican controlled House and see the gridlock Obama has been faced with since 2010...

If he wasn't such a radical Marxist he wouldn't be having that problem.

 

[Flopper]

"Santorum is essentially an ultra-right-wing protest candidate." Women in particular don't trust him on social issues, and even in this political climate, Americans won't elect "a religious zealot and armchair militarist of Santorum's stripe."

If the upcoming election were really about social values, nomination of Santorum might make sense, at least to the social conservatives, but that's not the case. Obama would easily win.

Who is stronger against Obama: Santorum or Romney? - The Week

 

[kwc57]

.

I realize the hardcore Republicans want us to believe they're just thrilled with their candidates (wink wink), but Jonah Goldberg serves up a pretty entertaining column today:

Jonah Goldberg: The GOP's quest for Mr. Right - latimes.com

Starts off with:

"If we could just take a little bit from each of them."

I've lost track of how many people I have heard say some version of this in the last couple of months. The "each of them" refers to the final four combatants for the Republican nomination.

You could take Newt Gingrich's verbal dexterity, encyclopedic grasp of politics and techno-optimism. Add in Rick Santorum's authenticity and religious conviction. Combine that with the essence of Ron Paul's principled passion for liberty and limited government. Stir vigorously and then pour into the handsome, squeaky-clean vessel of Mitt Romney (while keeping his business acumen and analytical skill). And voila, you'd have the perfect candidate.

Of course, you could just as easily have a Frankenstein's monster with Gingrich's verbal pomposity, Santorum's resentful and dour sanctimony, Paul's conspiratorial nuttiness and the full suite of Romney's Stepford Republican qualities. It calls to mind Homer Simpson's scheme to forcibly mate his pets in a burlap sack so as to create "a miracle hybrid, with the loyalty of a cat and the cleanliness of a dog."

.

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

All one has to do is look at the Republican controlled House and see the gridlock Obama has been faced with since 2010...

Uhhhh, Harry (The Obstructionist) Reid..........

 

[Sallow]

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

All one has to do is look at the Republican controlled House and see the gridlock Obama has been faced with since 2010...

If he wasn't such a radical Marxist he wouldn't be having that problem.

Well..

The radical theocrats that have been voted in via the Tea Party have nothing on their agendas except Christanizing the good ol' USA.

They would like to turn the country into the western version of Saudi Arabia.

No thanks.

 

[VaYank5150]

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

All one has to do is look at the Republican controlled House and see the gridlock Obama has been faced with since 2010...

If he wasn't such a radical Marxist he wouldn't be having that problem.

Can you name the FIRST bill the GOP pushed through the House after they took over in 2010?

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Actually, it's pretty common knowledge that Republicans and conservatives are NOT thrilled with their candidates. The question is, WHY are Democrats and liberals so thrilled with their choice. With the record Obama has to run on, do you honestly find anything to be thrilled about? The man should be shaking in his boots.

No one is thrilled. I voted for Obama in 08 and I'm was hoping for a rational GOP nominee I could vote for in '12. However, of the four GOP nominees still in the only one I could vote for is Mitt, and he's well on his way to losing his second bid.

So if you're a Democrat the most exciting thing about this cycle is the idea that someone so poisonous to moderates like Santorum or Newt could be the nominee. Because to be honest Obama should lose in '12, but the GOP is well on its way to handing Obama a second term.

For the GOP, the same is true. Every Republican friend I have hates this field. The only thing they're excited about is beating Obama.

This will be a terrible election cycle. In Novemeber it'll almost certainly be a choice between the devil you know or the one you don't. I know I was hoping for better.

 

[JoeB131]

"Santorum is essentially an ultra-right-wing protest candidate." Women in particular don't trust him on social issues, and even in this political climate, Americans won't elect "a religious zealot and armchair militarist of Santorum's stripe."

If the upcoming election were really about social values, nomination of Santorum might make sense, at least to the social conservatives, but that's not the case. Obama would easily win.

Who is stronger against Obama: Santorum or Romney? - The Week

I don't think Romney would be any stronger. And with the economy on teh mend (or at least, we've accepted less, which we should never do) Romney has no argument to make.

Santorum won't win because he's a weak candidate, not because he has a weak message.

Most Americans are conservative in their social views. Sorry, they just are. Santorum has the radical view that abortion is a bad thing and marriage should be one man and one woman. So do most Americans.

 

[Flopper]

"Santorum is essentially an ultra-right-wing protest candidate." Women in particular don't trust him on social issues, and even in this political climate, Americans won't elect "a religious zealot and armchair militarist of Santorum's stripe."

If the upcoming election were really about social values, nomination of Santorum might make sense, at least to the social conservatives, but that's not the case. Obama would easily win.

Who is stronger against Obama: Santorum or Romney? - The Week

I don't think Romney would be any stronger. And with the economy on teh mend (or at least, we've accepted less, which we should never do) Romney has no argument to make.

Santorum won't win because he's a weak candidate, not because he has a weak message.

Most Americans are conservative in their social views. Sorry, they just are. Santorum has the radical view that abortion is a bad thing and marriage should be one man and one woman. So do most Americans.

I agree with most of your statements, but I take issue with you on your statement that most Americans are social conservatives. I think most Americans consider themselves fiscal conservatives, not social conservatives. When you look at the primary social conservative issues, polls certainly don't show any strong leaning to the right.

Same sex marriage - for first time, Gallup's reports, a majority of Americans (53%) believe same-sex marriage should be recognized by the law as valid.

Gays in the military - a Washington Post ABC poll finds 75% of Americans favor letting gays serve openly in the military.

Overturning Role V. Wade - Support has been eroding for years. In addition, in a January Gallup poll, 59 percent of the public believes abortion laws should remain as they are.

School vouchers - 40 percent support school vouchers, while parents of school-age children are split 47-47 percent.

Sex Education - Only 15 percent of Americans say they want abstinence-only sex education in the schools.

For First Time, Majority of Americans Favor Legal Gay Marriage
75% back letting gays serve openly
Americans Support Abortion Rights
ABCNEWS.com : Poll: School Vouchers No Major Issue

 

[JimH52]

It is a sad fact that Romney has the best chance to beat Obama. Santorum is too far over the edge on almost every issue. But Newt is lurking in the wings.

 

[JoeB131]

I agree with most of your statements, but I take issue with you on your statement that most Americans are social conservatives. I think most Americans consider themselves fiscal conservatives, not social conservatives. When you look at the primary social conservative issues, polls certainly don't show any strong leaning to the right.

Same sex marriage - for first time, Gallup's reports, a majority of Americans (53%) believe same-sex marriage should be recognized by the law as valid.

Gays in the military - a Washington Post ABC poll finds 75% of Americans favor letting gays serve openly in the military.

Overturning Role V. Wade - Support has been eroding for years. In addition, in a January Gallup poll, 59 percent of the public believes abortion laws should remain as they are.

School vouchers - 40 percent support school vouchers, while parents of school-age children are split 47-47 percent.

Sex Education - Only 15 percent of Americans say they want abstinence-only sex education in the schools.

]

I think there's a major difference between "We'll allow this so you stop whining" and "We really think this is a good idea".

Gay marriage has lost every time it's been put on a ballot.

Most people don't think abortion on demand is a good idea. But the recongize it's probably impossible to stop.

I personally think that abortion is horrible. Most women who have them have them for stupid reasons. Like the gal I knew back in the 1990's who got pregnant to force her boyfriend to make good on his promise to marry her, and he didn't. And then a year later, she got back together with him and it happened again.

But I recongize that we'd need a police state to ever have a workable abortion law.

So when a liberal says to me, "We can't vote for Santorum, he's going to take away our abortions", I don't take it very seriously, because I've been hearing that nonsense since Reagan.

 

[Flopper]

I agree with most of your statements, but I take issue with you on your statement that most Americans are social conservatives. I think most Americans consider themselves fiscal conservatives, not social conservatives. When you look at the primary social conservative issues, polls certainly don't show any strong leaning to the right.

Same sex marriage - for first time, Gallup's reports, a majority of Americans (53%) believe same-sex marriage should be recognized by the law as valid.

Gays in the military - a Washington Post ABC poll finds 75% of Americans favor letting gays serve openly in the military.

Overturning Role V. Wade - Support has been eroding for years. In addition, in a January Gallup poll, 59 percent of the public believes abortion laws should remain as they are.

School vouchers - 40 percent support school vouchers, while parents of school-age children are split 47-47 percent.

Sex Education - Only 15 percent of Americans say they want abstinence-only sex education in the schools.

]

I think there's a major difference between "We'll allow this so you stop whining" and "We really think this is a good idea".

Gay marriage has lost every time it's been put on a ballot.

Most people don't think abortion on demand is a good idea. But the recongize it's probably impossible to stop.

I personally think that abortion is horrible. Most women who have them have them for stupid reasons. Like the gal I knew back in the 1990's who got pregnant to force her boyfriend to make good on his promise to marry her, and he didn't. And then a year later, she got back together with him and it happened again.

But I recongize that we'd need a police state to ever have a workable abortion law.

So when a liberal says to me, "We can't vote for Santorum, he's going to take away our abortions", I don't take it very seriously, because I've been hearing that nonsense since Reagan.

I think most people think abortion is pretty horrible, but that doesn't mean they want to take away a women's right to choose. Parent certainly want their teens to abstain from sexual intercourse, but they want them to have the knowledge to protect themselves.

Same sex marriage was illegal in every state just 8 years ago. Today, it's legal in 7 states and is under consideration in 5 others. Public opinion on same sex marriage and gay rights in general are changing rapidly, particularly among the young. It doesn't mean more people approve of the gay life style, it simply means more people want equal rights for gay people. I think the reason for this shift is people are accepting the fact that homosexuality is not a choice but is genetic. If you accept this, it's difficult to justify discrimination against people because of the way they were born.

 

[JoeB131]

I think most people think abortion is pretty horrible, but that doesn't mean they want to take away a women's right to choose. Parent certainly want their teens to abstain from sexual intercourse, but they want them to have the knowledge to protect themselves.

Besides the fact you are conflating contraception with abortion here, why is abortion "horrible" as you say? If a fetus isn't really a person, there shouldn't be anything more horrible about an abortion than let's say a colonoscopy.

Same sex marriage was illegal in every state just 8 years ago. Today, it's legal in 7 states and is under consideration in 5 others. Public opinion on same sex marriage and gay rights in general are changing rapidly, particularly among the young. It doesn't mean more people approve of the gay life style, it simply means more people want equal rights for gay people. I think the reason for this shift is people are accepting the fact that homosexuality is not a choice but is genetic. If you accept this, it's difficult to justify discrimination against people because of the way they were born.

It's never happened because the people voted. It's either happened because a judge ruled it, or a legistlature figured this state is just blue enough where we can get away with it.

I do think that eventually, people will acquiese it, at least until the Sixth Great Awakening happens, and we swing back to the prudish side again. In some ways, we've already done so. Look at the amount of nudity in movies from the 1980's compared to the amount now.

 

[Flopper]

I think most people think abortion is pretty horrible, but that doesn't mean they want to take away a women's right to choose. Parent certainly want their teens to abstain from sexual intercourse, but they want them to have the knowledge to protect themselves.

Besides the fact you are conflating contraception with abortion here, why is abortion "horrible" as you say? If a fetus isn't really a person, there shouldn't be anything more horrible about an abortion than let's say a colonoscopy.

Same sex marriage was illegal in every state just 8 years ago. Today, it's legal in 7 states and is under consideration in 5 others. Public opinion on same sex marriage and gay rights in general are changing rapidly, particularly among the young. It doesn't mean more people approve of the gay life style, it simply means more people want equal rights for gay people. I think the reason for this shift is people are accepting the fact that homosexuality is not a choice but is genetic. If you accept this, it's difficult to justify discrimination against people because of the way they were born.

It's never happened because the people voted. It's either happened because a judge ruled it, or a legistlature figured this state is just blue enough where we can get away with it.

I do think that eventually, people will acquiese it, at least until the Sixth Great Awakening happens, and we swing back to the prudish side again. In some ways, we've already done so. Look at the amount of nudity in movies from the 1980's compared to the amount now.

Actually I think a colonoscopy is pretty horrible, having to go through one every three years, but seriously, whether your political persuasion is to the left or right, abortion is horrible because you are either ending a life or what will be come a life. Of course there is another side to the coin. Bringing a child into a life where it is unwanted is also pretty horrible. At any rate, I don't think this decision should be made by the government.

When gay marriage was first legalized in Massachusetts in 2004, many states rush to block it. However, attitudes are changing and as you said, people will acquiese.

Nudity in movies may have decreased somewhat, but I don't think that has anything to do with morality or people becoming prudish. In the 20th century, sex was used to sell a lot of poor quality movies. The sexier the movie the higher the box office, regardless of the quality of the movie. Today, people expect a lot more. However, when it comes to hard core, business is booming on the Internet and has all but replaced the porn theaters of the 20th century.

 

[Peach]

Honestly, the only one left in the GOP field that the WH fears is Romney. That is who they are preparing to face. I understand your feeling for Santorum, but that is the truth. I think the WH will have a party if Santorum wins the GOP nod.

If Bush, born in Massachusetts, raised mostly in Maine, can claim Texas as home state, Romney is from Massachusetts.